NMSU-A nursing program is strong

NMSU-A nursing program is strong

There are 58 comments on the Alamogordo Daily News story from Aug 15, 2010, titled NMSU-A nursing program is strong. In it, Alamogordo Daily News reports that:

In response to a letter to the editor in the Daily News on July 25 about New Mexico State University-Alamogordo's nursing program having serious issues that need addressing, the current nursing program is, indeed, in transition.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Alamogordo Daily News.

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Florence

Roswell, NM

#1 Aug 15, 2010
I saw this letter coming a mile away.
It all sounds 'great' on paper, however, only time will tell how the NMSU-A Nursing Program will fare. For the upcoming students, I wish them well. This is the foundation of their nursing knowledge base. Our community needs educated, dedicated nurses who sincerly want to be care givers, not just another warm body picking up a pay check! If we lose this program our community will suffer greatly!
As for the new instructors, I wish them the best. Inquiring minds still wonder why the current administration lost so many of the previous instructions, who were very qualified and extremly dedicated to the education of our new RNs.
As for the NCLEX, Dr. Star, you still can't explain WHY so many for the recent nursing classes failed their NCLEX, the majority of them failed on both their FIRST and SECOND attemps. Those results speak for themselves, and of NMSU-A Nursing Program. SOMEONE dropped the ball with those students. FYI: Take home test did not educated them on the critial thinking needed for Medical/Surgical Nursing. This is a vital part of their core training.
question

Chandler, AZ

#2 Aug 15, 2010
Florence: you contradict yourself. According to you, the majority of the students did not pass the NCLEX even though the data shows otherwise. It also sounds like you have been replaced and that is your overriding concern--not the students or the program. Is this a correct assumption?
Answer

Cloudcroft, NM

#4 Aug 15, 2010
Gee, I wonder which delightful member of the NMSU-A Administration posted the insulting response to Florence's comment to the article? The article in question is an obvious attempt to whitewash the mess they made of the NMSU-A Nursing Program resulting in the exodus of top notch professionals that were the NMSU-A Nursing faculty. As for the new students entering the program, good luck, you're going to need it.
Resident

Carrizozo, NM

#5 Aug 15, 2010
I think Florence was removed from the program in some capacity.
Inquirer

Alamogordo, NM

#6 Aug 15, 2010
Florence, you said "someone dropped the ball." Well, if the ball was dropped, who did the dropping? It has been implied it was the current administration. But, how can that be when Dr. Starr only became director in August of 2009 and she did not teach any of the student who graduated in 2009. So who dropped the ball? It looks to me, it was as you said, "the previous instructions (sp - instructors), who were very qualified and extremly dedicated" who did the dropping of the ball.
Florence

Roswell, NM

#7 Aug 15, 2010
question wrote:
Florence: you contradict yourself. According to you, the majority of the students did not pass the NCLEX even though the data shows otherwise. It also sounds like you have been replaced and that is your overriding concern--not the students or the program. Is this a correct assumption?
NO, THIS IS NOT A CORRECT ASSUMPTION! I fail to see the contradiction. It is simple. There have been many students from the past 2 years that have failed their NCLEX, not once but twice! These graduate nurses have suffered emotionally and finacially because of the delay in their RN license. I realize that they hold their own fate in dedicating themselves to prepare for the NCLEX, but the majority of them feel they were failed by certain instructors.

Since Jack Rogers left the NMSU-A program, a downhill spiral began, starting with the interum director and currently with Dr. Star. The interum director also became their Medical/Surgical Instructor, and from what came out of those classes became a joke. That semester is the CORE of their nursing knowledge base. Without it you are lost.

The dedicated instructors left because they could not stand by and watch the Nursing Program continue in the matter it was going. As with everything there is the "elite group" that runs the show, they were not part of that group, nor did the instructors want to be! Their voices were not being heard, therfore they decided to leave before the ship sank.

For your information, I am not an instructor but a former student of the NMSU-A Nursing Program! I am sure you know that statistics can be manipulated to show favor in one direction or another. The bottom line is those students who have graduated under that "screwed up" administraion did not receieve the education that they paid for. Here is where you see the difference between a nurse educator who is dedicated to teaching future nurses and an nurse educator who is there to pick up a pay check. The results can be seen in the final product that comes out of that nursing program.

I do consider myself one of the lucky ones, I have the honor of being taught by Mrs. Diehl, Mrs. Fritze, Mrs. Weitzel, Mrs. Andreoli, Mrs. Gilliand, Mrs. Edenburg, and Mr. Rogers as my instructors. They didn't hold my hand and baby me through the program, they didn't give us take home test, which would have lead to no challenge to our learning process.

I am a nurse in our community that works with those students who failed their NCLEX, not once but twice and are now forced to work as a CNAs until they pass their boards, or not work at all. I work with students who are entering or are still in the program and they are scared to death at the future of the NMSU-A program. As a nurse in our local community, I am scared of the end result that will come out of NMSU-A. As this will be the new nurse that will work along side me or take care of myself or my loved ones.

The reason for all the turmoil is we want someone to clean house up there and stop this "elite group" from running our nursing program into the ground.
Florence

Roswell, NM

#8 Aug 15, 2010
Resident wrote:
I think Florence was removed from the program in some capacity.
Resident, you would be amazed at what this nurse went through to graduate with top honors from the NMSU-A Nursing Program.

May I ask if you are one of the many people who never made it through the program and perhaps are very bitter? Uh?
If so, I suggest that you enroll this semester as they are accepting 32 students and perhaps someone will hold your hand and give you take home tests. But then when it comes time for your NCLEX you will have to really study, as you will probably need it.
Florence

Roswell, NM

#9 Aug 15, 2010
Inquirer wrote:
Florence, you said "someone dropped the ball." Well, if the ball was dropped, who did the dropping? It has been implied it was the current administration. But, how can that be when Dr. Starr only became director in August of 2009 and she did not teach any of the student who graduated in 2009. So who dropped the ball? It looks to me, it was as you said, "the previous instructions (sp - instructors), who were very qualified and extremly dedicated" who did the dropping of the ball.
Inquirer, I think I answered those questions for you.
Let's just say "those people" still have the BALL and the dedicated educators have left the court. Many of them have gone on to join a much better team, so to speak!
A concerned Mom

Albuquerque, NM

#10 Aug 15, 2010
I have learned first hand how wrong the nursing program is here in Alamogordo. My daughter was told to get all her nursing classes and take the nursing exam before she applied to the nursing program. She did all this and passed only to be told she didn't get into the nursing program because it's not what you know sweetie, it's who you know! Holding her head up high she decided to apply to another in state college only to be told that the Alamogordo office didn't transfer her records in time and, if they had she would have been excepted.Please keep in mind my daughter requested this with a month notice. Still wondering how many other military families have been treated by The AlamogordoN
Stickler

Phoenix, AZ

#11 Aug 16, 2010
Florence wrote:
<quoted text>
..... I am sure you know that statistics can be manipulated to show favor in one direction or another. "
BON reports an 85% pass rate during 2009, the most recent reporting period. Are you saying that the BON manipulated these figures?
another stickler

Cloudcroft, NM

#12 Aug 16, 2010
Wait until the end of October when the latest scores from the NM Nursing Board come out, and you will see what all the fuss is about. Everyone also needs to carefully re-read the text of Florence's response to "question." I know she used complete sentences, conveyed her thoughts clearly and concisely, and even used a big word or two. The nerve!

In the meantime, if you want to really find out what is happening with the MNSU-A nursing program, just enroll in the fall semester. Hey, there are over 30 slots available! Prerequisites? You know, that stuff you have to know before even entering the nursing program is being changed, for the easier I hear. So, who needs a strong math and science background before entering the MNSU-A Nursing program? I mean, learning that stuff is so hard! So, now you're in the program. Be prepared to give up two years of your life, and a lot of money for tuition, books, labs, etc. I hear there are now lots of easy, on-line courses too with the revamp of the curriculum. They are all the rage now, you know. Never mind that you won't really learn anything in them as compared to a real class room setting with a real nursing instructor. And, oh boy, take home exams! I can't help but think there are easy A's there! Who doesn't want their ego stroked with getting easy A's? Sweet! And, as we all know, employers look for high grade point averages instead of silly stuff like competency! And here we are, two years later, you're on stage at graduation thanking everybody you can think of for helping you out to get your degree. Oh oh, here comes that pesky Nursing Board exam that you have to pass so you can become an RN. What!? You failed it? Could it be because you just weren't taught the skills and given the knowlege to pass the exam? Is the NMSU-A administration going to be upset by this? Of course not. They got your money, you got a degree. And ... no refunds if the degree fails to live up to expectations. At least you got to be in one of the lovely new buildings built on campus. They are really nice. I hear the new Nursing building is a real "gas!"

Oh, if the administration tries to pin this on the departed instructors who tried to prevent all this, don't believe for a minute.
Robert

Cerrillos, NM

#13 Aug 16, 2010
Yes, it is obvious how well the nursing program is doing when the nurses coming out of the program are incompetent and shouldn't be allowed to care for anyone. Instead of numbers, maybe the nursing program needs to teach their nurses about saving lives and trying not to kill people in the process. The program is a joke now and they will let anyone in the program with half a brain.
maybe

Mayhill, NM

#14 Aug 16, 2010
A concerned Mom wrote:
I have learned first hand how wrong the nursing program is here in Alamogordo. My daughter was told to get all her nursing classes and take the nursing exam before she applied to the nursing program. She did all this and passed only to be told she didn't get into the nursing program because it's not what you know sweetie, it's who you know! Holding her head up high she decided to apply to another in state college only to be told that the Alamogordo office didn't transfer her records in time and, if they had she would have been excepted.Please keep in mind my daughter requested this with a month notice. Still wondering how many other military families have been treated by The AlamogordoN
Slow transcripts are just part of it. That's not the nursing department's job to send. I've had to drive to the town and pick my kids' up when needed. Help your daughter out by making sure the paperwork is sent in on time. Parents and/or students have to do this all the time...and sometimes it takes more than a month. I'm just saying...
NMSU-A graduate

Alamogordo, NM

#15 Aug 17, 2010
Robert wrote:
Yes, it is obvious how well the nursing program is doing when the nurses coming out of the program are incompetent and shouldn't be allowed to care for anyone. Instead of numbers, maybe the nursing program needs to teach their nurses about saving lives and trying not to kill people in the process. The program is a joke now and they will let anyone in the program with half a brain.
I agree that the nursing program is in serious need of help, and that it seems impossible to me to produce skilled nurses without a hands-on approach to teaching...BUT

Robert, your blanket statement is absurd. I, and many of my fellow NMSU-A nursing graduates are highly skilled professionals that required far more than "half-a-brain" to enter the program, and certainly to pass the NCLEX. I think that it is so unfair to stamp the students that are currently entering the program as being flawed or 'incompetent' or in anyway less than those that came before them simply due to the change in staff. They are entering a field that is so demanding and draining and taxing already, and they shouldn't have to listen to ignorant people making ignorant statements about their role in life and death, before they even have the chance to prove themselves.

We as nurses, as individuals, choose the type of nurse we are going to be...our education does not assign it to us.
Grad from old regime

Houston, TX

#16 Aug 17, 2010
The former faculty believed in quality and outcomes. They did not play into numbers. Students were admitted needing to have certain prerequisites, and an entrance exam. This was decided using evidence and student success outcomes. The former faculty built the program using research and evidence to enhance student outcomes. If you look at the board pass rates this is reflected. I would ask that people do not take my word for this, look at the statistics and ask how they came to the conclusion of their pass rate. You should see the downward trend since May 2008 since the intern took over in the pass rates. In fact, I implore the newspaper to post the pass rates of each semester graduating class. As well, watch for the BON statistics for 2009 for more proof.
I have seen this firsthand throughout my schooling there.
The program was not easy. There was not take home tests until the interim director showed up. Students knew their stuff when they passed.
The curriculum was not just pulled out of the air. It was a two year project that was thought through. Now it is just a whim. This is how you produce quality professionals in the field.
No program sends students to clinical unprepared. Not even diploma programs. The students will be going to clinical without any science or knowlege to make the experience meaningful.
The students cannot be successful if they are not taught what they need to know. The students cannot pass boards if they are not taught how to take a nursing exam. The students cannot learn if the clinical time is just space taking, and not hands on learning that fits the content.
You all took an oath to uphold the profession. I would suggest keeping it.

Take home tests and lax teaching methods are to blame.
old timer

Albuquerque, NM

#17 Aug 17, 2010
It is truly sad to hear and work with some of the students that recently graduated from NMSU-A nursing program and failed the NCLEX exam. These graduate nurses have worked hard in school only to fail the exam, and some even for a second time. It is indeed a reflection on the program as a whole.

Yes you say that there was a 85% pass rate, but for how many students? I believe the past enrollment was for only aproximately 20 students. Figure out the math!! I personally know that the second to last graduating class had 8 students fail, so how could that account for a 85% pass rate. Oh maybe those percentages have not posted as of yet.

As a resident of Alamogordo with over 30 years of professional nursing experience, and still practicing, I feel that if we want to provide quality nursing care in our community then the program needs to teach the students basic nursing skills, such as Caring and Compassion. These two qualities are by far the basis for a competent nurse. It appears that many of today's nurses just go into the field of health care for the money.

To the students entering the nursing program this semester, I wish all of you the best of luck. Study hard, stay focused, and God Bless.
Mother Father Spirit

La Luz, NM

#18 Aug 17, 2010
Mother Father Spirit, please save our nursing program, that's all I have to say.
one of the old

Albuquerque, NM

#19 Aug 17, 2010
My question to Dr Starr is:
If this program is so wonderful, why then, over the last 3 semesters did Mrs Diehl, Mrs Fritze, Mrs Weitzel, Mrs Bolin, Mrs Eydenburg, and Mrs gililland all resign? Does that even remotely hit home to someone? 6 instructors quit after Mrs Ramey and Dr Starr arrived on the scene.
I think that speaks loudly!!!!

I also think that a program director should have a masters and or a doctorate from an accredited school in NURSING, not something else. We hear all of the time that there shouldn't be religion in schools, yet Dr Starr tells us all about the mother father spirit...who is she to preach to us about that? Save that for Theology, not Nursing.
one of the old

Albuquerque, NM

#20 Aug 17, 2010
Stickler wrote:
<quoted text>
BON reports an 85% pass rate during 2009, the most recent reporting period. Are you saying that the BON manipulated these figures?
that is a average number...there are 2 cohorts, 1 that graduates in may and another that graduates in december. There are also different number of students in each cohort, so depending on how many graduate and pass/fail, depends on the average. That average is combined with the 2nd cohort for the total average.
In the semester I graduated from there were 9 of us. 8 of the 9 passed on the first attempt, giving my cohort a 88% pass rate. It will differ in each cohort. The BON statistic is for 1st time NCLEX takers only, not retesters.
That is for 2008. Just wait for the 2009 statistics...
Robert

Cerrillos, NM

#21 Aug 17, 2010
NMSU-A graduate wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree that the nursing program is in serious need of help, and that it seems impossible to me to produce skilled nurses without a hands-on approach to teaching...BUT
Robert, your blanket statement is absurd. I, and many of my fellow NMSU-A nursing graduates are highly skilled professionals that required far more than "half-a-brain" to enter the program, and certainly to pass the NCLEX. I think that it is so unfair to stamp the students that are currently entering the program as being flawed or 'incompetent' or in anyway less than those that came before them simply due to the change in staff. They are entering a field that is so demanding and draining and taxing already, and they shouldn't have to listen to ignorant people making ignorant statements about their role in life and death, before they even have the chance to prove themselves.
We as nurses, as individuals, choose the type of nurse we are going to be...our education does not assign it to us.
First, would you like me to change my blanket statement to statements that are more specific about recently graduated nursing students? I could do that, but I do not think this is the appropriate forum. The appropriate forum is the administration these newly graduated students work for. And for the record, nurses are not the only people that work hard for their degrees, and choose to become the person they will be in their profession, regardless of how and what they have been taught. Isn't the nursing program only an Associate's Degree?

I have never seen such a group of people who thought they were better than everyone else than on these forums, and the surrounding community. My wife graduated from this program in 1982, the second graduating class of the program. She does not feel the need to be superior to others, nor does she make mistakes as frequently as the newly graduating nurses do. I can not tell you how many times I was thankful my wife was there in the hospital with me. Have you ever seen a newly graduated nurse try to give a diabetic 20 units of insulin in a 5cc syringe? Now that is nothing to brag about, nor be proud of. In fact, that is something called ignorance that you and your fellow cohorts NEED to listen to. Patient complaints are one of the best ways to learn and better yourselves with nursing, especially in a hospital setting. Unfortunately, some dont get to complain. They die before they do. But I wont go into specifics on that, as I said before, this is not the appropriate forum, so take my blanket statement as you will.

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