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Glorya

Mcdonough, GA

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#5133
Mar 25, 2013
 
posts^
jeb stuart

Savannah, GA

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#5134
Mar 25, 2013
 
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
The problem with the Progessive agenda (in my opinion) is that on paper, it can sound very good and reasonable.(I am talking about how current Progressives describe it, not as explained so well in the posts quoting the Heritage article.) How do you argue with helping people in need, how do you argue that everyone should have a house of their own (the housing crisis was a consequence of Democrat policies regardless of how people try to blame it on Bush), everyone should have a gold standard health plan, everyone should have free child care, everyone should have a college education - people should have all of these things - whether OR NOT they can afford it. Sure, in a perfect world, all the above would be great. But this isn't a perfect world, it is a world that follows certain undeniable realities. All of the above items cost money and if the individuals can't afford it, but our government is going to give it to them, SOMEONE must pay for it. And the current system is unsustainable. When 35% of the population receives some form of means tested government aid, as opposed to the 47% that receives a government check of any kind, our economy is in danger. I am a big proponent of "charity begins at home" in the thought that local communities are in a much better situation to help their neighbors. For being a small city, Cartersville has an amazing number of local organizations to help those in need and with much more efficiency than any government program.
i'd not dare to argue with you about that.but wars cost a bunch of money,too.and not nearly as many people seem to worry about that.btw,whwre did you get your info about Cyprus? I had to go to the ny times to even read about it(I don't like watchin' either fox or cnn.they are a country of about one million-do you really think that are really relevant to our current situation?

Since: Jul 12

Douglasville, GA

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#5135
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Progressives wrote:
All of the above posts pretty much describes the progressives of today.
It took me forever to read it as it was pretty windy, more like a first chapter in a book. But well said and hit the nail on the head. A good history lesson for those of us that care. Thanks.

Since: Jul 12

Douglasville, GA

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#5136
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Almost nothing asserted in the post above is at all accurate.
This is a classic example of a "Straw Man" argument.
That's where you create an opponent, unfairly and inaccurately imbue in that opponent all sorts of evil traits, then attack the Straw Man claiming he has all those evil traits.
Can't wait to see documentation supporting all those inaccurate assertions about Progressives.
But, don't hold your breath - since none of it's true - that documentation just ain't gonna show.
A statement that I pretty much expected from you. Whats the
matter with you, can't stand the light of day? Progressives always hate the truth and do anything they can to distort it.
Bored

Dahlonega, GA

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#5137
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Bigdave1 wrote:
<quoted text>
A statement that I pretty much expected from you. Whats the
matter with you, can't stand the light of day? Progressives always hate the truth and do anything they can to distort it.
He's a progressive which equals Boring.
Informed Opinion

Cape Coral, FL

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#5138
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Bigdave1 wrote:
<quoted text>A statement that I pretty much expected from you. Whats the
matter with you, can't stand the light of day? Progressives always hate the truth and do anything they can to distort it.
Still waiting for that documentation.

Otherwise it's simply creating a Straw Man and attacking him. That tactic that gets you an "F" in high school debate class, and as a result not persuasive at all.

It always comes back to those pesky facts, and not including facts simply demonstrates none exist to support the argument.

Since: Nov 12

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#5139
Mar 25, 2013
 
jeb stuart wrote:
<quoted text>i'd not dare to argue with you about that.but wars cost a bunch of money,too.and not nearly as many people seem to worry about that.btw,whwre did you get your info about Cyprus? I had to go to the ny times to even read about it(I don't like watchin' either fox or cnn.they are a country of about one million-do you really think that are really relevant to our current situation?
Some are looking at Cyprus as the first domino to fall. Spain and Italy have reportedly also looked at seizing portions of bank deposits to alleviate their own economic problems. So now some are predicting possible runs on banks in those countries by people trying to prevent their savings being confiscated. And the Obama administration has floated the idea of taking over the 401K systems. 401K's are a huge amount of money that the Dems would love to get their hands on. Currently, all they are talking about is mandating employers who don't offer 401ks having to offer a government program 401k -(again, this is all being proposed only)- but given the nationalization of healthcare, is it really such a stretch to presume that if such a government 401k program were established that they would try and make everyone take part in that system rather than private sector 401k's?
jeb stuart

Savannah, GA

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#5140
Mar 25, 2013
 
Bigdave1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Probably not, but trying to down play the facts and trying to belittle me are not changing a thing. So are you a Progressive?
no dave, I was just tryin' to play on your sense of humor.i respect you and would not belittle you.
Progressives

Dahlonega, GA

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#5141
Mar 25, 2013
 
Here's an informative link from the same website.

http://www.heritage.org/initiatives/first-pri...

Since: Nov 12

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#5142
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Still waiting for that documentation.
Otherwise it's simply creating a Straw Man and attacking him. That tactic that gets you an "F" in high school debate class, and as a result not persuasive at all.
It always comes back to those pesky facts, and not including facts simply demonstrates none exist to support the argument.
Still waiting for you to point out any inaccuracies. And are you denying the quotes from leading Progressives are actual quotes? The posts themselves contained documentation, your claiming the documentation isn't there doesn't make it so. So again, show us inaccuracies, otherwise you are continuing to use the Straw Man you are falsely accusing the posts of employing.
jeb stuart

Savannah, GA

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#5143
Mar 25, 2013
 
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
My contention would be that they did. If you are basing this solely on how long it took to finally abolish slavery, I would have to agree that it took far too long.
not just that,but that any party,gov't,etc. needs to be willing and and should accept change(so long as it is a benefit to the majority)btw,i have never seen a progressive on a ballot).
jeb stuart

Savannah, GA

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#5144
Mar 25, 2013
 
jeb stuart wrote:
<quoted text>not just that,but that any party,gov't,etc. needs to be willing and and should accept change(so long as it is a benefit to the majority)btw,i have never seen a progressive on a ballot).
sorry,but I should said 'so long as it benefits the majority'.

Since: Jul 12

Douglasville, GA

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#5145
Mar 25, 2013
 
jeb stuart wrote:
<quoted text>no dave, I was just tryin' to play on your sense of humor.i respect you and would not belittle you.
O.K. You can if you want to, as many others have done. I am used to it and I am also thick skinned up to a certain point. I do have my limits where I draw the line.

Since: Nov 08

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#5146
Mar 25, 2013
 
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Almost nothing asserted in the post above is at all accurate.
This is a classic example of a "Straw Man" argument.
That's where you create an opponent, unfairly and inaccurately imbue in that opponent all sorts of evil traits, then attack the Straw Man claiming he has all those evil traits.
Can't wait to see documentation supporting all those inaccurate assertions about Progressives.
But, don't hold your breath - since none of it's true - that documentation just ain't gonna show.
Your third sentence pretty much describes EXACLY what you extreme libs/progressives do on a daily basis on Topix. Funny how that shoe doesn't feel so good when it's on the other foot.
Man in Plaid

Opelika, AL

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#5148
Mar 25, 2013
 

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jeb stuart wrote:
<quoted text>wow! does this mean that a the magazine "progressive farmer"(which really came into prominence in the 1930's-altho it was first published in the 1880's)was really a communist-inspired magazine?
Not necessarily. This magazine arose from Southern populism, which became a factor in politics in the last twenty-five years of the nineteenth century. At least in its early years, The Progressive Farmer, and other magazines of its kind, had a strong political bent. While the Southern populists were not embraced by Progressives such as Theodore Roosevelt, they had similar views on politics and economics. They typically supported high taxes on corporations and highly profitable businesses, viewed government spending as a form of economic stimulation, believed in the necessity of big government and a powerful executive branch, and highly favored wealth redistribution.

One of the major aspects of populism that has a clear Marxist aspect was the widespread desire for the federal government to seize control of all American railways and rail transportation. Another aspect of it that leads back to my earlier post was the dependence of political figures upon an underclass (often referred to as the "hick vote") to support their agendas. Think Huey Long, who was a standard-bearer for wealth redistribution and entitlement-based populist demagoguery.

While some incentives that populist figures such as Long pushed through can work, they depend heavily on government spending. Ultimately, the money needed to fund the entitlements that they depend on to secure the votes of the "poor" will far outstrip tax dollars coming in to the government coffers. Unfortunately for the people, those who enact such legislation will likely be out of office when this problem fully arises. As a result, these leaders leave the citizenry to deal with the devastating consequences of their desire to gain and keep power at the expense of his/her constituents.

Bear in mind when discussing the Populist party and Progressive politics in the US that the period from 1880 through the 1930s was rife with Marxist thought. Thus, if we look to history, we find that both of these terms (populist and progressive) are charged with a strong current of left wing ideology.

Since: Nov 08

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#5149
Mar 25, 2013
 
domino wrote:
<quoted text>
Even though I totally agree with all that you and Aggie say, I usually only read and not post. I have strong beliefs about politics, religion,abortions and same-sex marriage. but I will keep those to myself. However, being from an all military family, I do not like anyone playing on words and thinking they know it all. I personally love the military and we were all George Bush fans. if some of these people knew what my family knows, they too would like George Bush. Wish I could elaborate, but I can't.
Thank you, domino. Those who are directly connected ALWAYS hold incredibly more "weight" than some uninformed, low information self-serving blow hard with an ax to grind.

Since: Jan 10

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#5150
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Bored wrote:
<quoted text>
He's a progressive which equals Boring.
+1

It also means clueless and uneducated...

Since: Jan 10

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#5151
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
Some are looking at Cyprus as the first domino to fall. Spain and Italy have reportedly also looked at seizing portions of bank deposits to alleviate their own economic problems. So now some are predicting possible runs on banks in those countries by people trying to prevent their savings being confiscated. And the Obama administration has floated the idea of taking over the 401K systems. 401K's are a huge amount of money that the Dems would love to get their hands on. Currently, all they are talking about is mandating employers who don't offer 401ks having to offer a government program 401k -(again, this is all being proposed only)- but given the nationalization of healthcare, is it really such a stretch to presume that if such a government 401k program were established that they would try and make everyone take part in that system rather than private sector 401k's?
If memory serves correct (it USUALLY does when referring to tax issues) the idea of "confiscating" $ from retirement plans was first discussed by Slick Willie...

I believe the rationale was that the "evil rich" had retirement plans and it "wasn't fair" that others didn't. Never mind the fact that some of us that weren't rich put money into retirement plans (planning for the long term) when it would have made life quite a it easier, financially, if we didn't...
jeb stuart

Savannah, GA

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#5152
Mar 25, 2013
 

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Bigdave1 wrote:
<quoted text> O.K. You can if you want to, as many others have done. I am used to it and I am also thick skinned up to a certain point. I do have my limits where I draw the line.
what are you talkin' about,dave? I just said that I was kiddin' ya about your sense o humor(dry,or lack of).man, do y'all ever ease off?good grief!!y'know it's not like we are deciding national policies here.

Since: Nov 12

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#5153
Mar 25, 2013
 
jeb stuart wrote:
<quoted text>not just that,but that any party,gov't,etc. needs to be willing and and should accept change(so long as it is a benefit to the majority)btw,i have never seen a progressive on a ballot).
About accepting change that is a benefit to the majority, that actually is the rub. What a liberal would see as a benefit to the majority, a conservative may see as a detriment to that same majority. While a sincere liberal (NOT a politician currying favor) may see more government assistance as a good and moral thing to do, a conservative may see it as simply entrapping people in a state of dependency from which it is difficult to escape. Welfare reform that Clinton was forced into by the newly Republican controlled Congress was a good thing that got many people off the welfare roles, but most Liberals called it heartless. Of course, now Clinton claims credit for the success. I will disagree vehemently with a liberal "civilian" while still recognizing the sincerity of their position in believing that what they think is the way to help people is valid. But when it comes to liberal politicians, that presumption of sincere intent is drowned out by their self serving hypocrisy.(example: John Kerry mooring his yacht in Rhode Island to avoid $500,000 in Massachussett's taxes)

And you're right, you won't see Progressive on the ballot. You will find few liberal (as defined by their previous self definitions) politicians calling themselves liberal anymore, progressive is the new term they use to avoid the negative connotations of "liberal."

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