Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Courier-Journal

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

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“Breaking the spell ”

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#108962
Jul 27, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
<quoted text>
Mine is not a theory...Scientific studies have determined what I posted to be accurate...
Other than nonsense and Gibberish,What is your opinion based on?
May be the result of too many Kangaroo boxing matches left your brain in an addled stage?
Tie me kangaroo down mate....LOL
The key to Atheism is Ignorance
"Studies"? So you have more than one study to cite? Do you know what a plural is?
I love how you cling to a single study and claim it as absolute truth, yet you dismiss the many thousands and thousands of studies on evolution.
Not to mention, you misstate that study time and time again.
I base much of my opinion on nonsense statements like "May be the result of too many Kangaroo boxing matches left your brain in an addled stage". My judgment resulting in such statements leads me to conclude you are hate-filled.
My opinion of you based upon your misstating the study you keep citing is that you have extreme bias and do not fully comprehend what you read. You twist the claims to say something they did not say.
My opinion of the double standard you have towards studies, is that you are either knowing lie to promote an agenda or you are in denial to keep your faith.

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#108963
Jul 27, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
The Atheist Syndrome: A Psychopathology of Unbelief
“The fool hath said in his heart,‘There is no God.’” So wrote David in diagnosing the problem of unbelief three thousand years ago.
.
David, the rootless dictator who sent his best friend to the front lines of war to die in order to hide the pregnancy he caused to his best friends wife, and then ultimately married her, and had children that are claimed to be the lineage to Jesus?

And we should listen to his advice, why? The man had motive to lie. He had motive to claim to know the mind of god.
I see king David as the moral equivalency of Saddam Hussein.

Now you might put such dictators on a pedestal, but I will not.

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#108964
Jul 27, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
The Atheist Syndrome: A Psychopathology of Unbelief
“The fool hath said in his heart,‘There is no God.’” So wrote David in diagnosing the problem of unbelief three thousand years ago.
But is foolishness the only problem? Might it not be compounded by something else, something over which the skeptic has no control? John Koster thinks so. And he tries, in The Atheist Syndrome, to establish his case.
Koster’s thesis is that the major proponents of atheism in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries all have suffered from a form of mental illness that he dubs “the atheist syndrome.
” Applying Freudian psychoanalysis to the likes of Charles Darwin, Thomas Henry Huxley, Friedrich Nietzsche, and Sigmund Freud himself, Koster concludes that their fear of domineering and abusive fathers transformed itself into hatred of the God their fathers represented to them. That hatred led to an irrational rejection of biblical truth and an embracing of falsehood — whether scientific materialism, occultism, or delusions of grandeur.
Koster further argues that their obsessive hatred was not limited to their fathers and God: self-hatred emerged when these brilliant men recognized in themselves what they hated in their fathers. Then came clinical depression, sexual perversion, psychogenic diseases, and ultimate collapse.
Christians who are tired of seeing the faith bashed by devotees of evolutionism, scientistic humanism, nihilism, and Freudianism will not be able to help finding Koster’s analysis appealing. Clarence Darrow, Adolf Hitler, Karl Marx, Friedrich Engels, Vladimir Ulyanov Lenin, Jean Paul Sartre, and Albert Camus all seem to wither under his gaze. In the final analysis, the thesis might be right.
So atheists are simply a product of their poor Christian upbringing?

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#108966
Jul 27, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
By Randal Rauser
If the new atheists distinguished themselves from the milquetoast atheism that preceded them by their honing of a sharper rhetorical knife, James Spiegel's book The Making of an Atheist responds with the razor sharp edge of a Samurai sword. If the new atheists have specialized in sweeping assertions about the questionable rationality of Christians, Spiegel one-ups them with sweeping assertions about the morality of atheism. If the new atheists have berated Christians as a bit soft in the head, Spiegel returns the favor by leveling a charge of corruption in the soul.
Get it? The picture ain't pretty.
Atheism, says Spiegel, is not really an "intellectual movement". Rather, "It is little more than moral rebellion cloaked in academic regalia. The new atheists are blinded by their own sin." Atheism shirks an "objective assessment of evidence" because of "stubborn disobedience" and "willful rebellion". It is "the suppression of truth by wickedness, the cognitive consequence of immorality. In short, it is sin that is the mother of unbelief."
And that's just in the first few pages of the first chapter!
While Spiegel believes that, biblically speaking, atheist are fools, he stresses that this is not foolishness as mere ignorance. Atheists are not "simply obtuse or feeble-minded". Rather, they are in deep moral rebellion. He explains:
"When smart people go in irrational directions, it is time to look elsewhere than reasoning ability for an explanation. And Scripture gives us clear direction as to where we should look. Consider the psalmist's declaration that `the fool says in his heart,`There is no God'" (Psalm 14:1). The Hebrew term rendered `fool' here denotes a person who is `morally deficient.' And elsewhere in the Old Testament Wisdom Literature we learn of various symptoms of this moral deficiency. The book of Proverbs says `a fool finds no pleasure in understanding'(Proverbs 18:2), that `fools despise wisdom and discipline'(Proverbs 1:7), that `a fool finds pleasure in evil conduct'(Proverbs 10:23) and is `hotheaded and reckless'(Proverbs 14:16)." "It is not intelligence they lack so much as self-control and the right values."
Spiegel provides other scriptures to support his provocative thesis. For instance, he observes of Ephesians 4:17-19: "The root of the problem, apparently, is not a lack of intelligence but rather a hardness of heart that is itself caused by immoral behavior." He cites John 3:19-21, "men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil", and then observes:
"Note also Jesus' point that evildoers do not simply ignore or reject the light but actually `hate' it. If this is so, then we should expect some atheists to display a certain amount of bitterness and even rage toward the idea of God. And, of course, this is just what we find among many atheists, especially the leaders of the new atheism."
But the most important passage for Spiegel's provocative thesis is Romans 1:18-21:
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the

EDITED FOR SPACE...
Again, when you cut a paste your propaganda, leave some space for our comments.
This guys entire hypothesis is based upon the claim of immorality of atheists. I wonder if he can show evidence atheists are immoral, or are atheists due to their immorality?
He claims atheists have an agenda to "suppress truth". What truth are we suppressing and how are we doing this?

Truth can be revealed in debate. Funny how I see so many Christians here running from so many of the points I bring up.
I await a believer to test this claim.
18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>Who on here ever thought we didn't???
Sniffing to much concrete dust???
We want TRUTH in our schools, and Evilution is PURE Conjecture!
You can, and I guess will deny that, as
Getting rid of God is YOUR Agenda!
Funny how hard you fight for something, that
you KNOW in your heart is a Lie!
SistaNoneyoBiz

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#108969
Jul 27, 2013
 

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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>At first I laughed!
Second, I thought these People have to be Obama supporters!
Then I read the last line... They Vote!
Now... I want to cry for America.... They are Obama supporters!
I kept a copy to pass along!
Of course the god believer assumes without any evidence.

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#108970
Jul 27, 2013
 
SistaNoneyoBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't even ever begin to think about any sort "utopia" in that sense. Why bother-it's just not realistic.
So, guess we actually kind of agree on stuff!
If you determined it was not realistic, how did you do this without ever beginning to think about it?

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#108971
Jul 27, 2013
 

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SistaNoneyoBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
Peas-and the astronaut reference was initially referencing life "beyond" planet Earth--the REST of the then quoted quote- really was just actual "irony" lol.
So none of your post had anything to do with the post you responded to? I do not dispute life beyond planet earth. I dispute the idea god must have created earth.
Irony to what?
All I see is continued diversion. Diversion is a sign of denial.

“There is no god.”

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The religie Syndrome: A Psychopathology of belief

The fool hath thought in its mind,"There is a god.’”
So wrote Alice in diagnosing the problem of belief in an invisible sky critter.

But is foolishness the only problem? Might it not be compounded by something else, something over which the christian has no control? Well jesus christ thinks so. And it tries, in The religie Syndrome, to establish its case.

In, jesus's(pronounced *hey seus* as in dr.) thesis it asserts that all christians in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries have all suffered from a form of mental illness that it dubs “the religie syndrome".

Applying Freudian psychoanalysis to christian leaders like benny hinn, john hagee, pat robertson, and david duke himself, jesus concludes that their domineering and abusive religie ways transformed itself into hatred of Atheism and the freedom from delusions represented by them. That hatred led to an irrational rejection of logic and truth and an embracing of delusion — whether godbotism, occultism, or visions of sky critters.

In conclusion the "study" shows that religies are now and always will be free roaming mental ward patients.

curious

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Jul 27, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>"Studies"? So you have more than one study to cite? Do you know what a plural is?
I love how you cling to a single study and claim it as absolute truth, yet you dismiss the many thousands and thousands of studies on evolution.
University of Toronto psychologists reported last year that “believing in God can help block anxiety and minimize stress,” their research showcasing “distinct brain differences” between believers and nonbelievers.
A new study released Wednesday by Rush University Medical Center in Chicago took the idea a step further.
In patients diagnosed with clinical depression,“belief in a concerned God can improve response to medical treatment,” said the new research, which has been published in the Journal of Clinical Psychology.
The operative term here is “caring,” the researchers said.“The study found that those with strong beliefs in a personal and concerned God were more likely to experience an improvement.”
The researchers compared the levels of melancholy or hopelessness in 136 adults diagnosed with major depression or bipolar depression with their sense of “religious well-being.” They found participants who scored in the top third of a scale charting a sense of religious well-being were 75 percent more likely to get better with medical treatment for clinical depression.
“In our study, the positive response to medication had little to do with the feeling of hope that typically accompanies spiritual belief,” said study director Patricia Murphy, a chaplain at Rush and an assistant professor of religion, health and human values.
“It was tied specifically to the belief that a Supreme Being cared,” she said.
“For people diagnosed with clinical depression, medication certainly plays an important role in reducing symptoms,” Ms. Murphy added.“But when treating persons diagnosed with depression, clinicians need to be aware of the role of religion in their patients’ lives. It is an important resource in planning their care.”
The Canadian researchers who found that belief in God lowers anxiety and stress also based their conclusions on measurements — monitoring the brain activities of believers and nonbelievers charged with some challenging tasks.
“We found that religious people or even people who simply believe in the existence of God show significantly less brain activity in relation to their own errors,” said Michael Inzlicht, assistant psychology professor at the University of Toronto, who led the research.
“They’re much less anxious and feel less stressed when they have made an error,” he said.
Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/feb/...
"According to researchers from Harvard Medical School, belief in god is correlated with improved outcomes of treatment for depression. Quoting:'In the study, published in the current issue of Journal of Affective Disorders, researchers comment that people with a moderate to high level of belief in a higher power do significantly better in short-term psychiatric treatment than those without. "Belief was associated with not only improved psychological well-being, but decreases in depression and intention to self-harm," says David H. Rosmarin, Ph.D., an instructor in the Department of Psychiatry at Harvard Medical School.' This raises interesting questions. Does this support the concept of depressive realism? If the association is found to be causal, would it be ethical for a psychiatrist to prescribe religion?"
Apparently Scientific Studies show that athiest are far more suicidal and are more likely to lack self confindence, amongst many other mental and character disorders...
==========
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/a...

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Jul 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Most agree he was Christian and that he did not want to use the word God. So he used the word providence. Have you ever seen how much credit he gives to providence?
"Most of us"? Who the hell is "us", Christians? Many if not most historian scholars say George seems to have been deist.
What I think most about Washington and his religious beliefs is, he did not want religion dictating government. He wanted a separation of church and state.

Most people think the cherry tree cutting was a true story, does it make it true?
Either way, their are varying views of what Washington believed as far as religion. It is really hard to know what any one person really thinks on a subject unless he records his views in depth. Even then it often gets twisted in the interpretations.
Jesus recorded none of his views. All of his views were opined by third parties and more.

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#108975
Jul 27, 2013
 

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curious wrote:
<quoted text>
University of Toronto psychologists reported last year that “believing in God can help block anxiety and minimize stress,” their research showcasing “distinct brain differences” between believers and nonbelievers.
A new study released Wednesday by Rush University Medical Center in Chicago took the idea a step further.
In patients diagnosed with clinical depression,“belief in a concerned God can improve response to medical treatment,” said the new research, which has been published in the Journal of Clinical Psychology.
The operative term here is “caring,” the researchers said.“The study found that those with strong beliefs in a personal and concerned God were more likely to experience an improvement.”
The researchers compared the levels of melancholy or hopelessness in 136 adults diagnosed with major depression or bipolar depression with their sense of “religious well-being.” They found participants who scored in the top third of a scale charting a sense of religious well-being were 75 percent more likely to get better with medical treatment for clinical depression.
“In our study, the positive response to medication had little to do with the feeling of hope that typically accompanies spiritual belief,” said study director Patricia Murphy, a chaplain at Rush and an assistant professor of religion, health and human values.
“It was tied specifically to the belief that a Supreme Being cared,” she said.
“For people diagnosed with clinical depression, medication certainly plays an important role in reducing symptoms,” Ms. Murphy added.“But when treating persons diagnosed with depression, clinicians need to be aware of the role of religion in their patients’ lives. It is an important resource in planning their care.”
The Canadian researchers who found that belief in God lowers anxiety and stress also based their conclusions on measurements — monitoring the brain activities of believers and nonbelievers charged with some challenging tasks.
“We found that religious people or even people who simply believe in the existence of God show significantly less brain activity in relation to their own errors,” said Michael Inzlicht, assistant psychology professor at the University of Toronto, who led the research.
“They’re much less anxious and feel less stressed when they have made an error,” he said.
Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/feb/...
"According to researchers from Harvard Medical School, belief in god is correlated with improved outcomes of treatment for depression. Quoting:'In the study, published in the current issue of Journal of Affective Disorders, researchers comment that people with a moderate to high level of belief in a higher power do significantly better in short-term psychiatric treatment than those without. "Belief was associated with not only improved psychological well-being, but decreases in depression and intention to self-harm,"
EDITED FOR SPACE!!!
Interesting. So a study lead by a Chaplin is what you cite?

I note the study showed less brain activity by believers when they had errors. So I conclude the believers fail to use their conscience as much as unbelievers.
Yes, doing wrong and feeling guilty about it does cause non believers stress. And I say this is a great thing. This burden of guilt is the natural mechanism that helps us to remember to do the right thing.
Are you of the mind that the guilty should go unpunished? Guilt and stress is punishment of sorts.
No wonder the religious repeat errors so often. They artificially blocked nature with religious ignorant bliss.

Putting more effort into not repeating errors should be the lesson here. So sad the Chaplin missed that lesson.
Being a good person is the key to mental well-being. So sad the Chaplin missed that lesson.

Atheists and believers alike need to head this lesson.
Being atheist is no cure all. Understanding why our brain does what it does, helps.

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#108976
Jul 27, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Most agree he was Christian and that he did not want to use the word God. So he used the word providence. Have you ever seen how much credit he gives to providence?
Providence can be of nature or of a god. Depends on that which you believe intervenes. Seems you assume Washington was speaking of a god. Others will think he was speaking of nature.
But again, I did not ask you what your opinion of his religion was. I only used Washington as an example of the differing opinions of his beliefs.
Now can you focus on the actual debate and stop diverting?

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#108977
Jul 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Reading it doesn't mean you understood what you read. People can spend their lives reading and studying it and not understand everything. It is quite incredible how understanding increases when studying it with the Holy Ghost as your companion. Jesus taught in hidden meanings so that only those who were ready to receive the information understand it because once you learn it, you are held accountable for that knowledge.
It is incredible how understanding increases when someone is not blinded by faith.
I get you think you can magically understand hidden meanings in the bible. Do you think for a second I or any atheist thinks this is rational?

I know their are many devout believers who study the bible like it is their job, but yet they still have different beliefs of what it means. So I conclude this holy ghost concept is not reliable at all.
If this holy ghost concept was real, I could see no reason for the protestant and Catholic differences.
Now can you explain why they would differ?

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#108978
Jul 27, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I have never said the Bible is inerrant.
This is why the Holy Ghost is important. It is also why there are so many interpretations of the same passages.
Sorry, but the contradictions of your statement is jarring me.
If the holy ghost is so important, then why are their so many interpretations of the same passages? Is the ghost not doing his job?
I thought you believed the holy ghost helped those who wrote the bible. If so, could the ghost not get the story correct?
You seem to want your cake and eat it also.
If the ghost could not make the story inerrant, then why would I think he could straighten out its meanings?
And really, do you expect us to believe in ghosts doing these magical things in our brains? Do you know how irrational that sounds?

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#108979
Jul 27, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
See it as you wish. You have not shown me anything impressive with your knowledge of deep doctrine of Christianity. Therefore I don't think you are qualified to tell a Christian what they believe. If me pointing out ignorance on your part looks like arrogance on my part, that just means I must have hit a nerve.
So what you see as your arrogance is just you hitting a nerve. Now what is the arrogance you charge against us due to?
You just cannot stop having double standards, can you.

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#108980
Jul 27, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok, dude, seriously? You are going to tell me that you can't see all the prophecies that foretell Christ? Even though His name is not mentioned?
Jesus is the only person that ever lived that has had any claim to fulfilling the prophecies that only the Son of God could perform, because He was not simply a man. Jesus had to fulfill all prophecies mentioned in the OT. The only reason Jews didn't believe Him is because they misunderstood that His kingdom was not on this earth like they thought.
Please just google the prophesies that foretell the coming of Jesus. This is so easy to look up.
Jews can't interpret their own writings due to the holy ghost not doing his job. Or maybe the ghost is but a myth. Or maybe the ghost is not helping you interpret the writings correctly.

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#108981
Jul 27, 2013
 
SistaNoneyaBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't see "Creationists" trying to remove Science books from schools...I see people hatefully ragging on, and degrading others for having beliefs that might differ from their own.
Which makes no sense either, because that kind of stuff is just as ignorant and harmful, as extremist anything else.
Yes and Amen "That is... Keep "YOUR" religion of Evilution out of our schools, as it is a total lie!
We can adapt to certain circumstances, but Man in the Beginning was still Man at the end...
We did not come from Pond scum!"

Yes and Amen is the sort of creationist I am speaking of.

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#108982
Jul 27, 2013
 
Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>That is... Keep "YOUR" religion of Evilution out of our schools, as it is a total lie!
We can adapt to certain circumstances, but Man in the Beginning was still Man at the end...
We did not come from Pond scum!
"
SistaNoneyaBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't see "Creationists" trying to remove Science books from schools...I see people hatefully ragging on, and degrading others for having beliefs that might differ from their own.
Which makes no sense either, because that kind of stuff is just as ignorant and harmful, as extremist anything else."

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#108983
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SistaNoneyoBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
The point was, people are NOT meant to be roboTic--or viewed as all the same. Nor is it rational to even begin to think, that just because one might belong to a certain "sector" (in this case-Science-such as NASA astronauts)is it wise to merely "assume" that they all hold the same perspectives, when it comes to BELIEFS (or lack thereof).
What you believe or don't believe in is your business (so long as it is NOT harming anyone in any shape fashion or form), just as mine are mine...(with no intents on harming others in any shape fashion or form) Just don't expect me to believe exactly as you believe, don't, because everyone believing the same thing (or not) is NOT reality either.
Obviously!
(I believe they call it in the sane world of rational, decent adults, agreeing to disagree, or STAYING AWAY from that which we might disagree with--- rather than beating, demeaning, picking juvenile fights or any of that type kindergarten ignorant sandbox level stuff)
Have a nice day :-).
Do assume I expect all to believe as I?
Seems to me the Christians here are doing this, and the ten commandments demand this.
I do not care if your intents is to harm me or not, if it harms me or society, I will voice my concerns about it whether it offends you or not.
I have shown repeatedly what I feel religion is doing that is not good for society. You continue to ignore this point as if religion is harmless. Again, did you forget about 9/11 already? Religion is not harmless. Perpetuating blind faith is not harmless. Maybe you think it is,so what? I do not, and you are not the boss of what I say. Do you hate freedom of speech? Am I not free to speak my mind? Am I to be passive to what I see as bad for society?

How can you not see the hypocrisy in your statement? If you really acted upon your beliefs claimed here, why are you beating, demeaning, picking juvenile fights or any of that type kindergarten ignorant sandbox level stuff?
Is what I voice causing harm?

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