Thousands Protest Roe V. Wade Decision

Full story: Newsday 306,257
Thousands of abortion opponents marched from the National Mall to the Supreme Court on Tuesday in their annual remembrance of the court's Roe v. Wade decision. Full Story
The Prince

Phillipsburg, NJ

#283677 Feb 12, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
Remember the talk of the 50% gas exchange? That's already a protocol in determining viability. If physicians think the fetus has not reached the 50% mark, it will be determined nonviable.
With that said, you do know scientists are tweaking artificial surfactant, yes? So in that sense, all that you say above *could* open the door for the courts to determine when viability is rather than the physicians. Fifty percent won't matter because they can use this new-fangled ALS and inject artificial surfactant to bring the newborn to viability.
I brought this up to you before, but you and glossed (misunderstood, ignored, poked fun of, or myriad other options) right over it.
Do you see this Doc? Or are you going to start flinging ad homs like monkeys fling sh*t?
This has always been the problem with the probrotion pagan view of abortion. You can't get past viablity. Like the flawed Supreme
Court decision that hinges on "viability", your definition of what is viable, hinges on this "50%" number.

The problmen is, what defines the 50%, how can you be sure you are not killing a viable unobrn child. Could we say that you have no real idea of when viability actually occurs because you have no real clear delfintion of what viabilty means. All of you proabort pagans have different definitions depending on how aggressively proabortion you are.

There is a national law being proposwed that would ban all third trimester abortions unless the mothers life is threatened by the pregnancy. Two doctors would have to agree. Since you put so much stock in "the law". Would you support this law if passed. I am sure that you would.
Forum

Hobbs, NM

#283678 Feb 12, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
Late and later term abortions are not the norm. These account for less than 2% of all annual abortions.
Neither do these compare to murder. It is illegal to abort late and later term without cause. Most states have restrictions and strict guidelines to follow.
It doesn't matter if I find it revolting and would not choose it for myself. It doesn't matter if a woman learns late in a wanted pregnancy her fetus is doomed and she decides it is better to abort. Neither does it matter if she is induced prematurely, births a doomed baby, only to watch it until it dies. These things happen outside your control, outside my control, outside the general public's control. Who do you think you are to control these personal, private medical matters?
I mean really?
Do these women know how their baby suffers? They can't hear
their baby screaming in the womb. How dumb.
Ocean56

AOL

#283679 Feb 13, 2013
The Prince wrote:
Please list all the reasons motherhood and pregnancy are bad. I don't think people really understand it like you do.
Actually, I believe I have said that pregnancy and motherhood are HARD, not bad, and there are quite a few HARDSHIPS involved with both. Some of the hardships mothers of all ages will face once a baby arrives include -- but are not limited to -- the following:

1. Loss of freedom
2. Loss of sleep
3. Loss of money
4. Loss of education and job/career opportunities
5. Loss of mobility
6. Loss of private time
7. Dealing with colic

There is no escaping the fact that becoming a mother makes a girl’s/woman's life much HARDER and she loses most, if not all, of the benefits and comforts she had before she got pregnant. Too many girls/women are PRESSURED into having children by family members and/or religious community, and purposely aren't told just how very hard motherhood is until AFTER they have had a baby. I think it is high time that changed. If some girls/women decide they don't want the hardships of motherhood, that is fine. The choice for a woman to be childfree is just as valid and respectable as the choice to be a mother.

Katie

Spanaway, WA

#283680 Feb 13, 2013
The Prince wrote:
<quoted text>
This has always been the problem with the probrotion pagan view of abortion. You can't get past viablity. Like the flawed Supreme
Court decision that hinges on "viability", your definition of what is viable, hinges on this "50%" number.
The problmen is, what defines the 50%, how can you be sure you are not killing a viable unobrn child. Could we say that you have no real idea of when viability actually occurs because you have no real clear delfintion of what viabilty means. All of you proabort pagans have different definitions depending on how aggressively proabortion you are.
There is a national law being proposwed that would ban all third trimester abortions unless the mothers life is threatened by the pregnancy. Two doctors would have to agree. Since you put so much stock in "the law". Would you support this law if passed. I am sure that you would.
Banning all third trimester abortions unless the woman's life is threatened is already how it's set up. Most states have restrictions and strict guidelines for these unfortunate events.

Why wouldn't I support a federal ban? Because women would now have a duty to die for the country. Their fetus took precedence over their life. Physicians would be too hesitant to perform an abortion lest they get prosecuted for it.

Catholic countries allow women to die all the time. Their fetuses, too. That what you want for the USA?

Is it murder when the woman dies due to lack of abortion when ending the pregnancy would've saved her?
Katie

Spanaway, WA

#283681 Feb 13, 2013
Forum wrote:
<quoted text>
Do these women know how their baby suffers? They can't hear
their baby screaming in the womb. How dumb.
Do you know how the amniotic fluid acts as an anesthetic? No, apparently you don't. How dumb.
Ocean56

AOL

#283682 Feb 13, 2013
Ocean56 wrote:
There is no escaping the fact that becoming a mother makes a girl’s/woman's life much HARDER and she loses most, if not all, of the benefits and comforts she had before she got pregnant. Too many girls/women are PRESSURED into having children by family members and/or religious community, and purposely aren't told just how very hard motherhood is until AFTER they have had a baby. I think it is high time that changed. If some girls/women decide they don't want the hardships of motherhood, that is fine. The choice for a woman to be childfree is just as valid and respectable as the choice to be a mother.
I forgot to add one more thing. Due to the health risks of pregnancy and the hardships of motherhood, the ONLY person who makes the decision whether or not to continue a pregnancy is the WOMAN who is pregnant.

Obskeptic

Detroit, MI

#283684 Feb 13, 2013
STO wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you believe disposing of a frozen embryo is also "killing a baby"?
Now that was simply a brilliant question. Next!
Guppy

Englewood, FL

#283685 Feb 13, 2013
This forum is going down the tubes.

The amniotic fluid acts as an anesthetic? Didn't know that.

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#283686 Feb 13, 2013
Screaming? Melodramatic twaddle.
Forum wrote:
<quoted text>
Do these women know how their baby suffers? They can't hear
their baby screaming in the womb. How dumb.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#283687 Feb 13, 2013
The Prince wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a national law being proposwed that would ban all third trimester abortions unless the mothers life is threatened by the pregnancy..
Psssssst.....NEWSFLASH.....LTA 's are ALREADY banned in the third trimester except for severe medical issues, and has been for years.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#283688 Feb 13, 2013
Obskeptic wrote:
<quoted text>
Now that was simply a brilliant question. Next!
Why are you afraid to answer? Its not a difficult question.

“Pro-Life”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#283689 Feb 13, 2013
Katie wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you know how the amniotic fluid acts as an anesthetic? No, apparently you don't. How dumb.
Prove that claim. Don't come back with expecting others to do it for you.

"...amniotic fluid acts as an anesthetic..."

Prove it.

“Pro-Life”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#283690 Feb 13, 2013
STO wrote:
<quoted text>
" A fetus is considered viable or not BEFORE birth."
"viability of a fetus isn't something that needs to be "reached" AFTER being born"
Doc and I discussed this a while back. I offered a hypothetical "artificial womb", as a future medical technology.
Given the hypothetical...
My understanding is that every fetus would be considered "viable", as soon as it developed from embryo to fetus, rendering no need to make that determination before birth.
I think that is ridiculous because essentially the word "viable" becomes meaningless in the scheme of current debate.
Tho, it fits the definition.
The fetus absolutely would not be considered viable without this ALS (artifical womb), and even with this ALS it would not meet what we consider viable, today ( a womb is a womb is a womb).
Does that help?
(I know, I know .. ad homs, right?)
STO: "I offered a hypothetical "artificial womb", as a future medical technology.
Given the hypothetical...
My understanding is that every fetus would be considered "viable", as soon as it developed from embryo to fetus, rendering no need to make that determination before birth.
I think that is ridiculous because essentially the word "viable" becomes meaningless in the scheme of current debate."

No, it's ridiculous because it's a senseless hypothetical to begin with, and what's ridiculous in your hypothetical is that you're expecting viablity at 8 weeks. When it goes "from embryo to fetus".

You came up with a senseless hypothetical that you expect others to make sense of, which is stupid.

Viability is about a determition made at a certain gestational point as to the potential of a fetus surviving outside of the womb. A determination made while that human life is in the womb, still a fetus, and not a newborn infant. Katie and some other PC are arguing vaibility of a newborn, and newborns "reaching" viability. The premise in their arguments about viability is wrong to begin with. They will never be right in the argument of viability i an abortion discussion as long as they argue viability as being about a born infant, when it's about a fetus in utero.

Your silly hypothetical is immaterial.
STO

Vallejo, CA

#283691 Feb 13, 2013
Obskeptic wrote:
<quoted text>
Now that was simply a brilliant question. Next!
Ok. Go ahead and answer.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#283692 Feb 13, 2013
lil Lily wrote:
<quoted text>

No, it's ridiculous because it's a senseless hypothetical to begin with,.
No Moron Lynniekins, its not ridiculous OR sensless. In fact, in a few short years, we'll have them. Its already happened with shark embryo's.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21905089

http://www.thesciencenews.info/2011/04/artifi...

But then, we know you dont give a shit about actual discussion, you'd MUCH rather dismiss anything ANYONE that's on your personal shit list as being "ridiculous" even tho its reality.
STO

Vallejo, CA

#283694 Feb 13, 2013
lil Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
STO: "I offered a hypothetical "artificial womb", as a future medical technology.
Given the hypothetical...
My understanding is that every fetus would be considered "viable", as soon as it developed from embryo to fetus, rendering no need to make that determination before birth.
I think that is ridiculous because essentially the word "viable" becomes meaningless in the scheme of current debate."
No, it's ridiculous because it's a senseless hypothetical to begin with, and what's ridiculous in your hypothetical is that you're expecting viablity at 8 weeks. When it goes "from embryo to fetus".
You came up with a senseless hypothetical that you expect others to make sense of, which is stupid.
Viability is about a determition made at a certain gestational point as to the potential of a fetus surviving outside of the womb. A determination made while that human life is in the womb, still a fetus, and not a newborn infant. Katie and some other PC are arguing vaibility of a newborn, and newborns "reaching" viability. The premise in their arguments about viability is wrong to begin with. They will never be right in the argument of viability i an abortion discussion as long as they argue viability as being about a born infant, when it's about a fetus in utero.
Your silly hypothetical is immaterial.
"Viability is about a determition made at a certain gestational point as to the potential of a fetus surviving outside of the womb."

With ALS, per Doc.

The point at which a fetus is "viable" has changed, IF one considers medical technology today as opposed 30 years ago.

Medical technology may one day include an artifical womb.

So, your ad homs aside, when is a fetus viable?
Obskeptic

Livonia, MI

#283695 Feb 13, 2013
LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>Why are you afraid to answer? Its not a difficult question.
No fear "lilrabbitfoofoo". Although most PL define the beginning of life at conception, an "embryo" that is conceived, studied, and frozen in the very first stages of development, in a test tube and not the womb, would never meet the legal or scientific definition of "viable". Now considering that I am just one of 320+ million people in our country, here's where the nuance comes in on my opinion. That circumstance is different then an embryo that begins it's conception in the womb as a result of mans natural connection with women. Isn't that just crazy? Even crazier is I believe that unless the mothers very life is in jeopardy from the developing fetus that to abort the baby is not an option. Now this is the craziest of them all "lilrabbitfoofoo", I'm sorry, but that name alone makes it difficult to take anything you say seriously. Just saying it out loud paints the most ridiculous mental image. My apologies, I digress. In the case of rape and incest, that better happen in the first trimester, with the abortion being considered murder legally and charges filed against the rapist for that death.
STO

Vallejo, CA

#283696 Feb 13, 2013
Obskeptic wrote:
<quoted text>
No fear "lilrabbitfoofoo". Although most PL define the beginning of life at conception, an "embryo" that is conceived, studied, and frozen in the very first stages of development, in a test tube and not the womb, would never meet the legal or scientific definition of "viable". Now considering that I am just one of 320+ million people in our country, here's where the nuance comes in on my opinion. That circumstance is different then an embryo that begins it's conception in the womb as a result of mans natural connection with women. Isn't that just crazy? Even crazier is I believe that unless the mothers very life is in jeopardy from the developing fetus that to abort the baby is not an option. Now this is the craziest of them all "lilrabbitfoofoo", I'm sorry, but that name alone makes it difficult to take anything you say seriously. Just saying it out loud paints the most ridiculous mental image. My apologies, I digress. In the case of rape and incest, that better happen in the first trimester, with the abortion being considered murder legally and charges filed against the rapist for that death.
" Although most PL define the beginning of life at conception, an "embryo" that is conceived, studied, and frozen in the very first stages of development, in a test tube and not the womb, would never meet the legal or scientific definition of "viable"."

You didn't answer the question. You said abortion was "killing a baby". So, do you equate disposal of a frozen embryo with "killing a baby"? Viability is irrelevant to this question.
STO

Vallejo, CA

#283697 Feb 13, 2013
LiIrabbitfoofoo wrote:
<quoted text>
No Moron Lynniekins, its not ridiculous OR sensless. In fact, in a few short years, we'll have them. Its already happened with shark embryo's.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21905089
http://www.thesciencenews.info/2011/04/artifi...
But then, we know you dont give a shit about actual discussion, you'd MUCH rather dismiss anything ANYONE that's on your personal shit list as being "ridiculous" even tho its reality.
Thanks Foo. I didn't know about the shark embryos.
Katie

Spanaway, WA

#283699 Feb 13, 2013
STO wrote:
<quoted text>
"Viability is about a determition made at a certain gestational point as to the potential of a fetus surviving outside of the womb."
With ALS, per Doc.
The point at which a fetus is "viable" has changed, IF one considers medical technology today as opposed 30 years ago.
Medical technology may one day include an artifical womb.
So, your ad homs aside, when is a fetus viable?
She copies my words "physician determines fetus is viable" but doesn't understand what these mean as she rides my a$$ and demands I prove what I am saying or bow down to her highness. Even worse, when coming up behind her buddy Doc, she doesn't understand what he's saying (although I'm sure she's clicking those icons in his favor).

Didja see where she told me to prove Doc is PC? How crazy is that? Doc can confirm or deny himself. He's always claimed he's PC, though I see him as PL holding exceptions for life of woman.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Pompano Beach Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Barack Obama, our next President (Nov '08) 2 min woodtick57 1,126,325
Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel (Jun '08) 7 min JOEL 70,084
Overpaid Firefighters (Sep '10) 19 min Righteous 397
Israeli troops begin Gaza pullout as Hamas decl... (Jan '09) 46 min TRD 68,651
Once slow-moving threat, global warming speeds ... (Dec '08) 1 hr scirocco 47,496
Boca woman sues UF fraternity brothers for secr... (Jul '08) 4 hr Zac Siegel 362
Missing 5-year-old Florida girl likely was abdu... (Feb '09) 10 hr zazz 96,519
Pompano Beach Dating
Find my Match

Pompano Beach Jobs

Pompano Beach People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

Pompano Beach News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in Pompano Beach

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]