Palmer seals chase report

Palmer seals chase report

There are 17 comments on the The Morning Call story from Oct 14, 2008, titled Palmer seals chase report. In it, The Morning Call reports that:

An investigation into whether Palmer police did anything wrong when they chased an alleged shoplifter who drove the wrong way on Route 22 and then crashed, killing himself and a 31-year-old New Jersey woman, ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Morning Call.

uneducated

Clarksburg, MD

#1 Oct 14, 2008
its a shame that thisis being dragged out for both the victims family and the police department. It was the fleeing criminals' fault that this happened, not the police. Does everyone think that if the police stopped following then he would have just did a u-turn on 22 and go on his merry way?? My feelings go out to the family but they are going after the wrong people in this by going after the police.
mistygirl318

Allentown, PA

#2 Oct 14, 2008
Why would the police chase someone the wrong way on the highway???? The police should be held resposible. I know they we chasing a shoplifter... Not like he was a bank robber...but I really do not feel they should have taken the chase as far as they did..now this poor woman lost her life and the life of he unborn child..and a husband has lost his wife and soulmate....I hope he gets all the money he can...not that it will replace his wife, but the police need to be held accountable for there actions in this case.
megg

United States

#3 Oct 14, 2008
The police were not responsible, the scumbag Kevin Messenger was...end of story.

“AOL? Seriously?”

Since: Jul 07

Pawleys Island, SC

#4 Oct 14, 2008
mistygirl318 wrote:
Why would the police chase someone the wrong way on the highway???? The police should be held resposible. I know they we chasing a shoplifter... Not like he was a bank robber...but I really do not feel they should have taken the chase as far as they did..now this poor woman lost her life and the life of he unborn child..and a husband has lost his wife and soulmate....I hope he gets all the money he can...not that it will replace his wife, but the police need to be held accountable for there actions in this case.
So let's send a message to all criminals, large and small, that police will NOT pursue if you enter a highway/roadway in the opposing direction of travel.
Which, of course, would encourage MORE criminals, large and small, to do so, thus putting even more innocent people at risk.
Brilliant!
daffy-in-easton

Broadway, NJ

#5 Oct 14, 2008
If this was the EASTON police they all would be getting millions... but its Palmer and we know they are the best!
loca paco

Brooklyn, NY

#6 Oct 14, 2008
it was a horrible unfortunate incident/accident.
the police are just doing their jobs.
the result has unfortunate. an innocent pregnant lady was the victom....along with the scumbag.honestly, if the cop hasnt pursue the thief, everyone wd be crying and screaming "why not?"
its all an accident, i feel for the family of the pregnant lady.but we CANNOT put all the blame on the police dept.so if the cop stopped chasing...who to say that the scumbag wont hit anything or anyone else?
CAPTAIN SKIRVY

Allentown, PA

#7 Oct 14, 2008
mistygirl318 wrote:
Why would the police chase someone the wrong way on the highway???? The police should be held resposible. I know they we chasing a shoplifter... Not like he was a bank robber...but I really do not feel they should have taken the chase as far as they did..now this poor woman lost her life and the life of he unborn child..and a husband has lost his wife and soulmate....I hope he gets all the money he can...not that it will replace his wife, but the police need to be held accountable for there actions in this case.
But had that been YOUR family memeber that was killed by this idiot, and the police hadnt have been chasing him, you would be blaming the police for not trying to stop him! I mean really, the guy was a wanted fugitive and you just think becasue he stole something that the cops should have let him just drive wherever he wanted to, anyone who says that this is in any way the cops fault are a bunch of finger pointing idiots! The police didnt force him onto 22 the WRONG WAY! Tragic, yes....the cops fault.....HELL NO!
CAPTAIN SKIRVY

Allentown, PA

#8 Oct 14, 2008
mistygirl318 wrote:
Why would the police chase someone the wrong way on the highway???? The police should be held resposible. I know they we chasing a shoplifter... Not like he was a bank robber...but I really do not feel they should have taken the chase as far as they did..now this poor woman lost her life and the life of he unborn child..and a husband has lost his wife and soulmate....I hope he gets all the money he can...not that it will replace his wife, but the police need to be held accountable for there actions in this case.
the fact that they did chase him as he went the wrongway is just another reason that they should have! It made it more apparent that this guy was dangerous, to others and himself, and needed to be stopped! Thats why idiot!
WRONG

Whitehall, PA

#9 Oct 14, 2008
WRONG! You would not be saying that if it was a member of your family killed. There was no reason for that chase to have happened.
Disgusted

AOL

#10 Oct 14, 2008
If Palmer had nothing to hide they'd make it public. I hope Palmer gets the pants sued off of them for being so stupid.
ouch

Easton, PA

#11 Oct 14, 2008
Disgusted wrote:
If Palmer had nothing to hide they'd make it public. I hope Palmer gets the pants sued off of them for being so stupid.
I'm really curious as to what you think they are trying to hide. The facts are out there: They chased a criminal the wrong way on Rt 22 and the crash happened. What are they trying to hide? Some people just like to vent even when they have nothing smart to say. Were aliens involved? Was the cop drunk? I'm waiting.........
No disrespect meant to the family. I'm sorry for their loss. And, no, I know aliens were not involved and the cop was not drunk. Just curious about the conspiracy theory is all.
Get a Grip

Bethlehem, PA

#12 Oct 15, 2008
If a cop confronts a person with a weapon and gets shot in the line of duty, is it his/her fault for engaging a criminal that has intent to kill? We as citizens should stand up for these brave men and women who put their lives on the line for us everyday. I am not naive and I know that there are law-breaking officers that should be held accountable for their actions. This is not one of those cases. IT WAS THE FAULT OF THE SHOPLIFTER THAT ENTERED THE HIGHWAY IN THE WRONG DIRECTION! I am truly sorry for all those who lost their loved ones that day, including said shoplifter. It was a tragic accident that could have been avoided by following simple laws.
Always Right

AOL

#13 Oct 15, 2008
Palmer Township will be held culpable here because they have no current regulations and guidelines that stipulate and dictate a patrol officer's response to a pursuit. They need to have various responses in worsening conditions that clearly lay out how an officer is to respond. All large cities have such regulations and they are in place to prevent exactly what happened here. It can not be left up to a patrol officer making less than $30,000 a year to decide what level of danger a fleeing suspect poses to the general public. There are other, safer ways to deal with this type of pursuit. The accident was preventable. The fact is the man escalated his escape attempt as it became clear the police would not back off.

Perspective, people...even if the guy would have gotten away he only stole a vacuum cleaner. Now he's dead, a pregnant woman is dead and it's going to cost the Township millions.

“AOL? Seriously?”

Since: Jul 07

Pawleys Island, SC

#14 Oct 15, 2008
Always Right wrote:
Palmer Township will be held culpable here because they have no current regulations and guidelines that stipulate and dictate a patrol officer's response to a pursuit. They need to have various responses in worsening conditions that clearly lay out how an officer is to respond. All large cities have such regulations and they are in place to prevent exactly what happened here. It can not be left up to a patrol officer making less than $30,000 a year to decide what level of danger a fleeing suspect poses to the general public. There are other, safer ways to deal with this type of pursuit. The accident was preventable. The fact is the man escalated his escape attempt as it became clear the police would not back off.
Perspective, people...even if the guy would have gotten away he only stole a vacuum cleaner. Now he's dead, a pregnant woman is dead and it's going to cost the Township millions.
I can promise you that Palmer Twsp. not only has a Pursuit Policy in place, but that it was reviewed by their Solicitor and their insurance carrier prior to being implemented.

And I may be wrong on this (and I'm sure I'll be corrected if I am), but I believe the MPOETC also requires a Pursuit Policy be in place as does PennDOT if your department applies for any enforcement grants.

As for the last section of your post, how can anyone predict that this wouldn't have occurred if the officer broke pursuit immediately when the actor entered the highway in the opposing direction?
megg

United States

#15 Oct 15, 2008
Always Right wrote:
Palmer Township will be held culpable here because they have no current regulations and guidelines that stipulate and dictate a patrol officer's response to a pursuit. They need to have various responses in worsening conditions that clearly lay out how an officer is to respond. All large cities have such regulations and they are in place to prevent exactly what happened here. It can not be left up to a patrol officer making less than $30,000 a year to decide what level of danger a fleeing suspect poses to the general public. There are other, safer ways to deal with this type of pursuit. The accident was preventable. The fact is the man escalated his escape attempt as it became clear the police would not back off.
Perspective, people...even if the guy would have gotten away he only stole a vacuum cleaner. Now he's dead, a pregnant woman is dead and it's going to cost the Township millions.
YAWN!!!!!!!!!!
He didn't "only steal a vacuum cleaner" and he would have hit someone whether or not the police were chasing him!!!
Always Right

AOL

#16 Oct 15, 2008
LongGoneFromAtwn wrote:
<quoted text>
I can promise you that Palmer Twsp. not only has a Pursuit Policy in place, but that it was reviewed by their Solicitor and their insurance carrier prior to being implemented.
And I may be wrong on this (and I'm sure I'll be corrected if I am), but I believe the MPOETC also requires a Pursuit Policy be in place as does PennDOT if your department applies for any enforcement grants.
As for the last section of your post, how can anyone predict that this wouldn't have occurred if the officer broke pursuit immediately when the actor entered the highway in the opposing direction?
The original MC article stated that that Palmer officials admitted that they did not have clear regulations for pursuits. I beleive the quote was the decision was "up to the pursueing officer".

“AOL? Seriously?”

Since: Jul 07

Pawleys Island, SC

#17 Oct 15, 2008
Always Right wrote:
<quoted text>
The original MC article stated that that Palmer officials admitted that they did not have clear regulations for pursuits. I beleive the quote was the decision was "up to the pursueing officer".
If, and only if, that is the case, then they probably are screwed. I stand by my post as far as requirements in Pa. for pursuit policies.
And if Palmer's insurance carrier didn't require one, shame on them.

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