Who says Mormons aren't Christians?

Who says Mormons aren't Christians?

There are 32098 comments on the CNN story from Oct 12, 2011, titled Who says Mormons aren't Christians?. In it, CNN reports that:

Editor's note: Dean Obeidallah is an award-winning comedian who has appeared on TV shows such as Comedy Central's "Axis of Evil" special, ABC's "The View," CNN's "What the Week" and HLN's "The Joy Behar Show." He is executive producer of the annual New York Arab-American Comedy Festival and the Amman Stand Up Comedy Festival.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CNN.

StupidLovesScoff ing

Live Oak, CA

#25955 May 24, 2013
osirica wrote:
The Cainite view, shared by the KKK and Mormonism...
Not shared by Jews today, nor by Christians.
is that Cain was white and then was turned black.
Is that YOUR view? Come on old sport!
And cain and adam and exiling... it really has no bearing on any of this.
"Adam" was exiled. Cain was not.
<quoted text>
Enough of your lying just because you own a keyboard.

9 And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?

10 And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.

11 And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;

12 When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.

13 And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.

14 Behold,***thou hast driven me out*** this day*** from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.

15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.

16 And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.

ex·ile
Noun
***The state of being barred from one's native country, typically for political or punitive reasons.***
===
Verb
***Expel and bar (someone) from their native country, typically for political or punitive reasons.***
===

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25956 May 24, 2013
Talmud...

We are going there. So far nothing about cain and black people in the Talmud

Talmud Bavli, Sanhedrin 108b

Our Rabbis taught: Three copulated in the ark, and they were all punished — the dog, the raven, and Ham. The dog was doomed to be tied, the raven expectorates [his seed into his mate's mouth]. and Ham was smitten in his skin from him descended Cush (the negro) who is black-skinned.

Now notice two things.

1. This has nothing to do with the Curse of Ham where he saw his father drunk
2. It addresses "CUSH", not "Canaan"
3. They consider some kind of "smiting" to be the black skin itself. Not sure, but I think they think having black skin is some kind of curse. Kind of idiotic and prejudiced though.

But now you have another non-biblical ideology that came about in the 4th century.

Now you'd think that as a Christian, you'd see how this is another evidence of why we should be Christian, and why we shouldn't follow Jewish tradition.

But more than that, you see how this came about through trying to connect a legend about Ham to Canaan.

There is nothing in here that shows a legacy going back to the time of the Bible writers teaching this.

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25957 May 24, 2013
All you are doing is posting the quote from the Bible.

The point is, if he were merely turned to a different skin color, that would attract MORE attention to him, making him EASIER to find and thus kill.

Whatever the sign or mark is, it would be something that would actually PROTECT HIM.

Changing his skin color... that doesn't protect him, nor does it do enough (obviously not) to warn those who would try to kill him or his descendents.

It didn't stop whites from enslaving and killing black people did it? Yet along the way they swore their black skin came from the mark of Cain

THEREFORE...

The idiotic notion had no traction in any biblical not even any antiquity writings on the matter.

of course unless you want to include the Talmud. Oh oops, they talk about Ham and Cush... not Cain.
StupidLovesScoffing wrote:
<quoted text>
Enough of your lying just because you own a keyboard.
9 And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
10 And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.
11 And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
12 When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
13 And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.
14 Behold,***thou hast driven me out*** this day*** from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.
15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.
16 And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.
ex·ile
Noun
***The state of being barred from one's native country, typically for political or punitive reasons.***
===
Verb
***Expel and bar (someone) from their native country, typically for political or punitive reasons.***
===
StupidLovesScoff ing

Live Oak, CA

#25958 May 24, 2013
osirica wrote:
By the way, both talmuds were not compiled until the 3rd - 4th centuries.
And they have a wide variety of other things they say about Christians and Jesus:
He and his disciples practiced sorcery and black magic, led Jews astray into idolatry, and were sponsored by foreign, gentile powers for the purpose of subverting Jewish worship (Sanhedrin 43a).
2) He was sexually immoral, worshipped statues of stone (a brick is mentioned), was cut off from the Jewish people for his wickedness, and refused to repent (Sanhedrin 107b; Sotah 47a).
3) He learned witchcraft in Egypt and, to perform miracles, used procedures that involved cutting his flesh, which is also explicitly banned in the Bible (Shabbos 104b).
But I'm sure you will make an excellent argument in support of the Talmud...
So let's keep going.
<quoted text>
CHANGING the SUBJECT
to ANYTHING BUT
the CLAIM
Y.O.U. can't PROVE

leaves you unable to back up anything you said.

Leaving "US" no place to move on, TO.

You've been caught lying twice in one short conversation.

You're dismissed.

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25959 May 24, 2013
Now that I reeled you in, making you think you had some traction. Getting back to the devastating point:

Owth is not "skin changing color on a person's body"

And even more ammo for me is this:

All of your historical references? NONE of them properly address the mark of Cain in the context of the Bible.

You have stuff about Ham, stuff about Kush, you have stuff about coal, and stuff about Cain's FACE. You have stuff about his countenance and other isolated references about this and that.

NOTHING about CAIN being MARKED with BLACK SKIN.

The earliest you will find comes from Islam, and the earliest Christian reference is from a Syriac in the 5th century that goes on some thing about an Adam-Book.

But the Jewish Talmud has all KINDS of discussion about Cain and the mark

Abba Arika ("Rab") said that God gave Cain a dog, making him an example to murderers.

Abba Jose ben Hanan said that God made a horn grow out of Cain. R. Hanin said that God made Cain an example to penitents (Gen. Rab. 22:12).

Rashi comments on Genesis 4:15 that the mark was one of the Hebrew letters of the Tetragrammaton: "He engraved a letter of His [God's] Name onto his [Cain's] forehead."

In Kabbalah, the Zohar states that the mark of Cain was one of the twenty-two Hebrew letters of the Torah, although the Zohar's native Aramaic doesn't actually tell us which of the letters it was. Some commentators, such as Rabbi Michael Berg in his English commentary on the Zohar, suggest that the mark of Cain was the letter vav.

Funny... more notions about letters on his forehead than about his SKIN changing color...

Yet you are not going along with what the HISTORIANS teach... ARE YOU

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25960 May 24, 2013
See this whole crap about segregation, as if it goes back to the days of Adam and Eve...

that's a bunch of white racist supremacist CRAP.

And to teach this, you slimy a$$hole, is why I am here

I will keep stomp stomp stomping you, whether you change your silly screen name or not.

You want to keep coming back? Bring the Talmud, bring some Syriac priests, bring the KKK, bring Hitler, Bedford Forrest, the Confederacy from the grave if you want to.

I will stomp STOMP STOMP em again!

Because there was noting in the Bible that was being taught to segregate or treat blacks in any way differently or as a cursed people.

And the racism in the MORMON church was not based on Talmud, or some ancient historical relationship.

It was based on 19th century AMERICAN WHITE ignorance and arrogance. It was Joseph Smith, copying Baptists who had been trolling this myth around to defend slavery.

Bring it, you punk. Bring your reply.

I am salivating for your reply

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25961 May 24, 2013
Changing the subject from WHAT?

This was about whether or not black people were curesd or marked from Cain... as YOU and the MORMON church and the KKK all allege.

THATS the subject. You want to change it to whether or not Cain or Adam were exiled.

I DO NOT CARE IF THEY WERE EXILED OR NOT. IT HAS NO BEARING ON THE OTHER POINT.

You've tried to:

1. raise the talmud. I shot that down
2. Syrian priest. Shot that down.
3. "Historians" you cant find any
4. "2000 year old" writings you cant find any
5. Skin color had to come from somewhere. Nipped that in the bud
6. Protect Cain by making it EASIER for people to find him... shot that stupid notion down.

You're afraid to talk about Islam becuase you know your sick religion is an offshot of Islam, with your "after Jesus prophet" and "Great Apostacy" myth.

You're stuck here while I keep stomping you. Get back up, raise your hand.

I think I see you twitching, REPLY so I can stomp you again!
StupidLovesScoffing wrote:
<quoted text>
CHANGING the SUBJECT
to ANYTHING BUT
the CLAIM
Y.O.U. can't PROVE
leaves you unable to back up anything you said.
Leaving "US" no place to move on, TO.
You've been caught lying twice in one short conversation.
You're dismissed.

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25962 May 24, 2013
Finally MORMONS:

You are intelligent enough to know the difference between biblical testimony and made up "revision" of biblical testimony.

And your prophet founder did the fatal mistake of taking revision and reinserting it into a "canon" AS biblical testimony.

And not just any revision... no... something that is heinous and sinful and just evil. Something that was shared by groups like the KKK, and NAZIs

THE END
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25963 May 24, 2013
God is Love. People made religion. All religion does is put people against each other. Does it matter what people believe in. Mormons aren't like Christians in many ways, but what does that really matter. The religion is the poison that makes us look bad. If your a two-faced religion affender then your giving that certain religion a bad name. We can't show people God's Love by the way we rep are name, but we can show God's Love through Christ, and how Christ died on the CROSS for us. HE DIED!! For me. What does that tell you? It doesn't matter what religion we are as long as we believe that JESUS IS ARE SAVIOR. What more do we need other than that.
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25964 May 24, 2013
Osirica:
You are completely right about the Islam thing, but you need to remember that God Loves all people no matter what. If he didn't he probably would have killed them by now. If you read my proposition up above you'll see what I mean. God judges but he does not discriminate against what the people decide becuase HE gave man free will.
:)
concerned in Egypt

Europe

#25965 May 24, 2013
Think About It wrote:
Osirica:
You are completely right about the Islam thing, but you need to remember that God Loves all people no matter what. If he didn't he probably would have killed them by now. If you read my proposition up above you'll see what I mean. God judges but he does not discriminate against what the people decide becuase HE gave man free will.
:)
Could you be any dumber?? Maybe

God does discriminate He made some black some white some brown some men some women.

No, God does not love all people no matter what, his love and his blessings are conditional, and these are based on time and choice.

To judge one must discriminate.

Discriminating is done when a choice via free will or judging is done they are one in the same one goes with the other. If one has free will and one makes a choice or one makes a judgement within their free will to eat an apple over an orange this can only be done on the basis of discriminating, judging on the basis of some quality reason such as taste, colour nutritional value etc to eat the apple over the orange.

So wake up, think your thoughts through, take a philosphy course or two and read about logical and rational thought.
Start with R.C.Sproul consequences of
ideas
morrrree

France

#25966 May 24, 2013
free best buy and amazon gift cards for watching a few music videos here http://bit.ly/10MNWz2
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25967 May 24, 2013
concerned in Egypt wrote:
<quoted text>
Could you be any dumber?? Maybe
God does discriminate He made some black some white some brown some men some women.
No, God does not love all people no matter what, his love and his blessings are conditional, and these are based on time and choice.
To judge one must discriminate.
Discriminating is done when a choice via free will or judging is done they are one in the same one goes with the other. If one has free will and one makes a choice or one makes a judgement within their free will to eat an apple over an orange this can only be done on the basis of discriminating, judging on the basis of some quality reason such as taste, colour nutritional value etc to eat the apple over the orange.
So wake up, think your thoughts through, take a philosphy course or two and read about logical and rational thought.
Start with R.C.Sproul consequences of
ideas
I hope you Know what you are saying because let me tell you... YOUR WRONG! Do you seriiously think that God made people different because he was descriminating. STUPID!!! READ THE FREAKING BIBLE. He seperated tongues and made people diferent because the people were making a tower to get to heaven. That's why God split the tongues and made them different. So that they wouldn't all be able to understand each other anymore, and wouldn't be able to make another tower to heaven. SO THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO FREAKING WORK TOGETHER. THINK ABOUT IT YOU IDIOT. God doesn't care the color of your skin. You need to check your freaking self before you wreck your freaking self. Your a stupid ignorent person that I've ever had that misfortune of arguing with. Also next time you want to try to tell me off stay on THE FREAKING SUBJECT!!!!!
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25968 May 24, 2013
concerned in Egypt wrote:
<quoted text>
Could you be any dumber?? Maybe
God does discriminate He made some black some white some brown some men some women.
No, God does not love all people no matter what, his love and his blessings are conditional, and these are based on time and choice.
To judge one must discriminate.
Discriminating is done when a choice via free will or judging is done they are one in the same one goes with the other. If one has free will and one makes a choice or one makes a judgement within their free will to eat an apple over an orange this can only be done on the basis of discriminating, judging on the basis of some quality reason such as taste, colour nutritional value etc to eat the apple over the orange.
So wake up, think your thoughts through, take a philosphy course or two and read about logical and rational thought.
Start with R.C.Sproul consequences of
ideas
PLUS I SAID HE DOES NOT DESCRIMINATE AGAINST PEOPLES WILL, BECAUSE ITS FREAKING FREE!!!!
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25969 May 24, 2013
concerned in Egypt wrote:
<quoted text>
Could you be any dumber?? Maybe
God does discriminate He made some black some white some brown some men some women.
No, God does not love all people no matter what, his love and his blessings are conditional, and these are based on time and choice.
To judge one must discriminate.
Discriminating is done when a choice via free will or judging is done they are one in the same one goes with the other. If one has free will and one makes a choice or one makes a judgement within their free will to eat an apple over an orange this can only be done on the basis of discriminating, judging on the basis of some quality reason such as taste, colour nutritional value etc to eat the apple over the orange.
So wake up, think your thoughts through, take a philosphy course or two and read about logical and rational thought.
Start with R.C.Sproul consequences of
ideas
Also stupid God can so what he wants. God does love all becuase he made us to love him and for him to love us. If he didn't love us so much why would he have sent his only son HIS ONLY SON to FREAKING DIE FOR US! Huh? Let me ask you something here, Would you give up your son for crappy stupid idiots who don't even care about you, People who say bad things about you or just completely disown you would you still give up your son to DIE on a CROSS for THOSE KIND OF PEOPLE? Would? A son that you would love so much. No you probably would. But God did, BECAUSE HE LOVES ALL!!! And if you are going to say something like God doesn't love all only conditionally then you can consider yourself a PHARISEE. God heals the weak and the broken. He can take an Atheist and turn them into a prophit. You sir need to read your FREAKING BIBLE more and get your facts straight.:)
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25970 May 24, 2013
Think About It wrote:
God is Love. People made religion. All religion does is put people against each other. Does it matter what people believe in. Mormons aren't like Christians in many ways, but what does that really matter. The religion is the poison that makes us look bad. If your a two-faced religion affender then your giving that certain religion a bad name. We can't show people God's Love by the way we rep are name, but we can show God's Love through Christ, and how Christ died on the CROSS for us. HE DIED!! For me. What does that tell you? It doesn't matter what religion we are as long as we believe that JESUS IS ARE SAVIOR. What more do we need other than that.
I'M A JESUS FREAK I WOULD KNOW!!!!
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25971 May 24, 2013
osirica wrote:
Changing the subject from WHAT?
This was about whether or not black people were curesd or marked from Cain... as YOU and the MORMON church and the KKK all allege.
THATS the subject. You want to change it to whether or not Cain or Adam were exiled.
I DO NOT CARE IF THEY WERE EXILED OR NOT. IT HAS NO BEARING ON THE OTHER POINT.
You've tried to:
1. raise the talmud. I shot that down
2. Syrian priest. Shot that down.
3. "Historians" you cant find any
4. "2000 year old" writings you cant find any
5. Skin color had to come from somewhere. Nipped that in the bud
6. Protect Cain by making it EASIER for people to find him... shot that stupid notion down.
You're afraid to talk about Islam becuase you know your sick religion is an offshot of Islam, with your "after Jesus prophet" and "Great Apostacy" myth.
You're stuck here while I keep stomping you. Get back up, raise your hand.
I think I see you twitching, REPLY so I can stomp you again!
<quoted text>
Osirica:
You are completely right about the Islam thing, but you need to remember that God Loves all people no matter what. If he didn't he probably would have killed them by now.LOL!! God judges but he does not discriminate against what the people decide becuase HE gave man free will. A free will is what everyone has. Poeple can say and do and believe in whatever they want to. God also states in the bible "that no one shall have another GOD other then me." If you have read the stories it tells about how God has killed countless people because of this. So remember don't get mad about what others say because when we die who's going to come out on top. Not them.
:)
Think About It

Englewood, CO

#25972 May 24, 2013
concerned in Egypt wrote:
<quoted text>
Could you be any dumber?? Maybe
God does discriminate He made some black some white some brown some men some women.
No, God does not love all people no matter what, his love and his blessings are conditional, and these are based on time and choice.
To judge one must discriminate.
Discriminating is done when a choice via free will or judging is done they are one in the same one goes with the other. If one has free will and one makes a choice or one makes a judgement within their free will to eat an apple over an orange this can only be done on the basis of discriminating, judging on the basis of some quality reason such as taste, colour nutritional value etc to eat the apple over the orange.
So wake up, think your thoughts through, take a philosphy course or two and read about logical and rational thought.
Start with R.C.Sproul consequences of
ideas
Another thing... that I'm going to have to give you credit for and then crush again because you were off a little is that.... Your right God did make men and women... here's were your wrong, God made us so that we can be joined TOGETHER AS A WHOLE, not to discriminate us. In the very beginning of time God made one man and then decided he needed a wife so he made women out of a rib bone from the man. Then if you don't know the rest... They had kids and there kids had kids and so on and so forth. Anything else you want to say... If not I'm done with this subject. And by the looks of it you have to. LOL!! Wow are you scared... you should be buddy. You haven't answered one of my back. So I'm just going to keep on bashing you.:)

sportxmouse

“Duty is a Privilege!”

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#25973 May 24, 2013
osirica wrote:
Changing the subject from WHAT?
This was about whether or not black people were curesd or marked from Cain... as YOU and the MORMON church and the KKK all allege.
THATS the subject. You want to change it to whether or not Cain or Adam were exiled.
I DO NOT CARE IF THEY WERE EXILED OR NOT. IT HAS NO BEARING ON THE OTHER POINT.
You've tried to:
1. raise the talmud. I shot that down
2. Syrian priest. Shot that down.
3. "Historians" you cant find any
4. "2000 year old" writings you cant find any
5. Skin color had to come from somewhere. Nipped that in the bud
6. Protect Cain by making it EASIER for people to find him... shot that stupid notion down.
You're afraid to talk about Islam becuase you know your sick religion is an offshot of Islam, with your "after Jesus prophet" and "Great Apostacy" myth.
You're stuck here while I keep stomping you. Get back up, raise your hand.
I think I see you twitching, REPLY so I can stomp you again!
<quoted text>
The only think you have proven is you hate being black.

sportxmouse

“Duty is a Privilege!”

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#25974 May 24, 2013
osirica wrote:
And he changed the skin color to what?
And why, vs any other color?
<quoted text>
He changed his color to black...
possibly so people would not identify him as Cain...
the man who committed murder.

He lightened his burden.

You have so many questions...
why don't you take this up with Heavenly Father?

We only have part of the scriptures available to us...
due to the Church of Rome!

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