Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Courier-Journal

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

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Yes and Amen

Winchester, KY

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#109580
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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>So you wish to stay in delusion just because your beliefs lead you to conclude atheism has no hopes?
Thanks for pinpointing a major reason some are blinded by faith.
Wishful thinking does not make it so.
Ironic how you call what we believe as magic then cite demonic magic for why we believe what we do.
Yours is more Magic than ours!
You think a rock stewed in a sludge, and Poof...
single celled critters appeared!
Funny, that even your car needed a Builder, but Life came from a rock!
The ONLY hope is with Christ, but you will get what you asked for!
Yes and Amen

Winchester, KY

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#109581
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Why are there no fossilized dead human babies on Mt Everest? Your god supposedly murdered all the babies yet not a single one can be found on Mt Everest.
If you wish for others to stop killing babies, maybe you should stop worshiping king baby killer (god).
Have YOU Looked??
No... I didn't think so!
Yes... God cleaned house... wait for the next cleaning!
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109582
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Nox Aeterna wrote:
<quoted text>
These institutions of higher learning are all private schools, as they receive no public funding they are able to put whatever they like in their curriculum. Also, being that they are all Ivy League schools, it's unlikely they will have many students who blindly follow without question.
I've taken religious studies classes as well, they aren't faith based classes...they examine the religion, it's doctrine, and it's evolution. They are more akin to a history class than anything else, you study the influence of religion not the religion's holy books.
WRONG, WRONG, WRONG AGAIN!!! Here's JUST two examples of MANY.

Sidney E. Frank Endowed Scholarship Fund

Established in 2004, the Sidney E. Frank Endowed Scholarship Fund gives financial assistance to selected students at Brown University. The scholarship stemmed from a $100 million gift specifically for undergraduate students, and was the largest single gift in the school's history. The scholarship is only open to U.S. citizens and legal permanent residents. Unlike many scholarship programs, students cannot apply for this opportunity. Instead, students with the greatest financial need will automatically be selected to receive awards of varying amounts.

Barry M. Goldwater Scholarship

Students at Dartmouth College can take advantage of the Barry M. Goldwater Scholarship and Excellence in Education Program. It was created by Congress to honor the former Senator and serviceman. At least 300 selected recipients will get $7,500 to cover tuition, food, room and board each year. Full-time Dartmouth students can ask the school to nominate them for the award. They must, however, meet the following criteria: be U.S. citizens, be sophomores or juniors, have at least a B grade point average and be in the top-25th percentile of their class.

Need an EXAMPLE of a NON IVY League as well?

U of PENN

Graduate Program
Overview

The graduate program in Religious Studies at the University of Pennsylvania offers unique research opportunities for students to become first class scholars, teachers and expositors in the field. Our program is situated within one of the largest and finest research universities in the country, easily accessible to other research centers along the eastern seaboard.

Michael J. Murray Memorial Scholarship

The College of Liberal and Professional Studies (LPS) at the University of Pennsylvania awards merit scholarships to a part-time student. The Michael J. Murray Memorial Scholarship is one such program, and it was created to honor the late founder of the LPS Student Advisory Board. In addition to the application, an applicant must submit a letter of recommendation and a resume. The student must be in the undergraduate program and must demonstrate a commitment to continuing education, leadership qualities and community service experience.

And do we really need to mention ALL the standard FEDERAL AID provided to students attending these schools?
They ALL partake of FEDERAL dollars!!!!!!!!!! ALL of them.

http://universitysfs.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do...

GET A CLUE, or crawl back under that rock shelter of dark age Ignorance you obvioulsy dwell beneath-- because you couldn't be more WRONG.
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109583
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Nox Aeterna wrote:
<quoted text>
I find it ironic that the letter from Jefferson that you were so kind as to quote actually supports my point and not yours. Jefferson is stating in no uncertain terms that a wall should exist between religion and government. By extension that means anything that is funded by the government, such as public education.
Perhaps you're not aware that Jefferson was an atheist, but look into it. He actually rewrote the Bible to remove all references to the supernatural, it's called the Jefferson Bible, look into that as well. Your attempt to support your own position only weakened it, it would be like me trying to support the cause for gay marriage by quoting Fred Phelps.
It supports MY point NOW, just as much as it did when I(!) first presented it!

It was writ to secure the right of religious freedom of worship-EXEMPT from GOVERNMENT interference.

And ONLY an IDIOT would even presume to conclude Jefferson, as being any sot of IGNORANT atheist--ESPECIALLY after reading a letter such as this, where obviosly the man had RESPECT OF AND FOR, the varying beliefs of OTHERS.

Probably because he was FAR more intelligent than to USE the disgustingly IGNORANT excuse of "atheism" just to try exclude himself from having a code of CIVIL ETHICS of DECENCY AND Morality.

Get it yet?

Atheism is NO EXCUSE whatsoever, NONE at all...to think that anyone is "above" having to have Ethics, Decency AND Morality in a civilized society, and to ignorantly think otherwise is on par lvel as being nothing more than being of a criminal THUG Mentality, plain and simple!!
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109584
Aug 4, 2013
 

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ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah okay, everybody knows by now that you have a THO for Semitic history. So what?
Beats the ell out of living in some dark age, thug, commieTic, slobbering rabid dogs society.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#109585
Aug 4, 2013
 

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SistaNoneYaBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
WRONG, WRONG, WRONG AGAIN!!! Here's JUST two examples of MANY.
Sidney E. Frank Endowed Scholarship Fund
Established in 2004, the Sidney E. Frank Endowed Scholarship Fund gives financial assistance to selected students at Brown University. The scholarship stemmed from a $100 million gift specifically for undergraduate students, and was the largest single gift in the school's history. The scholarship is only open to U.S. citizens and legal permanent residents. Unlike many scholarship programs, students cannot apply for this opportunity. Instead, students with the greatest financial need will automatically be selected to receive awards of varying amounts.
Barry M. Goldwater Scholarship
Students at Dartmouth College can take advantage of the Barry M. Goldwater Scholarship and Excellence in Education Program. It was created by Congress to honor the former Senator and serviceman. At least 300 selected recipients will get $7,500 to cover tuition, food, room and board each year. Full-time Dartmouth students can ask the school to nominate them for the award. They must, however, meet the following criteria: be U.S. citizens, be sophomores or juniors, have at least a B grade point average and be in the top-25th percentile of their class.
Need an EXAMPLE of a NON IVY League as well?
U of PENN
Graduate Program
Overview
The graduate program in Religious Studies at the University of Pennsylvania offers unique research opportunities for students to become first class scholars, teachers and expositors in the field. Our program is situated within one of the largest and finest research universities in the country, easily accessible to other research centers along the eastern seaboard.
Michael J. Murray Memorial Scholarship
The College of Liberal and Professional Studies (LPS) at the University of Pennsylvania awards merit scholarships to a part-time student. The Michael J. Murray Memorial Scholarship is one such program, and it was created to honor the late founder of the LPS Student Advisory Board. In addition to the application, an applicant must submit a letter of recommendation and a resume. The student must be in the undergraduate program and must demonstrate a commitment to continuing education, leadership qualities and community service experience.
And do we really need to mention ALL the standard FEDERAL AID provided to students attending these schools?
They ALL partake of FEDERAL dollars!!!!!!!!!! ALL of them.
http://universitysfs.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do...
GET A CLUE, or crawl back under that rock shelter of dark age Ignorance you obvioulsy dwell beneath-- because you couldn't be more WRONG.
College religion courses are critical in nature, not devotional. That's the key difference.

Critical religion courses in high schools would be fine and dandy if teachers understood the material well enough to tackle it and were not too drunk on Christ to actually teach it *critically*.

The purpose of the First Amendment is to prevent the state from hammering religion down your throat or preventing you from practicing your religion. It is not meant to allow you to, y'know, hammer your religion down peoples' throats.

I love how Christianity rules the nation but because people aren't allowed to proselytize to kids between 8 and 3 PM Christians are "persecuted".

"You won't let me lead the class in 'Old Rugged Cross'....PERSECUTION! The Liberal atheists have taken over!"
Yes and Amen

Winchester, KY

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#109586
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Not sure where I would find such information, but you claimed it as if you have seen some stats, so show them. The onus of evidence is upon you who claimed it.
Just one, but feel free to search for yourself, as I KNOW
You want the Truth about ALL things!

http://www.baylorisr.org/2012/04/%e2%80%9ccan...
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109587
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
Bingo.
If a religious experience is by nature personal then it cannot be a foundation for any sort of rational belief. It certainly can't be used to do any real work in the world. If nobody is talking about the same god-damned thing it's a circus.
That makes sense!!
One persons personal, certainly does NOT make for any one elses belief, rational or not.

It's amazing how some would even want to waste any time at all, thinking such would though.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#109588
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SistaNoneYaBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
It supports MY point NOW, just as much as it did when I(!) first presented it!
It was writ to secure the right of religious freedom of worship-EXEMPT from GOVERNMENT interference.
And ONLY an IDIOT would even presume to conclude Jefferson, as being any sot of IGNORANT atheist--ESPECIALLY after reading a letter such as this, where obviosly the man had RESPECT OF AND FOR, the varying beliefs of OTHERS.
Probably because he was FAR more intelligent than to USE the disgustingly IGNORANT excuse of "atheism" just to try exclude himself from having a code of CIVIL ETHICS of DECENCY AND Morality.
Get it yet?
Atheism is NO EXCUSE whatsoever, NONE at all...to think that anyone is "above" having to have Ethics, Decency AND Morality in a civilized society, and to ignorantly think otherwise is on par lvel as being nothing more than being of a criminal THUG Mentality, plain and simple!!
You do know that Thomas Jefferson cut out all the magic from the Bible and pasted the remaining bits into his own version, the Jeffersonian Bible...right? I'm not saying the man was an atheist but please don't make the ignorant mistake of saying he was anything at all like a Christian in the sense that you understand it.

He rejected the divinity of Jesus, for pete's sake.

Also, since when did atheism have anything to do with rejection of ethics? Did I miss that memo? From my reading and study on this topic it seems that atheists are very concerned with ethical questions and spend a metric f*ckton of time talking about it.

All I ever hear from Fundies is that atheists are Satanic and "god did it".

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

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#109589
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The Jefferson Bible (not the "Jeffersonian" as I posted):

"Using a razor, Jefferson cut and pasted his arrangement of selected verses from the books of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John in chronological order, mingling excerpts from one text to those of another in order to create a single narrative. Thus he begins with Luke 2 and Luke 3, then follows with Mark 1 and Matthew 3. He provides a record of which verses he selected and of the order in which he arranged them in his "Table of the Texts from the Evangelists employed in this Narrative and of the order of their arrangement".
Consistent with his naturalistic outlook and intent, most supernatural events are not included in Jefferson's heavily edited compilation. Paul K. Conkin states that "For the teachings of Jesus he concentrated on his milder admonitions (the Sermon on the Mount) and his most memorable parables. What resulted is a reasonably coherent, but at places oddly truncated, biography. If necessary to exclude the miraculous, Jefferson would cut the text even in mid-verse."[8] Historian Edwin Scott Gaustad explains, "If a moral lesson was embedded in a miracle, the lesson survived in Jeffersonian scripture, but the miracle did not. Even when this took some rather careful cutting with scissors or razor, Jefferson managed to maintain Jesus' role as a great moral teacher, not as a shaman or faith healer."[9]
Therefore The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth begins with an account of Jesusís birth without references to angels (at that time), genealogy, or prophecy. Miracles, references to the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, and Jesus' resurrection are also absent from his collection.[10]
No supernatural acts of Christ are included at all in this regard, while the few things of a supernatural nature include receiving of the Holy Spirit,[11] angels,[12] Noah's Ark and the Great Flood,[13] the Tribulation,[14] the Second Coming,[15] the resurrection of the dead,[16] a future kingdom,[17][18] and eternal life,[19] Heaven,[20] Hell[21] and punishment in everlasting fire, the Devil,[22] and the soldiers falling backwards to the ground in response to Jesus stating, "I am he."[23]
Rejecting the resurrection of Jesus, the work ends with the words: "Now, in the place where He was crucified, there was a garden; and in the garden a new sepulchre, wherein was never man yet laid. There laid they Jesus. And rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre, and departed." These words correspond to the ending of John 19 in the Bible."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson_Bible#...
Yes and Amen

Winchester, KY

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#109590
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Out of Area wrote:
"Your children will see what you're all about by what you live rather than what you say."
Wrong there!
I guess you don't have kids...
They're lil see-n-says...
Repeat everything you say!
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109591
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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>Are you suggesting, that when God told Noah, He was going to clean house...
He left a few stragglers???
Many civilizations recorded a Flood story, and Noah's kids
didn't sit around the house late in years, as they do now!
I just don't think they had the same advanced technological abilities to see "everywhere", as we do now.

I don't dispute great floods.

I believe they happened....there's too much evidence PROVING they did.
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109592
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
College religion courses are critical in nature, not devotional. That's the key difference.
Critical religion courses in high schools would be fine and dandy if teachers understood the material well enough to tackle it and were not too drunk on Christ to actually teach it *critically*.
The purpose of the First Amendment is to prevent the state from hammering religion down your throat or preventing you from practicing your religion. It is not meant to allow you to, y'know, hammer your religion down peoples' throats.
I love how Christianity rules the nation but because people aren't allowed to proselytize to kids between 8 and 3 PM Christians are "persecuted".
"You won't let me lead the class in 'Old Rugged Cross'....PERSECUTION! The Liberal atheists have taken over!"
Between 8 and 3 PM, they are learning the secular subject.

HOWEVER should a few choose to sit and quietly discuss OTHER subjects in a study hall, INCLUDING what ever books they might be discussing-- not harming themselves or others--leave them kids alone!!

and they all got along JUST fine..of a learned respect OF and For others beliefs and differences, humanely and decently (usually) bless their little hearts.
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109593
Aug 4, 2013
 

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Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
You do know that Thomas Jefferson cut out all the magic from the Bible and pasted the remaining bits into his own version, the Jeffersonian Bible...right? I'm not saying the man was an atheist but please don't make the ignorant mistake of saying he was anything at all like a Christian in the sense that you understand it.
He rejected the divinity of Jesus, for pete's sake.
Also, since when did atheism have anything to do with rejection of ethics? Did I miss that memo? From my reading and study on this topic it seems that atheists are very concerned with ethical questions and spend a metric f*ckton of time talking about it.
All I ever hear from Fundies is that atheists are Satanic and "god did it".
From the actions of some on here-they have absolutely NO regard OR respect for the beliefs of others, and THAT IGNORANCE is NO excuse either-NO matter the race, CREED or color.

(and anyone that's read any US history realizes what a grand plantation lord Jefferson was as well. SO there.)
SistaNoneYaBiz

Somerset, KY

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#109594
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Yiago wrote:
The Jefferson Bible (not the "Jeffersonian" as I posted):
"Using a razor, Jefferson cut and pasted his arrangement of selected verses from the books of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John in chronological order, mingling excerpts from one text to those of another in order to create a single narrative. Thus he begins with Luke 2 and Luke 3, then follows with Mark 1 and Matthew 3. He provides a record of which verses he selected and of the order in which he arranged them in his "Table of the Texts from the Evangelists employed in this Narrative and of the order of their arrangement".
Consistent with his naturalistic outlook and intent, most supernatural events are not included in Jefferson's heavily edited compilation. Paul K. Conkin states that "For the teachings of Jesus he concentrated on his milder admonitions (the Sermon on the Mount) and his most memorable parables. What resulted is a reasonably coherent, but at places oddly truncated, biography. If necessary to exclude the miraculous, Jefferson would cut the text even in mid-verse."[8] Historian Edwin Scott Gaustad explains, "If a moral lesson was embedded in a miracle, the lesson survived in Jeffersonian scripture, but the miracle did not. Even when this took some rather careful cutting with scissors or razor, Jefferson managed to maintain Jesus' role as a great moral teacher, not as a shaman or faith healer."[9]
Therefore The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth begins with an account of Jesusís birth without references to angels (at that time), genealogy, or prophecy. Miracles, references to the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, and Jesus' resurrection are also absent from his collection.[10]
No supernatural acts of Christ are included at all in this regard, while the few things of a supernatural nature include receiving of the Holy Spirit,[11] angels,[12] Noah's Ark and the Great Flood,[13] the Tribulation,[14] the Second Coming,[15] the resurrection of the dead,[16] a future kingdom,[17][18] and eternal life,[19] Heaven,[20] Hell[21] and punishment in everlasting fire, the Devil,[22] and the soldiers falling backwards to the ground in response to Jesus stating, "I am he."[23]
Rejecting the resurrection of Jesus, the work ends with the words: "Now, in the place where He was crucified, there was a garden; and in the garden a new sepulchre, wherein was never man yet laid. There laid they Jesus. And rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre, and departed." These words correspond to the ending of John 19 in the Bible."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson_Bible#...
Another One mans opinion-ONLY.

The world is FULL of that!

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

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#109595
Aug 4, 2013
 

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SistaNoneYaBiz wrote:
<quoted text>
Beats the ell out of living in some dark age, thug, commieTic, slobbering rabid dogs society.
yeah, well sorry for your reality. Que sera sera.

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

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Yes and Amen wrote:
<quoted text>I Love it when Bob Beckle says something truly right...
And two seconds later....
What IF your dating methods were bunk... what would that
do to your theories???
Don't give me that "Many ways of dating" stuff...
Be honest... What IF?
What ifs are part of the delusion process... There are dozens of different was of dating stuff... We test that dating methods are correct, The Basic Science used in the assorted dating methods is well understood and applies to many other scientific principles... And those assorted methods and other fields using those scientific principles verify themselves everyday in assorted experiments in labs across the world and processes used in assorted manufacturing process across the globe... If Carbon dating was bunk, which is only used for dating to around 50,000 years then your computer would not work and you would not have flat screen TV's...

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I haven't failed to answer anything that I am aware of. I don't always answer insults because they aren't questions.
I have presented logic within the Christian Faith. Once you can accept that there is a God and that Jesus Christ is His Son, my logic makes sense. But since I have readily admitted that faith is required to believe in God, you can't make it past that first step to begin to understand the rest of my logic. Milk before meat
Seeing as how the subject was faith in god in general, I am not sure why you act as if I am off topic. Again it is you who does not seem to be able to keep up with the subject.
No, I cannot get past the idea faith is a virtue. I cannot just dive in and believe in a god that has absolutely zero evidence and looks to be extremely conflicted and immoral. I know all this insults you, so sugar coating is not going to likely help anyway.
I see faith as a weakness, not a virtue.
Is faithfully believing god wants you to fly a plane into a building a virtue or a weakness in your eyes? I see it as a weakness.
Is discriminating upon others due to your religious beliefs a virtue or a weakness in your eyes? I see it as a weakness, and this is why I oppose your beliefs.
This has everything to do with you not being able to defend your faith with logical reasoning.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#109599
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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm talking about land dwelling creatures.
Then say the words, because I cannot read your thoughts. But the answer has already been given by others and I already. Do you not accept those answers as logical? If not, why not? What about those answers defies logic? Do you dispute their was a mass extinction? Do you dispute there was a large difference in the amount of oxygen then? Do you dispute there was a void that mammals were better adapted to fill? Do you dispute there were animals around hundreds of millions of years ago?
Sometimes evolution looks like the luck of the draw, and in some respects it might be. Animals go extinct quite often. Humans might be extinct within a few thousand years. Maybe it will be a hundred thousand years from now. If that is the end of humans, we will have existed for less time than many dinosaurs. If that is the end, we will have existed for less time than some other hominids.

I know it is instinctive to think all was built for us, but in the history of earth, humans are yet but a blip in time.
One could say the earth looks more like it was built for cockroaches, or ants. Ants would likely say this, but they do not have such an imagination.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

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#109600
Aug 4, 2013
 

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do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Just telling you what the Bible said. This was David's only sin
Yes, and the bible claims many things that are highly unlikely. But even if it were so, it still does not make David a good, moral man. What he did was premeditated murder. I do not consider murderers, moral people. Maybe you have lower standards. Maybe god has lower standards. I guess my standards are higher than gods. I do not forgive David for murdering. To put such a person on a pedestal is sending a poor message. It sends the message that one can murder and yet be off the hook. David should have been put in prison for his deeds. But the god you worship gave him a pass after murdering the innocent child of his. Yet another poor moral message. Punish the person who committed the crime, not his family. What kind of screwed up lesson is this?
I am sure you would never consciously teach your kids to punish a persons family for the crimes of one member.Yet if you teach the David story, that is just what you are doing.

This is why I have no faith in the bible or your god.

These are not the sort of stories I want taught to my kids. It is a poor moral message.

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