Obama's Death of Coal Production

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Save Us

Johnson City, TN

#1 Apr 2, 2012
Faced with rising gas prices, President Obama recently outlined what he calls an “all-of-the-above” energy policy “that develops every available source of American energy - oil, gas, wind, solar, nuclear, biofuels and more.” You may notice something missing there - coal, America’s most abundant and affordable fuel source. The administration’s “all of the above” strategy is anything but.

This shouldn’t be surprising. In 2008, then-candidate Barack Obama said that as president, he would pursue a “cap-and-trade” program to make electricity rates “necessarily skyrocket” and “bankrupt” builders of new coal power plants. He has never recanted those words.

Yet America runs on coal. We have the world’s largest coal reserves - we’re the Saudi Arabia of coal. Coal fuels nearly 40 percent of U.S. electric power generation. New coal plants typically have lower overall costs per megawatt hour than new wind, solar and nuclear power. And all those shiny new electric cars the president is so fond of run primarily on electricity from coal.

Mr. Obama’s cap-and-trade program crashed on a shoal of popular hostility. Recognizing that, as he put it, he had to find another way of “skinning the cat,” the president decided to circumvent Congress by directing regulatory agencies to implement his green agenda.

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) found a perfect proxy for coal - the mercury that only coal-fired power plants emit. In December, the EPA issued its 2011 Mercury and Air Toxics Standards (MATS) rule, which imposes stringent new controls on power-plant emissions of mercury, acid gases and other hazardous air pollutants (HAPs). According to the EPA, utilities will have to spend $9.6 billion in 2016 alone to comply.

This enormous cost will increase everyone’s power bills. That might make sense if the pollutants subject to the rule posed significant risks to public health. They don’t. The rule is aimed primarily at mercury emissions, but mercury is not a health hazard in the atmosphere. Negative health effects can result when it gets into water and accumulates in the bodies of fish.

Since: Mar 12

United States

#2 Apr 2, 2012
Save Us wrote:
Faced with rising gas prices, President Obama recently outlined what he calls an “all-of-the-above” energy policy “that develops every available source of American energy - oil, gas, wind, solar, nuclear, biofuels and more.” You may notice something missing there - coal, America’s most abundant and affordable fuel source. The administration’s “all of the above” strategy is anything but.
This shouldn’t be surprising. In 2008, then-candidate Barack Obama said that as president, he would pursue a “cap-and-trade” program to make electricity rates “necessarily skyrocket” and “bankrupt” builders of new coal power plants. He has never recanted those words.
Yet America runs on coal. We have the world’s largest coal reserves - we’re the Saudi Arabia of coal. Coal fuels nearly 40 percent of U.S. electric power generation. New coal plants typically have lower overall costs per megawatt hour than new wind, solar and nuclear power. And all those shiny new electric cars the president is so fond of run primarily on electricity from coal.
Mr. Obama’s cap-and-trade program crashed on a shoal of popular hostility. Recognizing that, as he put it, he had to find another way of “skinning the cat,” the president decided to circumvent Congress by directing regulatory agencies to implement his green agenda.
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) found a perfect proxy for coal - the mercury that only coal-fired power plants emit. In December, the EPA issued its 2011 Mercury and Air Toxics Standards (MATS) rule, which imposes stringent new controls on power-plant emissions of mercury, acid gases and other hazardous air pollutants (HAPs). According to the EPA, utilities will have to spend $9.6 billion in 2016 alone to comply.
This enormous cost will increase everyone’s power bills. That might make sense if the pollutants subject to the rule posed significant risks to public health. They don’t. The rule is aimed primarily at mercury emissions, but mercury is not a health hazard in the atmosphere. Negative health effects can result when it gets into water and accumulates in the bodies of fish.
coal is carbon - carbon in atmosphere causes global warming-notice the weather lately?
John

United States

#3 Apr 3, 2012
azor wrote:
<quoted text>coal is carbon - carbon in atmosphere causes global warming-notice the weather lately?
Wrong again dummy,there is no proof to this left wing idiocy,most scientists dispute this theory.Solar energy from the sun is also a cause to warming of the earths surface and is currently at a very high level.Keep drinking the kool aid,this will lead to more brain damage,AND TRUST ME YOU CAN'T AFFORD MUCH MORE.

Since: Mar 12

United States

#4 Apr 3, 2012
John wrote:
<quoted text>Wrong again dummy,there is no proof to this left wing idiocy,most scientists dispute this theory.Solar energy from the sun is also a cause to warming of the earths surface and is currently at a very high level.Keep drinking the kool aid,this will lead to more brain damage,AND TRUST ME YOU CAN'T AFFORD MUCH MORE.
you have it backwards john - MOST SCIENTISTS do NOT dispute this FACT - the sun is a constant - the CARBON IN THE ATMOSPHERE is the biggest problem - it raises the greenhouse effect; and unlike a greenhouse we can't open a window to release it -oh well - some people will never GET IT - but keep trying; you may understand someday; if you don't die from heatstroke .

“Internet Famous”

Since: Jun 09

Chicago, IL

#5 Apr 3, 2012
John wrote:
<quoted text>Wrong again dummy,there is no proof to this left wing idiocy,most scientists dispute this theory.Solar energy from the sun is also a cause to warming of the earths surface and is currently at a very high level.Keep drinking the kool aid,this will lead to more brain damage,AND TRUST ME YOU CAN'T AFFORD MUCH MORE.
You couldn't be more wrong.
Driver

Boynton Beach, FL

#6 Apr 3, 2012
stink you an azor couldn't be more wrong THE SUN makes up more than 98.9% of the matter in our solar system. In another word IT'S the BIG BOY ON THE BLOCK. It does contribute to global warming more than anything man can ever do. Besides Mount st helens put more carbon in the atmosphere within 15 minutes of eruption than man kind has done since he was on the surface of the earth.

azor your an idiot what the hell do you think solar flares are! The sun IS NOT A CONSTANT!
Two complete dumbasses people think for yourself for once!

Since: Mar 12

United States

#7 Apr 3, 2012
Driver wrote:
stink you an azor couldn't be more wrong THE SUN makes up more than 98.9% of the matter in our solar system. In another word IT'S the BIG BOY ON THE BLOCK. It does contribute to global warming more than anything man can ever do. Besides Mount st helens put more carbon in the atmosphere within 15 minutes of eruption than man kind has done since he was on the surface of the earth.
azor your an idiot what the hell do you think solar flares are! The sun IS NOT A CONSTANT!
Two complete dumbasses people think for yourself for once!
we can't do a thing about the heat from the sun - just thank God for it - if you don't think the planet is heating up ; just study glacial melting for instance. The evidence is there.
Driver

Boynton Beach, FL

#8 Apr 3, 2012
azor wrote:
<quoted text>we can't do a thing about the heat from the sun - just thank God for it - if you don't think the planet is heating up ; just study glacial melting for instance. The evidence is there.
Like I said you're a dumbass, I never said the planet wasn't heating up. I said mankind couldn't do anything about it one way or the other, dipshit.
John

Fort Lauderdale, FL

#9 Apr 4, 2012
Lee County Thinker wrote:
<quoted text>
You couldn't be more wrong.
You should change your monicker to something else besides thinker,do not listen to this carbon based theory on Global warming,the larger % of scientists say the warming temps are a result of the sun and the core of our planet and the shifting of the earths plates,you are like the other morons,you hear a lie enough you start to beleive it as fact.

Since: Mar 12

United States

#10 Apr 4, 2012
John wrote:
<quoted text>You should change your monicker to something else besides thinker,do not listen to this carbon based theory on Global warming,the larger % of scientists say the warming temps are a result of the sun and the core of our planet and the shifting of the earths plates,you are like the other morons,you hear a lie enough you start to beleive it as fact.
still wrong john. i know it's hard ; but keep trying to think for yourself.
John

United States

#11 Apr 5, 2012
azor wrote:
<quoted text>still wrong john. i know it's hard ; but keep trying to think for yourself.
You are a complete ignorant waste of skin.How is that?
Wow

Campbellsville, KY

#12 Apr 5, 2012
Turn off your lights and air and heat and see how it feels without coal.

Since: Mar 12

United States

#13 Apr 6, 2012
Driver wrote:
stink you an azor couldn't be more wrong THE SUN makes up more than 98.9% of the matter in our solar system. In another word IT'S the BIG BOY ON THE BLOCK. It does contribute to global warming more than anything man can ever do. Besides Mount st helens put more carbon in the atmosphere within 15 minutes of eruption than man kind has done since he was on the surface of the earth.
azor your an idiot what the hell do you think solar flares are! The sun IS NOT A CONSTANT!
Two complete dumbasses people think for yourself for once!
just thinking " driver " at the present rate of ice melt ; boynton beach will be underwater in 30 yrs. too bad; i like that beach. don't know where you get your info; but totally false; research it for yourself.
John

Orlando, FL

#14 Apr 7, 2012
azor wrote:
<quoted text> just thinking " driver " at the present rate of ice melt ; boynton beach will be underwater in 30 yrs. too bad; i like that beach. don't know where you get your info; but totally false; research it for yourself.
Hey Stupid,what is the present rate of ice melt?How long before the flooding begins?Please enlighten us.
Rats A_ _

Knoxville, TN

#15 Apr 7, 2012
Who gives a Rats A$$ I am to busy trying to DIG out a living to worry about 100 years from now.
Ask yourself this Who is getting rich off the carbon credits ( another thing you can't even see or touch )?
It's all BS.
Besides, if the climate warms up they won't need to burn as much coal.
The government has it's hands in way to many things and thinks they know what I need,what I need to do and how I need to live.
Washington is run by millionaire lawyers and better than you educated professors.
We need a working man in the white house.
Driver

Boynton Beach, FL

#16 Apr 7, 2012
No azor; Like I said you're the idiot what I said is true and here is the facts from the university of Indiana. You could easily find these anywhere with a simple search on goggle

Mass Distribution in the Solar System
The Sun contains 99.85% of all the matter in the Solar System. The planets, which condensed out of the same disk of material that formed the Sun, contain only 0.135% of the mass of the solar system. Jupiter contains more than twice the matter of all the other planets combined. Satellites of the planets, comets, asteroids, meteoroids, and the interplanetary medium constitute the remaining 0.015%. The following table is a list of the mass distribution within our Solar System.

Sun: 99.85%
Planets: 0.135%
Comets: 0.01%?
Satellites: 0.00005%
Minor Planets: 0.0000002%?
Meteoroids: 0.0000001%?
Interplanetary Medium: 0.0000001%?

Here's the link azor "the algore idiot"

JD
Driver

Boynton Beach, FL

#17 Apr 7, 2012
Oh! an the stinker always runs from the "Driver" because all he can do is spew algoreisms and I crush'em with facts. stink has never had an original thought or an opinion in the several years I have opposed him, it's the truth!

JD

“Internet Famous”

Since: Jun 09

Chicago, IL

#18 Apr 8, 2012
John wrote:
<quoted text>You should change your monicker to something else besides thinker,do not listen to this carbon based theory on Global warming,the larger % of scientists say the warming temps are a result of the sun and the core of our planet and the shifting of the earths plates,you are like the other morons,you hear a lie enough you start to beleive it as fact.
There is a very small number of scientists who are climate change deniers and that number is shrinking every day. If you think I'm wrong, show me some evidence.

“Internet Famous”

Since: Jun 09

Chicago, IL

#19 Apr 8, 2012
Driver wrote:
Oh! an the stinker always runs from the "Driver" because all he can do is spew algoreisms and I crush'em with facts. stink has never had an original thought or an opinion in the several years I have opposed him, it's the truth!
JD
I've never run from anything old man. Every time I destroy you and you Fox talking points, you start crying like a little bitch. Thats why I was banned from the other board.

“Internet Famous”

Since: Jun 09

Chicago, IL

#20 Apr 8, 2012
Ice age data bolsters greenhouse gas, warming link

By SETH BORENSTEIN | Associated Press

http://news.yahoo.com/ice-age-data-b...171754...

WASHINGTON (AP)— The dramatic temperature increases that thawed the last ice age followed spikes in carbon dioxide levels in the air, a new study finds. Researchers say that further strengthens the scientific case explaining current man-made global warming.

In the new study, scientists show the atmospheric concentration of that heat-trapping greenhouse gas jumped more than 40 percent. Then global temperatures went up about 6 degrees Fahrenheit (3.5 degrees Celsius).

What is remarkable is that when the two are plotted they rise, plateau and rise again in a striking similar way with a slight lag. The warming over 6,000 years follows the greenhouse gas increase, just as scientific theory has long held.

This is important because, until this study, the two curves weren't quite so in sync. At some points, it seemed that the temperatures warmed before the carbon dioxide levels increased, something that climate skeptics seized upon.

How could carbon dioxide cause warming if the temperatures warmed first, argue skeptics, who are in the scientific minority.

Earlier studies had looked at carbon dioxide levels and temperature readings from Antarctica, not the entire world. A study published Wednesday in the journal Nature estimated global temperatures using 80 different proxies — ice and mud samples from dozens of places around the world — and found that globally, temperatures clearly went up only after carbon dioxide jumped.

"You end up with something that looks remarkably similar to the pattern of rising carbon dioxide through time," study lead author Jeremy Shankun of Harvard University said. "This, to me, seems like pretty powerful proof of theory of the connection between greenhouse gases and global warming."

There are two main sources of carbon dioxide, the chief greenhouse gas. The natural source comes mostly from dead plants and animals and that amplified the ice age thaw. In modern day, emissions from burning coal, oil and other fossil fuels add greatly to that natural carbon dioxide.

The ice age warming in Antarctica still appears to come before the carbon dioxide increases, which are calculated using an 800,000 year old Antarctic ice core, but there's good reason, Shankun said.

Temperature records and other ocean data paint a complicated picture of just how the last ice age thawed. It's almost like a Rube Goldberg machine, with one step leading to another and another. When the last ice age peaked about 25,000 years ago, the ice sheet extended to Iowa and New York City, Shankun said.
The ice sheet was actually so large that it was unstable, said study co-author Peter Clark of Oregon State University.

The initial trigger to the melt: A small and predictable wobble in Earth's orbit around the sun. That tiny wobble meant a tilt toward the sun that brought more sunlight in the Northern Hemisphere, causing ice sheets to melt and sending whopping levels of fresh water into the world's oceans.

That caused the global circulation of the oceans to stop, which in turn warmed the southern oceans, melting southern ice sheets over areas where more of the world's carbon dioxide is trapped, Shankun said.

That released massive amounts of the greenhouse gas, which then amplified the global temperature spike, Shankun said.

By 11,000 years ago, the ice age was history and greenhouse gas and temperature levels had stabilized. That changed with the industrial age and the increased use of fossil fuels.

Carbon dioxide levels have jumped roughly the same amount in the last century as they did over 6,000 years to get out of the ice age, Shankun said.

Penn State University professor Richard Alley and others called this a significant advance in studies about past climate change and carbon dioxide, saying "this may be of help in explaining things out in the sound-bite world."

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