Who do you support for Governor in Oh...
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#14089 Nov 21, 2012
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
Didn't you just get done telling me how many new jobs there are in Ohio?
Yes I did. But I've been doing this for a long time now. I've seen quite a few things in my time.
Pops

United States

#14090 Nov 21, 2012
titonton duvaunte pants wrote:
<quoted text> lol your second hand smoke comment was made without reading what the article was about or what I even referenced from it. I didn't vote because I couldn't see enough of a difference in the two. Everybody said romney was parroting obama. I would say there was a bigger difference between obama in 07 campaign and obama in 2012 campaign, than there was a difference between romney and obama. No? Obama is more like bush
And the neo cons this time around. http://www.loonwatch.com/2011/12/eye-opening-...
http://www.thenation.com/blog/36756/blackwate...
I hear what you say about the simularities & don't strongly but if we looked forward B4 voting we would realize that Obama may be nominating 1-3 NEW Justices. SCARY to me. Then there is at least 1 more point/difference...Obama divides & creates animosity. Doing that isn't even in Romneys DNA. To me, those are TWO HUGH differences. HUGH
Duke for Mayor

Canton, OH

#14091 Nov 21, 2012
UdintBuildThat wrote:
Good to see Duke and Che will be thankful for their massive level of envy for CEO pay tommarow.
I'm thankful that you are not my neighbor.

woof
Pops

United States

#14092 Nov 21, 2012
Duke for Mayor wrote:
<quoted text>
You're close, but you've got it a little screwed up.
They don't like the Chinese either.
What they like, is wealth, status, ego, and power.
woof
And China doesn't have wealth?? LOL
WOOOOOF
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#14093 Nov 21, 2012
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
I've suffered more from unions than what I ever got out of them.
Does Pop have a pension?
Pops

United States

#14094 Nov 21, 2012
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
That company died from years of mismanagement.
I am interested in hearing your theories on how the union destroyed the jobs.
The company died because Union greed was reaching for too much while the company was already in reorganization bankruptcy since Jan 2012.
The Union did create some jobs, basically job redundancy. Seperate loading dock workers to load ONLY snack cakes & others to load ONLY Rainbow bread even IF one or the other was just standing around. Then there's the FACT that snack cakes & bread could NOT be delivered from the same truck by the same driver. This created MORE jobs by basically doubling the delivery fleet.
This M.O. went throughout the entire operation creating inefficient duplication of staffing.
So YES, the union created jobs, AND a job pyramid that fell in on itself financially.
So IF management was 'mismanaging' under those circumstances, I guess you're right.
Another mistake of the union was not realizing the flexibility of a family owned company that is already in reorganization compared to a company that has a hugh slow moving board of directors.
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#14095 Nov 21, 2012
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
Not much choice when they close down a company.
You seem to misunderstand. The company wanted them to work for less money and benefits. So the workers made a decision. They decided not to work under those conditions. Exactly what you advocated.
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#14096 Nov 21, 2012
Pops wrote:
<quoted text>I hear what you say about the simularities & don't strongly but if we looked forward B4 voting we would realize that Obama may be nominating 1-3 NEW Justices. SCARY to me. Then there is at least 1 more point/difference...Obama divides & creates animosity. Doing that isn't even in Romneys DNA. To me, those are TWO HUGH differences. HUGH
Who is Hugh?
Duke for Mayor

Canton, OH

#14097 Nov 21, 2012
Pops wrote:
<quoted text>I hear what you say about the simularities & don't strongly but if we looked forward B4 voting we would realize that Obama may be nominating 1-3 NEW Justices. SCARY to me. Then there is at least 1 more point/difference...Obama divides & creates animosity. Doing that isn't even in Romneys DNA. To me, those are TWO HUGH differences. HUGH
Keeping Obama in office to make nominations of SC justices was one of the primary reasons I voted for him.

As for your opinion that he creates division, I vehemently disagree.

woof
Duke for Mayor

Canton, OH

#14098 Nov 21, 2012
Pops wrote:
<quoted text>And China doesn't have wealth?? LOL
WOOOOOF
that went right over your head Pops.

woof
Save Yourself

Canton, OH

#14099 Nov 21, 2012
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
I've suffered more from unions than what I ever got out of them.
How would you sum up the treatment of hard working Americans and the concern of "job creators" for the worker's safety in these factories before there were unions? Justify the top guys at Hostess giving themselves bonuses for running a failing company. Explain the years when Hostess was union but the company was still making money.
Pops

United States

#14100 Nov 21, 2012
Save Yourself wrote:
<quoted text>
The non-Union companies I have worked for go as follows. Rich old man buys company for pocket lint and a whistle, way back when. Old man puts his inept son in charge. We work on Christmas day while the owners and their families give themselves a nice bonus and have dinner together. Inept son has no clue how to run the company, grinds every penny he can from it and then the company goes under. You see it all the time. The person running the show is so damn stupid that anyone could walk off the floor and instantly do a better job. Now if only they were born with the right last name...Those are the facts. Everyone I know has seen this first hand and unions had nothing to do with it. The only reason you guys are anti-union is because some rich old man told you to think that and you did.(Also see climate change)
You're not too far off. Historic & banking stats show that most family owned companies do survive the 3rd generation. There's an further explaination for this but the summary is still true.
Pops

United States

#14101 Nov 21, 2012
Duke for Mayor wrote:
<quoted text>
that went right over your head Pops.
woof
Maybe that is why I am bald! It clipped my hair off. WOOF
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#14102 Nov 21, 2012
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
You seem to misunderstand. The company wanted them to work for less money and benefits. So the workers made a decision. They decided not to work under those conditions. Exactly what you advocated.
No, that's not what I advocated. What I said is that if they don't like the financial changes, leave the company and work somewhere else. That's the problem with unions; you can't just say "leave and find a better job." They won't, and then they go on strike and cause the company to close down anyway.
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#14103 Nov 21, 2012
Save Yourself wrote:
<quoted text>
How would you sum up the treatment of hard working Americans and the concern of "job creators" for the worker's safety in these factories before there were unions? Justify the top guys at Hostess giving themselves bonuses for running a failing company. Explain the years when Hostess was union but the company was still making money.
For starters, CEO's don't have hourly or salary jobs. They have contract jobs. The only way a company can get these CEO's is to meet them on their terms. It's no different than an actress or a baseball player. If a pitcher is getting paid 4 million a year, but gets injured or has a bad year, he still gets the contracted money. Same for a CEO.

Government adopted many if not all of the safety provisions that the unions came up with. So the question is, how long are we indebted to unions because they were the first to come up with the idea many, many years ago?

I can't tell you what went wrong at Hostess that caused them to want to scale back wages or benefits. But I will remind you that we've had a suck economy for over five years now. Hostess products are not cheap. They have been putting on sales such as buy one box of X and get the second box free. I know because again, I purchased their products every week.
Pops

United States

#14104 Nov 21, 2012
Che Reagan Christ wrote:
<quoted text>
Who is Hugh?
TYPO ...HUGE
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#14105 Nov 21, 2012
Pops wrote:
<quoted text>The company died because Union greed was reaching for too much while the company was already in reorganization bankruptcy since Jan 2012.
The Union did create some jobs, basically job redundancy. Seperate loading dock workers to load ONLY snack cakes & others to load ONLY Rainbow bread even IF one or the other was just standing around. Then there's the FACT that snack cakes & bread could NOT be delivered from the same truck by the same driver. This created MORE jobs by basically doubling the delivery fleet.
This M.O. went throughout the entire operation creating inefficient duplication of staffing.
So YES, the union created jobs, AND a job pyramid that fell in on itself financially.
So IF management was 'mismanaging' under those circumstances, I guess you're right.
Another mistake of the union was not realizing the flexibility of a family owned company that is already in reorganization compared to a company that has a hugh slow moving board of directors.
Who is this Hugh you keep blamming everything on?
Che Reagan Christ

Medina, OH

#14106 Nov 21, 2012
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
For starters, CEO's don't have hourly or salary jobs. They have contract jobs. The only way a company can get these CEO's is to meet them on their terms. It's no different than an actress or a baseball player. If a pitcher is getting paid 4 million a year, but gets injured or has a bad year, he still gets the contracted money. Same for a CEO.
Government adopted many if not all of the safety provisions that the unions came up with. So the question is, how long are we indebted to unions because they were the first to come up with the idea many, many years ago?
I can't tell you what went wrong at Hostess that caused them to want to scale back wages or benefits. But I will remind you that we've had a suck economy for over five years now. Hostess products are not cheap. They have been putting on sales such as buy one box of X and get the second box free. I know because again, I purchased their products every week.
Oh, I get it. A CEO gets to demand whatever ridiculous salary he wants, but the union doesn't get to negotiate at all.
Duke for Mayor

Canton, OH

#14107 Nov 21, 2012
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
No, that's not what I advocated. What I said is that if they don't like the financial changes, leave the company and work somewhere else. That's the problem with unions; you can't just say "leave and find a better job." They won't, and then they go on strike and cause the company to close down anyway.
You really are funny.

A strike is a union's tool of last resort in the grand scheme of collective bargaining. Its the essence of unionization when faced with intolerable, or unfair labor practices, to stick together for the greater good of all.

No union wishes to "close up" their shops.

That isn't their decision to make. You're being completely disingenuous in suggesting that it is.

Union members going on strike are sending a message: Address our concerns, or we're prepared to stay home, or find other work.

If an employer chooses not to address those concerns, that's their decision. And closing up shop is only a secondary choice, one of several they could make after choosing not to address the concerns of their workforce.

Get a grip, man. The election's over.

woof
Pops

United States

#14109 Nov 21, 2012
Save Yourself wrote:
<quoted text>
How would you sum up the treatment of hard working Americans and the concern of "job creators" for the worker's safety in these factories before there were unions? Justify the top guys at Hostess giving themselves bonuses for running a failing company. Explain the years when Hostess was union but the company was still making money.
Here's the thing...NO ONE mentioned safety issues that I have heard of, NO ONE.
2nd, as a privately owned company, they could have turned their business into a fish farm if they wanted to.
3rd, The owners stand to make more money NOW by selling off & investing in something else OR sitting on a beach or snow slope somewhere.
BUT they wanted to keep the company going in a profitable way.
NOT just profitable to them, profitable to everyone that gets a paycheck.
IF the employees don't earn enough, they can go to work for Edelman's, Rubel's, Pepperidge Farm, Dunkin' Donuts, Hussmans, the area grocery store, bakery or whoever.
Whether or not the owners were competent doesn't matter, their investment/money is still THEIR investment/money.
They can roll it & smoke it or flush it down a sewer if they want. They did NOT have to provide jobs at any pay rate for all of these years. In fact it was & IS effort on their part to try to keep the company going when they could sit back on investments instead of selling off 10 yrs ago & putting their money in McD's or P&G or WalMart or oil or realastate, coconut farms, take their money off shore or whatever.
By employing people they were sharing their wealth.
OR is this a 'distribute the wealth' issue?

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