Our recommendation: Springboro voters...

Our recommendation: Springboro voters should say 'yes' the first time to school levies

There are 31964 comments on the Dayton Daily News story from Feb 5, 2008, titled Our recommendation: Springboro voters should say 'yes' the first time to school levies. In it, Dayton Daily News reports that:

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Since: May 08

Location hidden

#7813 Aug 18, 2009
Macs Daughter wrote:
Has anyone else checked the number of kids per class at Dennis, Five Points, or other schools? They are posted.My son's class has 25 in it.(He's at Dennis) This is no different than last year. I think that parents need to be cautious about how they approach this with their kids. If indeed, there are "crowded classrooms", I would suggest that parents be as positive as possible with their kids. If parents are negative about it, the kids can't help but react negatively ! Make the best of it ! Its not the end of the world . If you "just can't deal with it", then by all means, check out alternatives. There's home schooling ; private schools; and parochial schools. NONE of which would require moving or selling your house. They would , however, require a little sacrifice on the part of mom and dad.
I want to congratulate you on having a adult positive view - you sound like a great parent - Life is not going to give your / my kids anything - they are going to work for it and work within the parameters that are given to them. The BOE closed a school if there was this BIG DEAL on numbers they could have shuffled the builds better. I don't think that 35 kids is a show stopper it just makes the parents work more. too many of the "money" parents in the SD want the SD to do the parents duties. they want a drop/go educational experience for the kids but responsibility for the education is the parent. Sell the BMer and stay at home and take responsibility for the kids. "DO IT FOR THE KIDS" IS a secret montra for keep the kids out of our hair and we will pay. Just a small example is the two kids who had the bombs - i was taught by my father to respect guns at age 7. If the parents do not take responsibilites for the kids no amount of money is going to help the kids.
Wondering

Englewood, OH

#7814 Aug 18, 2009
Yes, you would have to look at the overall classroom sizes. Some may be larger but 31 in a classroom is certainly doable. What do you want to do? Hire another 4th grade teacher who stays on the payroll forever when next year's 4th grade class is smaller? It is an ebb and flow situation depending on the grade and the school.

Since this is hitting a nerve with some of the parents, expect it to be front and center on the next campaign...hire more teachers to lower class sizes!
Wondering

Englewood, OH

#7815 Aug 18, 2009
Mark Witsken wrote:
<quoted text>
Looking back at my class pictures from the late 70's & early '80s, NOT ONE OF THEM shows less than 30 heads per homeroom.
Two of them, 1977 & 1979, has 37 per class.
I think that most 'boroians honestly don't know how good they have it here & now.
The schools need to STOP their hyper-focus on the inane state testing, and concentrate their attention on the things our kids will need to compete in the job market, and ultimately with the rest of the world in the global economy.
We really don't need any more lousy lemming test-takers as high school graduates.
If this country is to have any real hope for the future, we're going to need lots o' CRITICAL THINKERS!!!!!
I looked at mine too - always about 32-35 to a classroom. It is something the teachers unions got emphasis on because obviously it is easier to teach to a less amount of students, less homework to grade, etc..

A good teacher should be able to lecture and help any number of students - babysitting a bunch of unruly kids it would become more difficult but then they don't have any control. The teachers of 20-30 years ago had control of their classrooms and acted and dressed professionally. I wish we could say the same today, even with all the technological advantages they have to teaching and grading to make their jobs easier.

Since: Aug 08

Mason, OH

#7816 Aug 18, 2009
Class sizes wrote:
I'm appalled at my son's class at Five Points. 31 kids?? This is getting to be a bit much. My friend in Centerville has a son in 4th grade and he will only have 22 students in his class. Tell me, which is better: a one-to-31 teacher to student ratio BETTER OR WORSE than one-to-22 teacher to student ratio?? If we could sell this house, we'd be moving out of Springboro Schools.
I would examine this number closely ! Just because there are 31 names listed for a class this is sometimes not correct. There may be 31 some time during the day. But when you take out the students who receive individual instruction in specific subjects the total class size fluctuates during the day. I would check with the school it may ease some of your concerns.
Oh Really

Cleveland, OH

#7817 Aug 18, 2009
Concerned Clearcreek Mom wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for the information but if we lose our supposedly "best" teachers for a little more money at the other districts, then they really aren't the best committed teachers anyway. They will just flee to the next district and continue to hop themselves around the state for the next little bit of money. Our teachers get compensated very well as luckily this is public information so we all have access to the salaries, the raises, and the supplemental pays.
Why are teachers that "flee" for more money any different from the rest of us who change jobs for better money. Being committed to a particular district has nothing to do with how good a teacher is.
Boroman54

Waynesville, OH

#7818 Aug 18, 2009
Oh Really wrote:
<quoted text>
Why are teachers that "flee" for more money any different from the rest of us who change jobs for better money. Being committed to a particular district has nothing to do with how good a teacher is.
Just as much as More Money means a better teacher. a Teacher is good/bad with little regard to Money. An Ernest person will accomplish their job without a goal of making money. How ernest was that NYC stock broker that milked all that Money from his clients. He was one of the richest around but was he good at his job Nope Just a better Conman.

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#7819 Aug 18, 2009
Oh Really - what you are stating is Money means better teachers?? I do not thinks so. An Ernest teacher is better than one who looks for the money. IE the NYC Stock broker who got caught in the Ponzy scheme. He was very rich but not a good stock broker. He just knew the con and played it.
Much like a great deal of the teachers - why do you think they have tenured employment in colleges so they can coast not to say there are no ernest teachers BUT it is stating that a teacher who looks for money in this profession is not ernest.

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7820 Aug 18, 2009
Always Question wrote:
The audit was done to identify cost savings and to keep the district on the tracks. In a nut shell.
<quoted text>
If your out of balance your overspent.
Not True. The audit states where springboro could cut to be at state minimums.

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7821 Aug 18, 2009
Always Question wrote:
<quoted text>
Nah....just you wait. The next levy that passes then all of a sudden pay to play will go away.
Says who? Just opinion and speculation on your part.

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7822 Aug 18, 2009
Boroman54 wrote:
<quoted text>if you would have read the whole post you would have seen I stated that boro was not real high BUT IT DOES NOT NEED TO BE" a fine example of omission is not lieing - As for my post not making sense - does the facts confuse you ?? the district population is going down - the number of homes for sale show this (on the raise for the 2nd quarter) there is little or no movement for employment in the area. 5 more companies will be announcing cuts in employment before the end of september. even an ole boro grad like myself sees the situation. 11% unemployment is here and 12% is possible and where is most of these ex-employee coming from the "Young" and all us older people do not see higher taxes a benefit
They are for sale which means they will be occupied once sold. So how is that in your words "going down". One family sells a house while one family buys that house. 1 family for 1 family is an even trade, no going up or down in poulation.

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#7823 Aug 18, 2009
excellent question - the available job numbers for the CinDay corridor is falling like a rock and with that the young couples who have kids will leave the older people with no kids will stay and/or down size so school pop will go down - and/or sales will not sell - Forclosure rate in warren county is up which means speculators will move in and buy houses to rent but no new jobs and according to department of labor numbers could take 10 years for rebound everyone is hurting
BoroEric wrote:
<quoted text>
They are for sale which means they will be occupied once sold. So how is that in your words "going down". One family sells a house while one family buys that house. 1 family for 1 family is an even trade, no going up or down in poulation.
what happened

Bluffton, SC

#7824 Aug 18, 2009
BoroEric wrote:
<quoted text>
They are for sale which means they will be occupied once sold. So how is that in your words "going down". One family sells a house while one family buys that house. 1 family for 1 family is an even trade, no going up or down in poulation.
whatever became of your wanting to run for BOE?

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#7825 Aug 18, 2009
BoroEric wrote:
<quoted text>
Not True. The audit states where springboro could cut to be at state minimums.
1) per Boro treasurer - Just imperical numbers - zero to six million so there is fat in the stew for cutting - and since the boro treasurer states there is no real fat the BOE Won't do anything unless levy (next time) is defeated. so be like all the rest of BOE/ADMIN do not worry until then I call it the "LM" effect

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7826 Aug 18, 2009
Boroman54 wrote:
excellent question - the available job numbers for the CinDay corridor is falling like a rock and with that the young couples who have kids will leave the older people with no kids will stay and/or down size so school pop will go down - and/or sales will not sell - Forclosure rate in warren county is up which means speculators will move in and buy houses to rent but no new jobs and according to department of labor numbers could take 10 years for rebound everyone is hurting <quoted text>
So, do you have numbers to justify that younger people with children are leaving or is this just based on the Boroman54 philosphy? I would have to agree with jobs leaving but the rest is speculation on your part.

I would speculate those with jobs and kids who could afford a house in springboro (because values have went down) would move in. Who wouldn't want to move to springboro being they made the money magazine list of best cities?

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7827 Aug 18, 2009
what happened wrote:
<quoted text>
whatever became of your wanting to run for BOE?
Thanks for asking, too much going on right now. Would not be able to give my family, job, and BOE all the time they deserve.

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7828 Aug 18, 2009
Boroman54 wrote:
<quoted text>1) per Boro treasurer - Just imperical numbers - zero to six million so there is fat in the stew for cutting - and since the boro treasurer states there is no real fat the BOE Won't do anything unless levy (next time) is defeated. so be like all the rest of BOE/ADMIN do not worry until then I call it the "LM" effect
What does the Boro treasurer mean "real fact"?

I would say "fat" is that which we can trim to achieve state minimums.

Yes, because the fat will be trimmed to get us at state mins. If that is the case then those houses will be vacant or owned/rented by people without children.

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#7829 Aug 18, 2009
BoroEric wrote:
<quoted text>
So, do you have numbers to justify that younger people with children are leaving or is this just based on the Boroman54 philosphy? I would have to agree with jobs leaving but the rest is speculation on your part.
I would speculate those with jobs and kids who could afford a house in springboro (because values have went down) would move in. Who wouldn't want to move to springboro being they made the money magazine list of best cities?
it is not rocket science - 1) unions cut jobs on seniority (young people lose) 2) job creation rate in whole state has dropped 10 percent per Department of labor existing jobs are held by older citizens (who don't have school age kids as much)and with the cut in 401's IRA etc will hold on to those remaining jobs longer so the young will not have the monies to buy the homes - for Georgia rate of creation of jobs is positive.(thanks NCR) Gas prices will continue the slow raises so people will move to the jobs that are here in the state rather than living 25 miles away. Just a couple ideas based on the facts can you provide any rebuttal facts showing the young job seeker a positive because my grandchildren are lookiing to stay here.

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7830 Aug 18, 2009
what happened wrote:
<quoted text>
whatever became of your wanting to run for BOE?
If you want to talk i will post an e-mail address where i can be reached.

It will be a one time e-mail that i would not use after we correspond. So not worried about posting it here.

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#7831 Aug 18, 2009
BoroEric wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for asking, too much going on right now. Would not be able to give my family, job, and BOE all the time they deserve.
typical sorry answer given by many an also-rans...bruce moore said the same thing when he threw his hat in the ring for school board 4 years ago...

“Better than State Minimums”

Since: Jul 09

Springboro

#7832 Aug 18, 2009
Boroman54 wrote:
<quoted text>it is not rocket science - 1) unions cut jobs on seniority (young people lose) 2) job creation rate in whole state has dropped 10 percent per Department of labor existing jobs are held by older citizens (who don't have school age kids as much)and with the cut in 401's IRA etc will hold on to those remaining jobs longer so the young will not have the monies to buy the homes - for Georgia rate of creation of jobs is positive.(thanks NCR) Gas prices will continue the slow raises so people will move to the jobs that are here in the state rather than living 25 miles away. Just a couple ideas based on the facts can you provide any rebuttal facts showing the young job seeker a positive because my grandchildren are lookiing to stay here.
1) Most of the people i know who are young and live in springboro do not wok union jobs. I would say most who went to college and earned a degree are not union employees.
2) young people tend to be harder workers and more willing to learn.

Neither your points nor mine are based on fact just speculation for the most part.

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