Common Core: Too Hot in the Kitchen
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teach

Utica, NY

#22 Oct 15, 2013
truth or wonder, whoever you go by, I find it interesting that you continue to blame teachers and unions for the poor results of our students. You need to look at who decides educational policy. Now that the federal government has tied funding to those states who agree to the common core, we have a system where politicians are dictating policy. Teachers have a curriculum that is not established by them or their union. It is stated by the district, state, and now federal government. Take some time to research the sites below since you claim that my union newsletter is influencing my opinion. Our government is trying to scare the country into buying into the common core. Standards and accountability are needed, however the means that they tie achievement and teacher success on a single test that doesn't even align to the common core curriculum, is not a fair means to this end. You are a well know teacher-basher, anti-union advocate. At least come up with some type of argument that doesn't hold teachers or unions as the scapegoat to the educational systems woes.

http://www.epi.org/publication/us-student-per...

http://news.stanford.edu/news/2013/january/te...

http://www.vdare.com/articles/pisa-scores-sho...

http://www.agiweb.org/education/statusreports...
Parent D

Brooklyn, NY

#23 Oct 15, 2013
It's not right. Straight A students are in helper classes!!! Different grade years have different language used to describe the same math formulas. The same ratio or fraction is described completely different if you are in 6th or 8th grade. SAME FOMULA BUT DIFFERENT LANGUAGE USED TO DESCRIBE THE OPERATORS! Are you kidding me!!!!

It is clear that common core was developed by a bunch of Doctorate dipsh**s that can't make it in the real world. We see the same ridiculous stuff in the corporate world with CMMI (Level 3 etc) and other worthless process models.

I'm sure the developers of common core were given a grant or a contract just because they were "friends" of some slimy politician. Now they are jamming this chaotic mess down our kids throats confusing the hell out of them.

Yes, I want the teachers to be evaluated, held to high standards, but not by a bunch of wanna be academics that can't make it in the real world. No wonder kids have college degrees and can't get a job. They are taught by professors that can't even apply themselves in the real world. Those who can't.... teach (or develop worthless teaching methods).
truth my ass

Syracuse, NY

#24 Oct 15, 2013
Truth wrote:
Is the alternative to return to the system that allowed children to be passed through the public school system and some graduate who can't read, write and do math at an elementary level?
The world is having our lunch when it comes to education. We should be leading the way.
We need Common Core or something similar to ensure that every child in America is getting the same information and graded in the same manner. We have the situation we do because teachers and administrators have had their own way and taught what they want, when they want and how they want without any real accountability. Teachers- you had your chance. You blew it. Time for a change. We need to catch up with the rest of the world.
. I taught in South Korea, for 3 years. They teach using rote memory. Do you even know what that means? They aren't learning, they're just passing tests! This method is used around the world. Plus, they don't educate everybody. Tests are given to see who has the aptitude to go to college.
Do not blast

Utica, NY

#25 Oct 15, 2013
slapanut wrote:
One more public hearing gets cancelled?!? The NYS Education Commish, Bruce Karam and that fat arse blowhard Howie Mettleman from BOCES need to hold a public forum in Utica. They'll all get murdered by angry parents and teachers. Common CORE is too dangerous of a way to teach your children.
What are you talking about? Karam and Mettleman are the messengers. Remember the expression, don't kill the messenger? They are just following the Commissions directive. Say what you want to say but they have not made this mess.
Teach

Methuen, MA

#26 Oct 16, 2013
They are the ones who choose modules to implement the core. There are alternatives to teach the required skills. Modules are a joke.

Level 3

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#27 Oct 16, 2013
Asking wrote:
So what's wrong with the word implementation?
Nothing is wrong with the word. Try again. Look a little harder.

They may be "smart" phones, but their users most certainly are not.
get it right

Utica, NY

#28 Oct 16, 2013
Truth, every time I see you post on education topics, it goes back to the same anti-union rhetoric. In your opinion, unions are to blame for everything from the Kennedy assassination to global warming. The same educational deficiencies you refer to are prevalent in many other states, including many that are "right to work". The problem is not unions, it's not standards, it's parents (moms and dads, not biological accidents). The Federal and NYS governments have tried for years to function "in loco parentis" to compensate for what everyone knows is the real problem. NY requires a license for just about everything except parenthood. When we adopt expectations and, more importantly, consequences for poor parenting, we'll eliminate the vast majority of the problems with education.
Truth

Utica, NY

#30 Oct 16, 2013
get it right wrote:
Truth, every time I see you post on education topics, it goes back to the same anti-union rhetoric. In your opinion, unions are to blame for everything from the Kennedy assassination to global warming. The same educational deficiencies you refer to are prevalent in many other states, including many that are "right to work". The problem is not unions, it's not standards, it's parents (moms and dads, not biological accidents). The Federal and NYS governments have tried for years to function "in loco parentis" to compensate for what everyone knows is the real problem. NY requires a license for just about everything except parenthood. When we adopt expectations and, more importantly, consequences for poor parenting, we'll eliminate the vast majority of the problems with education.
I do blame the teacher unions for a lot. We've allowed a special class of public worker be created as a result of their demands. I think I may be more disgusted by generations of elected boards of education who sat on the other side of the negotiating table, supposedly representing taxpayer interests, and allowing this ridiculousness to happen.

You say "In your opinion, unions are to blame for everything from the Kennedy assassination to global warming" which is obviously a gross exaggeration and at the same time blaming parents and poverty for all of the deficiencies in education. Haven't there always been poor and disabled children in classrooms? Haven't there always been waves on non-English speaking immigrant children in classrooms? Of course there have but somehow we gone from the top of the heap in public education to the middle of the pack. The timing of the decline interestingly enough corresponds exactly with teachers getting collective bargaining rights and boards of educations giving away taxpayer money like it grows on trees.

No Child Left Behind is a perfect example. This was an attempt to do something like the Common Core is designed to do. Those in charge of the program went to state education departments and asked for a few things. First a baseline to measure progress against. Then a plan for improvement. And finally a schedule with milestones to gauge progress. In general states set their own programs, goals and timetables. When test scores showed that the milestones that educators had themselves set were not being met the excuses like you've embraced started flying. It exposed education in the US and educators who were providing it as part of the problem. Can't have that if you are a union. That's too much like accountability. Anything that shines a light on ineffective teachers or methods must not be allowed to stand.

The goal was to not let students be passed through the system and graduated without basic reading and writing skills. Admirable goal I think. I don't give it much of a chance though given the power that teacher unions have demonstrated time and again.

You're right it does happen in other states it's just that New York is one of the worst.
slapanut

Utica, NY

#31 Oct 19, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Your conspiracy theory is ridiculous. You don't seem to have even the most basic knowledge of what Common Core is or how it was created and by whom. I suggest you review this webpage and other information on the same site:
http://www.corestandards.org/resources/freque...
http://www.corestandards.org/resources/myths-...
We are where we are because there has not been too much local control but too much teacher control. Doesn't every teacher you talk to give you the impression that they know exactly what is wrong with the education system and they know exactly what to do about it.(Their solutions more often than not have to do with more taxpayer money) A New York student is different from an Idaho student who is different from a Mississippi student......for that very reason.
There needs to be a "common core" that ensures continuity in education. Ask and college recruiter that looks at applications form different states. Ask large employers about their most common complaint being that younger workers lack the basic writing and communication skills that those that came before them always had.
As with anything new it will take time to work out the kinks in the Common Core. At the end of the day though if the goals are met then we will once again be on an upward trajectory when compared with the rest of the world and companies won't have to import "brain power".
OK bigmouth, riddle me this? So is it right if the NYS Education Commissioner has his own kids attend a private school - which by the way DO NOT HAVE to follow the Common CORE? Yet he preaches it for the rest of NYS and tells us this is the way it's going to be and deal with it?

Another thing - Catholic schools and charter schools don't have to follow the Common CORE standards either.
slapanut

Utica, NY

#32 Oct 19, 2013
Noticed ever since the NYS Education Commish gone quiet evr since he got found out his kids go to a pivate school? Five more states have now already opted out of the Common CORE.
slapanut

Utica, NY

#33 Oct 19, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Did you read that in your union magazine?
In Finland, who leads the world in education, only the top 10% of those who apply for university to become teachers are accepted. That couldn't have anything to do with it could it?
While we were raising the AYSO soccer generation where everyone gets a trophy other countries more successful in education were examining and making their standards more rigid.
At the same time we spend more and more taxpayer money every year on education, the outcome is on the decline.
Rather than making demographic excuses the goal should be to reverse the decline regardless how we stack up against others. The Common Core at least sets goals and requires accountability. Two are things that have been sadly lacking in the public school system since they unionized.
For those who judged this poster clueless or nuts. He's absolutely correct about Finland. The Smithsonian magazine did print that article. Read here:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/people-places/W...

Finland DO NOT believe in standardized testings. They are a waste of time and money.
OldDays

Carthage, NY

#34 Oct 19, 2013
I believe that one of the main problems in education is that teachers are not allowed to control their classrooms. Students who have clearly not learned what they should have, must be promoted to the next grade. Administrators and parents pressure and force teachers to make exceptions and bend the rules. Disruptive students are allowed to remain in the classroom. Respect and discipline are not allowed in the classroom. Standards and tests are 'unfair' because all the students are 'winners'. I believe that education is a privilege and not a right. If the student cannot behave properly, he should be reprimanded or expelled. If he fails his exams, then he should be held back until he passes them. If the third grade classroom is filled with 15 year olds, then so be it. I do feel that collective bargaining has made public education too expensive and has given teachers benefits that are not possible nowadays in the private sector. On the other hand, Teachers cannot do miracles, but in many cases, their hands are tied and those in command(parents, administrators and students) do not allow them to do their jobs.
Truth

Herkimer, NY

#35 Oct 20, 2013
slapanut wrote:
<quoted text>
OK bigmouth, riddle me this? So is it right if the NYS Education Commissioner has his own kids attend a private school - which by the way DO NOT HAVE to follow the Common CORE? Yet he preaches it for the rest of NYS and tells us this is the way it's going to be and deal with it?
Another thing - Catholic schools and charter schools don't have to follow the Common CORE standards either.
You are not quite right.

If a school, any school, recieves federal funding of any kind then it is bound by the Common Core curriculum. Charter schools definitely fall in that category. Second, since the PSAT, SAT and ACT are being rewritten to accomdate the Common Core then it is in the interest of every school, federally funded or not, to abide by it.
Truth

Herkimer, NY

#36 Oct 20, 2013
slapanut wrote:
<quoted text>
For those who judged this poster clueless or nuts. He's absolutely correct about Finland. The Smithsonian magazine did print that article. Read here:
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/people-places/W...
Finland DO NOT believe in standardized testings. They are a waste of time and money.
Without test results how do you suppose we know that Finland's students are at or near the top when compared with the rest of the world?

You are partially right though. Finland doesn't use standard testing the way we think of it but they do use testing and do not think testing is a waste of time and money. Each teacher in the Finnish system has the responsibility for testing each student individually based on that student's abilities. The results of those tests are monitored and spot checked by the Finnish government to ensure that each student is getting what they need and the teacher is performing. Are you suggesting then that all US teachers be responsible for their students in that same way?

Common Core may not be exactly the answer that's needed to solve the problem of decling educational outcomes in the US public school system but it does provide order and structure to a system that has been for a long time left to teachers to teach what they want, when they want, how they want and with very little accountibility for failure. It may not be the right answer but I believe we need to try something to reverse the decline. Does that assessment sound clueless or nuts?

The facts are the facts. Since the 1960's the state of public educational outcomes in America have been in decline when compared with the rest of the world. I base my opinion regarding changing the existing system on that.
Finn

New Hartford, NY

#38 Oct 20, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Without test results how do you suppose we know that Finland's students are at or near the top when compared with the rest of the world?
You are partially right though. Finland doesn't use standard testing the way we think of it but they do use testing and do not think testing is a waste of time and money. Each teacher in the Finnish system has the responsibility for testing each student individually based on that student's abilities. The results of those tests are monitored and spot checked by the Finnish government to ensure that each student is getting what they need and the teacher is performing. Are you suggesting then that all US teachers be responsible for their students in that same way?
Common Core may not be exactly the answer that's needed to solve the problem of decling educational outcomes in the US public school system but it does provide order and structure to a system that has been for a long time left to teachers to teach what they want, when they want, how they want and with very little accountibility for failure. It may not be the right answer but I believe we need to try something to reverse the decline. Does that assessment sound clueless or nuts?
The facts are the facts. Since the 1960's the state of public educational outcomes in America have been in decline when compared with the rest of the world. I base my opinion regarding changing the existing system on that.
Finland may be the whitest ountry in the world.
slapanut

Utica, NY

#39 Oct 24, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
You are not quite right.
If a school, any school, recieves federal funding of any kind then it is bound by the Common Core curriculum. Charter schools definitely fall in that category. Second, since the PSAT, SAT and ACT are being rewritten to accomdate the Common Core then it is in the interest of every school, federally funded or not, to abide by it.
Charter schools DO NOT have to follow the Common CORE standards. Heck the teachers are not even certified.

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