Teachers have Cadilac Pensions?
Truth

Utica, NY

#221 Aug 13, 2014
Don't paint all teachers with the same broad brush. The vast majority are well meaning, good people. It is the system that we've allowed to evolve that is the problem. We've allowed their unions to create a special class of people exempt from economic forces that the people who pay their salary and benefits have to foot the bill for.

I do think drug testing in any public sector job is appropriate. That includes public safety and all elected officials. Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen though.
Unspecial

Moravia, NY

#222 Aug 13, 2014
Truth wrote:
Don't paint all teachers with the same broad brush. The vast majority are well meaning, good people. It is the system that we've allowed to evolve that is the problem. We've allowed their unions to create a special class of people exempt from economic forces that the people who pay their salary and benefits have to foot the bill for.
I do think drug testing in any public sector job is appropriate. That includes public safety and all elected officials. Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen though.
Unions are a special class of people? How about the millions of people collecting Medicaid and welfare benefits that working folks- including union workers- support? Illegal immigrants? They should have to have mandatory drug tests too. While you're on the subject of pensions and benefits, I find it incredible that teachers are scrutinized but nobody brings up the fact that elected officials get 100% health benefits for life after 10 years of service. And don't think that they will have to settle for Obamacare like the rest of us. Teachers and civil service unions aren't even the icing on that cake!
t POLITIX

Little Falls, NY

#223 Aug 13, 2014
Feel better now that you got that off your chest . . .
Truth Aszhole

Whitesboro, NY

#224 Aug 13, 2014
Truth wrote:
Don't paint all teachers with the same broad brush. The vast majority are well meaning, good people. It is the system that we've allowed to evolve that is the problem. We've allowed their unions to create a special class of people exempt from economic forces that the people who pay their salary and benefits have to foot the bill for.
I do think drug testing in any public sector job is appropriate. That includes public safety and all elected officials. Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen though.
Public sector emplotees are exempt from economic forces? Really? Since when? The average pension in n.y.s. is less than $1000/month you aszwipe. You're a real piece of work.
Truth Aszhole

Whitesboro, NY

#225 Aug 13, 2014
Hey Truth, do u work for a living you touchole? Or are you just an aszwipe pissed because you don't or won't get a pension you prick with ears.
Truth Aszhole

Whitesboro, NY

#226 Aug 13, 2014
Actually, I hope you do work you nitwit. So you can continue to pay taxes to support my upcoming pension that I'll be grabbing in a couple years, asshat
Retired Teacher

Utica, NY

#227 Aug 13, 2014
I had to pay into my pension for 10yrs., I have every rite to collect my NYS Teacher Pension!
Union guy

Utica, NY

#228 Aug 14, 2014
Public Pensions are the greatest thing since slice bread?
Truth

Utica, NY

#229 Aug 14, 2014
Truth Aszhole wrote:
<quoted text>Public sector emplotees are exempt from economic forces? Really? Since when? The average pension in n.y.s. is less than $1000/month you aszwipe. You're a real piece of work.
Again your name calling shows who you are and the weakness of what you have to say. You obviously don't know what you are talking about and lack the prerequisite facts to carry on a reasonable discussion about this.

During the economic downturn (some have called "The Great Recession") that started in 2008 the returns on investment(ROI) for the NYS Pension Fund did not meet the fund manager's projections for what it would take to keep the fund healthy and functioning. That difference had to be made up in order to protect NYS retirees from losing benefits. The taxpayers made up that difference in the form of higher taxes. This, unlike the private sector where many with pensions saw their benefits cut or sustained large losses in their IRA's, 401k"S or other retirement vehicles. What this means is that NYS pensioneers were exempt from what was happening in the real economy. Private sector retirees were not.

Why do you think the governor came up with the Tier 6 concept? It was so that state employees would be more responsible for their own retirements(similar to what has happened in the public sector) and taxpayers wouldn't be on the hook for protecting them in an economic downturn like we've been experiencing for the pas several years.
Truth

Utica, NY

#230 Aug 14, 2014
Retired Teacher wrote:
I had to pay into my pension for 10yrs., I have every rite to collect my NYS Teacher Pension!
Let's use real numbers.

How much did you actually pay into your pension fund? I say the pension funds because you don't have an individual account. Like Social Security contributions go to the fund, not to individual accounts.

Here's the formula used to calculate teacher retirement benefits:
https://www.nystrs.org/main/benefits/service....

Let's use $50k as an example. I think $50k in cash(exempt from NYS tax by the way) and medical benefits is very conservative given the formula and current salaries. It is not unusual for a retiree to live 20 years after retiring.$50k x 20 years =$1 million. The question then is whether during those 10 years when you contributed to your retirement, you put enough in to generate a return anywhere equal to that $1 million. Obviously not. If you did and the system worked that way then taxpayers like me wouldn't have to pay more and more every tear in order to support the NYS Pension Fund.
Truth

Utica, NY

#231 Aug 14, 2014
Truth Aszhole wrote:
Actually, I hope you do work you nitwit. So you can continue to pay taxes to support my upcoming pension that I'll be grabbing in a couple years, asshat
I'm sure that all who know you would be impressed by your language, intelligence and your sentiment. Have a nice day.
Unspecial

Moravia, NY

#232 Aug 14, 2014
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's use real numbers.
How much did you actually pay into your pension fund? I say the pension funds because you don't have an individual account. Like Social Security contributions go to the fund, not to individual accounts.
Here's the formula used to calculate teacher retirement benefits:
https://www.nystrs.org/main/benefits/service....
Let's use $50k as an example. I think $50k in cash(exempt from NYS tax by the way) and medical benefits is very conservative given the formula and current salaries. It is not unusual for a retiree to live 20 years after retiring.$50k x 20 years =$1 million. The question then is whether during those 10 years when you contributed to your retirement, you put enough in to generate a return anywhere equal to that $1 million. Obviously not. If you did and the system worked that way then taxpayers like me wouldn't have to pay more and more every tear in order to support the NYS Pension Fund.
And how much per person for a family of at least 4 on welfare and Medicaid for 20 years? And how much for a town councilman or county legislator, which is not a full time job, for their insurance at 100% for 20 years?
Pensions

Clifton Park, NY

#233 Aug 14, 2014
In case anyone is interested.

http://rocdocs.democratandchronicle.com/datab...
truth pinhead

Whitesboro, NY

#234 Aug 14, 2014
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Again your name calling shows who you are and the weakness of what you have to say. You obviously don't know what you are talking about and lack the prerequisite facts to carry on a reasonable discussion about this.
During the economic downturn (some have called "The Great Recession") that started in 2008 the returns on investment(ROI) for the NYS Pension Fund did not meet the fund manager's projections for what it would take to keep the fund healthy and functioning. That difference had to be made up in order to protect NYS retirees from losing benefits. The taxpayers made up that difference in the form of higher taxes. This, unlike the private sector where many with pensions saw their benefits cut or sustained large losses in their IRA's, 401k"S or other retirement vehicles. What this means is that NYS pensioneers were exempt from what was happening in the real economy. Private sector retirees were not.
Why do you think the governor came up with the Tier 6 concept? It was so that state employees would be more responsible for their own retirements(similar to what has happened in the public sector) and taxpayers wouldn't be on the hook for protecting them in an economic downturn like we've been experiencing for the pas several years.
You're correct, Investment returns were down after the great recession. Is that state employees fault? Why don't you put the blame where it squarely belongs? With Wall St. & the banking industry who thru their greed & stupidity put the economy of this country on it's knees. But no, public employees are your target. You're a fool.
LMC

North Billerica, MA

#235 Aug 14, 2014
It always looks greener on the other side.
Govt Pension

Utica, NY

#236 Aug 14, 2014
Teachers deserve stellar pensions!!!
Umm

Clifton Park, NY

#237 Aug 14, 2014
truth pinhead wrote:
<quoted text>You're correct, Investment returns were down after the great recession. Is that state employees fault? Why don't you put the blame where it squarely belongs? With Wall St. & the banking industry who thru their greed & stupidity put the economy of this country on it's knees. But no, public employees are your target. You're a fool.
Well the working class certainly had no problem taking those easy bank loans did they?
Truth

Whitesboro, NY

#238 Aug 15, 2014
truth pinhead wrote:
<quoted text>You're correct, Investment returns were down after the great recession. Is that state employees fault? Why don't you put the blame where it squarely belongs? With Wall St. & the banking industry who thru their greed & stupidity put the economy of this country on it's knees. But no, public employees are your target. You're a fool.
One of he things that truly amazes me about this exchange is that I believe that you believe the nonsense you're posting.

This is not about blame for economic cycles. The economy cycles constantly up and down. This is about how we respond to the cyclical nature of the economy in dealing with retirement benefits. In the real world of private sector business which has transitioned away from pension plans to 401ks, it is the individual who sustains the losses and has to hope that he/she can make up for those losses before it's time for them to retire. In the public sector NYS Pension system there are no losses for the individual. The taxpayers are called upon to make up the difference so that there are no changes in the amount of the retirement benefit.

In a nutshell, public sector employees in the NYS pension system are exempt(isolated, protected or whatever term you choose to use) from the ever cycling economy and most in the private sector who pay for that are not. The Tier 6 move toward having public sector employees contribute more toward their own retirement is designed to help correct that situation. Do you not understand that?

Calling me names is not going to prove anything(except your inability to have a factual discussion), make you seem more intelligent, hurt my feelings or change the facts.
civil service

Utica, NY

#239 Aug 15, 2014
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
What makes you think that many of the people who don't agree with you don't have degrees and jobs that pay well? Why do you assume that? I can assure you it isn't true but I'm just curious why you make that assumption.
the answer is the same, stop complaining and do something about it, take the test and if you pass it and qualify you too can get a job that offers a pension! you will get nowhere by crying like a little baby. If these people had a good paying job they wouldnt have to be here on topix all of their lives crying!
Truth

Whitesboro, NY

#240 Aug 15, 2014
civil service wrote:
<quoted text>
the answer is the same, stop complaining and do something about it, take the test and if you pass it and qualify you too can get a job that offers a pension! you will get nowhere by crying like a little baby. If these people had a good paying job they wouldnt have to be here on topix all of their lives crying!
First, I'm not crying like a baby. I'm pointing out facts in a taxpayer funded system that is not equitable and is out of touch with the economic realities of the real world.

Second, if I wanted a civil service job I would have taken a test and pursued a career in the public sector. It never appealed to me. That's not the point. I am not envious. I'm angry that we have a system where the benefits in the public sector are so far out of whack with economic reality and I have to put up more and more of what I earn every year to support that system. Twenty five years from now when the benefits of Tier 6 are fully realized taxpayers won't have this problem to the degree that exists now. That really odesn't make me feel that much better though.

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