Truth

Utica, NY

#62 Feb 21, 2013
Lloyd wrote:
<quoted text>
i know my union just took 3 ZEROS for raises so anyone who thinks we dont deserve our pensions we paid for and invested can Pis* up a rope our pension makes billions the state has been trying to dip into it for years! You people had the same opertunities to take the jobs we have we just got off our asses and took a civil service exam and passed some tests and BAM we got a state job, i bet you guys that are complaining are collecting off the system when you should be working....know the facts before you open your mouth!
Lloyd,
If it was you and your public sector co-workers that fully funded the pension system then no one would care about it. Most would probably say "good for you". That isn't the case though. The truth is that your contributions play only a small part in the health of the system. It is taxpayer dollars, private sector taxpayer dollars, that ensures the future of that system. In economic times like these when no one including the pension fund is able to make much return on investment, it is the taxpayer who makes up the difference between the projections for what is needed to perpetuate the fund and the actual return on investment.

You need to do a little research about how the pension fund works and how it is funded. Something besides your union newsletter I mean. I guarantee that if you were to do that you would understand why people are disguted. It's not envy. It's the facts that make this situation ridiculous.
Its Cretin

New Hartford, NY

#63 Feb 21, 2013
Wrong wrote:
<quoted text>Nobody outside utica is jealous of you retard stuck IN utica no matter how good it makes your childish havenot upstate ass to pretend and imagine otherwise. Save it, there's no contest that's why people move away from there and laugh at you for thinking it's "a life" no matter what you pretend. Now go imagine you're a successful billionaire public servant. Freeze dried idiot, at least "most people" can spell toilet so we can see who's NOT being paid much for their brains! LMAO!
Guess who? Yep, it's Cretin creepin' around under a different name and address again! You can run but you can't hide..........Cretin!
sick of it

Utica, NY

#64 Feb 21, 2013
Guest wrote:
<quoted text>. Explain to these good folks what's going to happen when our fiat money goes belly up.
The coming currency crisis is an entirely different problem. You can't keep printing money and not backing it up. Our trade deficit exists because we've made concessions to our creditors (primarily the Chinese). Watch what happens when they come calling. Right now it's good for them . They need American consumers. Eventually. Americans discretionary spending will dry up due to lack of opportunities. The Chinese will demand an asset....more than likely real estate. It's happening now. Long term gold will keep climbing in value. Bet against America and our idiot officials and you will win-guaranteed! Credit ratings will continue to drop, pension and investment values will continue to drop as well and poof! The taxpayers will be handed a bigger bill. This isn't rocket science. You can't keep building a house of cards and thinking the wind isn't going to come along and blow it over. But keep fighting on here and not educating yourself to what's going on around the world and you'll all be fine as one freedom after another is taken away. Enjoy the Daytona 500 because life in America is good because Obama says so!
Truth

Utica, NY

#65 Feb 21, 2013
Proud Public Employee wrote:
What a bunch of envious, whiney morons we have here, who lacked the ambition and insight to get a quality job early in life and now regret it. I was offered a pension but with lower pay for what I do when I was hired. I could have had a similar job in the private sector that would have paid more but had no pension. But, I had to first go to college and spend tens of thousands of dollars to get an education which qualified me for my liscence, which then qualified me to take a test. I then scored high enough on the test to get hired; no one just gave me a free job. I have since spent over 30 years taking care of mentally ill people that no one else would bother with. I and my coworkers have gone to work every day and put up with being assaulted, threatened, and degraded as a routine part of our work. Should we do this for free? Of course not; it's laughable anyone would suggest that. Can just anyone do this kind of work? Not if you care about how well a person is treated. You must be very fortunate to have no mental illness or physical disability in your family. If you did you would understand that it takes much patience and skill to do this work while treating people humanely. Cuomo's proposal for pension changes will never succeed because the pension fund is protected by the state constitution and would require a re-write to change it. Mayors across the state are rejecting it as the fraudulent shell game that it is. Not going to happen. Everyone here had the same choices where you chose to work. I have worked for the public for years and deserve the pension I was promised, in exchange for better pay I could have had if I worked elsewhere. Don't like it? Too bad you didn't work hard, get educated, and get a better job years ago... Public employees are not the only people earning pensions by the way. Many private corporations also offer them. The New York State Employees Retirement system is fully funded and free standing on its own investments. The taxpayer does not pay into it. These are facts and everything else said here is just bullshit from the usual loudmouth know-it-alls out here. Just envious little people who did not plan their lives well...
"The New York State Employees Retirement system is fully funded and free standing on its own investments."

If this is true then why is it that the number one driver of tax and budget increases in every municipality and school district is the employer(that would be the taxpayer) contribution to retirement benefits? Obviously your statement is false. The system cannot be sustained without constant input of tax dollars.

As an educated person you should understand what the situation is in reality.

To your other points. Many, if not most of us work. Most of those work hard too and engage in occupations that can be every bit as challenging as yours. You are not special. You are not entitled to extra because of the work thet YOU chose to do. Many in the private sector went ot college, took out student loans and have all of the same financial burdens you do. What they don't have is a taxpayer funded pension where benefits will last as long as they do. The private sector has mostly transitioned away from pensions to employer sponsored 401k's or like retirement vehicles. It was a business decison because the employer funded pension systems could not be sustained over time due to the rising costs. Unlike the public sector businesses cannot just reach into people's pockets when costs go up. They have to be competetive.

You are wrong. It's not envy. Unions and the union mentality have done more to destroy American jobs than anything else. In New York things will only get worse because the unions in the public sector. People and businesses willl continue to leave for places where they aren't seen as an ATM for public sector worker benefits among other things.
Its Cretin

New Hartford, NY

#66 Feb 21, 2013
Wrong wrote:
<quoted text>LOL! Wronggggggg! 65% goes to phony public safety pretenders. Could you be a little more winy or act like I care? Either way it's not my problem I don't live in NY and pay the retard show so it's not skin off my back what lies you have to blow in order to have self respect. You're all welfare to me. Don't forget it.
Straight from Peotone, Il (he's actually still on his couch, in the basement of his stepdaddy's crack house with one thumb in his azz and the other in his mouth - then he swaps) it's..........Cretin!
Guest

Utica, NY

#67 Feb 21, 2013
sick of it wrote:
<quoted text>
The coming currency crisis is an entirely different problem. You can't keep printing money and not backing it up. Our trade deficit exists because we've made concessions to our creditors (primarily the Chinese). Watch what happens when they come calling. Right now it's good for them . They need American consumers. Eventually. Americans discretionary spending will dry up due to lack of opportunities. The Chinese will demand an asset....more than likely real estate. It's happening now. Long term gold will keep climbing in value. Bet against America and our idiot officials and you will win-guaranteed! Credit ratings will continue to drop, pension and investment values will continue to drop as well and poof! The taxpayers will be handed a bigger bill. This isn't rocket science. You can't keep building a house of cards and thinking the wind isn't going to come along and blow it over. But keep fighting on here and not educating yourself to what's going on around the world and you'll all be fine as one freedom after another is taken away. Enjoy the Daytona 500 because life in America is good because Obama says so!
. Thank you. Now did everyone understand this?
face facts

New York, NY

#68 Feb 21, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
"The New York State Employees Retirement system is fully funded and free standing on its own investments."
Yeah, its so "fully funded" that they brought about Tier 6 a couple years ago to revamp the UNDERFUNDED system.

BTW, I know you didn't originally post that ludicrous statement and rebutted it nicely.
Snowed in

United States

#69 Feb 21, 2013
Guest wrote:
<quoted text>. Thank you. Now did everyone understand this?
Yeah, you're a public servant trying to pretend you pay your way. Thanks!
Snowed in

United States

#70 Feb 21, 2013
Proud Public Employee wrote:
What a bunch of envious, whiney morons we have here, who lacked the ambition and insight to get a quality job early in life and now regret it. I was offered a pension but with lower pay for what I do when I was hired. I could have had a similar job in the private sector that would have paid more but had no pension. But, I had to first go to college and spend tens of thousands of dollars to get an education which qualified me for my liscence, which then qualified me to take a test. I then scored high enough on the test to get hired; no one just gave me a free job. I have since spent over 30 years taking care of mentally ill people that no one else would bother with. I and my coworkers have gone to work every day and put up with being assaulted, threatened, and degraded as a routine part of our work. Should we do this for free? Of course not; it's laughable anyone would suggest that. Can just anyone do this kind of work? Not if you care about how well a person is treated. You must be very fortunate to have no mental illness or physical disability in your family. If you did you would understand that it takes much patience and skill to do this work while treating people humanely. Cuomo's proposal for pension changes will never succeed because the pension fund is protected by the state constitution and would require a re-write to change it. Mayors across the state are rejecting it as the fraudulent shell game that it is. Not going to happen. Everyone here had the same choices where you chose to work. I have worked for the public for years and deserve the pension I was promised, in exchange for better pay I could have had if I worked elsewhere. Don't like it? Too bad you didn't work hard, get educated, and get a better job years ago... Public employees are not the only people earning pensions by the way. Many private corporations also offer them. The New York State Employees Retirement system is fully funded and free standing on its own investments. The taxpayer does not pay into it. These are facts and everything else said here is just bullshit from the usual loudmouth know-it-alls out here. Just envious little people who did not plan their lives well...
You smoke crack. The taxpayer doesn't fund your pension? REALLY? Where does that imaginary money come from Skipper? Please inform.
Also, don't confuse yourself into thinking everyone is so envious. I know what you make and I'm not turning green. Far from it, it reassures me I took the right advice and got a degree that let's me pick and chose and pay into my retirement. As the cookie crumbled I didn't even need to worry either way so get over yourself omg wow is it so bad there that state employees really walk around thinking they're in th etop 5 already?
Its Cretin

New Hartford, NY

#71 Feb 21, 2013
Snowed in wrote:
<quoted text>You smoke crack. The taxpayer doesn't fund your pension? REALLY? Where does that imaginary money come from Skipper? Please inform.
Also, don't confuse yourself into thinking everyone is so envious. I know what you make and I'm not turning green. Far from it, it reassures me I took the right advice and got a degree that let's me pick and chose and pay into my retirement. As the cookie crumbled I didn't even need to worry either way so get over yourself omg wow is it so bad there that state employees really walk around thinking they're in th etop 5 already?
A "degree"? Hmmm..........it's Cretin!
Truth

Utica, NY

#72 Feb 21, 2013
Snowed in wrote:
<quoted text>You smoke crack. The taxpayer doesn't fund your pension? REALLY? Where does that imaginary money come from Skipper? Please inform.
Also, don't confuse yourself into thinking everyone is so envious. I know what you make and I'm not turning green. Far from it, it reassures me I took the right advice and got a degree that let's me pick and chose and pay into my retirement. As the cookie crumbled I didn't even need to worry either way so get over yourself omg wow is it so bad there that state employees really walk around thinking they're in th etop 5 already?
I hope this Proud Public Employee will answer for himself/herself. They seem to be under the false impression that it is the return on the pension fund investments and the contributions of public employees that keep the system going. I don't really how anyone with an ounce of common sense could believe this. I guess you believe what you want to believe because of emotion maybe.

I'm sure most of us have receieved anti-Obama or anti-gun control emails. If we agree with what they say many will blindly forward them without checking the facts. We just desperately want them to be true. The truth though is that most of them are sprinkled with half-truths or some are downright falsehoods. Same thing here. These people don't want to believe that their pension benefits are being subsidized largely by the taxpayers. They would rather believe what their union rep or union newsletter tells them even though it isn't true.

I think in the end it will be math that prevails regardless of anyone's opinion. The pension system cannot be sustained in its' present form and something will have to give. That's the math here. Tier 6 is a bandaid on a gaping wound. That means the promises this poster referred to will have to be broken. When that happens all will know who was funding the public pension system.

I have another bandaid I'd like to suggest. In New York State all public sector pension benefits are exempt from NYS tax. Let's tax those to help backfill the budget gap.
Whiteout

United States

#73 Feb 21, 2013
They'd love that. It's basically what already happens.
face facts

New York, NY

#74 Feb 21, 2013
For the amounts paid out in pensions compared to what is actually withheld from public employees, they must be making about a 50% return on investment, seriously.
Fi Guy

New Hartford, NY

#75 Feb 21, 2013
face facts wrote:
For the amounts paid out in pensions compared to what is actually withheld from public employees, they must be making about a 50% return on investment, seriously.
You're completely wrong unless you intended for that to be humorous. In order to support the current level of payouts, massive influxes of tax payer cash are needed. The fact that the taxpayers are shouldering the burden is not even a debatable topic.
See this recent article: http://www.uticaod.com/news/x1146194462/Pensi...
Truth

Utica, NY

#76 Feb 21, 2013
Fi Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
The fact that the taxpayers are shouldering the burden is not even a debatable topic.
Tell that to the Proud Public Employee and those who support his/her post.

Nice link by the way. Thank you for interjecting facts.
Fi Guy

New Hartford, NY

#77 Feb 21, 2013
proud public employee

West Hartford, CT

#78 Feb 21, 2013
Envious little trolls, couldnt make it on their own, have to beat up on others to feel better abput themselves. Oh well, argue all you want, believe whatever you want. The pension sytem is constitutionally protected in New York State, you'e not gonna change it posting out here. I start collecting mine very soon. I think I will move to North Carolina where there is no state tax as I dont intend to invest another dime in New York.
Fi Guy

New Hartford, NY

#79 Feb 21, 2013
proud public employee wrote:
Envious little trolls, couldnt make it on their own, have to beat up on others to feel better abput themselves. Oh well, argue all you want, believe whatever you want. The pension sytem is constitutionally protected in New York State, you'e not gonna change it posting out here. I start collecting mine very soon. I think I will move to North Carolina where there is no state tax as I dont intend to invest another dime in New York.
No doubt when it comes to your money! Amazing!
The plastic fantastic

United States

#80 Feb 21, 2013
"Envious" of someone who makes half or a third of what I do? Ever clear 47k after taxes for two weeks work? Couldn't make it on my OWN? You're the one who had to dance for the 70k are you serious? I don't care if you believe it or not if you're the arrogant example of the envious little squirrel that got himself a peanut no thanks. What's it like to know that some people have at 32 what you still don't have at 60? GET the fk out of there already then that was a good one!
wrong again

Herkimer, NY

#81 Feb 21, 2013
proud public employee wrote:
Envious little trolls, couldnt make it on their own, have to beat up on others to feel better abput themselves. Oh well, argue all you want, believe whatever you want. The pension sytem is constitutionally protected in New York State, you'e not gonna change it posting out here. I start collecting mine very soon. I think I will move to North Carolina where there is no state tax as I dont intend to invest another dime in New York.
Dipshit, there is state tax in North Carolina.

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