Union Station
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Truth

Utica, NY

#1 May 21, 2014
Hold on to your wallets and use your head when you hear the sound bites because they are at it again.

This from the OD:
" Union Station work to be part of area's rebirth"

Read more: http://www.uticaod.com/article/20140521/News/...

"ďI donít want our structures to look the way they have been,Ē Oneida County Executive Anthony Picente said.ďThis is cleaning up the area and it fits with the rebirth of the area.Ē
The nanotechnology developments in Marcy and the success of the Utica Comets hockey team are widely touted indicators that the city is turning around."

Common thread through all of these "rebirths" is that they are all financed using taxpayer money. If there were any true potential investors would be lining up to pitch in. they aren't.

Another rebirth. Really? If you were to be able to go back to the media reports in the 1980's when there was a major renovation of Union Station you'd find exactly the same headline.
Ex Utican

Utica, NY

#2 May 21, 2014
Thats hysterical, very sad and hysterical at the same time.

Since: May 14

Clifton Park, NY

#3 May 21, 2014
That's the key. When there's no private money money being invested...well it's just mental masturbation. Look at the fiasco the city is going through with a convenience store! Lol!
Da Law

New Hartford, NY

#4 May 21, 2014
Ah, Union Station. Every few years since the 70s it becomes part of another "revitalization effort" for the same area. So far we've spent over $70 million inflation adjusted dollars on the facility and have absolutely nothing to show for it.

No, strike that. It actually *declined*. What was supposed to be the regional transportation hub is now handling fewer bus departures than ever before and has seen it's railroad ridership only sluggishly start to come back from bottoming out. What was supposed to be a prime commercial space turned into a boondoggle that required a wholesale relocation of government offices to the building just to keep the lights on.

And, in a move that surely confirms the existence of the Friends and Family Plan, they sold off 20% of the parking spaces to a developer. For a project that has been a running disaster, even after huge piles of public money and tax breaks were thrown at it. Mind you, this is after multiple use surveys and development plans for Union Station identified a lack of parking as one of the building's biggest problems.

BTW, the plan to renovate the package facility? First floated in the late 70s, and it's actually been paid for twice. Once during the Winter Olympics development effort in the 80s and again back in 1996 as part of the "Boehlert Center" plan.

It would be funny if it wasn't so tragic. "This time will be different!" really should be the city's official motto.

Since: May 14

Clifton Park, NY

#5 May 21, 2014
Da Law wrote:
Ah, Union Station. Every few years since the 70s it becomes part of another "revitalization effort" for the same area. So far we've spent over $70 million inflation adjusted dollars on the facility and have absolutely nothing to show for it.
No, strike that. It actually *declined*. What was supposed to be the regional transportation hub is now handling fewer bus departures than ever before and has seen it's railroad ridership only sluggishly start to come back from bottoming out. What was supposed to be a prime commercial space turned into a boondoggle that required a wholesale relocation of government offices to the building just to keep the lights on.
And, in a move that surely confirms the existence of the Friends and Family Plan, they sold off 20% of the parking spaces to a developer. For a project that has been a running disaster, even after huge piles of public money and tax breaks were thrown at it. Mind you, this is after multiple use surveys and development plans for Union Station identified a lack of parking as one of the building's biggest problems.
BTW, the plan to renovate the package facility? First floated in the late 70s, and it's actually been paid for twice. Once during the Winter Olympics development effort in the 80s and again back in 1996 as part of the "Boehlert Center" plan.
It would be funny if it wasn't so tragic. "This time will be different!" really should be the city's official motto.
Spot on. Not sure if utica got the memo that people in this country other than in urban centers don't ride the train.
Blowhard Center

New Hartford, NY

#6 May 21, 2014
The Boehlert Center was mentioned above. Ha! It should be called the Blowhard Center! Yes, good ol Sherry gets Union Center named after him, despite his incompetence as area Congressman for multiple terms. Boehlert couldn't save GAFB despite being on the Armed Services Committee! In fact Boehlert was part in parcel in getting the BRACC a reason to close Plattsburg AFB! Yes, Boehlert in his stupidity had a proposal drawn up outlining the reasons to close Plattsburg. Yes! Close Plattsburg, save GAFB! Do it! Don't need PAFB! Oops! The BRACC panel said, ok! We'll close GAFB & PAFB! How's that Congressman Boehlert? We don't see a need for either base! Thanx for bringing PAFB to our attention! 10,000 jobs in NYS gone thanx to Boehlert's big yap & stupidity! And he gets a building named after him! The citizens of Plattsburg just love 'ol Sherry!

Not!

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#7 May 21, 2014
Iím curious how you would handle revitalization in Utica. If you were in charge, what moves would you make to improve our economic future? We donít need people to complain about every project attempted in this area. We need people who have constructive ideas. Iím not trying to put you down or insult you, Iím truly looking for positive change. I know you will say dump all our politicians, but that isnít going to happen overnight. Give me something we can build on. Ways to draw businesses to central NY. Other areas are fighting for every dollar the state and federal government is making available. Here we complain about it. Why? Government grants are going to be spent somewhere. Why not here? We should be fighting for more money, not complaining about what we do get.

Since: May 14

Clifton Park, NY

#8 May 21, 2014
JusticeDefiled13501 wrote:
Iím curious how you would handle revitalization in Utica. If you were in charge, what moves would you make to improve our economic future? We donít need people to complain about every project attempted in this area. We need people who have constructive ideas. Iím not trying to put you down or insult you, Iím truly looking for positive change. I know you will say dump all our politicians, but that isnít going to happen overnight. Give me something we can build on. Ways to draw businesses to central NY. Other areas are fighting for every dollar the state and federal government is making available. Here we complain about it. Why? Government grants are going to be spent somewhere. Why not here? We should be fighting for more money, not complaining about what we do get.
And the problem is just with your wording. Why should areas be fighting government for handouts? In that situation utica will never win.
Ex Utican

Utica, NY

#9 May 21, 2014
It's too late
Ex Utican

Utica, NY

#10 May 21, 2014
Utica Lies and Riggies wrote:
<quoted text>
And the problem is just with your wording. Why should areas be fighting government for handouts? In that situation utica will never win.
Thats right. What happened to standing up and doing it for yourself instead of looking for the gov. cheese. Also, anybody that gives you money owns you.
Da Law

Ilion, NY

#11 May 21, 2014
JusticeDefiled13501 wrote:
Iím curious how you would handle revitalization in Utica. If you were in charge, what moves would you make to improve our economic future?
That's easy. Dump the Tinkerbell thinking and institute a policy of performance metrics. To use the package facility as an example, the official development plan consists of...happy thoughts. Please take particular notice in the article of the weasel words and phrases that absolutely infest ideas like this:

"It's hoped the market could one day expand..."

"..what could be..."

"...officials hope..."

"..it has a lot of potential."

So close to a million dollars is being spent on...nothing more than a hunch. There are no signed vendors. There are no studies showing a demand for retail or office space in the area. Which isn't surprising, since the city is absolutely filled WITH EMPTY AND ABANDONED COMMERCIAL SPACE.
Other areas are fighting for every dollar the state and federal government is making available. Here we complain about it. Why?
Because, after untold millions of dollars of taxpayer money being spent on "development", we have jack to show for it.

Want to make a wager? I think it's a pretty sure bet that the current Union Station renovations will be done by the same company that's been renovating the same building for the last 40 years. They've made millions and the public has...nothing. Can you seriously look at Union Station and it's environs and tell me we actually have an asset worth all the money that's been plowed into it?
Government grants are going to be spent somewhere. Why not here? We should be fighting for more money, not complaining about what we do get.
It's not a matter of money. It's a matter of results. The current renovation plan is a make work project for the benefit of the Friends and Family Plan, nothing more. The building already has unoccupied commercial space. They literally couldn't give it away! And now they're building more commercial space at a site that doesn't even have enough parking to handle it's already limited traffic. Oh, and that's ignoring the publicly financed development project in the building right across the street. You know, the one with multiple floors of empty space that no one wants?

Here, I'll make another bet. Wanna guess the odds that the county is going to buy back the parking area that was sold to a private developer?

That's what passes for "economic development" in Utica.

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#12 May 21, 2014
Utica Lies and Riggies wrote:
<quoted text>
And the problem is just with your wording. Why should areas be fighting government for handouts? In that situation utica will never win.
That's a great idea, stop all government handouts. But until that happens we SHOULD be fighting for our share. We pay taxes too.

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#13 May 21, 2014
Da Law wrote:
<quoted text>
That's easy. Dump the Tinkerbell thinking and institute a policy of performance metrics. To use the package facility as an example, the official development plan consists of...happy thoughts. Please take particular notice in the article of the weasel words and phrases that absolutely infest ideas like this:
"It's hoped the market could one day expand..."
"..what could be..."
"...officials hope..."
"..it has a lot of potential."
So close to a million dollars is being spent on...nothing more than a hunch. There are no signed vendors. There are no studies showing a demand for retail or office space in the area. Which isn't surprising, since the city is absolutely filled WITH EMPTY AND ABANDONED COMMERCIAL SPACE.
<quoted text>
Because, after untold millions of dollars of taxpayer money being spent on "development", we have jack to show for it.
Want to make a wager? I think it's a pretty sure bet that the current Union Station renovations will be done by the same company that's been renovating the same building for the last 40 years. They've made millions and the public has...nothing. Can you seriously look at Union Station and it's environs and tell me we actually have an asset worth all the money that's been plowed into it?
<quoted text>
It's not a matter of money. It's a matter of results. The current renovation plan is a make work project for the benefit of the Friends and Family Plan, nothing more. The building already has unoccupied commercial space. They literally couldn't give it away! And now they're building more commercial space at a site that doesn't even have enough parking to handle it's already limited traffic. Oh, and that's ignoring the publicly financed development project in the building right across the street. You know, the one with multiple floors of empty space that no one wants?
Here, I'll make another bet. Wanna guess the odds that the county is going to buy back the parking area that was sold to a private developer?
That's what passes for "economic development" in Utica.
Are you suggesting this for all areas that receive government money, or just Utica. Do you have a problem with all the graft and corruption going on throughout the rest of the state or just Utica. If the state or feds want to give us money, I say we take it before some other crook gets there first. It may sound cynical, but I would rather have the money go to our crooks.
Crazy Sue speaks

Bronx, NY

#14 May 21, 2014
JusticeDefiled13501 wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you suggesting this for all areas that receive government money, or just Utica. Do you have a problem with all the graft and corruption going on throughout the rest of the state or just Utica. If the state or feds want to give us money, I say we take it before some other crook gets there first. It may sound cynical, but I would rather have the money go to our crooks.
Not surprising Sue you have no brains. You seem to feel status quo is fine.

"Well everyone else is costing us a fortune with pork LET'S GET OURS!!!"

You sound like that clueless Bill Keeler.... as long as you get yours you don't mind the welfare state. God forbid the next welfare recipient has a "LOBSTER!!!" in their cart.
Da Law

Ilion, NY

#15 May 21, 2014
JusticeDefiled13501 wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you suggesting this for all areas that receive government money, or just Utica.
No, I'm all for corruption everywhere except Utica.
If the state or feds want to give us money, I say we take it before some other crook gets there first. It may sound cynical, but I would rather have the money go to our crooks.
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you the reason Utica is the way it is.

Since: May 14

Clifton Park, NY

#16 May 21, 2014
JusticeDefiled13501 wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a great idea, stop all government handouts. But until that happens we SHOULD be fighting for our share. We pay taxes too.
Utica can't fight for its "share". There's nothing to "fight" with. All that happens are these little pet projects that line the same contractors pockets. A utica politician could get the state to dump a 100 million dollars into union station and it's still a train station in the middle of nowhere.
Amen

Bronx, NY

#17 May 21, 2014
Da Law wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I'm all for corruption everywhere except Utica.
<quoted text>
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you the reason Utica is the way it is.
Bingo. These people simply cannot be helped. even if you wanted to. There is a very feeble level of understanding there I think.
Get with it

Bronx, NY

#18 May 21, 2014
JusticeDefiled13501 wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a great idea, stop all government handouts. But until that happens we SHOULD be fighting for our share. We pay taxes too.
Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of Liberty.Ė Thomas Jefferson
Uticism

Bronx, NY

#19 May 22, 2014
Gimme gimme gimme! And then they cry when the taxes chased away all their businesses! How stupid do they have to be when they can't see that's what put them there at the bottom of the US economy!
Just sayin

Utica, NY

#20 May 22, 2014
Ex Utican wrote:
<quoted text>
Thats right. What happened to standing up and doing it for yourself instead of looking for the gov. cheese. Also, anybody that gives you money owns you.
That would mean more tax increases, and you don't want that. That would also mean leaving your computer screen and donating time and, SURPRISE, money to the cause. I highly doubt that the majority who post on this website do either of those.

In this city, everyone wants everything for absolutely nothing.

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