Scott

Dawsonville, GA

#12236 May 19, 2013
L Sign at a Gun Show

"My brother and I went to the Gun Show at Reliant Center Saturday, Mar.23, 2013.
An all-day big show and lots of guns. Looked like people buying mostly hand guns and a lot were just looking, as we were. Thousands of people, hundreds signing up and joining the NRA - wow!
The best sign I saw there was at a booth that read :
"IF YOU VOTED FOR OBAMA, WE DO NOT WANT YOUR BUSINESS.
YOU'RE TOO DAMN STUPID TO HAVE A FIREARM!"

Now this is a real background check...!

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#12237 May 19, 2013
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand suggesting reading a book to Right Wing Wackos is like asking Dracula to eat garlic.
But give knowledge a try, and perhaps you'll get a grasp on why you'll never see a moderate or progressive allowed to run for national office, until wealth and income disparity is reversed.
Here's a great book -
"What Then Must We Do?: Straight Talk About the Next American Revolution"
author: Gar Alperovitz
Gar Alperovitz is a professor of political economy at the University of Maryland and a co-founder of the Democracy Collaborative. His books include "The Decision to Use the Atomic Bomb" and "America Beyond Capitalism."
"But give knowledge a try, and perhaps you'll get a grasp on why you'll never see a moderate or progressive allowed to run for national office, until wealth and income disparity is reversed."

I would LOVE to hear an explanation of this statement - Are you attempting to claim that Bill Clinton and Obama are neither moderate nor progressive - REALLY? Are you attempting to say Hillary Clinton, John Kerry, Christopher Dodd and Joe Biden are not moderate or progressive? Please define the words then.

And recommending a book by Gar Alperovitz - no, thank you. The man is a loon. He's a good little liberal who pretends he KNOWS what Truman really knew in WWII and he KNOWS what Truman's motivations were in dropping the bombs - never mind all the factual evidence that completely demolishes his pet theories.

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#12238 May 19, 2013
Bill in Dville wrote:
<quoted text>
+1
Romney was not my first choice. Nor my second choice.
Same with McCain.
My votes were against BO.
Ditto, that.

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#12240 May 19, 2013
columbus native wrote:
<quoted text>Everyday is a bad day for these republicans, let's just keep it that way by keeping them outa the White House. You hear them on this forum and the term "Misery loves company " comes to mind. They are trying to come up with anything to get our President out and nothing now or before is going to do this. Some IRS employees will be fired and someone but our president will take the heat for Benghazi and then we non-republicans are going to expect congress to benghazi on to more important issues, such as immigration reform. But now you wait and see if in their desperate situation republicans put immigration reform on the back burner and burn much precious time on smaller prioities like benghazi and some few IRS people who broke the law.
It is a shame most of you on the Left can't see past your nose and recognize what most of us consider the more troubling aspects of both Benghazi and the IRS scandal.

Benghazi - The questions about the lack of security and even the reduction in security were enough to justify inquiry, but what makes no sense at all is the REASON for all those misleading changes to the talking points - why was the State Dept (and whomever else was involved) so in knots about parsing every word in the talking points and why continue the fiction about a video that they knew was fiction.
It isn't so much they made all the changes and continued to blame a video - it is WHY they did those things that on their face are so STUPID.

And do you really not want to know WHO told military support to stand down, when they were ready to go and help Americans in danger and were just begging for permission? I think you would feel differently if it were one of your family members who were seemingly abandoned.
(and no, I don't think it was Obama, I just want to know who it was and once again, WHY?)

The IRS - HOW can you not see the danger when a government entity with the absolute power the IRS wields goes after organizations that "it" (meaning those in positions of power) disagrees with. And even more frightening - having as one of the criteria for "extra scrutiny" the simple phrase "criticize the government". Do you really care so little about the 1st Amendment?
I do not believe, and the evidence supports that belief , that this was just low level employees. The IG report states DC supervisor involvement as well as involvement of IRS personnel in California, not just Ohio. But even if it were "just" low level employees, don't you think it should bother you that they felt they could get away with harassing organizations simply because THEY disagreed with them? It should.
Bored

Dawsonville, GA

#12241 May 19, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
It is a shame most of you on the Left can't see past your nose and recognize what most of us consider the more troubling aspects of both Benghazi and the IRS scandal.
Benghazi - The questions about the lack of security and even the reduction in security were enough to justify inquiry, but what makes no sense at all is the REASON for all those misleading changes to the talking points - why was the State Dept (and whomever else was involved) so in knots about parsing every word in the talking points and why continue the fiction about a video that they knew was fiction.
It isn't so much they made all the changes and continued to blame a video - it is WHY they did those things that on their face are so STUPID.
And do you really not want to know WHO told military support to stand down, when they were ready to go and help Americans in danger and were just begging for permission? I think you would feel differently if it were one of your family members who were seemingly abandoned.
(and no, I don't think it was Obama, I just want to know who it was and once again, WHY?)
The IRS - HOW can you not see the danger when a government entity with the absolute power the IRS wields goes after organizations that "it" (meaning those in positions of power) disagrees with. And even more frightening - having as one of the criteria for "extra scrutiny" the simple phrase "criticize the government". Do you really care so little about the 1st Amendment?
I do not believe, and the evidence supports that belief , that this was just low level employees. The IG report states DC supervisor involvement as well as involvement of IRS personnel in California, not just Ohio. But even if it were "just" low level employees, don't you think it should bother you that they felt they could get away with harassing organizations simply because THEY disagreed with them? It should.

Great post! Of course you'll get no sensible response from any liberal. What you will get is mockery, hooting, and a lot of whining it was Bush's fault.


Informed Opinion

North Fort Myers, FL

#12242 May 19, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>"But give knowledge a try, and perhaps you'll get a grasp on why you'll never see a moderate or progressive allowed to run for national office, until wealth and income disparity is reversed."

I would LOVE to hear an explanation of this statement - Are you attempting to claim that Bill Clinton and Obama are neither moderate nor progressive - REALLY? Are you attempting to say Hillary Clinton, John Kerry, Christopher Dodd and Joe Biden are not moderate or progressive? Please define the words then.

And recommending a book by Gar Alperovitz - no, thank you. The man is a loon. He's a good little liberal who pretends he KNOWS what Truman really knew in WWII and he KNOWS what Truman's motivations were in dropping the bombs - never mind all the factual evidence that completely demolishes his pet theories.
None are close to moderate or progressive.

Everyone mentioned is far to the right of Dwight Eisenhower for God's sake.

Clinton signed NAFTA that destroyed millions of American jobs, but added trillions to the profits of corporations who moved those jobs to Mexico.

That's a Right Winger, and he has been repaid in millions and millions of dollars in "contributions" to his "Library",$1 Million Dollar "speeches", and seats on boards of manufactures companies.

Dodd has protected the boards of banks and corporations more the anyone else, providing weak, toothless regulations on banks and corporations to assure no actual oversight occurs.

He is repairs with Millions in contributions.

Elizabeth Warren is the only true moderate in the Senate- and she was not encouraged or supported to the extent she should have been, in fact, Obama refused to appoint to regulating position(s) because the banks hated her so.

Obama is Bush with a brain, and as long as Right Wing Wackos keep accusing him of being liberal, the actual Right Wing money folks just sit back and laugh at you all.
Informed Opinion

North Fort Myers, FL

#12243 May 19, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>It is a shame most of you on the Left can't see past your nose and recognize what most of us consider the more troubling aspects of both Benghazi and the IRS scandal.

Benghazi - The questions about the lack of security and even the reduction in security were enough to justify inquiry, but what makes no sense at all is the REASON for all those misleading changes to the talking points - why was the State Dept (and whomever else was involved) so in knots about parsing every word in the talking points and why continue the fiction about a video that they knew was fiction.
It isn't so much they made all the changes and continued to blame a video - it is WHY they did those things that on their face are so STUPID.

And do you really not want to know WHO told military support to stand down, when they were ready to go and help Americans in danger and were just begging for permission? I think you would feel differently if it were one of your family members who were seemingly abandoned.
(and no, I don't think it was Obama, I just want to know who it was and once again, WHY?)

The IRS - HOW can you not see the danger when a government entity with the absolute power the IRS wields goes after organizations that "it" (meaning those in positions of power) disagrees with. And even more frightening - having as one of the criteria for "extra scrutiny" the simple phrase "criticize the government". Do you really care so little about the 1st Amendment?
I do not believe, and the evidence supports that belief , that this was just low level employees. The IG report states DC supervisor involvement as well as involvement of IRS personnel in California, not just Ohio. But even if it were "just" low level employees, don't you think it should bother you that they felt they could get away with harassing organizations simply because THEY disagreed with them? It should.
Please.

Keep pretending Right Wingers give a damn about our troops.

What a crock.

5,000 American troops dead for no purpose other than getting Bush re-elected as a "War-Time" president.

13 embassy and consulate attacks under Bush resulting in 60 dead.

And Right Wingers don't say a word.

Suddenly 2 CIA mercenaries and 2 State Department employees are killed under confusing circumstances and suddenly they demand this and demand that.

Anyone who takes them seriously has to believe Right Wing Wackos are just too stupid or ignorant to know that 2001 to 2009 occurred.

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#12244 May 19, 2013
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
None are close to moderate or progressive.
Everyone mentioned is far to the right of Dwight Eisenhower for God's sake.
Clinton signed NAFTA that destroyed millions of American jobs, but added trillions to the profits of corporations who moved those jobs to Mexico.
That's a Right Winger, and he has been repaid in millions and millions of dollars in "contributions" to his "Library",$1 Million Dollar "speeches", and seats on boards of manufactures companies.
Dodd has protected the boards of banks and corporations more the anyone else, providing weak, toothless regulations on banks and corporations to assure no actual oversight occurs.
He is repairs with Millions in contributions.
Elizabeth Warren is the only true moderate in the Senate- and she was not encouraged or supported to the extent she should have been, in fact, Obama refused to appoint to regulating position(s) because the banks hated her so.
Obama is Bush with a brain, and as long as Right Wing Wackos keep accusing him of being liberal, the actual Right Wing money folks just sit back and laugh at you all.
WOW, this explains a LOT. Out of sheer curiosity, if you could be dictator for a day, what 3 changes would you make to this country- in any area you choose.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#12245 May 19, 2013
ChicknButt wrote:
<quoted text>
Interesting that you mentioned this name.
Just a little indisputibly true factoid:
Fred Koch founded the John Birch society. His sons the Koch Brothers are the driving force financially and organizationally for the largest propaganda machine ever assembled on the planet. They are the driving force behind todays Tea Party and right-wing politics.
This is true.
You need shock treatments. Just sayin'.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#12246 May 19, 2013
ChicknButt wrote:
<quoted text>
Great Post. It tells it like it is.
Some of these right wing whackos would do well to actually consider what you're talking about here.
Oh! And you loonie liberal socialist commie lunatics don't need to check YOURSELVES? THAT is why you'll NEVER convince anyone else that you have the best interests of this country at heart. You aren't to be trusted because you are "right fighters." Nothing else matters to you but "winning'.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#12247 May 19, 2013
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
It's amusing to hear how in a country that is 80% of the population, 89% of the Supreme Court, and 87% of Congress are "Christian", to hear how afraid Right Wingers are they're being "persecuted".
With those super, super majorities, I'd be embarrassed to claim I was getting my butt - it'd make me look like my God really wasn't on my side.
Those percentages do not matter. The poster was referring to what is not ALLOWED. YOU should be embarrassed because you libs CLAIM(although you are clearly a HYPOCRITE) to be so compassionate. Heck! You are ALL hypocrites. If you are the face of compassion, we are definitely in touble.
Informed Opinion

North Fort Myers, FL

#12248 May 19, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>WOW, this explains a LOT. Out of sheer curiosity, if you could be dictator for a day, what 3 changes would you make to this country- in any area you choose.
That isn't all that tough.

All countries do best when they enjoy a strong and growing Middle Class.

A string and growing Middle Class requires governmental policies that encourage the distribution of wealth throughout the populace.

That is accomplished by tax policies that discourage the outrageous accumulation of wealth into the hands of a few - Progressive taxes on all income and inheritance taxes, strong laws encouraging collective bargaining, and well-funded public education.

Democracy cannot survive if power is purchased by those with the most wealth. That means contributions (a/k/a bribes), have to be limited to small donations from Americans,(persons), not corporations, unions, PACs, or other entities.

Democracy requires everyone share responsibility and sacrifice. That means everyone serves 2 years military service unless they're disabled, in which case they serve 3 years public no military service.

Basically we're describing America under Republicans like Eisenhower and Teddy Roosevelt.
Informed Opinion

North Fort Myers, FL

#12249 May 19, 2013
Synergy wrote:
<quoted text>Those percentages do not matter. The poster was referring to what is not ALLOWED. YOU should be embarrassed because you libs CLAIM(although you are clearly a HYPOCRITE) to be so compassionate. Heck! You are ALL hypocrites. If you are the face of compassion, we are definitely in touble.
Your government provided Thorazine prescription needs to be doubled.

That post cannot make sense to even you.

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#12250 May 19, 2013
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
That isn't all that tough.
....[Your points have been repeated below.]
Going in reverse order:
IO -"Democracy requires everyone share responsibility and sacrifice. That means everyone serves 2 years military service unless they're disabled, in which case they serve 3 years public no military service."

So basically, the Israeli model - I admit, I have wondered in the past if that might not be a very good thing. But I am not ready to take such a drastic step. While I think it would be good for all kids after leaving high school to have a two year military stint, I just have an aversion to mandatory service. But I might should think about that more seriously.
==========

IO-"Democracy cannot survive if power is purchased by those with the most wealth. That means contributions (a/k/a bribes), have to be limited to small donations from Americans,(persons), not corporations, unions, PACs, or other entities."

I have no problem with this at all, but it would be difficult to control (just remember Al Gore and the Buddhist nuns). But just because something is difficult doesn't mean it isn't worth striving for. But it would have to include all those you mentioned. While I am sure you have the greater problem with corporations, I have a much bigger loathing for the unions. But the idea of only individual citizens being able to contribute would make politicians be more responsive to John Q Public, which is as it was intended. And there should also be a limit on how much personal money candidates could contribute to their own campaigns - thus keeping someone wealthy from virtually "buying" an office.

==========
IO-"A string and growing Middle Class requires governmental policies that encourage the distribution of wealth throughout the populace.
That is accomplished by tax policies that discourage the outrageous accumulation of wealth into the hands of a few - Progressive taxes on all income and inheritance taxes, strong laws encouraging collective bargaining, and well-funded public education."

Here we part ways completely. I absolutely agree that a strong and vibrant Middle Class is vital to the strength of this country, but I would argue that it is a heavy handed government with too many intrusive policies that have led to the shrinking of the Middle Class. Why should people who have worked hard to better themselves and their lives be punished by having more and more of that hard earned money taken away - that is a clear disincentive to work hard. And why should those same people who have worked hard not be able to hand that down to their children. Inheritance taxes have made it virtually impossible for children to keep family farms that have been in their families for generations. Why shouldn't someone be able to pass down a family business without jumping through piles of paperwork (and expense) to make it possible.
While I will never argue that unions were needed at one time, that time has passed. Now it is the unions who abuse their power for selfish gain and none more so than public employee unions. Our public schools are a disaster and pumping more money into them is not the answer. The teachers unions must be dissolved. They have become nothing more than a protection racket for incompetent and sometimes criminal teachers. As I mentioned earlier, New York City alone spends $22 million to warehouse teachers that cannot be allowed back in the classroom because of reported abuse/impropriety/ or ineffectiveness. Let the tax money follow the child, not the child follow the tax money to the local public school. Give the parents control of that money to be given to whatever school they wish to enroll their child in - public, private, charter, magnet, whatever. Parents have the ultimate interest in their child receiving a good education - let the schools compete for that tax money.

Your turn.

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#12251 May 19, 2013
Laughing at U wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you taken out the garbage yet? I think I hear your wife calling.
Nope, I think you hear your wife telling you to plunge the toilet after your latest output...

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#12252 May 19, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
It is a shame most of you on the Left can't see past your nose and recognize what most of us consider the more troubling aspects of both Benghazi and the IRS scandal.
Benghazi - The questions about the lack of security and even the reduction in security were enough to justify inquiry, but what makes no sense at all is the REASON for all those misleading changes to the talking points - why was the State Dept (and whomever else was involved) so in knots about parsing every word in the talking points and why continue the fiction about a video that they knew was fiction.
It isn't so much they made all the changes and continued to blame a video - it is WHY they did those things that on their face are so STUPID.
And do you really not want to know WHO told military support to stand down, when they were ready to go and help Americans in danger and were just begging for permission? I think you would feel differently if it were one of your family members who were seemingly abandoned.
(and no, I don't think it was Obama, I just want to know who it was and once again, WHY?)
The IRS - HOW can you not see the danger when a government entity with the absolute power the IRS wields goes after organizations that "it" (meaning those in positions of power) disagrees with. And even more frightening - having as one of the criteria for "extra scrutiny" the simple phrase "criticize the government". Do you really care so little about the 1st Amendment?
I do not believe, and the evidence supports that belief , that this was just low level employees. The IG report states DC supervisor involvement as well as involvement of IRS personnel in California, not just Ohio. But even if it were "just" low level employees, don't you think it should bother you that they felt they could get away with harassing organizations simply because THEY disagreed with them? It should.
+1

"It is a shame most of you on the Left can't see past your nose and recognize what most of us consider the more troubling aspects of both Benghazi and the IRS scandal."

That's why they're the clueless and uneducated. They don't know, and, in many cases, don't care.
Danger Zone

Atlanta, GA

#12253 May 19, 2013
An interesting article about death tax & family farms.

http://www.ijreview.com/2012/12/25030-coming-...

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#12254 May 19, 2013
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Please.
Keep pretending Right Wingers give a damn about our troops.
What a crock.
...
The Straw Man strikes again!

So, all right wingers don't care about our troops? What a crock.

And the Liberaces do? What a crock.

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#12255 May 19, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
Going in reverse order:
IO -"Democracy requires everyone share responsibility and sacrifice. That means everyone serves 2 years military service unless they're disabled, in which case they serve 3 years public no military service."
So basically, the Israeli model - I admit, I have wondered in the past if that might not be a very good thing. But I am not ready to take such a drastic step. While I think it would be good for all kids after leaving high school to have a two year military stint, I just have an aversion to mandatory service. But I might should think about that more seriously.
==========
IO-"Democracy cannot survive if power is purchased by those with the most wealth. That means contributions (a/k/a bribes), have to be limited to small donations from Americans,(persons), not corporations, unions, PACs, or other entities."
I have no problem with this at all, but it would be difficult to control (just remember Al Gore and the Buddhist nuns). But just because something is difficult doesn't mean it isn't worth striving for. But it would have to include all those you mentioned. While I am sure you have the greater problem with corporations, I have a much bigger loathing for the unions. But the idea of only individual citizens being able to contribute would make politicians be more responsive to John Q Public, which is as it was intended. And there should also be a limit on how much personal money candidates could contribute to their own campaigns - thus keeping someone wealthy from virtually "buying" an office.
==========
IO-"A string and growing Middle Class requires governmental policies that encourage the distribution of wealth throughout the populace.
That is accomplished by tax policies that discourage the outrageous accumulation of wealth into the hands of a few - Progressive taxes on all income and inheritance taxes, strong laws encouraging collective bargaining, and well-funded public education."
Here we part ways completely. I absolutely agree that a strong and vibrant Middle Class is vital to the strength of this country, but I would argue that it is a heavy handed government with too many intrusive policies that have led to the shrinking of the Middle Class. Why should people who have worked hard to better themselves and their lives be punished by having more and more of that hard earned money taken away - that is a clear disincentive to work hard. And why should those same people who have worked hard not be able to hand that down to their children. Inheritance taxes have made it virtually impossible for children to keep family farms that have been in their families for generations. Why shouldn't someone be able to pass down a family business without jumping through piles of paperwork (and expense) to make it possible.
While I will never argue that unions were needed at one time, that time has passed. Now it is the unions who abuse their power for selfish gain and none more so than public employee unions. Our public schools are a disaster and pumping more money into them is not the answer. The teachers unions must be dissolved. They have become nothing more than a protection racket for incompetent and sometimes criminal teachers. As I mentioned earlier, New York City alone spends $22 million to warehouse teachers that cannot be allowed back in the classroom because of reported abuse/impropriety/ or ineffectiveness. Let the tax money follow the child, not the child follow the tax money to the local public school. Give the parents control of that money to be given to whatever school they wish to enroll their child in - public, private, charter, magnet, whatever. Parents have the ultimate interest in their child receiving a good education - let the schools compete for that tax money.
Your turn.
+1 +1 +1

One of the very finest posts in this thread!

“Marble Man”

Since: Jul 11

Dallas, GA

#12256 May 19, 2013
Bill in Dville wrote:
<quoted text>
+1
"It is a shame most of you on the Left can't see past your nose and recognize what most of us consider the more troubling aspects of both Benghazi and the IRS scandal."
That's why they're the clueless and uneducated. They don't know, and, in many cases, don't care.
Their problem is that the LWLD's have no idea of what they want. Progressive taxes? Hell, it don't get more progressive than Fairtax.org .

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