seperation of church and state

seperation of church and state

Posted in the Shively Forum

Politically incorrect

United States

#1 Jul 23, 2013
Someone show me where this is in the constitution?
just curious

Louisville, KY

#2 Jul 24, 2013
Politically incorrect wrote:
Someone show me where this is in the constitution?
1st Amendment..."Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion"...etc. However, prior to the 14th Amendment, or rather SCOTUS interpretation of the 14th Amendment, it only applied to...well, Congress. States were free to enact laws regarding religion according to their own constitutions. So your point, prior to 1866, was a valid one as long as you were using state in the singular sense and not a collective one.
Now, under current (case) law, the 1st amendment applies to every state, not just the federal government.
Not saying that's right, but that's how it is.
bob

United States

#3 Jul 24, 2013
The tyranny of the majority is no more "right" in one state than any other. Folks are free to practice and promote their religion all they want, long as the don't expect others to foot the bill. Public property belongs to all of us, not just the dominant religious sect of a given area.

Bear in mind, the same amendment that keeps creationism out of public schools also keeps evolution out of Sunday school. That is, unless the church chooses to teach evolution in Sunday school. Their right to do so, or not, is protected.
just curious

United States

#4 Jul 24, 2013
bob wrote:
The tyranny of the majority is no more "right" in one state than any other. Folks are free to practice and promote their religion all they want, long as the don't expect others to foot the bill. Public property belongs to all of us, not just the dominant religious sect of a given area.
Bear in mind, the same amendment that keeps creationism out of public schools also keeps evolution out of Sunday school. That is, unless the church chooses to teach evolution in Sunday school. Their right to do so, or not, is protected.
And I don't disagree. My point was that prior to the 14th Amendment, or rather early 20th century when SCOTUS used it to apply the 1st Amendment to states as well as Congress, a state legislature could have legally made a religion the "official" religion in that state (as long as it didn't violate the state constitution in some way).
wrong

Lexington, KY

#5 Jul 24, 2013
the actual term separation of church and state is not in the constitution. big difference between separation and establishment.
bob

Louisville, KY

#6 Jul 24, 2013
wrong wrote:
the actual term separation of church and state is not in the constitution. big difference between separation and establishment.
"Big difference" in that they're opposites? Sure. Gov't promotion of religion is essentially establishment. That very much includes federally funded public schools, for obvious reasons.
just curious

Louisville, KY

#7 Jul 25, 2013
I should also point out that at the time the Constitution was ratified, many states had an official state religion. This was an issue the founding fathers obviously believed was a matter for each state to decide for themselves. However, SCOTUS, in their infinite wisdom interpreted otherwise.

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