Paul Revere

London, KY

#23 Sep 29, 2013
In 2012 about 47 million Americans were receiving Food Stamps. That's up by 21 million in only 5 years. The cost has also exploded from $33 billion in '07 to nearly $80 billion in 2012. And yet the Dept. of Agriculture has employees out working every street corner trying to enroll more and more people into the program. The threshold for Food Stamp eligibility continues to drop lower and lower.
This is simply furthering the nanny state, entitlement society. Many employers can't get workers to fill some positions because people can stay home, collect welfare, food stamps and other government handouts and live pretty well. And the big selling point is that they don't have to do anything whatsoever except visit their mailbox.

It's funny how liberals ALWAYS like to bring up Walmart when they want to start beating the minimum wage drum. We all know why that is...Walmart does not allow unions in there stores and that is absolutely killing the left. Especially since Walmart employees number over 1 million in the US alone.
Now, get this...if Walmart were forced to pay half of its pre tax earnings to its employees as a wage increase, the average employee would go from making $20,000 per year to $25,000. Big whoop. And when you figure that Walmart would almost certainly offset those additional costs with higher prices, you can see that the net sum gain would be negligible. That doesn't even include the number of layoffs that would result from having to pay more in wages.
And what of all the billions in taxes that Walmart pays each year? Do we just forget about that and leave it out of the conversation?
The fact is that many (if not all) of the Walmart employees that are instructed on how to sign up for govt benefits are in fact...part time employees. You don't work a part-time job and expect to make enough to feed your family. Walmart hires someone and tells them what they can expect to be paid and for how many hours. The knowledge is there for the perspective employee. Why are we demonizing a company that pays huge amounts in taxes and does supply jobs to many who need them?
The Walmart argument is simply more weath redistribution talk from liberals who want to be able to dictate how much companies should be allowed to earn. It's garbage.

http://www.businessinsider.com/walmart-employ...

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

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Since: Apr 10

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#24 Sep 29, 2013
Paul Revere wrote:
In 2012 about 47 million Americans were receiving Food Stamps. That's up by 21 million in only 5 years. The cost has also exploded from $33 billion in '07 to nearly $80 billion in 2012. And yet the Dept. of Agriculture has employees out working every street corner trying to enroll more and more people into the program. The threshold for Food Stamp eligibility continues to drop lower and lower.
This is simply furthering the nanny state, entitlement society. Many employers can't get workers to fill some positions because people can stay home, collect welfare, food stamps and other government handouts and live pretty well. And the big selling point is that they don't have to do anything whatsoever except visit their mailbox.
It's funny how liberals ALWAYS like to bring up Walmart when they want to start beating the minimum wage drum. We all know why that is...Walmart does not allow unions in there stores and that is absolutely killing the left. Especially since Walmart employees number over 1 million in the US alone.
Now, get this...if Walmart were forced to pay half of its pre tax earnings to its employees as a wage increase, the average employee would go from making $20,000 per year to $25,000. Big whoop. And when you figure that Walmart would almost certainly offset those additional costs with higher prices, you can see that the net sum gain would be negligible. That doesn't even include the number of layoffs that would result from having to pay more in wages.
And what of all the billions in taxes that Walmart pays each year? Do we just forget about that and leave it out of the conversation?
The fact is that many (if not all) of the Walmart employees that are instructed on how to sign up for govt benefits are in fact...part time employees. You don't work a part-time job and expect to make enough to feed your family. Walmart hires someone and tells them what they can expect to be paid and for how many hours. The knowledge is there for the perspective employee. Why are we demonizing a company that pays huge amounts in taxes and does supply jobs to many who need them?
The Walmart argument is simply more weath redistribution talk from liberals who want to be able to dictate how much companies should be allowed to earn. It's garbage.
http://www.businessinsider.com/walmart-employ...
Wal-mart made a 15 billion profit last year. Are you suggesting they are not making enough money to give each of their employees a living wage? As the largest employer in the US you would think that they would want to set the example on how to treat your employees. If Sam Walton new what was happening to his company and how they were treating it employees he would turn over in his grave. BTW if this model were only happening in Wal-mart it would not be an issue, but the reality is that companies are not paying a living wage in general. When you have people who can't afford to go to college, get stuck in a job in which they can't provide for themselves working 40 hours a week. You see a huge divide. This idea that it will get better if we just turn the other way is a growing problem. I am not suggesting that there is not issues in government spending, but to say that the waste is all because of the poor is absurd. The people who will be hit hardest by this is the people we send to fight for our freedoms and then shit on when the come home. So don't tell me that this great nation can't do better especially for our veterans and our children. The plan of the GOP is to once again screw over our veterans and our children by caving to the people who don't need the handouts. Perhaps we should study corporate welfare and remove THAT before we start taking food and shelter away from the seniors, veterans and children.

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

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Location hidden

#25 Sep 29, 2013
BTW these are the people that the GOP want to make it harder by lowering SNAP. My suggestions is if you want people of SNAP then start paying our military more money so they are not in poverty.

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/milita...
Tough Love

Somerset, KY

#26 Sep 30, 2013
Don't forget that the same bill that cuts funds to food stamps, dramatically increased the subsidies given to the large corporate farmers. It's just another example of conservative "fiscal hypocrisy."

Now, I'm all for a complete make over for our food assistance program, including a better means test. Social service programs should be a temporary helping hand for those in need, not a way of life or a substitute for paying workers and or military a living wage. With two sons career military I have seen first hand just how hard it can be to support a family on an enlisted military salary. That said, neither has ever gone on food stamps. In fact, both are doing quite well. With housing and health insurance virtually paid for and a host of other perks, you'd have to be a really poor money manager not to save. Also, having a working spouse is also a huge plus. According to both sons, their counterparts who are struggling to make ends meet are usually new recruits, people with large families with spouses who don't work or people who are just bad with money. Are their salaries too low? Absolutely. But then so are the salaries of millions of Americans who have seen their purchasing power decrease year after year as a result of corporate greed and congressional cronyism.
Paul Revere

London, KY

#27 Sep 30, 2013
I've offered it before and I'll do it again here. I will agree to ending corporate subsidies IF liberals will agree to end ALL government subsidies. That means so-called green/solar energy, ethanol production...any and all govt subsidies would end. So, any takers?
Walmart employees average pay is about $12.00 per hour. Part time employees is probably a little less. That's better than Kroger and the grocery chain most definitely has a union shop. So, where's the complaints about them?
By the way, thanks to Obamacare those 40 hour work weeks will soon be a thing of the past. As will a lot of full time jobs. Watch for it when the employer mandate ultimately kicks in. It's already hurt UPS workers and it's not even in effect yet.

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

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Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#28 Sep 30, 2013
Paul Revere wrote:
I've offered it before and I'll do it again here. I will agree to ending corporate subsidies IF liberals will agree to end ALL government subsidies. That means so-called green/solar energy, ethanol production...any and all govt subsidies would end. So, any takers?
Walmart employees average pay is about $12.00 per hour. Part time employees is probably a little less. That's better than Kroger and the grocery chain most definitely has a union shop. So, where's the complaints about them?
By the way, thanks to Obamacare those 40 hour work weeks will soon be a thing of the past. As will a lot of full time jobs. Watch for it when the employer mandate ultimately kicks in. It's already hurt UPS workers and it's not even in effect yet.
I think you are missing the point of the entire thread. We are talking about why so many people need government assistance in the first place. When you have two parents working 40 hours a week and still can not provide for their family there is a problem. This problem is exacerbated by companies that should be leading the way in employee relations not paying employees a living wage and instead telling them how to sign up for government help....This in my opinion is just another way corporation are receiving subsidies although in this case the subsidy is hitting the taxpayer and not the company. You can try to make it about other thing, but the fact of the matter is corporate greed/greed in general is what is crushing the middle class. They can't afford education to pull themselves out and they are forced to work 40 hours a week and still get help from the government. If you can't see something wrong with this picture then you are blind to facts and reality.
whattt

Somerset, KY

#29 Oct 2, 2013
CTT wrote:
<quoted text>
1%? Seriously?
I was talking to a peace officer recently, asked him about what percentage of people they come in contact with were on drugs. His response was drug use is so prevalent they have to assume they all are, especially the younger generation, but that at least half were were actually on something.
Education is a key factor, but even that won't fix the problem without more jobs. Jobs left this country partly due to Unions forcing companies to pay high wages to uneducated drones to screw in a widget all day, and partly due to government polices like NAFTA that allowed companies to ship jobs to Mexico etc where employees are paid $3 a day versus $30 an hour here.
All the stuff that we need and buy here should be made here. I believe that alone would make a huge difference in our economy
yup,,, I am with you
Paul Revere

Somerset, KY

#32 Oct 2, 2013
Allanon80 wrote:
<quoted text>
You still avoided to answer why people need government help in the first place. Both can quote facts to support our side, but the fact of the matter is people only need government help because corporations are not leading the way in living wages. The reason they are not doing so is because of greed. What they fail to realize is if they pay their employees more and give them a living wage, they will in turn buy more thus improving the economy. If you don't pay them a living wage then they people will seek help from the government. Companies who sacrifice wages for huge profits is part of the problem here....Also remember that the people that are working 40 hours a week and on government help are still contributing to that system via their taxes. Stop blaming the poor and ask yourself why someone who is working 40 hours can't make it and is eligible for help in the first place.
Perhaps low skilled workers need to stop depending on McDonalds and Walmart as a long term career choice. Walmart offers you a job at a plainly specified hourly wage...what do you do? Do you take it and try to work toward a better position either inside Walmart or at some other company? Or do you complain that Walmart should be paying you more than what YOU agreed to?
No company owes you anything beyond what you and they agree to under the tendered job offer.
I got news for you sweetheart, Walmart and just about every other large company (aside from Amazon) are in business to make as much money as they can. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with that. NOBODY should be able to restrict the success of an American or and American company. That's wealth redistribution you're talking about and it has its roots in Marxist Socialism. And that stuff has failed everywhere it has been tried.
I laid it out for you a few posts back. Walmart could take one half of its yearly profit and give it back to its employees and the average salary would only rise by about $5K. Doing that would also affect the enormous $7 billion dollars the government collects from Walmart in taxes as well. So, what do you want? Less taxes paid by Walmart or a minimal increase in salary? Either choice would result in higher prices being passed on to the consumer so, it's a lose-lose situation.
The REAL truth is that most who are receiving food stamps and welfare don't need or deserve it. But, why have any ambition when Santa will take care of everything? Food, money, healthcare, cell phones and any number of other handouts. You're seeing the creation of a society willingly dependent on the government, cradle to grave. I've met people who's sole ambition is to get all those goodies and live that life. They think it's owed to them. Probably because for years liberals have been telling them it is.

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

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Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#33 Oct 3, 2013
Paul Revere wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps low skilled workers need to stop depending on McDonalds and Walmart as a long term career choice. Walmart offers you a job at a plainly specified hourly wage...what do you do? Do you take it and try to work toward a better position either inside Walmart or at some other company? Or do you complain that Walmart should be paying you more than what YOU agreed to?
No company owes you anything beyond what you and they agree to under the tendered job offer.
I got news for you sweetheart, Walmart and just about every other large company (aside from Amazon) are in business to make as much money as they can. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with that. NOBODY should be able to restrict the success of an American or and American company. That's wealth redistribution you're talking about and it has its roots in Marxist Socialism. And that stuff has failed everywhere it has been tried.
I laid it out for you a few posts back. Walmart could take one half of its yearly profit and give it back to its employees and the average salary would only rise by about $5K. Doing that would also affect the enormous $7 billion dollars the government collects from Walmart in taxes as well. So, what do you want? Less taxes paid by Walmart or a minimal increase in salary? Either choice would result in higher prices being passed on to the consumer so, it's a lose-lose situation.
The REAL truth is that most who are receiving food stamps and welfare don't need or deserve it. But, why have any ambition when Santa will take care of everything? Food, money, healthcare, cell phones and any number of other handouts. You're seeing the creation of a society willingly dependent on the government, cradle to grave. I've met people who's sole ambition is to get all those goodies and live that life. They think it's owed to them. Probably because for years liberals have been telling them it is.
It sounds to me that your answer to the problem is to get rid of the uneducated and the poor. Instead of giving solutions to the problems you would rather blame the problems on people you consider undesirable in society....I am sure I have heard that song and dance before so have the Jews BTW. I am not saying there is not tough choices that have to be made, but just writing off a whole nation of people is not the answer either...Like I said the GOP wants everyone to have guns without registering them and then those very same people that want to starve...Sound like the making of a riot to me, but I only have history to show me that. You see as blame the less fortunate, I see as a social responsibility for corporation to step up and do the right thing. Until the economic divide starts closing again things will only get worse.
You have not laid out any plan either other than get rid of the uneducated and poor. I hate to tell you this but there are far more of them than there are the rich. So now that you all have fought to make sure everyone has a gun, do you want to be the first one to tell them they are no longer needed in this country and therefore have to go....BTW I would suggest starting with our armed forces since a large number of them are on SNAP benefits because our government won't pay them enough to support their family even though they are fighting to make sure we are safe. Food for thought.
Paul Revere

Somerset, KY

#34 Oct 3, 2013
Allanon80 wrote:
<quoted text>
It sounds to me that your answer to the problem is to get rid of the uneducated and the poor. Instead of giving solutions to the problems you would rather blame the problems on people you consider undesirable in society....I am sure I have heard that song and dance before so have the Jews BTW. I am not saying there is not tough choices that have to be made, but just writing off a whole nation of people is not the answer either...Like I said the GOP wants everyone to have guns without registering them and then those very same people that want to starve...Sound like the making of a riot to me, but I only have history to show me that. You see as blame the less fortunate, I see as a social responsibility for corporation to step up and do the right thing. Until the economic divide starts closing again things will only get worse.
You have not laid out any plan either other than get rid of the uneducated and poor. I hate to tell you this but there are far more of them than there are the rich. So now that you all have fought to make sure everyone has a gun, do you want to be the first one to tell them they are no longer needed in this country and therefore have to go....BTW I would suggest starting with our armed forces since a large number of them are on SNAP benefits because our government won't pay them enough to support their family even though they are fighting to make sure we are safe. Food for thought.
Yeah, your party has taken control of 1/7th of the economy, is trying to stifle public debate and is admittedly guilty of harassing those who offer opposition views to a liberal govt agenda....and I'm the fascist? Yeah, OK.
I'll type slowly for you.
Most jobs at companies like Walmart, McDonalds, Kroger, etc. are considered entry level. Meaning that they are for low skilled workers. Many are high school and college aged kids who have no experience in the workforce. So, with no skills why should they expect to be paid on an equal basis as someone who has spent 8-10 years in the workforce?
If you start forcing companies to pay wet behind the ears, low skilled kids off the street the same as those who have been with the company for some period of time, those jobs are going to go away. Liberals are trying to wrangle control of the private sector thru intrusive laws (Obamacare) and over regulation but, they don't fully control it yet. Wealth redistribution and social engineering is their goal and that's part of the reason that liberalism is an insidious, creeping, evil. They use phrases like "step up and do the right thing" that actually mean 'give in to our Marxist demands or we'll national your industry too'.

And, are you really going to drag out the old worn out liberal standby of 'Republican want people to starve'??? Come on, that's so lame it's pathetic! But, I'll play along just to make things interesting. Allow me to quote an article that appeared in the NY Times back in 2008 that demonstrates how Conservatives put liberals to shame when it comes to charitable giving and red states give far more than those that vote blue. It's really very revealing...

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/21/opinion/21k...

And where are these riots you speak of? People have been toting unregistered guns for decades and I'm fairly certain a few of them might even have been hungry at some point. So, where are the riots? More liberal poppycock.
Scare tactics, hyperbole, elitist condescension, lies and thinly veiled threats. Yep, that pretty much sums of liberals that have taken control of the Dem Party these days.
Walmart veteran

Campbellsville, KY

#35 Oct 3, 2013
Paul Revere wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps low skilled workers need to stop depending on McDonalds and Walmart as a long term career choice. Walmart offers you a job at a plainly specified hourly wage...what do you do? Do you take it and try to work toward a better position either inside Walmart or at some other company? Or do you complain that Walmart should be paying you more than what YOU agreed to?
No company owes you anything beyond what you and they agree to under the tendered job offer.
I got news for you sweetheart, Walmart and just about every other large company (aside from Amazon) are in business to make as much money as they can. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with that. NOBODY should be able to restrict the success of an American or and American company. That's wealth redistribution you're talking about and it has its roots in Marxist Socialism. And that stuff has failed everywhere it has been tried.
I laid it out for you a few posts back. Walmart could take one half of its yearly profit and give it back to its employees and the average salary would only rise by about $5K. Doing that would also affect the enormous $7 billion dollars the government collects from Walmart in taxes as well. So, what do you want? Less taxes paid by Walmart or a minimal increase in salary? Either choice would result in higher prices being passed on to the consumer so, it's a lose-lose situation.
The REAL truth is that most who are receiving food stamps and welfare don't need or deserve it. But, why have any ambition when Santa will take care of everything? Food, money, healthcare, cell phones and any number of other handouts. You're seeing the creation of a society willingly dependent on the government, cradle to grave. I've met people who's sole ambition is to get all those goodies and live that life. They think it's owed to them. Probably because for years liberals have been telling them it is.
walmart has been hijacked by greedy money grabbers at the corporate level.sams dreams for a company built for his workers died with him.he even called us associates instead of employees.longtime associates like myself are leaving by the thousands because they have realized that SAMs vision for his people has become a nightmare.sam had created a wonderful place to work .his sayings used to be framed and hanging in the halls in back for us all to read.they have been removed.
Remember

Nicholasville, KY

#36 Oct 4, 2013
sawdust wrote:
<quoted text>
You're right, it needs changing. I once had a friend that worked in the food stamp office and he was always trying to get me to come sign up on food stamps because I was a self employed logger. He said he could fix it so no one would ever know. That was back in the 80's.
I remember the days when the needy got monthly govt. commodities, cheese, peanut butter, powdered milk, powdered eggs, flour, cornmeal, etc. It worked pretty good and the idea came from the Mormon church who still has the most efficient welfare system in the world.
I would actually rather volunteer at a soup kitchen than to see my tax dollars go for so much fraud.
Cheese and peanut butter! O but those were the good old days when Reagan was president, and the food stamp office gave Exlax to move it on.
Now the Republicans want to illuminate the Mexicans because they voted for Obama.
food stamp for drugs

Somerset, KY

#37 Oct 4, 2013
They buy the groceries for someone who will pay cash. Generally 60+ cents on the dollar. The cash is then used to buy Pills or whichever drug they need to trade or barter for the drug of their choice.
The ones that REALLY suffer from not drug testing, are the very children that the food stamp & welfare program was intended to help in the first place.
However, When you consider that better than 72% are known by the US Gov. to be brain damaged by being Bi-Polar, Sociopathic in-bread outcast of society, Their is little hope that their ongoing mind set of living off of the system with no reguard for the working class that have no chance of social security benefits due to the mismanagement of the program, will ever concern them anyway.
Compare it to the V/a's no care program set up to discount service connected vet to be listed as non-service connected even when they served in war time. No benefits for us, as we are stuck to pick up the bill for all the welfare fraud & their vast number of dead-beat leaches, sucking the system dry.
Yes

Manchester, KY

#38 Oct 4, 2013
I say cut it all, some will die off like a weak coyote does in the wild. GET BACK TO NATURE!

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

Level 5

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#39 Oct 6, 2013
Paul Revere wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, your party has taken control of 1/7th of the economy, is trying to stifle public debate and is admittedly guilty of harassing those who offer opposition views to a liberal govt agenda....and I'm the fascist? Yeah, OK.
I'll type slowly for you.
Most jobs at companies like Walmart, McDonalds, Kroger, etc. are considered entry level. Meaning that they are for low skilled workers. Many are high school and college aged kids who have no experience in the workforce. So, with no skills why should they expect to be paid on an equal basis as someone who has spent 8-10 years in the workforce?
If you start forcing companies to pay wet behind the ears, low skilled kids off the street the same as those who have been with the company for some period of time, those jobs are going to go away. Liberals are trying to wrangle control of the private sector thru intrusive laws (Obamacare) and over regulation but, they don't fully control it yet. Wealth redistribution and social engineering is their goal and that's part of the reason that liberalism is an insidious, creeping, evil. They use phrases like "step up and do the right thing" that actually mean 'give in to our Marxist demands or we'll national your industry too'...
You can only squeeze the people so long before the pressure causes things to pop. WE have seen this in history. The French Revolution being a prime example of the income inequality that caused a number of wells to do to lose their head. When you are an elite group calling the shots then you lose. Corporations have bought and paid for our elected officials on both sides of the aisle. They are using their money and leverage to get the laws passed that line their pockets to an even greater degree all while the middle class suffers and disappears. Then you with all your money and spin the story to blame all the poor people on government help as the actual problem. You then can use your corporate clout and bought elected officials to make sure you don't have to pay a living wage all the while getting people distracted by what you are doing. The Koch bothers have done a great job on distracting us from what they and other corporations are doing.

Perhaps we should think about how to get corporations out of politics and the people back in it. Perhaps we should end the many money wasters we have in the budget before we decide to take away from people who struggle everyday just to get to the next. I suggest we bring all our soldiers home from all the bases we have throughout the world and close them down. Then we should use our military here at home like we do abroad by building up infrastructure her at home. Next we could stop this ridiculous war on drugs that is a HUGE waste of money and is not actually doing anything to stop people from being on drugs. Next we could take all that new found money and increase spending on our education system. We are falling behind in human capital. If you want to help the people get off the government teat then HELP them via the only that we know works...education. Everyone should be given the chance to get a college degree without going 10's of thousands in the whole BEFORE you even start your career. Why not give positive solutions instead of being a negative nancy?

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

Level 5

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#40 Oct 6, 2013
Sorry about the typos in my previous post I am tired and need sleep.
tired of it

Lexington, KY

#41 Oct 7, 2013
Allanon80 wrote:
<quoted text>
You're right my figures were wrong. Since starting the testing in Fl only 2% have tested positive for drugs. I stand corrected....either way it is not the most cost effective way of removing the problem and only adds to the debt for states. Education and an actual living wage is the only way to really fix the problem. Are you one of those people who think companies should pay what they want and don't think there should be a minimum wage? You are deluding yourself if you don't think there is a socio-economical divide in this country.
I find it odd that a certain party wants to make sure that everyone has a gun, but then wants to make sure those same people can't eat by voting down SNAP benefits. Sounds like the makings of a riot to me. Think French Revolution!
the testing has decreased the applications by 50% though.
tired of it

Lexington, KY

#42 Oct 7, 2013
http://www.floridafga.org/2011/10/floridas-dr...

latest data i could find, if you can find newer, i'd love to see it.

“Welcome to the Winds of Change”

Level 5

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#43 Oct 7, 2013
tired of it wrote:
http://www.floridafga.org/2011 /10/floridas-drug-test-law-for -welfare-cash-assistance-first -quarter-facts-2/
latest data i could find, if you can find newer, i'd love to see it.
Here you go
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/18/us/no-savin...

Notice there is about a 6 month difference in which the nytimes is the newer of the two. If I had more time I am sure we could find something newer.
Paul Revere

Somerset, KY

#44 Oct 7, 2013
"Income equality" is an impossibility. It's simply not possible. God created us all with different levels of talent and expertise in different areas. That was intentional. Some people are the best ditch diggers you'll ever meet. Others are capable of espousing new concepts tied to Cosmic String Theory. Never the two shall meet.
Promoting "income equality" is nothing more than Marxist code-language for wealth redistribution. Meaning. the govt should be empowered to decide limits on how much you should be allowed to make and how you should spend your salary.
As long as people have walked the Earth, some have have been rich and some have been poor. That will NEVER change. The best we can hope for is that our society be allowed to offer as much opportunity as it can. Marxism, Socialism or any other type of society can not offer the opportunities that Capitalism can. It's been proven over and over.
Creating an entitlement society is in direct opposition to opportunity and self reliance, both cornerstones of America's rise to prominence.
And if you really believe an uprising by the poor who are hooked on govt handouts is a real possibility, I've got some ocean front property in Utah that I can make you a great deal on.

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