Letter to Editor: Fish passage

Letter to Editor: Fish passage

There are 15 comments on the Red Bluff Daily News story from Jul 27, 2010, titled Letter to Editor: Fish passage. In it, Red Bluff Daily News reports that:

Editor: Nobody knew about this Stone guy? Why does it take so long to drag the truth out of people? What is this? Ostrich land? Back in the sixties I and some of my friends used to go to Rio Vista for a bass festival.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Red Bluff Daily News.

Reality

Los Molinos, CA

#1 Jul 27, 2010
1) Supply water to our crops and orchards before we destroy those industries.

2) Declare a moratorium on fishing for salmon in our continental waters from Mexico to the Canadian border until our salmon can recover.

How about a moratorium on new agricultural expansion or even a reduction in the water used for ag. If you are taking a holistic look at the problem you cannot deny that our water needs have increased and this has an effect on salmon population. Why are farmers more valuble than fishermen in your analysis?
rhondar

United States

#2 Jul 29, 2010
Reality wrote:
1)
How about a moratorium on new agricultural expansion or even a reduction in the water used for ag. If you are taking a holistic look at the problem you cannot deny that our water needs have increased and this has an effect on salmon population. Why are farmers more valuble than fishermen in your analysis?
Great solution, why don't we outsource our ag industry to another state. Better yet how about China,India or Perhaps the African continent?
Reality

Los Molinos, CA

#3 Jul 29, 2010
rhondar - My point is that the writer values ag more than fishing. By your logic we are headed to outsource our fishing industry. Why is expansion of agriculture more important than the health of our fishing industry? We can not expand ag forever without consequences. Your post is indictative of the attitude that any criticizm or suggestion that ag should be balanced with other interests is meet with hostility.

Since: Mar 10

Chico, CA

#4 Jul 30, 2010
Reality wrote:
rhondar - My point is that the writer values ag more than fishing. By your logic we are headed to outsource our fishing industry. Why is expansion of agriculture more important than the health of our fishing industry? We can not expand ag forever without consequences. Your post is indictative of the attitude that any criticizm or suggestion that ag should be balanced with other interests is meet with hostility.
Gotta eat!!
Reality

Los Molinos, CA

#5 Jul 30, 2010
I like to eat salmon... Reducing agricultural water needs won't starve us.. also typical pro ag hyperbole
rhondar

United States

#6 Jul 30, 2010
Reality wrote:
I like to eat salmon... Reducing agricultural water needs won't starve us.. also typical pro ag hyperbole
There is nothing wrong with farm raised salmon after all the wild salmon population is currently not sustainable, the dams for ag use have been in place for decades, so could this be the cause of the sudden collapse? Doesn't seem likely. The pumping stations in the delta and all along the Sacramento river are now and have been for the last few years "maxing out" capacity. The pumping stations are pumping so much water the flow is actually reversed. Coupled with the failure of the "fish screen" many fish are sucked up and killed. Maybe it is time to halt offshore fishing for salmon, as well as recreational fishing. Maybe Ca needs to look at more dams and reservoirs instead of razing them. Maybe we need ot cut back on ag use God knows we throw out more food than we overfed Americans eat. But farmers being forced to sell is an unnecessary evil.

Under God

Chico, CA

#7 Jul 31, 2010
rhondar wrote:
<quoted text>
There is nothing wrong with farm raised salmon after all the wild salmon population is currently not sustainable, the dams for ag use have been in place for decades, so could this be the cause of the sudden collapse? Doesn't seem likely. The pumping stations in the delta and all along the Sacramento river are now and have been for the last few years "maxing out" capacity. The pumping stations are pumping so much water the flow is actually reversed. Coupled with the failure of the "fish screen" many fish are sucked up and killed. Maybe it is time to halt offshore fishing for salmon, as well as recreational fishing. Maybe Ca needs to look at more dams and reservoirs instead of razing them. Maybe we need ot cut back on ag use God knows we throw out more food than we overfed Americans eat. But farmers being forced to sell is an unnecessary evil.
What a load of bull****. By definition it is not wild salmon that are unsustainable, as they were here long before white men decimated their habitat by diverting rivers, polluting waters, and over-fishing what few species could survive such abuse. Farm raised salmon cause extreme damage to natural habitats and disrupt the delicate balance of the ecosystem. The impacts of mans excessive use of fossil fuels and disruption of natural streamflows is coming to a head as our overpopulation of the planet is stressing our ecosystem to the breaking point. As a civilization we must treat our planet with greater humility and respect, reduce our wasteful and copious consumption of natural resources, and use our intellects to learn to live with what God provides rather than engineer things to aggrandize ourselves.
rhondar

United States

#8 Aug 1, 2010
Under God wrote:
<quoted text>What a load of bull****. By definition it is not wild salmon that are unsustainable, as they were here long before white men decimated their habitat by diverting rivers, polluting waters, and over-fishing what few species could survive such abuse. Farm raised salmon cause extreme damage to natural habitats and disrupt the delicate balance of the ecosystem. The impacts of mans excessive use of fossil fuels and disruption of natural streamflows is coming to a head as our overpopulation of the planet is stressing our ecosystem to the breaking point. As a civilization we must treat our planet with greater humility and respect, reduce our wasteful and copious consumption of natural resources, and use our intellects to learn to live with what God provides rather than engineer things to aggrandize ourselves.
Congratulations Under God, may I bestow an honorary title in the indian tradition. Squats on Rock is a suitable moniker. For such unerring repetition of the crap you learned in the public school system. I believe you've also earned a gold star in the hall of shame at the Indoctrination Station.
Though American indians hold a moral high ground within the liberal (left wing) imagination, they were responsible for nearly wiping out the buffalo. One of the brilliant insights they garnered through hemp laden ceremonies led them to believe that if a single buffalo escaped a hunt it would alert the others. So they killed all they could, far more than they could ever utilize.
As the evil white men began to inhabit the east coast the hides were highly prized, the benevolent indians were more than willing to oblige by killing hundreds of thousands of buffalo for all the "firewater" they could guzzle. They diverted natural streams, hunted into extinction the early horses that were in north America. The saber tooth cats and other mammals were hunted to extinction. Tribes would war on each other for simple grievances and perceived insults, they would make slaves out of or torture and slaughter entire villages men, women and children. Cannibalism as well was practiced here in north America as it was on most other continents. They would intentionally set fire to the prairie to stampede buffalo off cliffs to their deaths.
There is proof that many different peoples including (gasp) whites, that traveled to north America before the Vikings and Columbus, there are pre historic tablets with Hebrew text carved in stone, on display at parks in and around Arkansas and Georgia. You are merely attempting to erroneously portray American indian "culture" as attaining a higher level of consciousness than the most advanced civilization to EVER inhabit this or any other planet in our immediate proximity. You are nothing more than a good student of the subversive "education system" that teaches you to hate your country and culture so as to hasten it's demise, nothing but a tool, a useful idiot. We are the most advanced of any civilization whether you realize this fact or not.
Michael Savage is correct. Liberalism is a mental disorder.
Lush Rimbaugh

United States

#9 Aug 2, 2010
rhondar wrote:
<quoted text>
Congratulations Under God, may I bestow an honorary title in the indian tradition. Squats on Rock is a suitable moniker. For such unerring repetition of the crap you learned in the public school system. I believe you've also earned a gold star in the hall of shame at the Indoctrination Station.
Though American indians hold a moral high ground within the liberal (left wing) imagination, they were responsible for nearly wiping out the buffalo. One of the brilliant insights they garnered through hemp laden ceremonies led them to believe that if a single buffalo escaped a hunt it would alert the others. So they killed all they could, far more than they could ever utilize.
As the evil white men began to inhabit the east coast the hides were highly prized, the benevolent indians were more than willing to oblige by killing hundreds of thousands of buffalo for all the "firewater" they could guzzle. They diverted natural streams, hunted into extinction the early horses that were in north America. The saber tooth cats and other mammals were hunted to extinction. Tribes would war on each other for simple grievances and perceived insults, they would make slaves out of or torture and slaughter entire villages men, women and children. Cannibalism as well was practiced here in north America as it was on most other continents. They would intentionally set fire to the prairie to stampede buffalo off cliffs to their deaths.
There is proof that many different peoples including (gasp) whites, that traveled to north America before the Vikings and Columbus, there are pre historic tablets with Hebrew text carved in stone, on display at parks in and around Arkansas and Georgia. You are merely attempting to erroneously portray American indian "culture" as attaining a higher level of consciousness than the most advanced civilization to EVER inhabit this or any other planet in our immediate proximity. You are nothing more than a good student of the subversive "education system" that teaches you to hate your country and culture so as to hasten it's demise, nothing but a tool, a useful idiot. We are the most advanced of any civilization whether you realize this fact or not.
Michael Savage is correct. Liberalism is a mental disorder.
Right on, man, those injuns got what they deserved!!
Lush Rimbaugh

United States

#10 Aug 2, 2010
...yeah, and I learned that in my private, Catholic school education. Screw public schools too!!
Respectful effort

Chico, CA

#11 Aug 2, 2010
It should be pretty obvious in this day and age that just as sure as the lumber industry will indiscriminately cut any tree that will make a profit, the fishing industry will indiscriminately fish the oceans dead to do the same.

Since it's obvious that the agriculture industry almost solely and without impunity encouraged illegal labor practices, I have no doubt that they'd use every drop of water if allowed.

That we, "gotta eat" is all fine and dandy if you plant rice in areas that receive triple the rainfall that we do. Instead we'll divert water to desert and sell the excess food or cotton overseas, leaving us without water.

Ultimately the choice isn't between Salmon or Striper, it's between mega Ag's profits and water.

The fish species is just a distraction as it's well known all fish counts are down.
http://www.swrcb.ca.gov/waterrights/water_iss...
rhondar

United States

#12 Aug 2, 2010
Lush Rimbaugh wrote:
<quoted text>
Right on, man, those injuns got what they deserved!!
Another tool chiming in...
Lush Rimbaugh wrote:
...yeah, and I learned that in my private, Catholic school education. Screw public schools too!!
But wait! There's more!

00
Maybe you will cast more pearls of wisdom upon us kind sir...
American Indian

Los Molinos, CA

#13 Aug 2, 2010
Rhondarism is a mental disorder

You really are doing nothing more than diplaying your prejudice and ignorance

saber tooth tigers... hunted to extinction 20,000 years ago by neandrathals in North America? Maybe... but maybe not

Hebrew texts in Arkansas? You must be a mormon if you believe that!

really hilarious!! What an ignorant racist! Your tea party must be proud!
Lush Rimbaugh

United States

#14 Aug 2, 2010
rhondar wrote:
<quoted text>
Another tool chiming in...
<quoted text>
But wait! There's more!
00
Maybe you will cast more pearls of wisdom upon us kind sir...
I rarely resort to ad hominem attacks, but you are a first class douche-bag.
Under God

Chico, CA

#15 Aug 3, 2010
rhondar wrote:
<quoted text>
Congratulations Under God, may I bestow an honorary title in the indian tradition. Squats on Rock is a suitable moniker. For such unerring repetition of the crap you learned in the public school system. I believe you've also earned a gold star in the hall of shame at the Indoctrination Station.
Though American indians hold a moral high ground within the liberal (left wing) imagination, they were responsible for nearly wiping out the buffalo. One of the brilliant insights they garnered through hemp laden ceremonies led them to believe that if a single buffalo escaped a hunt it would alert the others. So they killed all they could, far more than they could ever utilize.
As the evil white men began to inhabit the east coast the hides were highly prized, the benevolent indians were more than willing to oblige by killing hundreds of thousands of buffalo for all the "firewater" they could guzzle. They diverted natural streams, hunted into extinction the early horses that were in north America. The saber tooth cats and other mammals were hunted to extinction. Tribes would war on each other for simple grievances and perceived insults, they would make slaves out of or torture and slaughter entire villages men, women and children. Cannibalism as well was practiced here in north America as it was on most other continents. They would intentionally set fire to the prairie to stampede buffalo off cliffs to their deaths.
There is proof that many different peoples including (gasp) whites, that traveled to north America before the Vikings and Columbus, there are pre historic tablets with Hebrew text carved in stone, on display at parks in and around Arkansas and Georgia. You are merely attempting to erroneously portray American indian "culture" as attaining a higher level of consciousness than the most advanced civilization to EVER inhabit this or any other planet in our immediate proximity. You are nothing more than a good student of the subversive "education system" that teaches you to hate your country and culture so as to hasten it's demise, nothing but a tool, a useful idiot. We are the most advanced of any civilization whether you realize this fact or not.
Michael Savage is correct. Liberalism is a mental disorder.
I am not portraying anything ma'am I'm expressing a point of view founded upon historical fact and present reality as any objective viewer would see it. Obviously you have been affected by the extremist rhetoric of those that engage in revisionist history. The fact is that the damage being wrecked on the planet by humans will lead to our demise if we don't change our behaviors. Evolution doesn't care if you are a native American, redneck, or tree hugger since they will all be gone if they can't find a way to live together along with the other species. All the finger pointing and intellectual arguments do is delay taking accountability for our impacts and actively addressing them. My environmental awareness has nothing to do with my gradeschool education since I graduated from high school in 1972 - it has everything to do with my independent research, humility, and spirituality, things which you apparently lack.

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