Chico firefighters
Gate Keeper

Chico, CA

#287 Aug 28, 2013
The pensions and benefits are exactly why these people work overtime. Because if the pensions and benefits were more reasonable then more workers would be hired and there wouldn't be as much overtime. The unions make sure that there is plenty of overtime by demanding excessive pensions and benefits. That in turn means that earnings skyrocket plus the pensions and benefits are very generous.

This is how pay is high and benefits are high.
The right is wrong

Lincoln, CA

#288 Aug 28, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> I see what you are saying but I hate to see people say that police/fire make 6 figures when their salary may be 65K (example only). Of course they make more if they work OT and I hope they claim that income on their tax returns. Unfortunately, most departments are understaffed because of budget cuts and OT is required to do the job. You don't walk away from a call just because your shift has ended.
I've started doing what steve and his but buddies suggest. I'm sick of paying the CEO's millions/billions for what a trained monkey can do so I buy chi -com crap and cut out the top 2%.

Seriously though, when things were going great during the "bubble" steve and his but buddies all told us how stupid we were for not getting into private industry and grabbing some of the gold. I can remember working for half what private industry was making. I went for the lower wages with promised benefits because I learned that corporate America couldn't be trusted. And as anyone can see who reads these posts, many of my fellow Americans can't be trusted.
Local

Hidden Valley Lake, CA

#289 Aug 28, 2013
The right is wrong wrote:
<quoted text>
I've started doing what steve and his but buddies suggest. I'm sick of paying the CEO's millions/billions for what a trained monkey can do so I buy chi -com crap and cut out the top 2%.
Seriously though, when things were going great during the "bubble" steve and his but buddies all told us how stupid we were for not getting into private industry and grabbing some of the gold. I can remember working for half what private industry was making. I went for the lower wages with promised benefits because I learned that corporate America couldn't be trusted. And as anyone can see who reads these posts, many of my fellow Americans can't be trusted.
That's just nonsense....no wonder you didn't provide a link....just B.S.

Public sector union employees make far more than private sector workers.
California Public Sector Retirement
Programs and Compensation
A financial analysis prepared for
The California Foundation for Fiscal Responsibility
http://www.fixpensionsfirst.com/docs/Full_Rep...

A public employee union friend told me that they actually support obamacare in hopes that taxes will go up enough to free up the huge money being paid in healthcare costs to public employee union workers.

The plan was to then take most of the existing public healthcare funding and grab it for public employee wages.
Unfortunately, we can't afford nobamacare any more than we can afford the huge exisitng salary/retirement/healthcare costs for public employees.
chico citizen

Redding, CA

#290 Aug 28, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> I see what you are saying but I hate to see people say that police/fire make 6 figures when their salary may be 65K (example only). Of course they make more if they work OT and I hope they claim that income on their tax returns. Unfortunately, most departments are understaffed because of budget cuts and OT is required to do the job. You don't walk away from a call just because your shift has ended.
Bottom line Sunshine, the city of chico is out of money. They are securing the equivalent of a pay day loan to meet payroll in Dec.

Fire/Police make up what like 75% of general fund.

we have to cut somewhere, fire is a good place to start. Nakamura utters one sentence about possibly contracting with calfire(great idea) and all of a sudden the fire dept figures out a way to cut OT. Quit screwing the taxpayers guys.

100 structure fires per year, 13000 medical calls following the emts.

Chico is not some big bad dangerous city like NY or Chicago although you would think it is by what were paying.

Bottom line again we cant afford chico fire, I hope cal fire gets a good look.

Please don't respond with the inevitable chicken little post.
Sunshine

Chico, CA

#291 Aug 29, 2013
Steve wrote:
One guy says "earn up to six figures", another guy breaks it into parts , salary and overtime, as if that makes a difference, to get the figure below six figures. I point this out and they give me peanuts.
I broke it down because salary is guaranteed but OT is not.
Sunshine

Chico, CA

#292 Aug 29, 2013
chico citizen wrote:
<quoted text>
Bottom line Sunshine, the city of chico is out of money. They are securing the equivalent of a pay day loan to meet payroll in Dec.
Fire/Police make up what like 75% of general fund.
we have to cut somewhere, fire is a good place to start. Nakamura utters one sentence about possibly contracting with calfire(great idea) and all of a sudden the fire dept figures out a way to cut OT. Quit screwing the taxpayers guys.
100 structure fires per year, 13000 medical calls following the emts.
Chico is not some big bad dangerous city like NY or Chicago although you would think it is by what were paying.
Bottom line again we cant afford chico fire, I hope cal fire gets a good look.
Please don't respond with the inevitable chicken little post.
Cal Fire is a "wildland" fire department and Chico is a municipal fire department. You get what you pay for and Chico will be loosing a lot of expertise if that department goes away. By the way, if we are not as bad as NY or Chicago, why is the police department paid so much. They get the bigger chunk of the budget.
What is a "chicken little post?"
Chico citizen

South San Francisco, CA

#293 Aug 29, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> Cal Fire is a "wildland" fire department and Chico is a municipal fire department. You get what you pay for and Chico will be loosing a lot of expertise if that department goes away. By the way, if we are not as bad as NY or Chicago, why is the police department paid so much. They get the bigger chunk of the budget.
What is a "chicken little post?"
Paradise seems to be doing ok with their new arrangement.

The people protesting this so much seem to be ones benefitting from a fire salary.

The majority of people I talk to and read letters to editor are in favor of a major restructure of salary/ pension numbers.

We don't need to pay Hollywood salaries for dept that goes on 100 structure fires a year.

We shouldn't be chasing emts all over town either.
I'd rather pay for more emts a lot cheaper than fire personnel.

I'm ok with paying police more, they have a much more dangerous job.

A chicken little post is the inevitable " if you cut fire spending, bad things will happen, buildings will burn people will die due to reduced staffing"

Fire is very good at fear mongering and trying to manipulate public opinion.

Finally, do you have any ideas to bring our budget back into balance?? I'm not talking about 2 or 3 hundred thousand, I'm talking millions.
Sunshine

Chico, CA

#294 Aug 29, 2013
Chico citizen wrote:
<quoted text>
Paradise seems to be doing ok with their new arrangement.
The people protesting this so much seem to be ones benefitting from a fire salary.
The majority of people I talk to and read letters to editor are in favor of a major restructure of salary/ pension numbers.
We don't need to pay Hollywood salaries for dept that goes on 100 structure fires a year.
We shouldn't be chasing emts all over town either.
I'd rather pay for more emts a lot cheaper than fire personnel.
I'm ok with paying police more, they have a much more dangerous job.
A chicken little post is the inevitable " if you cut fire spending, bad things will happen, buildings will burn people will die due to reduced staffing"
Fire is very good at fear mongering and trying to manipulate public opinion.
Finally, do you have any ideas to bring our budget back into balance?? I'm not talking about 2 or 3 hundred thousand, I'm talking millions.
First of all Paradise is half the size of Chico and has half the population. They are basically a wildland community. I am just really tired of the fire department bashing. Fire doesn't chase EMTs all over town, fire usually arrives first at no additional fee to the caller. Police do not have a more dangerous job in my estimation. Why do you say that? I'm for public safety - both police and fire. Don't you think the city management had anything to do with the pensions and benefits? Our finance manager received over $20K in raises during the downturn. The city asked the fire department to do more with less about 8-9+ years ago. Which means the city saved money on pensions and benefits by asking the FD to work OT so they wouldn't have to hire, train, equip and pay pension and benefits to new hires. 100 structure fires is about 1 every 3-4 days. You know they do a lot more than that and medical calls. No more bashing, please.
Chico citizen

South San Francisco, CA

#295 Aug 29, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> First of all Paradise is half the size of Chico and has half the population. They are basically a wildland community. I am just really tired of the fire department bashing. Fire doesn't chase EMTs all over town, fire usually arrives first at no additional fee to the caller. Police do not have a more dangerous job in my estimation. Why do you say that? I'm for public safety - both police and fire. Don't you think the city management had anything to do with the pensions and benefits? Our finance manager received over $20K in raises during the downturn. The city asked the fire department to do more with less about 8-9+ years ago. Which means the city saved money on pensions and benefits by asking the FD to work OT so they wouldn't have to hire, train, equip and pay pension and benefits to new hires. 100 structure fires is about 1 every 3-4 days. You know they do a lot more than that and medical calls. No more bashing, please.
1. I suspect the real reason people are opposed to cal fire is the lower pay/benefits.

2. You're missing my point WE DON'T NEED YOU AT MED CALLS!!!!!

3. Police deal with real danger on a much more frequent basis criminals with guns etc. Not a 90 year senior citizen who fell in bathroom, let emts deal with that.

4. Somebody had to come in and bring fiscal reality to our city or we would have gone bankrupt!! Nakamura and his staff have a crappy job I don't have a problem with their salaries, they are cleaning up years of fiscal mismanagement.

5. You have no solution to cutting the budget?

6. Bottom line again, we can't have public servants making three to four times the median wage in our city, it is unsustainable. How can we pay someone at age 50 100,000plus for the rest of their lives? They could draw a pension longer than they actually worked!!!!

7. When R. Stone published fire salaries on life in chico FBI page, the outrage was equal from both sides, the only difference was the outcry from pro fire was all spouses, children etc. Ever try to pull a pig from a feeding trough? It can get ugly!

8. Bottom bottom line, chico fire we just can't afford you.
Steve

Chico, CA

#296 Aug 29, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> Cal Fire is a "wildland" fire department and Chico is a municipal fire department. You get what you pay for and Chico will be loosing a lot of expertise if that department goes away. By the way, if we are not as bad as NY or Chicago, why is the police department paid so much. They get the bigger chunk of the budget.
What is a "chicken little post?"
Bottom bottom line, chico fire we just can't afford you.
Chico citizen

Redding, CA

#297 Aug 30, 2013
Chico citizen wrote:
<quoted text>
1. I suspect the real reason people are opposed to cal fire is the lower pay/benefits.
2. You're missing my point WE DON'T NEED YOU AT MED CALLS!!!!!
3. Police deal with real danger on a much more frequent basis criminals with guns etc. Not a 90 year senior citizen who fell in bathroom, let emts deal with that.
4. Somebody had to come in and bring fiscal reality to our city or we would have gone bankrupt!! Nakamura and his staff have a crappy job I don't have a problem with their salaries, they are cleaning up years of fiscal mismanagement.
5. You have no solution to cutting the budget?
6. Bottom line again, we can't have public servants making three to four times the median wage in our city, it is unsustainable. How can we pay someone at age 50 100,000plus for the rest of their lives? They could draw a pension longer than they actually worked!!!!
7. When R. Stone published fire salaries on life in chico FBI page, the outrage was equal from both sides, the only difference was the outcry from pro fire was all spouses, children etc. Ever try to pull a pig from a feeding trough? It can get ugly!
8. Bottom bottom line, chico fire we just can't afford you.
I understand if you have no response Sunshine, chico fire is a pretty undefensible position.
Sunshine

Chico, CA

#298 Aug 31, 2013
Chico citizen wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand if you have no response Sunshine, chico fire is a pretty undefensible position.
You are wrong and I will get back with you. Two family members passed this week so some things had to be put aside for a while.
Steve

Chico, CA

#299 Aug 31, 2013
. Bottom line again, we can't have public servants making three to four times the median wage in our city, it is unsustainable. How can we pay someone at age 50 100,000plus for the rest of their lives? They could draw a pension longer than they actually worked!!!! and prevent others from retiring early due to the enormous tax burden thrust upon the tax payers.
Sunshine

Paradise, CA

#300 Sep 14, 2013
Steven Matthew David wrote:
Randell Stone's comments about firefighters.
http://youtu.be/aq9wZNkg60c
Somebody said he was deemeaning to the chief. It doesn't look that way in that youtube vid.
I agree with part of your post. I didn't hear him deemeaning the chief. I did in fact hear him give salary figures that were wrong. When you are speaking like he was (also a public servant) you should be darn sure you get your facts and figures right! He did not.
Sunshine

Paradise, CA

#301 Sep 14, 2013
Steve wrote:
. Bottom line again, we can't have public servants making three to four times the median wage in our city, it is unsustainable. How can we pay someone at age 50 100,000plus for the rest of their lives? They could draw a pension longer than they actually worked!!!! and prevent others from retiring early due to the enormous tax burden thrust upon the tax payers.
Steve, you really need to do some research. You are simply repeating the erroneous information you have heard without checking on it yourself.
Sunshine

Paradise, CA

#302 Sep 14, 2013
Chico citizen wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand if you have no response Sunshine, chico fire is a pretty undefensible position.
The City of Chico, many years ago, asked the fire department to work with less empolyees and earn overtime in order to save the city money. They saved the city the cost of recruiting, hiring, training, equipment, salaries and benefits by doing this. The city of chico has more than twice as many policemen as firemen. The firemen do a heck of a job and if you don't want them to make so much money, cut the overtime by hiring what is needed. I agree that the city has not been managed very well. That is the responsibility of the CITY, not the firemen.
Steve

Sloughhouse, CA

#303 Sep 14, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> I broke it down because salary is guaranteed but OT is not.
You broke it down to make their income appear less than it actually is.
Steve

Sloughhouse, CA

#304 Sep 14, 2013
Chico citizen wrote:
<quoted text>
1. I suspect the real reason people are opposed to cal fire is the lower pay/benefits.
2. You're missing my point WE DON'T NEED YOU AT MED CALLS!!!!!
3. Police deal with real danger on a much more frequent basis criminals with guns etc. Not a 90 year senior citizen who fell in bathroom, let emts deal with that.
4. Somebody had to come in and bring fiscal reality to our city or we would have gone bankrupt!! Nakamura and his staff have a crappy job I don't have a problem with their salaries, they are cleaning up years of fiscal mismanagement.
5. You have no solution to cutting the budget?
6. Bottom line again, we can't have public servants making three to four times the median wage in our city, it is unsustainable. How can we pay someone at age 50 100,000plus for the rest of their lives? They could draw a pension longer than they actually worked!!!!
7. When R. Stone published fire salaries on life in chico FBI page, the outrage was equal from both sides, the only difference was the outcry from pro fire was all spouses, children etc. Ever try to pull a pig from a feeding trough? It can get ugly!
8. Bottom bottom line, chico fire we just can't afford you.
8. Bottom bottom line, chico fire we just can't afford you.
Steve

Sloughhouse, CA

#305 Sep 14, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> The City of Chico, many years ago, asked the fire department to work with less empolyees and earn overtime in order to save the city money. They saved the city the cost of recruiting, hiring, training, equipment, salaries and benefits by doing this. The city of chico has more than twice as many policemen as firemen. The firemen do a heck of a job and if you don't want them to make so much money, cut the overtime by hiring what is needed. I agree that the city has not been managed very well. That is the responsibility of the CITY, not the firemen.
We could hire more fireman if salaries and benefits would commensurate with the median income of Chico taxpayers.
Spin machine

Redding, CA

#306 Sep 14, 2013
Sunshine wrote:
<quoted text> The City of Chico, many years ago, asked the fire department to work with less empolyees and earn overtime in order to save the city money. They saved the city the cost of recruiting, hiring, training, equipment, salaries and benefits by doing this. The city of chico has more than twice as many policemen as firemen. The firemen do a heck of a job and if you don't want them to make so much money, cut the overtime by hiring what is needed. I agree that the city has not been managed very well. That is the responsibility of the CITY, not the firemen.
You can spin it any way you want, here are some facts
1. Chico fire somehow found a way to cut OT after nakamura mentioned calfire. Very weasily.
2. If they had done this earlier their fellow city employees would not have lost their jobs.
3. Caper acres would still be open.
4. We're not talking about hiring more fire personnel, were talking doing more with less. Cutting wages and contributing more to pension,
5. Reduced staffing and everyone is ok.
6. If fire doesn't like new wages/pension structure hit the road. You are public employees and there will be hundreds lined up to take over.

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