Wyman report online now

Wyman report online now

Posted in the Utica Forum

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Cooper

Utica, NY

#1 Dec 13, 2013
http://oneidacountysheriff.us/download/OCSO_K...

Where's the guy who talks like he knows everything about what happened? I don't think he's gonna like this.
still misdirecting

Clark Mills, NY

#2 Dec 13, 2013
Cooper wrote:
http://oneidacountysheriff.us/ download/OCSO_Knoxboro_Rd_AAR_ 122013.pdf
Where's the guy who talks like he knows everything about what happened? I don't think he's gonna like this.

Again they are making it seem as though Patterson fired first... not the case!!!
pretend to be smart

Utica, NY

#3 Dec 13, 2013
They completely pat themselves on the back in that report and state "total culpability" lies with Patterson alone.

Where was it addressed in this report where Wyman and other individuals who were NOT trained for these situations were allowed to remain there?
Cooper

Utica, NY

#4 Dec 13, 2013
Blame does lie with Patterson. I thought that before and I'm even more convinced after reading this report.

It's like the report said- Patterson could have ended the whole thing at any time before it escalated. He ignored repeated requests and orders from law enforcement and when hit with non-lethal force designed to get him to submit, he fired killing Deputy Wyman. Patterson is exactly where he should be.

You dishonor the memory of Deputy Wyman with your nonsensical posts.
fcktard

Little Falls, NY

#6 Dec 13, 2013
As expected wrote:
As predicted by many. The cowards of the county took a suicidal standoff, turned it into a gunfight and got their untrained guy killed. It's funny this is the only time I ever saw cops shoot at someone like that, get their own guy killed and all these supposed expert excuse makers blame only the goof with the gun. It sounds like every single person on the property was either an idiot or an incompetent. Par for the course everybody knew they wouldn't man up why did that only take 3 years?
spot on.

They totally contradict themselves in the report also. They acknowledge the man was suicidal, yet go on to say he could have ended it at any time. Wrong. They clearly identify he is in a mental state which would not give way to rational thought to actually come out and end the stand off. They get an F for this cover up of a report.

And they still do not bring up the untrained people, Wyman included, who never should have been allowed to stay there once the ERT showed up to handle the stand off.

Maciol and the OCSO killed Wyman with their ineptitude.
fcktard

Little Falls, NY

#7 Dec 13, 2013
Cooper wrote:
Blame does lie with Patterson. I thought that before and I'm even more convinced after reading this report.
It's like the report said- Patterson could have ended the whole thing at any time before it escalated. He ignored repeated requests and orders from law enforcement and when hit with non-lethal force designed to get him to submit, he fired killing Deputy Wyman. Patterson is exactly where he should be.
You dishonor the memory of Deputy Wyman with your nonsensical posts.
He dishonored himself when he remained involved at a scene he was clearly not trained to handle. Gung ho and got killed.

Experts nationwide all say the same thing, this situation was not handled correctly once they identified Patterson as suicidal. It was amateur hour and you never shoot at a suicidal person. The idiots who are credited for creating this report are complicit in the cover up now as well and should been deemed corrupt.
Chrissy

Grenaa, Denmark

#8 Dec 13, 2013
I can't take it cleaning toilets, the foil on my dump walls didn't stop the aliens from probing me, the home depot doors didn't stop the smell of cow sht all day long from driving me into a gutless cow ard state.

Mommy I need my dollies an teddy bear to hug when the inmates get off the top of me. The cheapest weapon didn't stop the aliens either.

Santa being me some K-Y it hurts.

HELP I CAN'T TAKE IT.....
fcktard

Little Falls, NY

#10 Dec 13, 2013
A member of the Sheriff's Office told me in person they knew they screwed this all up. The State Police offered assistance but Rob "the slob" let his ego get in the way and told them they could handle it.

Best of all, Maciol was only sheriff less than 6 months and got the first deputy in decades killed in the line of duty.
Da Law

Malone, NY

#11 Dec 13, 2013
The report confirms almost everything that was speculated. The most important being the total collapse of command and control functions and Dep. Wyman's refusal to obey a direct order. The truly disturbing part is this:

"Nothing will change the outcome of this incident now. What anyone did or did not do is therefore now irrelevant, except for the role this awareness will lead to their future actions."

In essence, the whole debacle was a big "Oopsie!" for everyone involved, sadly confirming the review's relationship to any concept of accountability.
Da Law

Malone, NY

#12 Dec 13, 2013
From the report:

"Meanwhile, Patterson had removed a jacket from the rear of the garage and began to put it on. When his right hand left the shotgun, ERTC and NEG2 simultaneously decided it was the opportune time to use the less lethal projectiles to at tempt to separate Patterson from the shotgun. ERT3 and ERT4 fired and both less lethal rounds struck Patterson in the torso, knocking him backwards into the wall."

This is either maddingly unclear or intentionally vague. Did ERTC and NEG2 yell "Fire!" to ERT3 and ERT4?

If that's the case then Patterson probably deserves a retrial.

Consider: He's blinded by multiple lightsources, hears someone yell "Fire!", gets hit by two rounds, and *then* opens fire.

That's an issue that his defense, to my knowledge, didn't bring up at the original trial. Patterson couldn't see anything, being dazzled by the scene lighting. His shots are consistent with someone blindly firing at those lights- the flashlight in Wyman's hand and the mount light on unit 462.
Truth

Utica, NY

#13 Dec 13, 2013
The report is clear, there was no reason to for Wyman to have been killed. Many, many , many mistakes were made. No policies and no training,
Wktv sucks

Ardsley, NY

#14 Dec 13, 2013
Wktv is scared to talk negative of the OC Sheriffs office. Wtvh breaks the report down and criticizes the sheriffs office. Bc it is the sheriffs office that screwed up. Also Wyman was told not to use the taser unless he was told to. Typical loose cannon. Sad that he had to die but he caused his death by not listening. What would you do if you were shot at and didn't know they were non lethal weapons and someone was rushing at you.
Typical Maciol BS

Vernon Center, NY

#15 Dec 13, 2013
What a poorly constructed and poorly written document. I've seen far better work produced by High School Sophomores. After all this time and after all the whitewashing, the report is the piece of garbage everyone with half a brain knew it would be.

My favorite portion of the report is right at the beginning. How many "investigative" reports begin with a memorial on the cover page? If the report was actually an investigation, it wouldn't memorialize anyone. Rather, it would stick to facts, which this report fails to do.

Next, the four authors are identified and summary details of their experience or education is provided, but no dates. Might as well state the report was prepared by Mickey Mouse. Credibility for the report is generated from technical expertise through experience and education. Why wasn't a resume for each author included? Another fail of the so-called report.

Next, Page 3 defines "Assumptions of the After Action Report". Excuse me, but statements blaming guilt on Mr Patterson are not assumptions; they are conclusions, and they are emotional, not technical. The report is so damn bias and full of emotional hogwash, it's sickening. Yet, it warns readers to not be caught up in "hindsight bias". What a joke!!!

There is so much wrong with the design of the document, let alone the BS conveyed it it's contents, it's appalling. That's only the first few pages.
Typical Maciol BS

Vernon Center, NY

#16 Dec 13, 2013
Truth wrote:
The report is clear, there was no reason to for Wyman to have been killed. Many, many , many mistakes were made. No policies and no training,
Correct, and the blame falls directly on the shoulders of Maciol.
Truth is

Utica, NY

#17 Dec 14, 2013
Looks like the county is paying a full time topix judge to sit around and judge comments! What a waste of time!
Da Law

Malone, NY

#18 Dec 14, 2013
Typical Maciol BS wrote:
Next, the four authors are identified and summary details of their experience or education is provided, but no dates. Might as well state the report was prepared by Mickey Mouse. Credibility for the report is generated from technical expertise through experience and education. Why wasn't a resume for each author included?
This isn't really a valid criticism. The report has flaws, in particular the vagueness of the command situation for the fire order I mentioned order, but in general it's a good piece of work given what they had to work with. Someone like Ranalli isn't going to put his name on a whitewash.
Da Law

Malone, NY

#19 Dec 14, 2013
Typical Maciol BS wrote:
<quoted text>
Correct, and the blame falls directly on the shoulders of Maciol.
Ultimately, yes, since he's the elected official in charge of the entire department. Based on the narrative in the report he did the right thing by deferring incident and tactical control to more experienced officers.
Da Law

Malone, NY

#20 Dec 14, 2013
fcktard wrote:
<quoted text>
And they still do not bring up the untrained people, Wyman included, who never should have been allowed to stay there once the ERT showed up to handle the stand off.
Your assertion is totally at odds with the actual content of the report. Read it again. The examination of the training issues, and the resulting loss of command and control, is absolutely unflinching.
Da Law

Malone, NY

#21 Dec 14, 2013
Cooper wrote:
Blame does lie with Patterson. I thought that before and I'm even more convinced after reading this report.
I totally agree.
It's like the report said- Patterson could have ended the whole thing at any time before it escalated. He ignored repeated requests and orders from law enforcement and when hit with non-lethal force designed to get him to submit, he fired killing Deputy Wyman. Patterson is exactly where he should be.
No, he's not. He should be in prison for manslaughter, not murder.
You dishonor the memory of Deputy Wyman with your nonsensical posts.
And you seem to be conflating the OCSD with the memory of Deputy Wyman. The two are not one and the same.
Sojourner Truth

Utica, NY

#22 Dec 14, 2013
It's very easy to armchair/Monday morning quarterback this. At the end of the day it's a sad and tragic reality that could've definitely been prevented, as even the most casual report reader will deduce. Serious and deadly mistakes were made and NOT one person needed to die or even suffer the pain of gunshots inside of this situation. This is deduced, not just from the report, but from a review of policies, procedures and anecdotal, real time experiences regarding exact or similar situations involving other police agencies. What does seem the greatest tragedy now is the apparent lack of sincere accountability in this report. Being a cop is not necessarily easy,and can be exceedingly dangerous and stressful, and for the truly good ones they deserve our respect and support, but the job requires utmost professionalism, responsibility and accountability for actions or inaction and professionalism, responsibility and accountability to the citizens and their rights they (the police) are sworn to protect, defend and uphold without bias. This comes in many forms and should be accompanied by a requisite amount of humility rather than smug bravado or condescending, ego-driven or self-promoting narcissism, etc...

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