Lakin man dies in crash

Sep 25, 2008 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Hutchinson News, Hutchinson Kansas

" A Lakin man was killed Monday afternoon in a two-vehicle crash about 12 miles northwest of Sublette.

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Since: Dec 07

Ulysses, KS

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#1
Oct 2, 2008
 
is there going to be any charges brought up.
Sherry girl

Ulysses, KS

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#3
Oct 2, 2008
 
What happened smurf?

Since: Dec 07

Ulysses, KS

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#5
Oct 2, 2008
 
Sherry girl wrote:
What happened smurf?
I was just asking a question to see if any charges might be brought up against the driver of the other truck. I should have known that tm would come on here and cuss and ruin anything that any one says, before long guerita will be on here and the fight will start.

“Crime = guerilla warfare”

Since: Oct 08

Ulysses, Kansas

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#6
Oct 2, 2008
 
brainy_smurf ... I've been wondering the same thing, I went out and looked at the accident scene and took some pics. There were no skid marks from the truck in which the driver was killed, indicating he did not attempt to slow down ... could easily be he saw it coming and reasoned the best thing to do was try to get past so Mrs. Covey could pass, may have even speeded up for that reason.

The driver making the left turn had every right to be on the road and make a left turn, hard to cite him for anything. He could have already been slowed enough or stopped so his brake lights were not on, which would have caused Mrs. Covey not to realize he was not moving with the traffic flow.

Mrs. Covey left skid marks indicating she was trying to slow and stop, but apparently couldn't get stopped soon enough to avoid her head on collision with the rear end of the truck making a left turn in front of her.

She had two choices, go right into the ditch and roll her rig (probably certain death as her trailer would come up over her cab in a jackknife scenario as it rolled in the ditch), and also there was a gas line danger right in her path if she did that, which could have ruptured. Or go left, which at the last minute is what she did,... her choices were very limited, no matter what she did would be wrong.

They said she was not wearing a seat belt, which contrary to popular law enforcement statistics / law, was probably what saved her life since not doing so allowed her to be ejected from the cab. Had she been wearing a seat belt, she would probably have been burned to death if not killed instantly from the collision, which is what happeded to the other driver. They said both trucks exploded in a fire ball from the collision. The asphalt was melted from shoulder to shoulder and wider / longer east-west than a large car. No one will ever know if the other driver was killed instantly from the impact or burned to death from the fire, trapped in his rig.

Some said the driver killed had just let off his wife and son before it happened somewhere, if he had not, they would have died as well.

This is a very sad situation all the way around, I know the Coveys personally.

From a legal point of view, since Mrs. Covey went left of center, and was also passing at an intersection (that law in Kansas applies to ALL intersections, not just major ones), in spite of the circumstances, I'm afraid if charges are to be made, she would be considered the one at fault, even though the driver makeing the left turn is really the one that caused the accident.

Life is not fair, too bad people have to suffer because it is not.

“Crime = guerilla warfare”

Since: Oct 08

Ulysses, Kansas

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#7
Oct 2, 2008
 
Actually, she had a third choice, which was her head on collision into the rear of the truck making a left turn in front of her. Of course that would have been sure death, and due to them all being there together, that collision would have probably spread over to the truck coming from the opposite direction anyway.

If the driver making the left turn had his left turn signal on, then he could not be cited for anything. If he did not (because is was defective or otherwise), then he could be considered to be at fault, since lack of it and lack of brake lights (which could be normal if he was not actively in the process of braking) would not alert Mrs. Covey to realize he was slowed down or stopped.
guerita

United States

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#8
Oct 2, 2008
 
brainy_smurf wrote:
<quoted text>
I was just asking a question to see if any charges might be brought up against the driver of the other truck. I should have known that tm would come on here and cuss and ruin anything that any one says, before long guerita will be on here and the fight will start.
First of all I have not said nothing mean to you at all so don't accuse me of starting anything with you. I am not out to ruin any of these sites like TM but yes I will defend myself.

No back to your question about the wreck. Usually they do charge the driver that cause the wreck if there is a death. In cases that I know of it is usually involantary manslater but I really don't know what happened so I can't tell you yes or no at this point.
guerita

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#9
Oct 2, 2008
 
the Posse wrote:
brainy_smurf ... I've been wondering the same thing, I went out and looked at the accident scene and took some pics. There were no skid marks from the truck in which the driver was killed, indicating he did not attempt to slow down ... could easily be he saw it coming and reasoned the best thing to do was try to get past so Mrs. Covey could pass, may have even speeded up for that reason.
The driver making the left turn had every right to be on the road and make a left turn, hard to cite him for anything. He could have already been slowed enough or stopped so his brake lights were not on, which would have caused Mrs. Covey not to realize he was not moving with the traffic flow.
Mrs. Covey left skid marks indicating she was trying to slow and stop, but apparently couldn't get stopped soon enough to avoid her head on collision with the rear end of the truck making a left turn in front of her.
She had two choices, go right into the ditch and roll her rig (probably certain death as her trailer would come up over her cab in a jackknife scenario as it rolled in the ditch), and also there was a gas line danger right in her path if she did that, which could have ruptured. Or go left, which at the last minute is what she did,... her choices were very limited, no matter what she did would be wrong.
They said she was not wearing a seat belt, which contrary to popular law enforcement statistics / law, was probably what saved her life since not doing so allowed her to be ejected from the cab. Had she been wearing a seat belt, she would probably have been burned to death if not killed instantly from the collision, which is what happeded to the other driver. They said both trucks exploded in a fire ball from the collision. The asphalt was melted from shoulder to shoulder and wider / longer east-west than a large car. No one will ever know if the other driver was killed instantly from the impact or burned to death from the fire, trapped in his rig.
Some said the driver killed had just let off his wife and son before it happened somewhere, if he had not, they would have died as well.
This is a very sad situation all the way around, I know the Coveys personally.
From a legal point of view, since Mrs. Covey went left of center, and was also passing at an intersection (that law in Kansas applies to ALL intersections, not just major ones), in spite of the circumstances, I'm afraid if charges are to be made, she would be considered the one at fault, even though the driver makeing the left turn is really the one that caused the accident.
Life is not fair, too bad people have to suffer because it is not.
I have to agree with you on this

“Crime = guerilla warfare”

Since: Oct 08

Ulysses, Kansas

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#12
Oct 2, 2008
 
One last comment. As a class A (commercial CDL) driver, I should point out that slowing down these big rigs using engine braking (which does not turn on the brake lights) is the preferred way to slow them down, and using your air brakes as little as possible, usually not at all until your speed is 40 miles per hour or less, to avoid wear and tear on the brake linings making these brakes worthless from heat and wear; ie, application of the air brakes (which would turn on the brake lights) is generally reserved for slower speeds under 40 miles per hour "right before final actual stop". This avoids overheating the brakes which can result in total brake fade and failure when you need it the most, makes the brakes fail prematurily, and due to the mass of these rigs at the speed they travel at, there is so much momentum (mass x velocity) that the air brakes / linings are not designed to be the "only" method of stopping these rigs. Engine braking and downshifting is the preferred way until you are almost stopped - this does not turn on your brake lights. It does generate the sounds of downshifting, but another driver in their rig full of noise may not hear said noises from the other rig braking ahead of it.

Since: Dec 07

Ulysses, KS

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#14
Oct 2, 2008
 
guerita wrote:
<quoted text>
First of all I have not said nothing mean to you at all so don't accuse me of starting anything with you. I am not out to ruin any of these sites like TM but yes I will defend myself.
No back to your question about the wreck. Usually they do charge the driver that cause the wreck if there is a death. In cases that I know of it is usually involantary manslater but I really don't know what happened so I can't tell you yes or no at this point.
true you haven't said anything mean to me, but I was right this post turned into a bashing contest with you and tiger mom. sometimes it is not worth defending yourself against someone like her/him or whatever. just be the better person and ignore the comments that she/he post to you.
guerita

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#16
Oct 2, 2008
 
brainy_smurf wrote:
<quoted text>
true you haven't said anything mean to me, but I was right this post turned into a bashing contest with you and tiger mom. sometimes it is not worth defending yourself against someone like her/him or whatever. just be the better person and ignore the comments that she/he post to you.
I HAVE NOT AND WILL NOT RESPOND TO HER ON THIS POSTING. I KNOW SHE WILL BE TALKING TRASH CAUSE THAT ALL IT KNOW TO DO.
NO LET GET BACK TO THE SUBJECT AND ACT LIKE SHE HASN'T POSTED HER OK.
Alumni

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#18
Oct 3, 2008
 
the Posse wrote:
brainy_smurf ... I've been wondering the same thing, I went out and looked at the accident scene and took some pics. There were no skid marks from the truck in which the driver was killed, indicating he did not attempt to slow down ... could easily be he saw it coming and reasoned the best thing to do was try to get past so Mrs. Covey could pass, may have even speeded up for that reason.
The driver making the left turn had every right to be on the road and make a left turn, hard to cite him for anything. He could have already been slowed enough or stopped so his brake lights were not on, which would have caused Mrs. Covey not to realize he was not moving with the traffic flow.
Mrs. Covey left skid marks indicating she was trying to slow and stop, but apparently couldn't get stopped soon enough to avoid her head on collision with the rear end of the truck making a left turn in front of her.
She had two choices, go right into the ditch and roll her rig (probably certain death as her trailer would come up over her cab in a jackknife scenario as it rolled in the ditch), and also there was a gas line danger right in her path if she did that, which could have ruptured. Or go left, which at the last minute is what she did,... her choices were very limited, no matter what she did would be wrong.
They said she was not wearing a seat belt, which contrary to popular law enforcement statistics / law, was probably what saved her life since not doing so allowed her to be ejected from the cab. Had she been wearing a seat belt, she would probably have been burned to death if not killed instantly from the collision, which is what happeded to the other driver. They said both trucks exploded in a fire ball from the collision. The asphalt was melted from shoulder to shoulder and wider / longer east-west than a large car. No one will ever know if the other driver was killed instantly from the impact or burned to death from the fire, trapped in his rig.
Some said the driver killed had just let off his wife and son before it happened somewhere, if he had not, they would have died as well.
This is a very sad situation all the way around, I know the Coveys personally.
From a legal point of view, since Mrs. Covey went left of center, and was also passing at an intersection (that law in Kansas applies to ALL intersections, not just major ones), in spite of the circumstances, I'm afraid if charges are to be made, she would be considered the one at fault, even though the driver makeing the left turn is really the one that caused the accident.
Life is not fair, too bad people have to suffer because it is not.
Well I knew Todd personally as I grew up with him, there was no chance for him to slow down because she pulled out just as he was coming and there was no chance for him to see that they were going to hit. I am sorry that the other driver is going through this but Todd is the one that died because if Mrs. Covey had been watching it would have never happened. And before anyone goes off on me I was a truck driver for a while and my whole family is full of drivers. I pray for all affected by this accident that they may all receive closure, especially Todd's child.
guerita

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#19
Oct 3, 2008
 
Alumni wrote:
<quoted text>
Well I knew Todd personally as I grew up with him, there was no chance for him to slow down because she pulled out just as he was coming and there was no chance for him to see that they were going to hit. I am sorry that the other driver is going through this but Todd is the one that died because if Mrs. Covey had been watching it would have never happened. And before anyone goes off on me I was a truck driver for a while and my whole family is full of drivers. I pray for all affected by this accident that they may all receive closure, especially Todd's child.
No one is going to go off on you ok anyway I'm not it was a bad accident and yes someone made a mistake and someone lost their life and it is sad for all that is involved. My Father and his friends that are truck drivers have all discussed the STOP ON A DIME thing and in simi's it can't be done. The fact that remains is that their is families tore up because of this and my prayers are with them.
guerita

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#24
Oct 3, 2008
 
grow up stupid *ss!
Out West

Kennewick, WA

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#27
Oct 4, 2008
 

Judged:

1

1

1

I have a friend in Ulysses that told me about this site.

It is too bad that you have someone that thinks being cruel is a "cute" thing to do. This lack of respect is one of the most [athetic things that I have ever seen.

I can't imagine what must have happened to someone that makes such heartless comments.

“Crime = guerilla warfare”

Since: Oct 08

Ulysses, Kansas

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#30
Oct 4, 2008
 
Alumni --

All of us who know the Coveys realize that Todd and his family are the ones who are most negatively affected by this tragedy; words are not sufficient to express our sympathy for all those involved.
The Coveys are good people (just as I'm sure Todd and his family are) whose regret will be on their souls for the rest of their lives.
As I stated before, life is not fair.
I was not trying to imply that Todd caused this wreck in any way; of all those involved, he would be the most innocent, but as such, he and his family have suffered the most.
The person making the left turn, from a legal point of view, is also equally innocent, as long as his turn signal was on and his rig was not deficient safety wise (brake lights working - assuming he had at some point in time used his air brakes to stop as opposed to relying solely on engine braking).
Usually from the legal perspective in these situations, the driver in Mrs. Covey's position is cited for speeding if that can be proven, following too closely, and going left of center.
Visablility was not a factor, unless some whirlwind blew dust at just the right time to interfere with Mrs. Covey's and Todd's seeing and distance judgement of all rigs involved,-- which I doubt is the case.
The only way Todd could be held partially responsible (PLEASE don't think I am trying to pin the blame on him, as I AM NOT -- just analytical thinking, that's all), is if he was speeding (and as I previously pointed out, even if this was the case, it might have been the RIGHT thing to do in some cases, even over the speed limit if necessary, in an attempt to "out drive" the pending accident and get past so Mrs. Covey could use his lane to pass); since there were no skid marks from his rig, it is difficult to assess his speed for whatever reason.
Sometimes the speedometer will "freeze" in these situations, and law enforcement will use this data to try to determine speed, but I fault even this approach since if one of his drive axles left pavement friction and was even minutely suspended in the air for an instant, with his engine rpms still high, his speedometer could easily rev up well above and beyond his "true" rig velocity.
Speeding could have been a factor for all drivers involved, except for the driver making the left turn. Harvest is on, and the traffic on that road is heavy; none of which justifies lack of caution by anyone.
I have been in serious accidents like this myself as the one making the left turn (fortunately no one died, but the property damage and injuries were severe). You know we as professional CDL drivers are taught to drive "a quarter of a mile out in front of you" and as far as your headlights can see at night. But it is my experience that in an accident situation, stages of the over-all accident escalate so quickly that by the time of impact(s), no one is acting by "thinking", but only "reacting" on the basis of what our sub-conscience minds are dictating as the "least possible threat". I'm sure that is why Mrs. Covey jerked the steering wheel to the left and crossed the center line at the last minute.
Had she taken the ditch, or gone straint into the rear of the rig in front of her, it is probable that her trailer would likely have jack-knifed around in front of Todd anyway, in which case, although he would have suffered a severe collision from the front of his truck with her trailer broadside; since in that scenario his rig's impact would have possibly been able to push her trailer back around and he might have survived such a collision.
But speculation will not rectify any of the suffering that has indeed occured, and in that sense is not a resolution to make any of the suffering less.
I support your comment about closure entirely. It is said that "time heals all wounds"; but as serious as this is, it will take a long time ... and I'm not sure that saying is always true anyway.
salina mom

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#31
Oct 4, 2008
 
cockroach squish!!! to ban a person from a site right click on the # of what they posted that is offensive and copy it, then scroll down to the lower portion of the type in your comments to yor post to the forum you will see in blue send us your feedback click on that then paste what you have coppied to it, and send it in, this will help in banning the persons IP address and computer # from posting anything into a room, yes I know its hard to keep up with the cockroach but hopefully will be worth it.
salina mom

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#32
Oct 4, 2008
 
topix will determin if it is offensive and ban that person from being able to type in that post, they will be able to read what you type but cant type anything back.
salina mom

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#33
Oct 4, 2008
 
please anyone who has a cockroach bothering them please keep squishing them so we can enjoy a nice conversation with friends and family, keep doing this to each post they do soon we will have a lovely place here to chat ;) Thanks

“Crime = guerilla warfare”

Since: Oct 08

Ulysses, Kansas

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#34
Oct 4, 2008
 
For the offensive, off-topic, or otherwise trivial comment, you can also just click on the "Report Abuse" link for said post, and Topix will review and delete it as their judgment call.

If enough "terms of service" violations are reported by enough users, the offending user will be banned from posting on the site.

One of the "terms of service" violations is being rude to another user.

The rude user is usually looking for attention; best policy is to just ignore them and/or report them.
salina mom

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#40
Oct 5, 2008
 
Read "The people who are trashin other people on this... To get rid of people that abuse text from your post

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