Proposed housing project in Montebello hills may be coming to a head

Jul 2, 2013 Full story: Whittier Daily News 68

FILE PHOTO: Oil pumps work in a remote location of the Montebello Hills over looking homes on Tuesday April 15, 2008.

Full Story
Name Withheld

Montebello, CA

#22 Jul 7, 2013
42 yr North Mtb resident wrote:
<quoted text>...keep at it if you want.
Thank you for your response. I believe you meant it as a compliment; however, I neither seek nor need your permission to post my opinions.
Theolona Ranger

Los Angeles, CA

#23 Jul 7, 2013
42 year resident writes
"Like the 'dog and pony show' of supporters who occasionally appear at city council meetings, the development supporters are composed, nearly 100% of the time, of recipients of the developer's baksheesh, PXP and Cook-Hill employees and contractors, out-of-town business interests, real estate speculators, and those who believe the unverified, unsubstantiated single-source whispers of money to come."

Worse than that is having to listen to them state completely wrong statement as if they have not read (or understood) one word of the record or of the process.
Montebello Businessperson

Torrance, CA

#24 Jul 9, 2013
What is with these people that are against progress in Montebello?

It doesn't matter if all the plants and animals are killed, polluted dust goes all over the city, traffic gets worse, and all the other problems.

It doesn't matter that everyone hates this project.

It doesn't even matter if the city goes bankrupt from the cost of this development and people lose value of their houses.

What matters is who owns the land and is what they want to do with it legal. This is not public land. Building homes is legal. Making money selling those homes on their own land is legal, and it doesn't matter where the landowners and developers live. People can do what they want with their own land, even if others don't like it.

THAT IS THE AMERICAN WAY!

Tell the treehuggers and other footdraggers to get over it and let someone build nice homes for those who want them. This isn't communist russia, so if you can't solve Montebello's problems, get out of the way of those who can and let businesspeople try. If you don't like the homes, don't buy one, but don't stop progress. There is a gold mine in the hills, and its owners deserve to get it. I'm sure there will be enough profit to spread around. Haven't you heard of 'trickle-down economics'?
Name Withheld

Montebello, CA

#25 Jul 9, 2013
There is a common misconception that because a piece of property is "private land" it is not subject to public control.

In California, the day to day operations of all oil/natural gas fields are regulated by the Department of Conservation's Division of Oil, Gas and Geothermal Resources (aka: DOGGR.) Under DOGGR, well operators must abide by strict regulations established by the State of California.

In addition to DOGGR, there are various local, state and federal agencies that oversee other aspects of land usage.

For example, the Montebello hills oil field has been subject to "several conditional use permits" that were established in the 1950's.

In regards to the proposed housing project, the developer must seek certain entitlements from the City of Montebello one of which would be a change from the current R-A-O zoning to "specific plan."

On a county level, the proposal will require permits from the Los Angeles County Department of Public Works and the County Sanitation Districts of Los Angeles County.

At the state level, the Regional Water Quality Control Board has jurisdiction over the issuing of a CWA Section 401 certification, a NPDES permit/notification, and possibly a dewatering permit if needed. The California Department of Fish & Game will weigh in with their own requirements.

DOGGER will need to be contacted for a site review and plan application as well as any other permits needed to deal with the abandonment or re-abandonment of oil/gas wells.

Finally, the proposal will be subject to Federal agency oversight such as the Army Corps of Engineers for a CWA Section 404 permit and the United States Fish & Wildlife Service due to the presence of the California gnatcatcher, a species recognized as "threatened" under the Endangered Species Act.

It should be noted that the mere presence of the California gnatcatcher "dramatically affected the amount of open space and development appropriate for the site."
DEIR Montebello Hills Specific Plan, Footnote 5, p.3-11
Trash Talk

Los Angeles, CA

#26 Jul 9, 2013
leaders are needed here
luckily Montebello has found one in 42 year resident

Montebello buisnesspersona
"People can do what they want with their own land, even if others don't like it."
ROFL
do you want to open a head shop or something?

"There is a gold mine in the hills, and its owners deserve to get it."

Condos lower the value of Montebello homeowners
do you not get the disconnect
Montebello taxpayers and schools do not need to subsidize foreign developers
Theolona Ranger

Los Angeles, CA

#27 Jul 9, 2013
goldmine in the hills
It's called oil production

Only profit is for some PXP connected insiders with their side business.
McMoran needs to stick to basics
Theolona Ranger

Los Angeles, CA

#28 Jul 9, 2013
Found a copy of the Story in My star News

More spin than the Disneyland tea cups

Project was delayed, not because of new legal counsel, but because the first EIR and Specific Plan were noticebly faulty. It did not even contain current data in 2009.

Councilman Jack Hadjinian wants the city staff to pick up the pace.
Jack- get real- the delay is entirely on the developers tardieness in preparing the new documents
Staff does not prepare the doucments- although it might be better if they did.

“It's unfair this company has been in this community for so long but doesn't have an opportunity for a public hearing," Hadjinian said at a council meeting last week.

Jack – there were public hearings on the 2009 Plan and EIR- that's why the developer had to redoo them.

“However, Darrell Heacock, a longtime real estate agent in the city, said the development would be positive for the city.
"This project is so important for the city," Heacock said. "The revenue it brings can generate support for the city.
It will bring more people and people need services.
People bring purchasing power."

This is the same Darrell Heacock that is a shill for the Caldrons.

Chamber of Commerce and Relator Heacock got this part right..
"It will bring more people and people need services. "
AND SERVICES COST MONEY

"People bring purchasing power."
Yes but they will no be spending in Montebello- With the project facing North they will be Shopping Monterey Park

I fail to understand the position of certain Relators who think that a condo project will not hurt property values and the tax base in Montebello and that in any case most property tax does not go to the City.
The city just gets the costs- there are no benefits.

About Time

In his first post about time makes the usual error of only considering revenue but not considering costs or effect on property values.

“The revenue would be great for the city”
It's the hidden and long term cost that torpedo the project- and the developer is long gone.

“Just make a decision. Yes or no.
Right or wrong. Just do it “

Now that makes sense- biggest decision in Montebello history and you want the Council to shoot from the hip

Secondly most of the open space will not be open to the public- It is reserved for oil field operations under the guise of habitat preserve.

Third
“No more talking, time for action.”-
Not even close- public hearings-
WE have already seen- Do it fast do it wrong do it over
about time

Concord, CA

#29 Jul 9, 2013
Theolona Ranger wrote:
Found a copy of the Story in My star News

More spin than the Disneyland tea cups

Project was delayed, not because of new legal counsel, but because the first EIR and Specific Plan were noticebly faulty. It did not even contain current data in 2009.

Councilman Jack Hadjinian wants the city staff to pick up the pace.
Jack- get real- the delay is entirely on the developers tardieness in preparing the new documents
Staff does not prepare the doucments- although it might be better if they did.

“It's unfair this company has been in this community for so long but doesn't have an opportunity for a public hearing," Hadjinian said at a council meeting last week.

Jack – there were public hearings on the 2009 Plan and EIR- that's why the developer had to redoo them.

“However, Darrell Heacock, a longtime real estate agent in the city, said the development would be positive for the city.
"This project is so important for the city," Heacock said. "The revenue it brings can generate support for the city.
It will bring more people and people need services.
People bring purchasing power."

This is the same Darrell Heacock that is a shill for the Caldrons.

Chamber of Commerce and Relator Heacock got this part right..
"It will bring more people and people need services. "
AND SERVICES COST MONEY

"People bring purchasing power."
Yes but they will no be spending in Montebello- With the project facing North they will be Shopping Monterey Park

I fail to understand the position of certain Relators who think that a condo project will not hurt property values and the tax base in Montebello and that in any case most property tax does not go to the City.
The city just gets the costs- there are no benefits.

About Time

In his first post about time makes the usual error of only considering revenue but not considering costs or effect on property values.

“The revenue would be great for the city”
It's the hidden and long term cost that torpedo the project- and the developer is long gone.

“Just make a decision. Yes or no.
Right or wrong. Just do it “

Now that makes sense- biggest decision in Montebello history and you want the Council to shoot from the hip

Secondly most of the open space will not be open to the public- It is reserved for oil field operations under the guise of habitat preserve.

Third
“No more talking, time for action.”-
Not even close- public hearings-
WE have already seen- Do it fast do it wrong do it over
It won't be shooting from the hip. What has been 5 years of wasting time. I want a council that has guts to make a tough decision.

Politicians are the same at any level. If I won the lotto and offered 3 of them a million dollars to vote yes, they would all do it and sell out their principles In a heart beat
about time

Concord, CA

#30 Jul 9, 2013
Montebello Businessperson wrote:
What is with these people that are against progress in Montebello?

It doesn't matter if all the plants and animals are killed, polluted dust goes all over the city, traffic gets worse, and all the other problems.

It doesn't matter that everyone hates this project.

It doesn't even matter if the city goes bankrupt from the cost of this development and people lose value of their houses.

What matters is who owns the land and is what they want to do with it legal. This is not public land. Building homes is legal. Making money selling those homes on their own land is legal, and it doesn't matter where the landowners and developers live. People can do what they want with their own land, even if others don't like it.

THAT IS THE AMERICAN WAY!

Tell the treehuggers and other footdraggers to get over it and let someone build nice homes for those who want them. This isn't communist russia, so if you can't solve Montebello's problems, get out of the way of those who can and let businesspeople try. If you don't like the homes, don't buy one, but don't stop progress. There is a gold mine in the hills, and its owners deserve to get it. I'm sure there will be enough profit to spread around. Haven't you heard of 'trickle-down economics'?
Most people here haven't , too much one sidedness , I don't care at all for this project , AT ALL. Your right, if it is their property they can do whatever they want with it, legally.

“Hilltop Park Above All”

Since: Sep 08

Montebello, CA

#31 Jul 9, 2013
Montebello Businessperson wrote:
What is with these people that are against progress in Montebello?
It doesn't matter if all the plants and animals are killed, polluted dust goes all over the city, traffic gets worse, and all the other problems.
It doesn't matter that everyone hates this project.
It doesn't even matter if the city goes bankrupt from the cost of this development and people lose value of their houses.
What matters is who owns the land and is what they want to do with it legal. This is not public land. Building homes is legal. Making money selling those homes on their own land is legal, and it doesn't matter where the landowners and developers live. People can do what they want with their own land, even if others don't like it.
THAT IS THE AMERICAN WAY!
Tell the treehuggers and other footdraggers to get over it and let someone build nice homes for those who want them. This isn't communist russia, so if you can't solve Montebello's problems, get out of the way of those who can and let businesspeople try. If you don't like the homes, don't buy one, but don't stop progress. There is a gold mine in the hills, and its owners deserve to get it. I'm sure there will be enough profit to spread around. Haven't you heard of 'trickle-down economics'?
Finally, someone who has apparently read the plan, believes what the developer says in their legally binding documents, understands its financial and physical dangers to the city, and still wants to build.

This is the Chamber of Commerce's stated opinion, too, but not usually stated so honestly.

This is a philosophical theme that was very popular in the 19th and early 20th centuries, but after such events as Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire in 1911, the increasing opposition to child labor in parts of the world, the use of DDT in the 1950's - 70's, the Love Canal, and more recently, the problems of hexachromium, it became apparent that some kind of regulation of business and development was necessary to curb the social destruction of the type of unfettered Capitalism described by the honest Montebello Businessperson.

What kind of a society do we want? One that does anything possible to make money, or one that makes money without excessively endangering the lives, property and wealth of other people?

“Hilltop Park Above All”

Since: Sep 08

Montebello, CA

#32 Jul 9, 2013
Oops, that should have been hexavalent chromium.
Trash talk

Los Angeles, CA

#33 Jul 10, 2013
about time has some valid points

"It won't be shooting from the hip. What has been 5 years of wasting time."

The developer has to reimburse the City for staff, attorneys, consultants and other costs. For a long time PXP ws way behind on it's reimbursements- the City stopped work till the bills were paid.
Are they current now- Please check

"I want a council that has guts to make a tough decision. "

Last time the project was presented the EIR was hastily and incompletely prepared by PXP's and selected "consultants".
They thought it just sail past the Rosie Vsquez, Kathy Salazar and the Felon.
Two things happened:
Bill Molinari got all his ducks in a row for a peoples referendum
and
Rosie lost the election in Nov 2009. majority changed and Kath and the Felon were recalled.
AS you may notice that group and/or their supporters seems to have arisen from the dead
Plan was sent back to the drawing board.
The council cannot do anything about the project until it is presented to them.
They could, however, fund planning, community development and the new general Plan so Montebello can get moving.
IMHO Cook Hill has been sandbagging waiting for the council to change.

"Politicians are the same at any level. If I won the lotto and offered 3 of them a million dollars to vote yes, they would all do it and sell out their principles In a heart beat "

Refer back to the previous councils I have to agree- maybe even a couple on this one
Watch how the "special interests" are lobbying this project.
Trash talk

Los Angeles, CA

#34 Jul 10, 2013
"This is the Chamber of Commerce's stated opinion, too, but not usually stated so honestly."

BINGO
The same Chamber of Commerce that has repeatedly run paid Cook Hill propaganda as a "feature".

What I fail to see is what's in it for the chamber or for any individual members.

The false hope for a little more business for themselves at the expense of all the homeowners and taxpayers of the City.

Do you really think they will turn right and fight the traffic on Montebello Blvd rather than hop directly on the 60 freeway or go straight across to the new Monterey Park Marketplace?

You can see the condo "flippers" lining up
Talk of condo rentals.
One big "project"
Montebello Businessperson

Torrance, CA

#35 Jul 11, 2013
It doesn't matter if the condos only sell for $1 each. If the landowner wants to sell them for that amount, then he should be able to do it. It's his land!

It doesn't matter if this high end housing development forces the city into bankruptcy. Why shouldn't this landowner be denied the chance to make money from his land like those who developed Sun-Ray Estates, Racquet Mountain I and II, and Brighton Hills did?

Just because the money isn't rolling into city hall anymore doesn't mean that we stop letting developers make a profit. We don't live under some soviet 5 year plan where the state rules all. In the USA the People Rule!

If this project costs the city their fire and police departments, then they cost too much anyway. I say Just Do It and let the chips fall where they may. The developer has spent thousands of $$$ garnering good will and millions of $$$$ on salaries and reports for years and years, and they deserve a return on their investment, like any businessman does.

Did anyone ask those developers of those other developments how much their developments would cost the city? I don't think so. The economics of residential developments are very well known. Like someone said, why do you think they pump so much money into the city? A landowner deserves to make money on any legal development they want to do.
Huh

Montebello, CA

#36 Jul 13, 2013
Montebello Businessperson wrote:
It doesn't matter if the condos only sell for $1 each. If the landowner wants to sell them for that amount, then he should be able to do it. It's his land!
It doesn't matter if this high end housing development forces the city into bankruptcy. Why shouldn't this landowner be denied the chance to make money from his land like those who developed Sun-Ray Estates, Racquet Mountain I and II, and Brighton Hills did?
Just because the money isn't rolling into city hall anymore doesn't mean that we stop letting developers make a profit. We don't live under some soviet 5 year plan where the state rules all. In the USA the People Rule!
If this project costs the city their fire and police departments, then they cost too much anyway. I say Just Do It and let the chips fall where they may. The developer has spent thousands of $$$ garnering good will and millions of $$$$ on salaries and reports for years and years, and they deserve a return on their investment, like any businessman does.
Did anyone ask those developers of those other developments how much their developments would cost the city? I don't think so. The economics of residential developments are very well known. Like someone said, why do you think they pump so much money into the city? A landowner deserves to make money on any legal development they want to do.
Sooooooo...
if the City of Montebello decides to rule against the developer by NOT approving their proposal then you would be okay with that because without the city's approval, it would be ILLEGAL for them to build their "high end housing development."
Or do you think that because the developer has pumped "so much money into the city" then the city should just roll over like a prostitute and let them have their way? PROSTITUTION is illegal and so is PAY FOR PLAY!!!!!!!
about time

Los Angeles, CA

#37 Jul 14, 2013
Huh wrote:
<quoted text>Sooooooo...
if the City of Montebello decides to rule against the developer by NOT approving their proposal then you would be okay with that because without the city's approval, it would be ILLEGAL for them to build their "high end housing development."
Or do you think that because the developer has pumped "so much money into the city" then the city should just roll over like a prostitute and let them have their way? PROSTITUTION is illegal and so is PAY FOR PLAY!!!!!!!
No, the city should
Make an informed choice. I know they are waiting for the correct info to make that choice. Not to be pressured by either side

“Hilltop Park Above All”

Since: Sep 08

Montebello, CA

#38 Jul 14, 2013
about time wrote:
<quoted text>
No, the city should
Make an informed choice. I know they are waiting for the correct info to make that choice. Not to be pressured by either side
Is it pressure to accept the wishes of 90%+ of the residents?

Why has it taken 6 years to get the 'correct info'?

I still haven't heard anyone assert that anyone in their right mind would spend $720,000 for substandard condos? That is the major basis for the sure income the city would supposedly receive. Anyone?
Up or down vote

Montebello, CA

#39 Jul 14, 2013
Let the people vote on the hills if the council has no guts to do it. Put it on the ballot and now.

“Hilltop Park Above All”

Since: Sep 08

Montebello, CA

#40 Jul 15, 2013
The people have already voted. So far, every councilmember that has expressed support for the proposed development has been voted out of office.
Up or down vote

Montebello, CA

#41 Jul 15, 2013
Then let the city continue to sink into oblivion like its neighboring cities to the south and east. It's all about the quality and education of the residents. Eventually north Montebello will look like the south and those who wanted nothing built in the hills will look back and know that they made a mistake.

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