UVA President Wins National Advocate for Higher Education Award

Full story: NBC29 Charlottesville

Teresa A. Sullivan received the 2013 Advocate for Higher Education Award Wednesday evening at the Public Relations Society of America's Counselors to Higher Education Senior Summit, being held in Washington, D.C. Sullivan delivered the organization's Pat Jackson Lecture Wednesday evening on "Building a Cathedral: Leadership in American Higher ... (more)
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jogger

Hillsville, VA

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#1
Apr 18, 2013
 

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Another meaningless award...from an organization no one has ever heard of before or ever will in the future....no wonder higher education is going to the dogs....
Liberalace

Charlottesville, VA

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Apr 18, 2013
 

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Look, I was no fan of Dragas's or how that was handled, but I am quite familiar with PRSA and they are the main trade group for the public relations business. Think about what PR people do...in that light, Sullivan certainly did receive an award. Either by design or luck, she came out on the plus side in spades in a public relations war.

The award has little to do with the success of UVa or her efficacy as a president. Just a trade group with specialists in the public relations of education blowing their own horn.

Now, move along boys and girls. Nothing to see here.

R.I.P.: David Arroyo, Sr.
sez you

Charlottesville, VA

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#3
Apr 18, 2013
 
Liberalace wrote:
Look, I was no fan of Dragas's or how that was handled, but I am quite familiar with PRSA and they are the main trade group for the public relations business. Think about what PR people do...in that light, Sullivan certainly did receive an award. Either by design or luck, she came out on the plus side in spades in a public relations war.
The award has little to do with the success of UVa or her efficacy as a president. Just a trade group with specialists in the public relations of education blowing their own horn.
Now, move along boys and girls. Nothing to see here.
R.I.P.: David Arroyo, Sr.
Sounds like something I'd say. Dragas did dig her own hole though.
harry

Charlottesville, VA

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#4
Apr 18, 2013
 
Cathedrals don't impoverish those who attend or their parents. Since 1978 college tuition has increased 1,120%, medical care 600%, shelter 376%, consumer price index 276% and food 220%.
Sullivan is part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#5
Apr 18, 2013
 

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jogger wrote:
Another meaningless award...from an organization no one has ever heard of before or ever will in the future....no wonder higher education is going to the dogs....
Higher education is going to the dogs. But its got nothing whatsoever to do with Sullivan and what she represents.

It has to do with the ignorant, moronic, anti-intellectual stuff that you and Dragas represent. YOU are participating in sending it to the dogs.
sez you

Charlottesville, VA

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#7
Apr 18, 2013
 
Hmmmmm wrote:
<quoted text>
Higher education is going to the dogs. But its got nothing whatsoever to do with Sullivan and what she represents.
It has to do with the ignorant, moronic, anti-intellectual stuff that you and Dragas represent. YOU are participating in sending it to the dogs.
No it has to do with politicians wanting to not support education to keep the unwashed masses in the tank. Thats why the US is ranked so low on the global scale. It serves their purpose. The US is a prime example of what happens when a few see themselves as knowing whats best for the many. The sad part? We let it happen.
sez you

Charlottesville, VA

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#8
Apr 18, 2013
 
Hmmmmm wrote:
<quoted text>
Higher education is going to the dogs. But its got nothing whatsoever to do with Sullivan and what she represents.
It has to do with the ignorant, moronic, anti-intellectual stuff that you and Dragas represent. YOU are participating in sending it to the dogs.
This is the end effect of capitalism, its all about the dollar.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#9
Apr 18, 2013
 
harry wrote:
Cathedrals don't impoverish those who attend or their parents. Since 1978 college tuition has increased 1,120%, medical care 600%, shelter 376%, consumer price index 276% and food 220%.
Sullivan is part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Well, don't leave us guessing harry. Lay it out there. Exactly what are the causes of increased tuition? And exactly what has/does Sullivan do that makes her part of the problem? Inquiring minds want to know.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#10
Apr 18, 2013
 

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sez you wrote:
<quoted text>No it has to do with politicians wanting to not support education to keep the unwashed masses in the tank. Thats why the US is ranked so low on the global scale. It serves their purpose. The US is a prime example of what happens when a few see themselves as knowing whats best for the many. The sad part? We let it happen.
What you just said is meaningless.

Although what politicians do plays a role. And that role is related to what amounts to tax revolts these days where - for some bizarre reason - people target schools rather than serious tax issues - you know, like wars and massive corporate subsidies.
harry

Charlottesville, VA

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#11
Apr 18, 2013
 
Hmmmmm wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, don't leave us guessing harry. Lay it out there. Exactly what are the causes of increased tuition? And exactly what has/does Sullivan do that makes her part of the problem? Inquiring minds want to know.
Dripping with condescension Hmmmmm? BOV has detailed the problems with Sullivan in a long list and they continue to pressure her on those items. Average faculty salaries are the highest in Virginia by a good margin and she wants more. I don't think she knows she is supposed to run an efficient school with productivity improvements rather than salary increases. My personal view is she thinks she works for the Faculty Senate rather than the BOV.
Her own compensation reported at $695,000/yr. is higher than the United States President and Vice-President combined. If you look at the list of salaries published in the Cavalier Daily there is an appalling high level of salaries and numbers of people in administrative positions.
That's for starters...I have more.
So lets hear your defense of Sullivan.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#12
Apr 18, 2013
 
harry wrote:
<quoted text>
Dripping with condescension Hmmmmm? BOV has detailed the problems with Sullivan in a long list and they continue to pressure her on those items. Average faculty salaries are the highest in Virginia by a good margin and she wants more. I don't think she knows she is supposed to run an efficient school with productivity improvements rather than salary increases. My personal view is she thinks she works for the Faculty Senate rather than the BOV.
Her own compensation reported at $695,000/yr. is higher than the United States President and Vice-President combined. If you look at the list of salaries published in the Cavalier Daily there is an appalling high level of salaries and numbers of people in administrative positions.
That's for starters...I have more.
So lets hear your defense of Sullivan.
Regardless of what you want to think about salaries there, UVA faculty salaries - as they are through the entire VA system - lag well behind the market. UVA is Virgina's flagship school so it isn't odd at all that, among schools in VA, salaries there would be highest. But that still leaves them below peer institutions elsewhere.

But more to the point, you have now implied that the increasing costs of higher ed are from high faculty salaries. In your first post you gave a bit about tuition inflation. You have now provided no information about faculty salary increases. I can tell you for sure that over the last decade in VA tuition has climbed while faculty salaries have fallen - in real terms.

What the BOV wants is for a university to be run more like a corporation - business logic. A lot of ppl think that's a good idea. But guess what? If you want to find out what has been inflating tuition costs it is exactly a business logic. Ever since college has become a mass consumer item (about 60s and so and on), it has become "business" in which the "businesses" compete for students. To do that they turn the campuses into big sleepaway camps for advanced adolescents. In other words, they pile tons and tons and tons of $$ into stuff that has not a damn thing to do with actual education - and that includes not dumping tons of money on faculty.

If you think otherwise, the only reason can be that you don't actually have a good understanding of what is going on. The BOV/Dragas strategy will only make it worse and continue to destroy universities as places that do education.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#13
Apr 18, 2013
 
Oh right. So I should have added - why is Sullivan concerned about faculty salaries? Across the state, universities are having serious problems with faculty recruitment and retention - b/c better deals are to be had elsewhere.

If you want your university to be able to "compete" for the best personnel, then you have to be able to offer competitive packages.

As I said, I don't care if anyone thinks faculty, in general, make to much money. The market for faculty is what it is. If Sullivan is quiet about people being underpaid relative to the competition before long everyone will be whining that she let all of the talent get away.

Most of the "talk" in out culture about educators being overpaid and inflating costs is a whole bunch of bunk carried by people who know little about educational institutions and how they operate.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#14
Apr 18, 2013
 
....and here are data since the '70s on faculty salaries: http://www.aaup.org/NR/rdonlyres/00982446-761...

The only way you can find faculty salaries as the "cause" of the increase in the cost of higher education is to completely make the s h -- up.
Overtaxed

Concord, VA

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#15
Apr 18, 2013
 
I guess the criteria for this "award" is to totally overpay everyone at UVA to the state's highest salaries at taxpayer expense while turning students into mindless liberal drones. If that is the case, she did well.
Hmmmmm

Harrisonburg, VA

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#16
Apr 18, 2013
 
Overtaxed wrote:
I guess the criteria for this "award" is to totally overpay everyone at UVA to the state's highest salaries at taxpayer expense while turning students into mindless liberal drones. If that is the case, she did well.
Oh good. Another absolute know-nothing chimes in.
harry

Charlottesville, VA

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#17
Apr 18, 2013
 
Hmmmmm wrote:
<quoted text>
Regardless of what you want to think about salaries there, UVA faculty salaries - as they are through the entire VA system - lag well behind the market. UVA is Virgina's flagship school so it isn't odd at all that, among schools in VA, salaries there would be highest. But that still leaves them below peer institutions elsewhere.
But more to the point, you have now implied that the increasing costs of higher ed are from high faculty salaries. In your first post you gave a bit about tuition inflation. You have now provided no information about faculty salary increases. I can tell you for sure that over the last decade in VA tuition has climbed while faculty salaries have fallen - in real terms.
What the BOV wants is for a university to be run more like a corporation - business logic. A lot of ppl think that's a good idea. But guess what? If you want to find out what has been inflating tuition costs it is exactly a business logic. Ever since college has become a mass consumer item (about 60s and so and on), it has become "business" in which the "businesses" compete for students. To do that they turn the campuses into big sleepaway camps for advanced adolescents. In other words, they pile tons and tons and tons of $$ into stuff that has not a damn thing to do with actual education - and that includes not dumping tons of money on faculty.
If you think otherwise, the only reason can be that you don't actually have a good understanding of what is going on. The BOV/Dragas strategy will only make it worse and continue to destroy universities as places that do education.
First, UVa salaries do not lag far behind those of all other institutions in Virginia, they top the list. Improvements in amenities don't account for a 1,120% increase in tuition since 1978 when other indicators like the CPI have risen by 275% If as you say, UVa salaries lag far behind the market we would see a mass exodus, which we do not, and UVa would have trouble attracting good professors and administrators, which it does not.
Refer back to my post, there is a target rich environment in every department for improving productivity and reining in salaries, noy just faculty salaries, but Sullivan has no appetite for it. And with her compensation exceeding that of the United States President we should see some results from her, don't you think?
Do you mean to say there is no business side to running a University, no opportunity to regularize compensation consistent with good business practice? I hope those in Darden don't think that way. My son attended the University and he may have thought he was going to a nice sleep away camp, but he found out pretty quick that wasn't the case and he had to work for his education. The amenities aren't the big costs here, salaries are.
I think the University faces a greater danger from complacency and poor management than from almost any business model designed to keep tuition costs down.
The canary in the mine in this case is less than 50% of students who are accepted at the University actually attend in the fall. That is very poor. All colleges need to cut their costs and stop impoverishing those who attend and/or their parents. UVa in particular.
Hmmmmm

Palmyra, VA

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#18
Apr 18, 2013
 
harry wrote:
<quoted text>
First, UVa salaries do not lag far behind those of all other institutions in Virginia, they top the list. Improvements in amenities don't account for a 1,120% increase in tuition since 1978 when other indicators like the CPI have risen by 275% If as you say, UVa salaries lag far behind the market we would see a mass exodus, which we do not, and UVa would have trouble attracting good professors and administrators, which it does not.
Refer back to my post, there is a target rich environment in every department for improving productivity and reining in salaries, noy just faculty salaries, but Sullivan has no appetite for it. And with her compensation exceeding that of the United States President we should see some results from her, don't you think?
Do you mean to say there is no business side to running a University, no opportunity to regularize compensation consistent with good business practice? I hope those in Darden don't think that way. My son attended the University and he may have thought he was going to a nice sleep away camp, but he found out pretty quick that wasn't the case and he had to work for his education. The amenities aren't the big costs here, salaries are.
I think the University faces a greater danger from complacency and poor management than from almost any business model designed to keep tuition costs down.
The canary in the mine in this case is less than 50% of students who are accepted at the University actually attend in the fall. That is very poor. All colleges need to cut their costs and stop impoverishing those who attend and/or their parents. UVa in particular.
Harry, your opening comments tell me several things very clearly. One is that you either cannot or did not read what I wrote. Amother is that you clearly have no earthly idea what is going on with salaries in higher education. And another is that you are bound and determined to think that the rising costs of higher ed are because of faculty salaries when that is obviously and blatantly, factually untrue.

So I am not going to waste my time with the common sense populist ragers of the world who love to spout off about things of which they know nothing. It would be more productive for me to argue with a tree stump.

Good day to you.
harry

Charlottesville, VA

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#19
Apr 22, 2013
 
Hmmmmm wrote:
<quoted text>
Harry, your opening comments tell me several things very clearly. One is that you either cannot or did not read what I wrote. Amother is that you clearly have no earthly idea what is going on with salaries in higher education. And another is that you are bound and determined to think that the rising costs of higher ed are because of faculty salaries when that is obviously and blatantly, factually untrue.
So I am not going to waste my time with the common sense populist ragers of the world who love to spout off about things of which they know nothing. It would be more productive for me to argue with a tree stump.
Good day to you.
Weak, very weak reply. My comments are based upon salaries and averages for schools in the state, published in the Cavalier Daily. If your comments are meant to discredit you have failed. About the best you can do is be condescending and untruthful. No defense of Sullivan though. That is telling.
Hmmmmm

Palmyra, VA

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#20
Apr 22, 2013
 
harry wrote:
<quoted text>
Weak, very weak reply. My comments are based upon salaries and averages for schools in the state, published in the Cavalier Daily. If your comments are meant to discredit you have failed. About the best you can do is be condescending and untruthful. No defense of Sullivan though. That is telling.
Harry, you have made claims about two things, neither of which you can answer based on salary info from the Cav Daily.(Salary info, btw, is public info & always available. There is no dramatic expose nature to it. It comes out publicly every single year).

One - you want to cite the rapid rise of the costs of higher ed over the last several decades and put that on faculty salaries. For that you would need data that both crosses that span of time and covers more than VA. You have neither. I provided a link to relevant data that makes it clear that faculty salaries have NOT skyrocketed even as the costs of higher ed have. Even if you want to look at the last 5 years, harry - tuition (and fees - do you know the difference?) have been increasing. Faculty salaries in VA have been flat --which actually means DECLINING after you adjust for inflation. You don't know what you are talking about - plain and simple.

Two - you want to deny that faculty salaries in the state of VA are not behind the market. You also cannot do that with data only on the state of VA. Go find it out for yourself Harry - the data are out there. The FACT that VA is behind the market is also cited in many of the news reports on faculty salaries, except it gets buried behind sensationalizing a small number of selected very high salaries. Most of the huge ones, btw, are administrative salaries, not faculty salaries. Once again - you don't know what you are talking about.

Or perhaps you point is that UVA salaries, on average are highest in the state? Right. As I already said, UVA is the flagship U for the state. Why wouldn't average salaries there be higher? Should the salaries of baseball players on farm clubs match those of the actual MLB team players?(The analogy is not precise since its not a farm system - but the general idea is not dissimilar). You want lower paid faculty - fine send the kids to another VA school.

Or perhaps your point is that faculty salaries are one of the major costs of running the University? Hmmmm....its an educational institution...and a large portion of the budget goes to pay the educators....yes yes. I see what you mean. That is odd....

I guess I can't even tell what your point is. The fact is that you have this populist, common-sense notion of what it going on. It is completely distorted and ill-informed.
harry

Charlottesville, VA

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#21
Apr 22, 2013
 
Still no defense of Sullivan Hmmmmm. She deserves $695,000 compensation/yr. when the President and Vice President of our country combined, earn less?
A number of straw dogs in your misguided missile.
First, I focused on both administrative and faculty salaries (go back and read) but you choose to only focus on faculty salaries. I'm guessing, but could you be the President of the Faculty Senate? Why do you seem to need to instruct all of us mere mortals that salaries in public institutions are a matter of public record. Could it be your hubris and condescension has led you to believe you are smarter than everyone else? Your assertion that college salaries aren't the main cause of tuition increases doesn't pass the red face test. What's worse to your case, you know it. The only relevant tests for compensation are 1) are you losing people at a high rate due to compensation and 2) can you replace them with qualified people. You have no evidence to suggest either we are losing people like that or can't replace them at UVa. If you had it, you would instruct us I'm sure.
Second, comparing UVa salaries to already high salaries in more expensive living areas and private institutions so overpriced as to be obscene is very weak. If I can buy a book on Amazon for 7$ less than the 2 local book stores, should I buy it for the average of the 3 outlets? No, that would be inefficient and a waste of money. Colleges are getting wise to this thankfully and are starting to control employee costs because the market is demanding it.
Third, your notion, because UVa is a flagship school in Virginia, that premium salaries naturally follow is fallacious. A flagship school should have flagship leadership as well. Leadership that runs an efficient school with well managed compensation levels. It has done this in the distant past when it was also a flagship school and that is solid evidence it can do it in the future.
Finally, I can see why you can't understand what my point is because you've done your best to confuse it. Sadly, other schools get the point and are moving to address it for their own sakes. UVa deserves better leadership that Sullivan so it remains a flagship school. The Faculty Senate isn't qualified to run the school and tries to because of a leadership vacuum. Salaries and other forms of compensation cannot continue to rise at the rates that drive tuition to levels that impoverish students or their parents. Which is the same point I made in my first post. No confusion here Hmmmmm.

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