Canucks wants Utica to guarantee revenue for AHL team

Posted in the Utica Forum

Comments

Showing posts 1 - 20 of65
< prev page
|
Go to last page| Jump to page:
Taxpayer

Utica, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#1
May 26, 2013
 
Hold on to your wallets

http://blogs.theprovince.com/2013/05/24/canuc...

The real concern when the Canucks sign on with Utica for their AHL affiliate should be in Abbotsford.
When it comes to the Heat, it could get worse before it gets better for ratepayers.
Unfortunately, there was a chance for it to be different. Itís not rocket engineering. If the Canucks had their farm club in Abby, theyíd finally have a shot at sustained financial success.
But that didnít happen, and thatís because
the Calgary Flames have six more years on a sweetheart deal in which the city guarantees that the team will receive $5.7 million a year in revenue.
If itís short, they dig into the taxpayersí wallets. Some bargain.
The Canucks are looking for some similar guarantees in the shorter deal theyíre negotiating with Utica.
Ya, who wouldnít be?
Utica wants a team and is willing to talk guaranteed revenue because they donít have much else to sell. They have an old, beaten up facility, which seats 4,000 and needs major refurbishing to get up to AHL standards.
If the Canucks go in there for a couple of years, itís a sure money pit if they donít have the city willing to offer up the public trough.
The deal is expected to be announced next week. If it falls apart, the Canucks have until June 13 to work something out. If they donít, their AHL team goes dormant, and their prospects will be spread around the AHL and ECHL. Itís a disastrous situation and one the 2009-10 Anaheim Ducks dealt with.

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

3

1

If this is true, wow. Unf.ckingelievable. Does any sane person think this is a good idea? The average AHL attendance is about 5,500. We wouldn't come close to that. We had an AHL team, and it was a complete bust. Under what scenario will this actually succeed? Other than the scenario where already broke taxpayers give millions of dollars they don't have to multimillionaires for a f.cking sports team the vast majority of locals don't even want.

Why the F.CK should local taxpayers subsidize a hockey team for a tiny fraction of the local population who will actually go to these games?

What a complete f.cking joke.
Sign it over

New Britain, CT

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#3
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

The Utica mayor and company get an a for effort but the truth is as long as there are this many trashy blacks and African immigrants and Bermese savages Utica will never be anything. The sooner we accept this the sooner the healing process can begin. You could give Utica blacks 100 grand each and they would buy 100 pairs of Jordan's so y invest another dime in this city.
Clueless

Utica, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#4
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

3

2

1

I can't believe Utica is even considering guaranteeing money to a team. Where the hell do they think it's going to come from? Absolutely absurd. It was clear from the get go that they would have to enter into such an arrangement, why have they even continued to entertain it? It really shows the ineptitude, stupidity and desperation of local officials. It's one thing to dream big but let's wake the hell up here.

Same on the Nano front. The lead guy doesn't take a job across the country if the efforts he's led are near to coming to fruition.

Then there's the new deal with the casino.

Utica/Rome is toast. Done, fin, finished...

Going to pack, buh bye!
Freddy

Utica, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#5
May 26, 2013
 
If Utica's mayor and company were on the ball they'd realize they have VAN over a barrel. The team has no where to go and it would kill their prospects development to be spread around w/o their organization's coaches. Utica doesn't need this team, this team needs Utica.
Reggie Dunlop

New York, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#6
May 26, 2013
 
Anybody know when an announcement is going to be made ?

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#9
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

2

1

1

Yay We Have A Fort wrote:
<quoted text>
The AHL team was not a bust.
It was a bust in the sense that attendance was among the lowest, if not the lowest, of any team in league (about half of the league average), and the team relocated because of the lack of fan support, poor demographics, lousy facilities, and miserable finances.

I'd say follow the money with this one. As is typical of this area, some well-connected douchebag is going to cash in big, and it isn't the taxpayers. This is so absurd it makes my head want to explode.
CCCP

Utica, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

In one post you say that the AHL was not a bust and then in the next you imply that it very nearly is.?!
Yay We Have A Fort wrote:
<quoted text>
Utica does not have as much negotiating power as you think. Quite frankly, the Canucks do not want to be in utica. If they don't get the right deal the team will go dormant and then either go to abbotsford next season when there are far easier guidelines for a Calgary buyout or end up in glens falls. This is a unique opportunity for utica that came along...actually a second chance if you will after vancouver unsuccessfully couldn't make abbotsford happen.

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#11
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Yay We Have A Fort wrote:
<quoted text>
Utica does not have as much negotiating power as you think. Quite frankly, the Canucks do not want to be in utica. If they don't get the right deal the team will go dormant and then either go to abbotsford next season when there are far easier guidelines for a Calgary buyout or end up in glens falls. This is a unique opportunity for utica that came along...actually a second chance if you will after vancouver unsuccessfully couldn't make abbotsford happen.
Yes, a unique opportunity to piss away millions of dollars in taxpayer money on an absurd venture which has zero chance to succeed. The only reason they would come here is because 1) they have no other place to go; 2) we are the only city dumb enough to waste money on such an asinine idea.

How long are the committing to Utica?

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#12
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

2

It's also astonishing that despite this deal being in the works, our local "news" media have been almost silent on it. I guess all the local reporters are busy covering the breaking news of Sylvan Beach opening on Memorial Day Weekend.

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#16
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

2

Yay We Have A Fort wrote:
<quoted text>
The team did not relocate because of poor fan support. I suggest you check the facts.
No, they relocated because they had TOO many fans attending their games, right? Good grief. The same factors which led to the old Utica Devils going bust are still here. Only things have gotten worse. And taxpayers are supposed to provide these clowns with welfare for the privilege of 1,500 people attending AHL games for a year. Fantastic idea.

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#17
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

4

3

2

Yay We Have A Fort wrote:
<quoted text>
No I'm not. Vancouver doesn'tt want to be on the east coast. They've stated this many times already. Quite simply if utica has to compete for a team next year against glens falls they will lose. What they're competing against right now is dormancy and one thing they have going for them is the 150,000 fee vancouver would have to pay to do that.
And utica guaranteeing against losses isn't necessarily a bad thing. Depends on lease rates of the aud. this gets a team in utica and it goes from there. Apply the money from the stte to improve the aud and hopefully fans show up to prove its a viable location. It's a unique opportunity for the area actually. If this were happening next year...well utica wouldn't even be in the discussion.
This is laughable. Under no circumstances should a broke, impoverished city be using taxpayer money to provide welfare to millionaires for a minor league hockey team.
discustedrebel

Belton, SC

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#18
May 26, 2013
 
WOW , I am extremely happy I do not live in Utica or anywhere in the north. I wish you all better days than what you are going through right now.
Bill

Utica, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#19
May 26, 2013
 
discustedrebel wrote:
WOW , I am extremely happy I do not live in Utica or anywhere in the north. I wish you all better days than what you are going through right now.
Okay Gomer. Nice schools and state flag.
Disgusting

Ravena, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#20
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

4

4

3

Truth Dig wrote:
<quoted text>
No, they relocated because they had TOO many fans attending their games, right? Good grief. The same factors which led to the old Utica Devils going bust are still here. Only things have gotten worse. And taxpayers are supposed to provide these clowns with welfare for the privilege of 1,500 people attending AHL games for a year. Fantastic idea.
Since you think you know it all here you go smarts as. The New Jersey devils relocated from Utica to Albany because if the deal they got from Albany. They were able to lease the one year old knickerbocker arena seating almost 15000 people for less than the auditorium in Utica. It was a no brainier. The Utica franchise was then sold to Calgary who moved it to a bigger market. At that time in the ahl tere was a trend to bigger markets to try and compete with the IHL. That experiment has for the most part failed in the ahl as teams are again congregating in the easy to reduce costs. The Utica devils franchise made money every single year for its six years there. Do you have anything else or will you just continue making ignorant statements based on your perception and not facts?
Section 204 Legend

Whitesboro, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#21
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

Disgusting wrote:
<quoted text>
Since you think you know it all here you go smarts as. The New Jersey devils relocated from Utica to Albany because if the deal they got from Albany. They were able to lease the one year old knickerbocker arena seating almost 15000 people for less than the auditorium in Utica. It was a no brainier. The Utica franchise was then sold to Calgary who moved it to a bigger market. At that time in the ahl tere was a trend to bigger markets to try and compete with the IHL. That experiment has for the most part failed in the ahl as teams are again congregating in the easy to reduce costs. The Utica devils franchise made money every single year for its six years there. Do you have anything else or will you just continue making ignorant statements based on your perception and not facts?
Very accurate background on Utica's moves after they left here. I definitely concur with your statement.I watched them win the Calder Cup as River Rats in Albany and then moving later becoming the Lowell Lock Monsters, I believe....Not 100% certain of who exactly owned the franchise in the latter years, but I believe that Lamoriello had his hands involved in Lowell as well.
Disgusting

Ravena, NY

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#22
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

Section 204 Legend wrote:
<quoted text>Very accurate background on Utica's moves after they left here. I definitely concur with your statement.I watched them win the Calder Cup as River Rats in Albany and then moving later becoming the Lowell Lock Monsters, I believe....Not 100% certain of who exactly owned the franchise in the latter years, but I believe that Lamoriello had his hands involved in Lowell as well.
It's sickening to read people in the Utica area think the Utica devils failed. They DIDN'T fail. They made money every single year. The league just tried to get bigger.

I'm not sure if its uticans perceptions that every time something or someone leaves utica it's because if failure. Far from. Just look at your population base. Do the kids who graduate leave that area because they failed? Far from. They are going to bigger and better places. The ahl is downsizing and utica is viable again. Run with it guys.

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#25
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

Disgusting wrote:
<quoted text>
Since you think you know it all here you go smarts as. The New Jersey devils relocated from Utica to Albany because if the deal they got from Albany. They were able to lease the one year old knickerbocker arena seating almost 15000 people for less than the auditorium in Utica. It was a no brainier. The Utica franchise was then sold to Calgary who moved it to a bigger market. At that time in the ahl tere was a trend to bigger markets to try and compete with the IHL. That experiment has for the most part failed in the ahl as teams are again congregating in the easy to reduce costs. The Utica devils franchise made money every single year for its six years there. Do you have anything else or will you just continue making ignorant statements based on your perception and not facts?
So let's see if I've got this right: the Devils bolted from Utica to play in a bigger City with a larger arena so they could make more money than they could make here? That's exactly what I've been saying, genius. They got a better deal to play in a bigger city with a bigger arena? No f.cking sh.t.

The average attendance for an AHL team is 5,600 per game. The aud seats 4,000. And it's dump. When the Devils played here, attendance at their games was less than HALF the league average. So how in God's name is this supposed to work? Here's how: the, poor, broke taxpayers of Utica (and undoubtedly Oneida County) will pony up millions in welfare for the corporate owners to make up for embarrassing attendance which, if we're lucky, will be about 2,500 a game, when the rest of the league is averaging 5,600. It will last a year (or 2) until they can find...... a bigger city with a bigger arena. Let's just hope taxpayers aren't hoodwinked into making a big payment up-front.

And Mr. Insider, please explain why, if the Devils were so profitable here, hasn't there been an AHL franchise interested in playing in our little budding metropolis for 20 years? Why are taxpayers expected to guarantee any profit for any private business?

When I first heard about this story, I thought the idea of bringing an AHL franchise was absurd on its face, for the simple and obvious mathematical reasons anyone with a 4th grade education could understand. But I figured if someone wanted to try it, go for it. Now we're learning catch. Me and every other tax payer is expected to blindly and stupidly finance this boondogle. Thanks, but no thanks.

The deranged fanaticism of people like you would be downright funny... if didn't so happen to cost the rest of us our tax dollars.

Level 7

Since: May 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#26
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

Yes, the Utica Devils were a smashing success. They were at or near the bottom of the league in attendance every single year they played here, constantly complained about attendance numbers and the quality of the arena, and after they left, we haven't SNIFFED an AHL franchise, for those very reasons. Now were supposed to believe the league is DOWNSIZING, when average attendance is 40% greater than the MAXIMUM CAPACITY of the Aud.

My God, what world are you people living in? You people are living in a fantasy world. And more power to you. Just don't take my tax money to finance your absurd delusions.

Level 9

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#27
May 26, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

Truth Dig wrote:
<quoted text>
So let's see if I've got this right: the Devils bolted from Utica to play in a bigger City with a larger arena so they could make more money than they could make here? That's exactly what I've been saying, genius. They got a better deal to play in a bigger city with a bigger arena? No f.cking sh.t.
The average attendance for an AHL team is 5,600 per game. The aud seats 4,000. And it's dump. When the Devils played here, attendance at their games was less than HALF the league average. So how in God's name is this supposed to work? Here's how: the, poor, broke taxpayers of Utica (and undoubtedly Oneida County) will pony up millions in welfare for the corporate owners to make up for embarrassing attendance which, if we're lucky, will be about 2,500 a game, when the rest of the league is averaging 5,600. It will last a year (or 2) until they can find...... a bigger city with a bigger arena. Let's just hope taxpayers aren't hoodwinked into making a big payment up-front.
And Mr. Insider, please explain why, if the Devils were so profitable here, hasn't there been an AHL franchise interested in playing in our little budding metropolis for 20 years? Why are taxpayers expected to guarantee any profit for any private business?
When I first heard about this story, I thought the idea of bringing an AHL franchise was absurd on its face, for the simple and obvious mathematical reasons anyone with a 4th grade education could understand. But I figured if someone wanted to try it, go for it. Now we're learning catch. Me and every other tax payer is expected to blindly and stupidly finance this boondogle. Thanks, but no thanks.
The deranged fanaticism of people like you would be downright funny... if didn't so happen to cost the rest of us our tax dollars.
Why do these idiots want Utica to have an AHL team so bad? That is what I am questioning. No locals are in favor,especially if we have to PAY them. If they come,and we don't have to pay them,ok. This whole deal stinks...

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

Showing posts 1 - 20 of65
< prev page
|
Go to last page| Jump to page:
Type in your comments below
Name
(appears on your post)
Comments
Characters left: 4000
Type the numbers you see in the image on the right:

Please note by clicking on "Post Comment" you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

•••
•••
•••
•••

Utica Jobs

•••
Enter and win $5000
•••
•••

Utica People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

•••

Utica News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in Utica
•••

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]
•••