Guess What World-Renowned Evangelical...

Guess What World-Renowned Evangelical Seminary (Sort of) Sanctioned a Gay Student Club?

There are 26 comments on the www.theblaze.com story from Jul 13, 2013, titled Guess What World-Renowned Evangelical Seminary (Sort of) Sanctioned a Gay Student Club?. In it, www.theblaze.com reports that:

Fuller Theological Seminary , one of the world's largest multi-denominational seminaries, apparently is the first major evangelical seminary to sanction an LGBT student club.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at www.theblaze.com.

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DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#1 Jul 14, 2013
Well done Fuller. Nice to see you are following the lesson Jesus was trying to teach in Luke 10:25-37.

(and I'll bet most anti gay Bible thumpers have to look it up to know which parable I refer to).

From a lifetime of having to use the Bible as a defense from those who treat it as a WMD, I've gotten pretty good at shooting them down.

“Building Better Worlds”

Since: May 13

Europa

#2 Jul 14, 2013
Jerry Lushwell ?

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#3 Jul 14, 2013
Good for them! Although I'm a little confused with the students' problem with Fuller's celibacy policy; it applies to the entire student body. If the hetero kids can't do it, why should the gay students get an exception? Even with the acknowledgement of its LGBT population, it remains a seminary.

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#4 Jul 14, 2013
stickyface wrote:
Good for them! Although I'm a little confused with the students' problem with Fuller's celibacy policy; it applies to the entire student body. If the hetero kids can't do it, why should the gay students get an exception? Even with the acknowledgement of its LGBT population, it remains a seminary.
This may come as a shock so I hope you're sitting down. I think most gays and lesbians would agree with you on that. We want equality not special rights.

Yes this gay man agrees with you.

Should I call the ambulance now or is your heart doing OK?

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#5 Jul 14, 2013
As a long time gay activist and very OUT man, If I joined this Seminary I'd have no problems with their rules. True it would be hard for me to suddenly become "non political" but I think that is a pretty Bold and sensible thing for a Seminary to ask. "Render unto Caesar ...but give God that which is His. And I have had many long periods of very happy celibacy in my life by my own choice so....

If the rules say this and that and I don't agree, no one is forcing me to join!

Just like Same Sex Marriage. Don't like it/ Don't approve of it? Fine then don't have one!

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#6 Jul 14, 2013
DNF wrote:
<quoted text>This may come as a shock so I hope you're sitting down. I think most gays and lesbians would agree with you on that. We want equality not special rights.
Yes this gay man agrees with you.
Should I call the ambulance now or is your heart doing OK?
Well, this gay man was just responding to what was in the article. I wouldn't dream of posting unless I'd actually read was it was about! Would you?

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#8 Jul 14, 2013
DNF wrote:
As a long time gay activist and very OUT man, If I joined this Seminary I'd have no problems with their rules. True it would be hard for me to suddenly become "non political" but I think that is a pretty Bold and sensible thing for a Seminary to ask. "Render unto Caesar ...but give God that which is His. And I have had many long periods of very happy celibacy in my life by my own choice so....
If the rules say this and that and I don't agree, no one is forcing me to join!
Just like Same Sex Marriage. Don't like it/ Don't approve of it? Fine then don't have one!
Fuller isn't asking the students to give up their politics; they're expecting them to remain celibate during their seminary! And not to persecute them or make them follow "rules", but as a sacrifice on their way to ordination. Seriously, did you read the piece?

Since: Oct 10

San Francisco

#9 Jul 14, 2013
So gay students can now openly become evangelicals, as long as they remember that their sexuality is “inconsistent with the teachings of Scripture.” How nice for them.

Like the GOProud and Log Cabin idiots, you'd have to be suffering from internalized homophobia to join the very people who are oppressing you. This is hardly cause for celebration.

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#10 Jul 15, 2013
stickyface wrote:
<quoted text>Well, this gay man was just responding to what was in the article. I wouldn't dream of posting unless I'd actually read was it was about! Would you?
First I apologize for assuming you were anti gay.

Second I did read the article, which is why I stated my opinion.

Again I hope you forgive me for behaving so badly.

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#11 Jul 15, 2013
stickyface wrote:
<quoted text>Fuller isn't asking the students to give up their politics; they're expecting them to remain celibate during their seminary! And not to persecute them or make them follow "rules", but as a sacrifice on their way to ordination. Seriously, did you read the piece?
Yes and we agree on those points.

I said I see no reason why anyone can have any problem with this policy. Though I disagree with the idea that says if gays and lesbians have sex we are sinning yet heterosexuals are not. But the issue is does any part of the policy treat gay and lesbian students differently than their heterosexual classmates. And that answer IMO is NO it does not.

What's your problem?

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#12 Jul 15, 2013
GoldenGator wrote:
So gay students can now openly become evangelicals, as long as they remember that their sexuality is “inconsistent with the teachings of Scripture.” How nice for them.
Like the GOProud and Log Cabin idiots, you'd have to be suffering from internalized homophobia to join the very people who are oppressing you. This is hardly cause for celebration.
I disagree. Any time we obtain equality under the 'laws' we win. And that IS cause for celebration.

Your religious bigotry is NOT cause for celebration.

Try remembering that it's not up to you to dictate a person's religious beliefs any more than it is for the GOP, the DNC, Catholics, Protestants, Jews, atheists, smokers or non smokers to do so.

Like I said, this is just like SSM. Don't like it don't join it.

Since: Oct 10

San Francisco

#13 Jul 15, 2013
DNF wrote:
<quoted text>I disagree. Any time we obtain equality under the 'laws' we win. And that IS cause for celebration.
Your religious bigotry is NOT cause for celebration.
Try remembering that it's not up to you to dictate a person's religious beliefs any more than it is for the GOP, the DNC, Catholics, Protestants, Jews, atheists, smokers or non smokers to do so.
Like I said, this is just like SSM. Don't like it don't join it.
I'm not joining it, and I'm not dictating anything. I'm expressing my opinion, which you apparently think is less valid than yours.

You can celebrate this all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that evangelical christians are among our biggest oppressors, so you'll have to forgive me for not popping open the champagne when we're welcomed into their camp as long as we don't act on our gayness.

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#14 Jul 15, 2013
DNF wrote:
<quoted text>Yes and we agree on those points.
I said I see no reason why anyone can have any problem with this policy. Though I disagree with the idea that says if gays and lesbians have sex we are sinning yet heterosexuals are not. But the issue is does any part of the policy treat gay and lesbian students differently than their heterosexual classmates. And that answer IMO is NO it does not.
What's your problem?
My main problem is the article's tone! It seems to be trying to create a controversy where there is none. Fuller's policy applies to all students; all concerned parties have agreed to it so why the presumption of a double standard? That's all I'm taking from it- and I agree with you!

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#15 Jul 15, 2013
DNF wrote:
<quoted text>I disagree. Any time we obtain equality under the 'laws' we win. And that IS cause for celebration.
Your religious bigotry is NOT cause for celebration.
Try remembering that it's not up to you to dictate a person's religious beliefs any more than it is for the GOP, the DNC, Catholics, Protestants, Jews, atheists, smokers or non smokers to do so.
Like I said, this is just like SSM. Don't like it don't join it.
Right! This is a huge advance for us, and if they are sincere, also a victory for modern Christians!

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#16 Jul 15, 2013
GoldenGator wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not joining it, and I'm not dictating anything. I'm expressing my opinion, which you apparently think is less valid than yours.
You can celebrate this all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that evangelical christians are among our biggest oppressors, so you'll have to forgive me for not popping open the champagne when we're welcomed into their camp as long as we don't act on our gayness.
But the students aren't attending Fuller to celebrate being gay- they're there to attain religious degrees to qualify themselves to teach! The non-gay students have to meet the same requirements regarding celibacy (and politics). They are seminarians who happen to be gay.

Since: Oct 10

San Francisco

#17 Jul 15, 2013
stickyface wrote:
<quoted text>But the students aren't attending Fuller to celebrate being gay- they're there to attain religious degrees to qualify themselves to teach! The non-gay students have to meet the same requirements regarding celibacy (and politics). They are seminarians who happen to be gay.
And what are they going to teach? That gay people are tolerable as long as we remain silent? That we're inconsistent with Scripture? Or that we're not up to Fuller community standards? From the article:

"Fuller’s community standards states that 'sexual abstinence is required for the unmarried' and marriage is between one man and one woman."

So straight alumni will be able to marry and have sex, but gays will not. I think it's sad that anyone finds that acceptable. But if such blatant discrimination and second-class citizenship don't bother you, go ahead and attend Fuller.

“What a FABULOUS pearl necklace”

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#18 Jul 15, 2013
GoldenGator wrote:
<quoted text>
And what are they going to teach? That gay people are tolerable as long as we remain silent? That we're inconsistent with Scripture? Or that we're not up to Fuller community standards? From the article:
"Fuller’s community standards states that 'sexual abstinence is required for the unmarried' and marriage is between one man and one woman."
So straight alumni will be able to marry and have sex, but gays will not. I think it's sad that anyone finds that acceptable. But if such blatant discrimination and second-class citizenship don't bother you, go ahead and attend Fuller.
Well, now, that's where things get sticky (make your own joke here.). Does their celibacy vow include students who are married? I don't see how they can! And if gay students can legally be wed, how can the rule apply to them? Who knows the answers to any of these? The piece didn't go into that much detail! Nor did it cover the cirriculum. We've taken another step toward acceptance, though, so let's savor a win!

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#19 Jul 15, 2013
GoldenGator wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not joining it, and I'm not dictating anything. I'm expressing my opinion, which you apparently think is less valid than yours.
So you've decided to lie about me just like Pepper now?
GoldenGator wrote:
<quoted text>You can celebrate this all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that evangelical christians are among our biggest oppressors, so you'll have to forgive me for not popping open the champagne when we're welcomed into their camp as long as we don't act on our gayness.
There is no need to forgive you for exercising your free speech. And I never said you had to agree with me.

I know many people don't like this policy. They are entitled to.

But thanks for trying to make ME the bad guy here.

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#20 Jul 15, 2013
stickyface wrote:
<quoted text>My main problem is the article's tone! It seems to be trying to create a controversy where there is none. Fuller's policy applies to all students; all concerned parties have agreed to it so why the presumption of a double standard? That's all I'm taking from it- and I agree with you!
Thanks.

And I am glad you have no problem when people disagree with you on that.

DNF

“Judge less, Love more”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark Ohio

#21 Jul 15, 2013
stickyface wrote:
<quoted text>Right! This is a huge advance for us, and if they are sincere, also a victory for modern Christians!
Agreed. It took us decades to get the RCC to change their dogma and admit there is nothing wrong with BEING GAY OR LESBIAN.

We have done the same in many other faiths as well.

If people don't like it they are free to leave the church and join another.

In time many will agree that it isn't a sin for gays and lesbians to have sex. In fact so VERY conservative Protestant groups were the first to make that change.

The Quakers did it in the late 60's.

If you can find the Doctrinal Letter of Faith they issued then, please send me the link.

I had it but when my last computer crashed I lost the book mark.

But this is pretty good as well.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_quak.ht...

"We declare that our sexuality is God's gift, and that sexual intercourse is to be enjoyed, as the Scriptures teach, only within the marriage of one man and one woman. We reject and utterly oppose homosexual activity, especially the "blessing" of same sex unions, as sinful and displeasing to our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. Right reason, Holy Scripture and the Spirit of Christ within us unitedly testify that homosexual practice is contrary to God's will. We also observe that homosexual practice is portrayed in the Scriptures as one of the awful consequences of humanity's pursuit of idolatry.(Romans 1:18-32)"

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