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Dollar

Van Wert, OH

#42 Nov 12, 2012
Flipside wrote:
<quoted text>
Regardless, it still doesn't changed the fact that American made companies are still in business, the Inspector General Barofsky stated repeatedly to Neil Cavuto "I mean, the good news is, that money — they already have that money that’s in that escrow account, so it does lower the total amount of money that they owe to the government, so that’s somewhat good news," Barofsky said. "But I don’t think we should exaggerate it too much, when we remember where — the source of this money is just other TARP money."
So here is the thing,Inspector General Barofsky stated its good news. GM is still operating in the United States, Tax payers did get the unused TARP money, and YES about $34 billion may never be repaid for some time, but lets look at it in a long term prospective. 1.) GM is still a quality American manufacturer 2.) Jobs are saved! people are working, more money into the economy, economy is more stable now that what it would be if the bail out never happen. It makes sense that if G.W. Bush can do this with wall street (which I never had a problem with) it makes sense to do the same thing for blue collars in Detroit.
A little bit of sacrifice for a greater cause will not kill anyone regardless what party came up with the idea. The goal is for a common cause instead of bashing. If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. The left wing is no different than the right wing and I will not partake into any tasteless attacks upon anyone for any difference in opinion from mine involving religion, race, sexual orientation, etc. At the least, we can level with each other on neutral ground and agree to disagree.
"Greater cause" ? Oh lord. With your logic, 100 years ago the govt should have bailed out horse and buggy manufacturers. You do understand that GM was basically stolen from shareholders? Rather than restructure under bankruptcy? How many USA plants still closed and opened overseas? So it's ok to toss them billions borrowed from China to keep up a failed business model? Gee, how come Ford is sitting pretty and didn't take a bailout?

Yes, it kills something. Logic and common sense., competition, business , you name it.
Flipside

Van Wert, OH

#43 Nov 12, 2012
It shouldn't matter that the US govt has 33% of shares. It doesn't matter who we borrow money from. Maybe it was a failed model. US plants that are over seas should be here in the US to create more jobs and lower the unemployment rate. Ford just lucked out in their end. The point is that JOBS ARE SAVED! But I guess that doesn't matter to you other than playing the blame game and pointing fingers. What is YOUR solution to this? I am interested on what you have to say.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#44 Nov 12, 2012
Flipside wrote:
It shouldn't matter that the US govt has 33% of shares. It doesn't matter who we borrow money from. Maybe it was a failed model. US plants that are over seas should be here in the US to create more jobs and lower the unemployment rate. Ford just lucked out in their end. The point is that JOBS ARE SAVED! But I guess that doesn't matter to you other than playing the blame game and pointing fingers. What is YOUR solution to this? I am interested on what you have to say.
The Huffington Post had an article, posted 11/5/2012, dealing with the GM bailout. I would encourage everyone to go online and read it. The author does present some interesting facts and questions the Obama contentions about saving "American" jobs. Like how many American jobs where lost when the government forced GM to close 600 new dealerships? And if GM assembles 70% of it's vehicles overseas, how then are American jobs saved? Nowhere in the bailout is there any suggestion to bring these jobs home to the US.

The article is entitled "A lemon under the GM bailout hood" and is written by Mark Pfeifle.
Dollar

Chicago, IL

#45 Nov 12, 2012
Flipside wrote:
It shouldn't matter that the US govt has 33% of shares. It doesn't matter who we borrow money from. Maybe it was a failed model. US plants that are over seas should be here in the US to create more jobs and lower the unemployment rate. Ford just lucked out in their end. The point is that JOBS ARE SAVED! But I guess that doesn't matter to you other than playing the blame game and pointing fingers. What is YOUR solution to this? I am interested on what you have to say.
.

Jobs were 'saved' with tax dollars that we will never see a return on and borrowing from china. It never took into account stability for the future. Just a band aid fox for union bosses crooks and votes.
spike

Ottawa, OH

#46 Nov 12, 2012
Dollar wrote:
<quoted text>
Says a man who voted for a man who blames everything on everyone else. Liberals, you are almost funnier winning than wham you lose ! Yes. We know the party of fear. It's the democrats. Vote for is or you will have to work !!! The horror.
I see you are still talking about people that can't spell.
What about the "funnier than WHAM you lose" Maybe you complain about others spelling because you are not as perfect as you want othere to think you are
Flipside

Van Wert, OH

#47 Nov 12, 2012
Kirby R Kelly wrote:
<quoted text>
The Huffington Post had an article, posted 11/5/2012, dealing with the GM bailout. I would encourage everyone to go online and read it. The author does present some interesting facts and questions the Obama contentions about saving "American" jobs. Like how many American jobs where lost when the government forced GM to close 600 new dealerships? And if GM assembles 70% of it's vehicles overseas, how then are American jobs saved? Nowhere in the bailout is there any suggestion to bring these jobs home to the US.
The article is entitled "A lemon under the GM bailout hood" and is written by Mark Pfeifle.
I shall take another look at your source. Im not calling you a lier, just double checking the facts and making sure they're correct.

Since: Aug 12

Salisbury, NC

#48 Nov 12, 2012
Do you folks not know that the cars GM produces overseas are meant to be sold overseas????
hereto

Van Wert, OH

#49 Nov 13, 2012
Kirby R Kelly wrote:
How many of you remember John F. Kennedy? The guy who stated "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country." Do you remember Ronald Reagan? The man who knew the meaning of the word "compromise." Both parties like to hold these men up as examples, yet both parties seem to have forgotten that these men acted for the betterment of the country as a whole.
How do you revive "leadership?"
You mean the same John F. Kennedy that voted in favor of every humanitarian bill that made it to his deck? Yes I remember him and would like to take this opportunity to thank him. What a great American! His party could learn a thing or two about compassion from such a great leader.

http://www.jfklibrary.org/Research/Ready-Refe...
hereto

Van Wert, OH

#50 Nov 13, 2012
Flipside wrote:
<quoted text> I shall take another look at your source. Im not calling you a lier, just double checking the facts and making sure they're correct.
I'm not going to defend Obama. But you might want to research Romney's connection with Delphi and you will learn how he, his wife and his son profited immensely from the bail out himself. Just saying, who can we trust nowadays?
hereto

Van Wert, OH

#51 Nov 13, 2012
Kirby R Kelly wrote:
<quoted text>
The Huffington Post had an article, posted 11/5/2012, dealing with the GM bailout. I would encourage everyone to go online and read it. The author does present some interesting facts and questions the Obama contentions about saving "American" jobs. Like how many American jobs where lost when the government forced GM to close 600 new dealerships? And if GM assembles 70% of it's vehicles overseas, how then are American jobs saved? Nowhere in the bailout is there any suggestion to bring these jobs home to the US.
The article is entitled "A lemon under the GM bailout hood" and is written by Mark Pfeifle.
the overwhelming majority of those closed dealerships donated to the Republican campaigns as well. I've wondered why we don't meet the Overseas demand here, It would promote domestic labor while at the same time,increase our national exports.
Dollar

Chicago, IL

#52 Nov 13, 2012
Flipside wrote:
<quoted text> I shall take another look at your source. Im not calling you a lier, just double checking the facts and making sure they're correct.
It wasn't like a straight loan like you or I would get. It's just simply a fact that GM still owes us billions

Since: Aug 12

United States

#53 Nov 13, 2012
Just how soon would you like GM to go tits up????
.
Am I the only one that sees that GM is still in a slow glide death spiral?

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#54 Nov 13, 2012
UdintBuildThat wrote:
Just how soon would you like GM to go tits up????
.
Am I the only one that sees that GM is still in a slow glide death spiral?
I see it. By giving the UAW a pass on making concessions, all we did was postpone GM's demise. With one of the biggest liabilities being pensions, the UAW was allowed to retain theirs intact, while the non-union retirees had their pensions turned over to the Pension Board, taking a big reduction and shifting the liability to the taxpayers.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#55 Nov 13, 2012
UdintBuildThat wrote:
Do you folks not know that the cars GM produces overseas are meant to be sold overseas????
It's been awhile since I checked out new vehcles, but I believe I looked at a truck that stated on the sticker that it was assembled in Canada. Granted, not what you'd consider "overseas." And don't they also give a percent of non-domestic parts used in assembly? My question would be is how much did the GM bailout help American workers compared to non-domestic workers who made parts used in assembly?

Since: Aug 12

United States

#56 Nov 13, 2012
I can vouch that the Oshawa Ontario assembly plant doesn't produce GM pick ups anymore. Not sure if they make anything else there now though.
.
All that work came to Roanoke Indiana and I'm pretty sure a lot of work in Flint MI also came to Roanoke. The only truck they don't make at Roanoke are the dualees.
.
However, all the truck frames they use at Roanoke come from St. Thomas Ontario. Ironically The same place in St. Thomas produces the frames for Ford as well.
.
Anymore I'm not sure about GM cars except for Corvettes; made in Bowling Green Kentucky.
.
To gripe about GM not making cars in the US as opposed to China and ship them over is like asking to cook the goose that lays golden eggs. In my humble opinion.
.
They're goin tits up soon enough anyway....good riddance. My next truck will be built in San Antonio and say Tundra on the side.
Dollar

Van Wert, OH

#57 Nov 14, 2012
Kirby R Kelly wrote:
<quoted text>
I see it. By giving the UAW a pass on making concessions, all we did was postpone GM's demise. With one of the biggest liabilities being pensions, the UAW was allowed to retain theirs intact, while the non-union retirees had their pensions turned over to the Pension Board, taking a big reduction and shifting the liability to the taxpayers.
Correct. Ford took care of this 10 years ago. Retiring older workers. Buying out younger ones with cash. The simple fact is, you can't keep paying hundreds of thousands of former workers their salary and healthcare for their families with basically no $ invested by the employee. The model will never ever work. Deals struck 30+ yrs ago, came home to roost.
Flipside

Van Wert, OH

#58 Nov 14, 2012
hereto wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean the same John F. Kennedy that voted in favor of every humanitarian bill that made it to his deck? Yes I remember him and would like to take this opportunity to thank him. What a great American! His party could learn a thing or two about compassion from such a great leader.
http://www.jfklibrary.org/Research/Ready-Refe...
Agreed. JFK was the last of the Conservative-Liberal. Regan, FDR, Teddy Roosevelt, great presidents because they sacrificed regardless of the party. It's now "Team Republican" and "Team Democrats" now.
Dollar

Van Wert, OH

#59 Nov 15, 2012
Flipside wrote:
<quoted text>
Agreed. JFK was the last of the Conservative-Liberal. Regan, FDR, Teddy Roosevelt, great presidents because they sacrificed regardless of the party. It's now "Team Republican" and "Team Democrats" now.
“It is a paradoxical truth that tax rates are too high and tax revenues are too low and the soundest way to raise the revenues in the long run is to cut the rates now … Cutting taxes now is not to incur a budget deficit, but to achieve the more prosperous, expanding economy which can bring a budget surplus.” John F. Kennedy, Nov. 20, 1962, president’s news conference

“Lower rates of taxation will stimulate economic activity and so raise the levels of personal and corporate income as to yield within a few years an increased – not a reduced – flow of revenues to the federal government.”

– John F. Kennedy, Jan. 17, 1963, annual budget message to the Congress, fiscal year 1964

Can add a bunch more if you like.

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