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Anonymous

Arlington, TX

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#479
May 23, 2013
 

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The below is bull shit!!!!!!!

jeff wrote:

Come on guys, serious answers please, quiet your childish instincts! Who's in?
I have found the right-wing article posted earlier "interesting." Right-wingers question sources used by progressives, so I did what I always do before reading a book or article....I do a search of the author writing and/or organization publishing it.

Let Freedom Ring, Inc., the organization that published the article right-wingers on here are fauning over, is yet another neo-con "think tank" funded by evangelical loon John Templeton, Jr. from his Wall Street tycoon daddy's Templeton Foundation. Let Freeedom ring and/or Templeton Foundation has in the past supported "intellegent design," the war in Iraq, elimination of Social Security and other hair-brained neo-con causes.

I can't even begin to point out the factual errors in the article. Most are slipped past the "low information" right-wing reader using the usual right-wing handstands of telling half-truths, innuendo and "forgetting" to mention important details.

wishing to actually LEARN about the recent financial crisis should start at the beginning. I recommend John Kenneth Galbraith's since 1954.

One can actually exchange 1920s dates for 2000s and the story is pretty much the same. Same right-wiThose "The Great Crash of 1929." It is a classic that has been in print ng rationalizations, excuses, crackpot economic theories, and social Darwinism that got us into the present mess.
Sunrise

Arlington, TX

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#480
May 24, 2013
 

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PANTSONFIRE wrote:
<quoted text>
I have found the right-wing article posted earlier "interesting." Right-wingers question sources used by progressives, so I did what I always do before reading a book or article....I do a search of the author writing and/or organization publishing it.
Let Freedom Ring, Inc., the organization that published the article right-wingers on here are fauning over, is yet another neo-con "think tank" funded by evangelical loon John Templeton, Jr. from his Wall Street tycoon daddy's Templeton Foundation. Let Freeedom ring and/or Templeton Foundation has in the past supported "intellegent design," the war in Iraq, elimination of Social Security and other hair-brained neo-con causes.
Nice try. You did a search of the author and organization looking for anything negative and that is all you came up with.
PANTSONFIRE wrote:
I can't even begin to point out the factual errors in the article. Most are slipped past the "low information" right-wing reader using the usual right-wing handstands of telling half-truths, innuendo and "forgetting" to mention important details.
Which means you have not factual errors to point out.
PANTSONFIRE wrote:
Those wishing to actually LEARN about the recent financial crisis should start at the beginning. I recommend John Kenneth Galbraith's "The Great Crash of 1929." It is a classic that has been in print since 1954.
You do realize the information in the book is just another man's opinion, don't you?
PANTSONFIRE wrote:
One can actually exchange 1920s dates for 2000s and the story is pretty much the same. Same right-wing rationalizations, excuses, crackpot economic theories, and social Darwinism that got us into the present mess.
WHITEMAN

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#481
May 24, 2013
 

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jeff wrote:
http://www.realclearpolitics.c om/epolls/other/president_obam a_job_approval-1044.html
He is still above 50%. That's' better than most have ever done at any time.
My question to my friends in the conservative camp is who are you going to run next time. Then lets' look at their polling numbers.
ABC job approval rating 45% as of this morning. James Rosen and IRS scandals causing it to drop according to report.
seriously

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#482
May 24, 2013
 

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WHITEMAN wrote:
<quoted text>
ABC job approval rating 45% as of this morning. James Rosen and IRS scandals causing it to drop according to report.
GREAT
Just asken

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#483
May 24, 2013
 

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WHITEMAN wrote:
<quoted text>
ABC job approval rating 45% as of this morning. James Rosen and IRS scandals causing it to drop according to report.
just check A B C web sight said Obama was holding steady. Yor must have been looking at the Absurd Bullshit Conserveative poll.

“Thar's a new sheriff in town..”

Since: Jan 09

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#484
May 24, 2013
 

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Sunrise wrote:
<quoted text>Nice try. You did a search of the author and organization looking for anything negative and that is all you came up with.
<quoted text>Which means you have not factual errors to point out.
<quoted text>You do realize the information in the book is just another man's opinion, don't you?
<quoted text>
No factual errors to point out, Sunrise? Really? Remember me telling how right-wing propaganda "forgets" to tell parts of the story? Let's take a closer look, shall we? LOL

I found it curious an article on the crisis failed to even mention the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission Report. It had even made the best sellers list. Seems the commission conclused the Community Reinvestment Act and other housing laws and policies played NO significant part in causing the crisis. It primarily blamed 30-years of deregulation (Reaganomics), lapses of ethics, and failure of corporate oversight.

Very few banks even fell under Community Reinvestment Act requirements. In fact, only 6% of ALL failed subprime mortgages were connected in any way to the CRA or other housing laws or regulations. The vast majority of subprime loans were peddled by companies not required to follow housing laws.

As for Freddie and Fannie, Clinton administration regulations required them to make a minimum of 30% of their loans to low-income buyers....that was raised to 54% under regulations put into place by the Bush administration.

As for subprime lending in general, it was at $16 billion when Clinton left office and rose to it's highest point of %600 billion in 2004-2005 under Bush. Shall I go on? LOL

John Kenneth Galbraith was one of the foremost economists and economic historians in American history. His "opinion," as you call it, is backed up by data, sourced footnotes and collaborative interpretations in the MANY histories he has written. He worked in the administration of four presidents as well as teaching at Harvard, Cambridge and Princeton, and served as a US Ambassador. Aside from his two Medals of Freedom, he worked out the economics of modern highway construction which became the Interstate Highway System we know today.

And you believe some right-wing rag with an article that fails to even mention the single most important document relating to the issue being written about. Beautiful! LOL

THIS is why right-wingers cannot be trusted to make intelligent decisions. They don't even have the ability to discern good, solid information from fairy tales written for the gullible and weak-minded.

Oh, your "wonderful" article left something else out at the very beginning...."Once upon a time..."
OnBSMountain

Paris, TX

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#485
May 24, 2013
 

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_Crisis...

“The first public hearing of the Commission was held on January 13, 2010,...
The Commission reported its findings in January 2011.”

*****So the commision was formed under an obama presidency…and released under obama. Hmmmmm… Do you think they would ever blame themselves for all their bad policies?

“Speaker of the House and Nancy Pelosi of California and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada each made three appointments, while House Minority Leader John Boehner of Ohio and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky each made two appointments:”

*****So the commission has 6 democrats and 4 Republicans. Little lopsided, huh? Do you think they would ever conclude fault to democrats, namely clinton and obama?

“…it was the collapse of the housing bubble—fueled by low interest rates, easy and available credit, scant regulation, and toxic mortgages— that was the spark that ignited a string of events, which led to a full-blown crisis in the fall of 2008. Trillions of dollars in risky mortgages had become embedded throughout the financial system, as mortgage-related securities were packaged, repackaged, and sold to investors around the world.

*****Hmmmmm, what is clinton’s fault? The only thing that isn’t is the low interest rates. Easy and available credit , scant regulation and toxic mortgages are all clinton and obama. Considering we have had low interest rates before, I would say that is not the main or would be the majority of the cause.

“In voting on the adoption of the final report the Commission was split evenly along partisan lines, with Angelides, Born, Georgiou, Graham, Murren, and Thompson (appointed by Democrats Pelosi and Reid) all voting in favor and Thomas, Hennessey, Holtz-Eakin, and Wallison (appointed by Republicans Boehner and McConnell) all dissenting. Among those dissenting Thomas, Hennessey, and Holtz-Eakin collaborated on a single report while Wallison, from the American Enterprise Institute drafted his alone and proposed that the crisis was caused by government affordable housing policies rather than market forces.[”
*****Dems said what we say is right, Republicans say BS, here is what happened and blamed government affordable housing policy, ie clinton doing.

“We conclude this financial crisis was avoidable.
"There was an explosion in risky subprime lending…”
*****Clinton’s doing.

“little meaningful action was taken to quell the threats in a timely manner." The Commission especially singles out the Fed's "failure to stem the flow of toxic mortgages."
*****Bush wanted to fix it but frank/dodd want to hid it.

http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/bill-clintons-dere...
“Ah, the progressives’ George W. Bush deregulation myth: Bush’s anti-regulation crusade caused our problems. This is a lie that seems true because of constant media repetition. In fact, Bush talked deregulation but vastly increased the regulatory state. He hired an astounding 90,000 new regulators.”

So Clinton – not Bush – was the bank deregulator.

Banks got in trouble because they filled their portfolios with securities built on shaky mortgages. And here is where Clinton does bear responsibility.
His secretary of housing and urban development was Andrew Cuomo, now governor of New York and apparent presidential wannabe.
Cuomo, as Wayne Barrett wrote in the Village Voice in 2008, made a series of decisions that “helped plunge Fannie and Freddie into the subprime markets without putting in place the means to monitor their increasingly risky investments. He turned the Federal Housing Administration mortgage program into a sweetheart lender with sky-high loan ceilings and no money down, and he legalized what a federal judge has branded ‘kickbacks’ to brokers that have fueled the sale of overpriced and unsupportable loans. Three to four million families are now facing foreclosure, and Cuomo is one of the reasons why.”
OnBSMountain

Paris, TX

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#486
May 24, 2013
 

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_Crisis...

“The first public hearing of the Commission was held on January 13, 2010,The Commission reported its findings in January 2011.”

*****So the commision was formed under an obama presidency…and released under obama. Hmm… Do you think they would ever blame themselves for all their bad policies?

“Speaker of the House and Nancy Pelosi of California and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada (both Democrats) each made three appointments, while House Minority Leader John Boehner of Ohio and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky (both Republicans) each made two appointments:”

*****So the commission has 6 democrats and 4 Republicans. Little lopsided, huh? Do you think they would ever conclude fault to democrats, namely clinton and obama?

“…it was the collapse of the housing bubble—fueled by low interest rates, easy and available credit, scant regulation, and toxic mortgages— that was the spark that ignited a string of events, which led to a full-blown crisis in the fall of 2008. Trillions of dollars in risky mortgages had become embedded throughout the financial system, as mortgage-related securities were packaged, repackaged, and sold to investors around the world.

*****Hmmmmm, what is clinton’s fault? The only thing that isn’t is the low interest rates. Easy and available credit , scant regulation and toxic mortgages are all clinton and obama. Considering we have had low interest rates before, I would say that is not the main or would be the majority of the cause.

“In voting on the adoption of the final report the Commission was split evenly along partisan lines, with Angelides, Born, Georgiou, Graham, Murren, and Thompson (appointed by Democrats Pelosi and Reid) all voting in favor and Thomas, Hennessey, Holtz-Eakin, and Wallison (appointed by Republicans Boehner and McConnell) all dissenting. Among those dissenting Thomas, Hennessey, and Holtz-Eakin collaborated on a single report while Wallison, from the American Enterprise Institute drafted his alone and proposed that the crisis was caused by government affordable housing policies rather than market forces.[”
*****Dems said what we say is right, Republicans say BS, here is what happened and blamed government affordable housing policy, ie clinton doing.

“We conclude this financial crisis was avoidable.
"There was an explosion in risky subprime lending…”
*****Clinton’s doing.

“little meaningful action was taken to quell the threats in a timely manner." The Commission especially singles out the Fed's "failure to stem the flow of toxic mortgages."
*****Bush wanted to fix it but frank/dodd want to hid it.
http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/bill-clintons-dere...
“Ah, the progressives’ George W. Bush deregulation myth: Bush’s anti-regulation crusade caused our problems. This is a lie that seems true because of constant media repetition. In fact, Bush talked deregulation but vastly increased the regulatory state. He hired an astounding 90,000 new regulators.”

So Clinton – not Bush – was the bank deregulator.

Banks got in trouble because they filled their portfolios with securities built on shaky mortgages. And here is where Clinton does bear responsibility.
His secretary of housing and urban development was Andrew Cuomo, now governor of New York and apparent presidential wannabe.
Cuomo, as Wayne Barrett wrote in the Village Voice in 2008, made a series of decisions that “helped plunge Fannie and Freddie into the subprime markets without putting in place the means to monitor their increasingly risky investments. He turned the Federal Housing Administration mortgage program into a sweetheart lender with sky-high loan ceilings and no money down, and he legalized what a federal judge has branded ‘kickbacks’ to brokers that have fueled the sale of overpriced and unsupportable loans. Three to four million families are now facing foreclosure, and Cuomo is one of the reasons why.”
Sunrise

Arlington, TX

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#487
May 24, 2013
 
OnBSMountain wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F inancial_Crisis_Inquiry_Commis sion

“The first public hearing of the Commission was held on January 13, 2010,...
The Commission reported its findings in January 2011.”

*****So the commision was formed under an obama presidency…and released under obama. Hmmmmm… Do you think they would ever blame themselves for all their bad policies?

“Speaker of the House and Nancy Pelosi of California and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada each made three appointments, while House Minority Leader John Boehner of Ohio and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky each made two appointments:”
*****So the commission has 6 democrats and 4 Republicans. Little lopsided, huh? Do you think they would ever conclude fault to democrats, namely clinton and obama?
“…it was the collapse of the housing bubble—fueled by low interest rates, easy and available credit, scant regulation, and toxic mortgages— that was the spark that ignited a string of events, which led to a full-blown crisis in the fall of 2008. Trillions of dollars in risky mortgages had become embedded throughout the financial system, as mortgage-related securities were packaged, repackaged, and sold to investors around the world.
*****Hmmmmm, what is clinton’s fault? The only thing that isn’t is the low interest rates. Easy and available credit , scant regulation and toxic mortgages are all clinton and obama. Considering we have had low interest rates before, I would say that is not the main or would be the majority of the cause.
“In voting on the adoption of the final report the Commission was split evenly along partisan lines, with Angelides, Born, Georgiou, Graham, Murren, and Thompson (appointed by Democrats Pelosi and Reid) all voting in favor and Thomas, Hennessey, Holtz-Eakin, and Wallison (appointed by Republicans Boehner and McConnell) all dissenting. Among those dissenting Thomas, Hennessey, and Holtz-Eakin collaborated on a single report while Wallison, from the American Enterprise Institute drafted his alone and proposed that the crisis was caused by government affordable housing policies rather than market forces.[”
*****Dems said what we say is right, Republicans say BS, here is what happened and blamed government affordable housing policy, ie clinton doing.
“We conclude this financial crisis was avoidable.
"There was an explosion in risky subprime lending…”
*****Clinton’s doing.
“little meaningful action was taken to quell the threats in a timely manner." The Commission especially singles out the Fed's "failure to stem the flow of toxic mortgages."
*****Bush wanted to fix it but frank/dodd want to hid it.
http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/bill-clintons-dere...
“Ah, the progressives’ George W. Bush deregulation myth: Bush’s anti-regulation crusade caused our problems. This is a lie that seems true because of constant media repetition. In fact, Bush talked deregulation but vastly increased the regulatory state. He hired an astounding 90,000 new regulators.”

So Clinton – not Bush – was the bank deregulator.

Banks got in trouble because they filled their portfolios with securities built on shaky mortgages. And here is where Clinton does bear responsibility.
His secretary of housing and urban development was Andrew Cuomo, now governor of New York and apparent presidential wannabe.
Cuomo, as Wayne Barrett wrote in the Village Voice in 2008, made a series of decisions that “helped plunge Fannie and Freddie into the subprime markets without putting in place the means to monitor their increasingly risky investments. He turned the Federal Housing Administration mortgage program into a sweetheart lender with sky-high loan ceilings and no money down, and he legalized what a federal judge has branded ‘kickbacks’ to brokers that have fueled the sale of overpriced and unsupportable loans. Three to four million families are now facing foreclosure, and Cuomo is one of the reasons why.”
Great post.

“Thar's a new sheriff in town..”

Since: Jan 09

Frogville

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#488
May 24, 2013
 

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OnBSMountain wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F inancial_Crisis_Inquiry_Commis sion

“The first public hearing of the Commission was held on January 13, 2010,...
The Commission reported its findings in January 2011.”

*****So the commision was formed under an obama presidency…and released under obama. Hmmmmm… Do you think they would ever blame themselves for all their bad policies?

*****So the commission has 6 democrats and 4 Republicans. Little lopsided, huh? Do you think they would ever conclude fault to democrats, namely clinton and obama?

*****Hmmmmm, what is clinton’s fault? The only thing that isn’t is the low interest rates. Easy and available credit , scant regulation and toxic mortgages are all clinton and obama. Considering we have had low interest rates before, I would say that is not the main or would be the majority of the cause.
“In voting on the adoption of the final report the Commission was split evenly along partisan lines, with Angelides, Born, Georgiou, Graham, Murren, and Thompson (appointed by Democrats Pelosi and Reid) all voting in favor and Thomas, Hennessey, Holtz-Eakin, and Wallison (appointed by Republicans Boehner and McConnell) all dissenting. Among those dissenting Thomas, Hennessey, and Holtz-Eakin collaborated on a single report while Wallison, from the American Enterprise Institute drafted his alone and proposed that the crisis was caused by government affordable housing policies rather than market forces.[”
Of course, I can't respond to all your intellectually lazy cut-and-paste tactics, but I'll give ONE example of your dishonesty...just like the one used in the Let Freedom Ring, Inc. article you posted.

In the above cut-and-paste you were careful to edit out the last sentence....that noted the disenting report by Wallison of the American Enterprise Institute was NOT supported by the data concerning subprime lending.

You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. FACT: Only 6% of mortgage defaults involved subprime loans connected in any way with the Community Reinvestment Act. In fact, their default rate was less than half of the other subprime loans.

I believe your contention was (it may have changed to suit some new right-wing dodge) that Clinton and Lawyer Obama "forced" subprime loans down the throats of bankers causing the bubble and subsequent economic crash.

Point of fact, banking REREGULATION brought on the crisis by eliminating oversight of subprime lending (and other practices) in the first place. That deregulation was orchestrated by Texas Republican and corporate whore Phil Gramm and others who lead the Wall Street deregulation parade.

By the way, the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission was created by law passed by Congress and signed by Obama after he took office. But, of course, we all KNEW it was just another Obama conspiricy, didn't we? LOL

“Thar's a new sheriff in town..”

Since: Jan 09

Frogville

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#489
May 24, 2013
 

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OnBSMountain wrote:
http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/bill-clintons-dere...
“Ah, the progressives’ George W. Bush deregulation myth: Bush’s anti-regulation crusade caused our problems. This is a lie that seems true because of constant media repetition. In fact, Bush talked deregulation but vastly increased the regulatory state. He hired an astounding 90,000 new regulators.”

So Clinton – not Bush – was the bank deregulator.

Banks got in trouble because they filled their portfolios with securities built on shaky mortgages. And here is where Clinton does bear responsibility.
His secretary of housing and urban development was Andrew Cuomo, now governor of New York and apparent presidential wannabe.
Cuomo, as Wayne Barrett wrote in the Village Voice in 2008, made a series of decisions that “helped plunge Fannie and Freddie into the subprime markets without putting in place the means to monitor their increasingly risky investments. He turned the Federal Housing Administration mortgage program into a sweetheart lender with sky-high loan ceilings and no money down, and he legalized what a federal judge has branded ‘kickbacks’ to brokers that have fueled the sale of overpriced and unsupportable loans. Three to four million families are now facing foreclosure, and Cuomo is one of the reasons why.”
WND....."World News Daily"? LOL Another right-wing rag that passes along gossip and goofy conspiricy stories. ROFLMAO!

My original conclusion stands: Right-wingers cannot be trusted to make important decisions involving policy because they can't tell the difference between a good, reputable source and polyunsaturated horsecrap. LOL
seriously

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#490
May 24, 2013
 

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OnBSMountain wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F inancial_Crisis_Inquiry_Commis sion

“The first public hearing of the Commission was held on January 13, 2010,The Commission reported its findings in January 201!wwww*So the commision was formed under an obama presidency…and released under obama. Hmm… Do you think they would ever blame themselves for all their bad policies?
…!
“Speaker of the House and Nancy Pelosi of California and Senate Majority Leader Ha?ee) each made two appointments:”
*****So the commission has 6 democrats and 4 Republicans. Little lopsided, huh? Do you think they would ever conclude fault to democrats, namely clinton and obama?
“…it was the collapse of the housing bubble—fueled by low interest rates, easy and available credit, scant regulation, and toxic mortgages— that was the spark that ignited a string of events, which led to a full-blown crisis in the fall of 2008. Trillions of dollars in risky mortgages had become embedded throughout the financial system, as mortgage-related securities were packaged, repackaged, and sold to investors around the world.
*****Hmmmmm, what is clinton’s fault? The only thing that isn’t is the low interest rates. Easy and available credit , scant regulation and toxic mortgages are all clinton and obama. Considering we have had low interest rates before, I would say that is not the main or would be the majority of the cause.
“In voting on the adoption of the final report the Commission was split evenly along partisan lines, with Angelides, Born, Georgiou, Graham, Murren, and Thompson (appointed by Democrats Pelosi and Reid) all voting in favor and Thomas, Hennessey, Holtz-Eakin, and Wallison (appointed by Republicans Boehner and McConnell) all dissenting. Among those dissenting Thomas, Hennessey, and Holtz-Eakin collaborated on a single report while Wallison, from the American Enterprise Institute drafted his alone and proposed that the crisis was caused by government affordable housing policies rather than market forces.[”
*****Dems said what we say is right, Republicans say BS, here is what happened and blamed government affordable housing policy, ie clinton doing.
“We conclude this financial crisis was avoidable.
"There was an explosion in risky subprime lending…”
*****Clinton’s doing.
“little meaningful action was taken to quell the threats in a timely manner." The Commission especially singles out the Fed's "failure to stem the flow of toxic mortgages."
*****Bush wanted to fix it but frank/dodd want to hid it.
http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/bill-clintons-dere...
“Ah, the progressives’ George W. Bush deregulation myth: Bush’s anti-regulation crusade caused our problems. This is a lie that seems true because of constant media repetition. In fact, Bush talked deregulation but vastly increased the regulatory state. He hired an astounding 90,000 new regulators.”

So Clinton – not Bush – was the bank deregulator.

Banks got in trouble because they filled their portfolios with securities built on shaky mortgages. And here is where Clinton does bear responsibility.
His secretary of housing and urban development was Andrew Cuomo, now governor of New York and apparent presidential wannabe.
Cuomo, as Wayne Barrett wrote in the Village Voice in 2008, made a series of decisions that “helped plunge Fannie and Freddie into the subprime markets without putting in place the means to monitor their increasingly risky investments. He turned the Federal Housing Administration mortgage program into a sweetheart lender with sky-high loan ceilings and no money down, and he legalized what a federal judge has branded ‘kickbacks’ to brokers that have fueled the sale of overpriced and unsupportable loans. Three to four million families are now facing foreclosure, and Cuomo is one of the reasons why.”
Excellent post
OnBSMountain

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#491
May 24, 2013
 

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PANTSONFIRE wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course, I can't respond to all your intellectually lazy cut-and-paste tactics, but I'll give ONE example of your dishonesty...just like the one used in the Let Freedom Ring, Inc. article you posted.
In the above cut-and-paste you were careful to edit out the last sentence....that noted the disenting report by Wallison of the American Enterprise Institute was NOT supported by the data concerning subprime lending.
You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. FACT: Only 6% of mortgage defaults involved subprime loans connected in any way with the Community Reinvestment Act. In fact, their default rate was less than half of the other subprime loans.
I believe your contention was (it may have changed to suit some new right-wing dodge) that Clinton and Lawyer Obama "forced" subprime loans down the throats of bankers causing the bubble and subsequent economic crash.
Point of fact, banking REREGULATION brought on the crisis by eliminating oversight of subprime lending (and other practices) in the first place. That deregulation was orchestrated by Texas Republican and corporate whore Phil Gramm and others who lead the Wall Street deregulation parade.
By the way, the Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission was created by law passed by Congress and signed by Obama after he took office. But, of course, we all KNEW it was just another Obama conspiricy, didn't we? LOL
How come you don't put your information cites? I cannot believe a word you say without proof.

The reason I did not leave that sentence in is because that report has the section titled:
" V.GOV ERNMENT PRESSURE PROBABLY DID NOT DRIVE LOOSE UNDERWRITING ... 257"

'Probably' is inconclusive. Fact is Clinton initiated stupid policy, had all his people push it, it backfired, and now taxpayers and our economy have been paying for 5+ years. Obama profited from suing banks over it, basically setting a precedent for any other BS lawsuits filed against banks to force them to submit to 'give money away' to uncreditworthy people.

So still, I submit, some of Bush2's deficit really belongs to clinton and obama.

“Thar's a new sheriff in town..”

Since: Jan 09

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#492
May 24, 2013
 

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OnBSMountain wrote:
<quoted text>
How come you don't put your information cites? I cannot believe a word you say without proof.
The reason I did not leave that sentence in is because that report has the section titled:
" V.GOV ERNMENT PRESSURE PROBABLY DID NOT DRIVE LOOSE UNDERWRITING ... 257"
'Probably' is inconclusive. Fact is Clinton initiated stupid policy, had all his people push it, it backfired, and now taxpayers and our economy have been paying for 5+ years. Obama profited from suing banks over it, basically setting a precedent for any other BS lawsuits filed against banks to force them to submit to 'give money away' to uncreditworthy people.
So still, I submit, some of Bush2's deficit really belongs to clinton and obama.
Clinton didn't initiate deregulation. That was the anti-government propaganda brainchild passed off on simple-minded Red State boobs like you by Ronald Reagan.

Make no mistake, Clinton and other Democrats drank their fair share of Reagan "free market" Kool-Aide after being trounced by Republican Wall Street whoring and bribery. I guess that is what one has to do in the face of vast wealth buying our democracy.

But Republicans have been pushing that anti-government social Darwinian crap since FDR....even before the LAST time they crashed the world economy To lay it all on Clinton and Democrats requires you ignore fifty-years of history, which is usuallly no problem for right-wingers, of course.

Why don't I post my citations? First, it would be a waste of time because right-wingers simply dismiss anything they don't want to hear. Secondly, I can actually think and write for myself and don't need to cut-and-paste volumes in a vain-glorious effort to appear like I know what I am talking about. Thirdly, much of my information comes from years of study and the earning of degrees...if I cited those many sources you might have to actually read a book and we both know THAT ain't gonna happen.

OnBSmountain, you have YEARS of study and experience to go through before you know even half of what you THINK you know. First on the agenda is to learn to recognize good sources of information from propaganda designed to make the gullible feel all warm and fuzzy.

I am sure someone, probably your mother, told you how smart you are. She lied.

“Thar's a new sheriff in town..”

Since: Jan 09

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#493
May 24, 2013
 

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OnBSMountain wrote:
<quoted text>
'Probably' is inconclusive.
No, "Probably" ISN'T inconclusive. That it is is a product of right-wing anti-intellectual black-and-white thinking.

Juries do it every day when they convict or acquit based on "beyond a reasonable doubt." And when decisions are made based on the "preponderance of evidence" and the "best evidence available."

Right-wingers live in a world of absolutes. Phychological surveys indicate they don't handle ambiguity very well at all. Well, sometimes people have to just go with the best they can do.

Does this mean Democrats don't make mistakes or make errors in judgement? Of course not! But they use the best available evidence, as opposed to know-it-all Republicans. Being a thinking person aware of human frailties I go with the Democratic way of thinking.

Welcome to the real world....
truman

Boise, ID

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#494
May 25, 2013
 

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PANTSONFIRE wrote:
<quoted text>
No, "Probably" ISN'T inconclusive. That it is is a product of right-wing anti-intellectual black-and-white thinking.
Juries do it every day when they convict or acquit based on "beyond a reasonable doubt." And when decisions are made based on the "preponderance of evidence" and the "best evidence available."
Right-wingers live in a world of absolutes. Phychological surveys indicate they don't handle ambiguity very well at all. Well, sometimes people have to just go with the best they can do.
Does this mean Democrats don't make mistakes or make errors in judgement? Of course not! But they use the best available evidence, as opposed to know-it-all Republicans. Being a thinking person aware of human frailties I go with the Democratic way of thinking.
Welcome to the real world....
Excellent posts,but laying that much Science and Truth on these simpletons and continuing to tell them things they dont want to hear...I predict the Homo name calling is about to start,that seems to be the default mode of these'Patriots'.
truman

Boise, ID

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May 25, 2013
 

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Anonymous wrote:
The below is bull shit!!!!!!!
jeff wrote:
Come on guys, serious answers please, quiet your childish instincts! Who's in?
I have found the right-wing article posted earlier "interesting." Right-wingers question sources used by progressives, so I did what I always do before reading a book or article....I do a search of the author writing and/or organization publishing it.
Let Freedom Ring, Inc., the organization that published the article right-wingers on here are fauning over, is yet another neo-con "think tank" funded by evangelical loon John Templeton, Jr. from his Wall Street tycoon daddy's Templeton Foundation. Let Freeedom ring and/or Templeton Foundation has in the past supported "intellegent design," the war in Iraq, elimination of Social Security and other hair-brained neo-con causes.
I can't even begin to point out the factual errors in the article. Most are slipped past the "low information" right-wing reader using the usual right-wing handstands of telling half-truths, innuendo and "forgetting" to mention important details.
wishing to actually LEARN about the recent financial crisis should start at the beginning. I recommend John Kenneth Galbraith's since 1954.
One can actually exchange 1920s dates for 2000s and the story is pretty much the same. Same right-wiThose "The Great Crash of 1929." It is a classic that has been in print ng rationalizations, excuses, crackpot economic theories, and social Darwinism that got us into the present mess.
Wow Anon.
What an indepth rebuttal.lol
About your speed though.

“Thar's a new sheriff in town..”

Since: Jan 09

Frogville

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#496
May 25, 2013
 

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truman wrote:
<quoted text>Excellent posts,but laying that much Science and Truth on these simpletons and continuing to tell them things they dont want to hear...I predict the Homo name calling is about to start,that seems to be the default mode of these'Patriots'.
Oh, I absolutely EXPECT that! LOL

Like I've said, I make no effort to educate THEM....that is hopeless. The goal is for them to show their "thinking" to the rest of the world.

I never argue with a redneck. I just listen and smile. I save argument for online where it deprives them of their two favorite tactics...volume and filibuster. No denying what they said...it's right there for the whole world to see! ;-)
truman

Boise, ID

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#497
May 25, 2013
 

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PANTSONFIRE wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, I absolutely EXPECT that! LOL
Like I've said, I make no effort to educate THEM....that is hopeless. The goal is for them to show their "thinking" to the rest of the world.
I never argue with a redneck. I just listen and smile. I save argument for online where it deprives them of their two favorite tactics...volume and filibuster. No denying what they said...it's right there for the whole world to see! ;-)
Absolutely!
I want these folks to broadcast their Walmart Neo Fascism Loud and Clear.
It important that those who might be fooled into beleiving the nonsense of GOP 'Rebranding'and 'Reaching out' to the demographics theyve profited from demonizing to their 'base' for decades,these people need to know what these sick and evil Tea Bag Cultists REALLY think.
From the Cut and Paste 'expert' to the drive by obscene phone call level poster.
Though it is telling as im sure youve seen how quickly the former can become the latter with only the slightest puncture of their facade of rationality.
I dont think any sane person can sample a few threads of what passes for discourse on the Right and walk away thinking letting these dingbats ANYWHERE near the reins of leadership of this Nation anytime in the forseeable future is a prudent idea.
truman

Boise, ID

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#498
May 25, 2013
 

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I must admit 'BS Mountains' posts are a perfect example of the Hypocracy that is so rampant on the Right:
The Party of 'Personal Responsibilty' resorting to such convoluted implausible equivocation to avoid accepting ANY Responsiblity for any of the negative repercussions of their idealogicaly inspired excesses from Reagan straight to Bush jr.
Absolute pathalogical DENIAL at its finest.

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