Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

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Safety pins and screws are still lodged in 15-year-old Ami Ortiz's body three months after he opened a booby-trapped gift basket sent to his family. Full Story
Voluntarist

United States

#51088 Apr 25, 2013
It was a response to your article which was all over the place
Lets start with fema camps with my first fact
EXECUTIVE ORDER # 11000 Allows the
government to mobilize civilians into work
brigades under government supervision
do you admit or deny?
rabbee yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

#51089 Apr 25, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>The holy Spirit has taught me thru meditation, and if you're going to call me a liar we can end this right now. Do you really think that I think I can make myself the Messiah if I'm not? I'm not that ignorant.
rabbee: sorry! but TheRuach HaKodesh, does not tell lies. does not get names wrong, nor disavows being here in TheTorah. i have seen and spoken with G-D, and you can't get More HOLY-SPIRIT than this.

and there is the unholy spirit too, i hope you do know. and i believe you can be, just as easily decieved by them as everyone else in this world including the muslems, jews, and christian.

G-D does not send, TheRuach HaKodesh to those who only want to hear vain lies. and there is not one person in this world, that thinks they are some kind of special messiah of some sorts.

if you even think, there is more than a few holy persons in this world today. then you are painting, a false vain picture.

and you are not calling me a liar, but are calling TheG-D WHO gave this assignment to me a liar. so how can any holy spirit, call THE MOST HOLY SPIRIT a liar?

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51090 Apr 25, 2013
Voluntarist wrote:
It was a response to your article which was all over the place
Lets start with fema camps with my first fact
EXECUTIVE ORDER # 11000 Allows the
government to mobilize civilians into work
brigades under government supervision
do you admit or deny?
No, that article had a specific topic, and lets stay on that topic for a change.

It proposed a modal personality and suggested several ways to sustain that personality. Was there anything in that article you really objected to? One of the more interesting things I got from it is that conspiracy theorists conjure their ideas up as a need to control their reality. Is that the case with you?

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51091 Apr 25, 2013
http://www.salon.com/2013/04/24/why_people_be...

What are the psychological forces at play in conspiracy thinking?

Basically whatís happening in any conspiracy theory is that people have a need or a motivation to believe in this theory, and itís psychologically different from evidence-based thinking. A conspiracy theory is immune to evidence, and that can pretty well serve as the definition of one. If you reject evidence, or reinterpret the evidence to be confirmation of your theory, or you ignore mountains of evidence to focus on just one thing, youíre probably a conspiracy theorist. We call that a self-sealing nature of reasoning.

Another common trait is the need to constantly expand the conspiracy as new evidence comes to light. For instance, with the so-called Climategate scandal, there were something like nine different investigations, all of which have exonerated the scientists involved. But the response from the people who held this notion was to say that all of those investigations were a whitewash. So it started with the scientists being corrupt and now not only is it them, but itís also all the major scientific organizations of the world that investigated them and the governments of the U.S. and the U.K., etc., etc. And thatís typical ó instead of accepting the evidence, you actually turn it around and say that itís actually evidence to support the conspiracy because it just means itís even broader than it was originally thought to be.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51092 Apr 25, 2013
http://www.salon.com/2013/04/24/why_people_be...

Everyone is prone to some degree of bias and motivated reasoning ó where do you draw the line, if there is one?

The crucial difference between having a preconceived notion ó we all do that, of course ó and conspiratorial thinking is when you get into that self-sealing reasoning and ignore every piece of evidence that is pointing the other way, when youíre starting to broaden the circle of conspirators, and when your skepticism gets to be nihilistic ó when you believe absolutely nothing that the government or the media is saying ó thatís when youíve crossed the line.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51093 Apr 25, 2013
http://www.salon.com/2013/04/24/why_people_be...

First of all, why do people believe conspiracy theories?

There are number of factors, but probably one of the most important ones in this instance is that, paradoxically, it gives people a sense of control. People hate randomness, they dread the sort of random occurrences that can destroy their lives, so as a mechanism against that dread, it turns out that itís much easier to believe in a conspiracy. Then you have someone to blame, itís not just randomness.
former res

Cheshire, CT

#51094 Apr 25, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
.... and itís psychologically different from evidence-based thinking. A conspiracy theory is immune to evidence, and that can pretty well serve as the definition of one. If you reject evidence, or reinterpret the evidence to be confirmation of your theory [belief], or you ignore mountains of evidence to focus on just one thing .....
Sounds a lot like religion - both Testaments!

How are things downstate? Nice up here in New Haven County.

Did I see Huggybear lurking around here again?

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51095 Apr 25, 2013
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Sounds a lot like religion - both Testaments!
How are things downstate? Nice up here in New Haven County.
Did I see Huggybear lurking around here again?
Huggybear is around, tie up your goats

Downstate is downstate of upstate

Yes, that evidence based thinking thingie.....but most religious people don't link their deity as part of a larger conspiracy. Perhaps they should.
former res

Cheshire, CT

#51096 Apr 25, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Huggybear is around, tie up your goats
Downstate is downstate of upstate
Yes, that evidence based thinking thingie.....but most religious people don't link their deity as part of a larger conspiracy. Perhaps they should.
The full quote from Karl Marx is: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_of_the_peo...

Huggy might like his victims tied up!

Then we can get into sheep jokes an why sheep herders wear cowboy boots etc

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51097 Apr 25, 2013
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
The full quote from Karl Marx is: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_of_the_peo...
Huggy might like his victims tied up!
Then we can get into sheep jokes an why sheep herders wear cowboy boots etc
You are mixing your concepts. It doesnt count if you have the conspiracy theory. Only if the religious person does.

Why DO sheep herders wear cowboy boots?
Voluntarist

United States

#51098 Apr 25, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
No, that article had a specific topic, and lets stay on that topic for a change.
It proposed a modal personality and suggested several ways to sustain that personality. Was there anything in that article you really objected to? One of the more interesting things I got from it is that conspiracy theorists conjure their ideas up as a need to control their reality. Is that the case with you?
Yes i object to the whole thing because it refers to conspiracy theories not being evidence based.
The Advocate

Mexico, Mexico

#51099 Apr 25, 2013
Voluntarist wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes i object to the whole thing because it refers to conspiracy theories not being evidence based.
Unfortunately few seem to care considering how ridiculously popular conspiracy theories are.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#51100 Apr 25, 2013
Voluntarist wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes i object to the whole thing because it refers to conspiracy theories not being evidence based.
You know how many times we have presented corrections to you?
Voluntarist

United States

#51101 Apr 25, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
You know how many times we have presented corrections to you?
None, you have only attempted to split hairs or stated a differing opion.
Voluntarist

United States

#51102 Apr 25, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
You know how many times we have presented corrections to you?
Opinion that is.

And when i say that there are influentual people aspiring to create a one world government, you say thats a conspiracy theory, i prove it to you and then you poo poo it.
The Advocate

Mexico, Mexico

#51103 Apr 25, 2013
Voluntarist wrote:
<quoted text>
Opinion that is.
And when i say that there are influentual people aspiring to create a one world government, you say thats a conspiracy theory, i prove it to you and then you poo poo it.
What "proof" is ever any solid proof in most conspiracy theories?
former res

Cheshire, CT

#51104 Apr 25, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
You are mixing your concepts. It doesnt count if you have the conspiracy theory. Only if the religious person does.
Why DO sheep herders wear cowboy boots?
The key in the quote your provided for me was the belief in a concept and the rejection of evidence-based thinking.

The fact that it made Karl Marx happy was just a bonus.

The rear legs of the sheep fit nicely in the boots and then they can't run away....or so I hear.
Voluntarist

United States

#51105 Apr 25, 2013
The Advocate wrote:
<quoted text>
What "proof" is ever any solid proof in most conspiracy theories?
There are facts, even seemingly circumstantial facts can lead a person of above average intelligence to disbelieve the "official story".

NORAD was running drills on 9/11, when the hijackers actually hijacked the planes it caused mass confusion, recordings of the controllers asking "is this real world or exercise".

Building 7 fell straight to the ground in the path of most resistance at free fall speed.
Voluntarist

United States

#51106 Apr 25, 2013
The Advocate wrote:
<quoted text>
What "proof" is ever any solid proof in most conspiracy theories?
Actually it is the government that comes up with the conspiracy theory, like on 9/11.

The book "9/11 omissions and distortions" is about what facts the 9/11 commission considered and those that they decided to leave out.
So picture a jury getting to see certain evidence but not allowed to consider certain other evidence.
A different verdict can conclude when evidence is withheld.

So many conspiracy theorists point out facts that were not considered. by the commission.

Plus the commission started with a conclusion and worked back to the beginning, instead of start to finish and a conclusion based on evidence.
Voluntarist

United States

#51107 Apr 25, 2013
Omissions
The Report fails to acknowledge that no steel-framed high-rise
building has ever collapsed due to fires .
The Report fails to mention the total collapse of 47-story steel-
framed skyscraper Building 7 at 5:20 on the day of the attack.
The Report contains no mention of the interview in which the
owner of Building 7 states that he and the Fire Department
decided to "pull" Building 7 -- an apparent admission of a
conspiracy to destroy the building and its contents.
The Report fails to mention the rapid removal and recycling of
the structural steel from the collapsed World Trade Center
buildings, even to make excuses for it.
The Report makes no mention of a statement by then-Mayor
Rudolph Giuliani to Peter Jennings indicating he had
foreknowledge of the collapses: "We were operating out of there
when we were told that the World Trade Center was gonna
collapse, and it did collapse before we could get out of the
building."
The Report contains no mentions of eyewitness accounts of
explosions preceding the collapse of South Towers.
The Report fails to mention that George W. Bush's brother,
Marvin Bush, and his cousin, Wirt Walker III, were principals in
the company that had the contract to provide security for the
World Trade Center, Stratesec, nor does it mention the company.
The Report makes no mention of the fact that a new lessor took
control of the World Trade Center complex just six weeks before
the attack, obtained an insurance policy covering terrorist
attacks, and successfully sued the insurance companies to obtain
twice the multi-billion-dollar value of the policy.
The Report repeats the list of 19 suspects identified by the FBI
within days of the attack, while failing to mention that six of
them reported themselves alive after the attack .
The Report fails to mention any of the reports of behavior by the
alleged hijackers before the attack that belie the official story
that they were devout Muslims on a suicide mission for Allah.
The Report fails to mention that the published passenger lists
contained no Arab names -- a fact publicized by skeptics of the
official story.
The Report fails to ask why the plane that crashed into the
Pentagon was not stopped by anti-aircraft missile batteries that
presumably ring the building.
The Report fails to mention that no credible footage of the
Pentagon attack has been made public, despite public knowledge
that the FBI seized footage of the attack from nearby businesses .
The Report does not ask why the Secret Service did not obtain air
cover for the President's motorcade from the Sarasota school to
the airport, nor for Air Force One, which took off at about 9:54,
until about 11:10.
The Report avoids mentioning several reports that government
officials and business leaders received warnings and avoided
targets of the attacks, including:
A warning by the FBI advising Attorney General John
Ashcroft to avoid flying on commercial airlines.
The report that Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel
plans the evening before the attack.
A warning to San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown to avoid
flying.
The grounding of Salman Rushdie by Scotland Yard.
The Report avoids mentioning a warning received by employees
of Odigo hours before the attack.
The Report does not mention that letters with weaponized
anthrax were sent to the two most powerful senators attempting
to slow the passage of the 9/11/01 attack-predicated USA
PATRIOT Act.
The Report states that the Commission was "chartered to prepare
a full and complete account of the circumstances surrounding
the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, including preparedness
for and the immediate response to the attacks," but fails to
mention that it makes no attempt to meet its charter.

http://911research.wtc7.net/post911/commissio...

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