Bible study rules for public schools ...

Bible study rules for public schools proposed

There are 149551 comments on the The Courier-Journal story from Feb 10, 2010, titled Bible study rules for public schools proposed. In it, The Courier-Journal reports that:

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Courier-Journal.

“There is no god.”

Since: Jan 12

USA

#107328 Jun 22, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
What makes your "interpretation" better than another?
TrueBeliever†

“See how you are?”

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#107329 Jun 22, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do you think they need to teach homosexuality in grade school?
What is "teaching" homosexuality and who says they do?

Why do you think you are sometimes regarded as crazy as a loon religious bigot?
haventt forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#107330 Jun 22, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
You claim your god is real, but you never provide evidence to suggest or support your god's existence. That makes you a liar or delusional, which is it?
that was to yaa. I think your question implies that a liar is someone who knows he is telling an untruth, and a delusional person does not know it is an untruth, with regard to belief in a god. Are you implying that a person who was brought up to believe in a god by parents and their accomplices is delusional - or is he or she brainwashed, which might be a different thing? I think someone who asserts there is a God is either a liar or a "believer" who is making a claim he or she cannot prove. But the cause of that person's belief can be any of several factors. I feel sorry for them, actually.

I appreciate it that you distinguish between an intentional liar, and someone who does not know better. People do not always know when they are telling falsehoods.
haventt forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#107331 Jun 22, 2013
LOL in a suit wrote:
<quoted text>
Well said.
Support the church and you support hatred and bigotry.
do you mean any church? or the Catholic Church? are you sure that every little church has leaders and members who are full of hatred and bigotry? That seems like a very comprehensive accusation.

Some churches and some denominations, and some of their members, are more hateful and bigoted than others. Do you make no distinction and condemn them all equally? That would remind me of the type of person who thinks each of the 10 commandments is of equal merit!

seems to me you become more like Skeptic every day. are you the same person?

“There is no god.”

Since: Jan 12

USA

#107332 Jun 22, 2013
haventt forgotten wrote:
<quoted text> do you mean any church? or the Catholic Church? are you sure that every little church has leaders and members who are full of hatred and bigotry? That seems like a very comprehensive accusation.
Some churches and some denominations, and some of their members, are more hateful and bigoted than others. Do you make no distinction and condemn them all equally? That would remind me of the type of person who thinks each of the 10 commandments is of equal merit!
seems to me you become more like Skeptic every day. are you the same person?
Blow me.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#107333 Jun 22, 2013
haventt forgotten wrote:
<quoted text> that was to yaa. I think your question implies that a liar is someone who knows he is telling an untruth, and a delusional person does not know it is an untruth, with regard to belief in a god. Are you implying that a person who was brought up to believe in a god by parents and their accomplices is delusional - or is he or she brainwashed, which might be a different thing? I think someone who asserts there is a God is either a liar or a "believer" who is making a claim he or she cannot prove. But the cause of that person's belief can be any of several factors. I feel sorry for them, actually.
I appreciate it that you distinguish between an intentional liar, and someone who does not know better. People do not always know when they are telling falsehoods.
Delusion can be created, and is often developed by external influences. People are not born with delusions. Many delusions are often the result of indoctrination or "brainwashing," and thus, as I have always said, they should be treated for the delusion, not discarded. But if they are just lying, and many are, then they should not be trusted, and possibly jailed if they have profited from the lie. But yes, a lie requires willfully telling the untruth.
haventt forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#107334 Jun 22, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
The LDS is a Protestant church, if it is a Christian church at all. Please don't tell me you actually think the LDS comes from before Catholicism.
So the LDS itself comes from a dead tree.
There are also at least four main groups within the church derived from Joseph Smith.
LDS - Latter Day Saints, or Mormons, followed Brigham Young to Utah. They were polygamous. They mostly gave it up in order to get Utah statehood. They did send a few of their members to Mexico where they continued to be polygamous - including one of Romney's grandfathers, I think. And a few folks stayed LDS and also stayed polygamous, and avoided the law.
The Fundamentalist LDS remained polygamous, and they still have several compounds in various parts of the US. They were the group that got raided a few years ago, with the charges of statutory rape being used as a part of the church ritual, along with polygamy. The charges stayed in place only for a couple of leaders, I think - and most of the other powerful men still are getting by with it.
The monogamous groups that did not follow B Young, stayed in the midwest, and formed into the Reorganized church = RLDS. They have two major midwestern centers, my town of Lamoni where Graceland College is located (with some RLDS domination - but increasingly less so in many ways)- and Independence, Mo. The church changed its name to Community of Christ. The more progressive leadership in the church finally got rid of the racism and some of the sexism (women now can be in the priesthood) and improved the church in other ways, and a splinter group dominated by old-fashioned men who opposed equal rights for women separated into the Restoration Branch - with numerous small churches in this area. The most liberal among the Cof C people are for gay rights and gay marriage rights, and are trying to bring the church to accept their view, slowly. At least they are battling against the homophobia - which will likely result in another split-off.
The church here has a doctrine of continuing revelation, which is good in that new progressive ideas can be introduced, but bad in that it attributes them to a new revelation from God, and also subjects them to a vote of the conference, to decide whether God really was the source of the new vision. It is a cover for liberal reformers, but what an awkward cover! There are rightwing nutcase split offs also, and some of them are "silenced" - that is the "big church" says their leaders are not approved by God and do not speak for the church. It is fascinating to watch the splits and the changes in this town.
For me, as an agnostic atheist, I find it very pleasant that I can call myself an ecumenical agnostic publicly, and not get in much difficulty. I explain ecumenicalism at length in terms of the view that it is a search for a common ethic of kindness, and it certainly puts people in a position of not wanting to be opposed to kindness, and bores them before I get to explaining the agnostic part. A few folks get it that I am an agnostic atheist, but I do not argue with them - poor things who are brainwashed and not taught to be rational need to at least see the wisdom of good ethics, and should not be confused with intellectual matters that they cannot allow themselves to consider. I suspect there are several other free-thinkers here, in addition to the few who are openly so. I love being an observer and watching the evolution of religious events here - our local Baptist minister denounced the hateful Phelps family (some of them came here to picket the play at Graceland, about the murder of the young gay man in Wyoming.
) And many college students picketed them when they were here - with signs saying God is love. And there are many in the big church here who are very good on many ethical matters - and who preach tolerance ane ecumenicalism on religion, including non-Christian religions.
A big difference among the heirs to Joseph Smith.
Angel with care

Chicago, IL

#107335 Jun 22, 2013
The bible is our sanction and shall be allowed
haventt forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#107336 Jun 22, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Delusion can be created, and is often developed by external influences. People are not born with delusions. Many delusions are often the result of indoctrination or "brainwashing," and thus, as I have always said, they should be treated for the delusion, not discarded. But if they are just lying, and many are, then they should not be trusted, and possibly jailed if they have profited from the lie. But yes, a lie requires willfully telling the untruth.
I like your kind impulse to think that these deluded folks should be treated for the delusion. Unfortunately some of the first amendment types have intimidated the psychiatric community into not calling a spade a spade, so to speak.

I personlly think that raising a child to believe in a hot hell of punishment is a form of child abuse and should be prosecuted. They should be in jail, and sterilized and not allowed to adopt once they get out. The children should be placed in decent homes. I do not think the police community would support that, nor many judges either.

There is a new controversy going on with regard to the socalled psychological treatment of trying to turn homosexual teenagers into heterosexual, against their will, maybe even by force from the parents. I hope this is finally regarded as a sort of cult, and prosecuted as kidnapping.

I think you and I could have extended discussions and find a few nuances where we disagree, but many very specific matters where we agree.

I like to tell folks that I am anti-abortion, and think the male is the one who should be killed, not the fetus. In some cases that is really my opinion, except that the male should be kept around in jail to be used as an organ donor. I think sexual relations between male and female should often be illegal for the male if he does not use a condom, and he belongs in jail - not with rights of a father - if it is any degree of rape whatsoever, including any trickery, or nonuse of a condom if she consents only if he does use a condom.

I do find it difficult to support abortion as being an OK thing, when it is used as a form of birth control, by trashy women and/or males. I do not like it that such folks become parents - I suspect they will be lazy irresponsible parents if they were too lazy or stupid to use birth control, in this day and age. I do not believe in any abridgement of abortion rights, however, since it would only lead to dangerous and illegal abortions. It will take better sex education - not closing of abortion clinics - to reduce abortions. I think many white males are especially worried about getting outnumbered and outvoted, and many of them want to populate the US with lots more white babies - to grow up to be rightwing nutcases, they hope.

We have an evil Congressman from Iowa, Steve King - who will take over from Michelle Bachmann and that horrid guy from Florida (did you know there is another disgusting black guy running for Lt. Gov in Va - look it up!) who got defeated (Alan West?- I hope to forget the name.

I value ethics, and politics is part of ethics. I can tolerate a believer who has kind ethics - more than a nonbeliever who is a rightwinger about political and social justice matters.
haventt forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#107337 Jun 22, 2013
LOL in a suit wrote:
<quoted text>
Blow me.
you do seem a lot like Skeptic. both of you obscene and nasty. you are a bad example of atheism. I would prefer to have someone like TT blow you up. These stupid terrorists who hit innocent people at random should consult me first and get an enemies list of the horrid people of this world, like you and Skeptic. It is not nice to kill innocents.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#107338 Jun 22, 2013
So true wrote:
<quoted text>yes they do and we shall each pay for our own , not the actions of others, mostly the bad ones are the ones recalled by others though. Great Friday to you.. That's what's sad.
Actually we often do pay consequences for the actions of others. I cannot even imagine how you think otherwise?

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#107339 Jun 22, 2013
lol wrote:
<quoted text>U R about as retarded asan inbred! Perhaps, U R inbred and YES we do know who U R! Run in front of my vehicle and see if I dont run u over. I hate cats like U! U R RETARDED! What kind of name is that anyways? A retarded one thats what kind! UR going to burn in hell kitty cat! ROTFLMAO at U TARDO!
Death threats right off the bat from the religious. No surprise at all. Must be one of those following Deuteronomy.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#107340 Jun 22, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
He said that the gay couple was brought into a classroom, so I thought he was talking about public school and it was to address bullying. Then he says it was a college course (and doesn't name the course title), so it wasn't a k-12 school and all who were present were adults.
He said that a man wanted to marry a goat according to a radio news report that he flipped past. A web search reveals it was a spoof - but he thinks it still validates his "slippery slope" idea. So much for the integrity of his "priesthood."
I can just hear the good little LDS kids playing tag on the playground.
"My daddy" <punch> "says that you are" <punch> "Hold him!" "an abomination" <punch> <kick> "in the eyes of God" <kick>
Aww.. aren't they just sooo cute?
Obviously it is far from "cute" and sarcasm is not likely to wake "Do Whut" out of his slumber of being complicit in the violence that is brought on by the indoctrinated kids in school.
He lives in complete ignorant bliss, due to his religious indoctrination.
His holy book tells him it is the right thing to do, and no matter what logical objections are given, he refuses to question his dogma.
This is the great flaw of religion. It is the same recipe that lead to 9/11. Blind faith is dangerous.

Religion is dangerous. This is a great example of how even modern Christians are perpetrating a dangerous idea.
They claim to be following a harmless personal belief, but this is part of the delusion.
what

Elkhorn City, KY

#107341 Jun 22, 2013
"The Greatest Failure Of Man Was The Creation Of A Creator." if gods best way of lettin us know about him is only from a book that is contradictory and in some cases just straight out sickening and vile, then i dont think that is a very powerful or smart god to begin with.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#107342 Jun 22, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do you think they need to teach homosexuality in grade school?
I didn't say that.

But if a homosexual couple came into a grade school on some kind of "family day" or "family week" and talked to the kids for a few minutes about their life as a couple that should be no more of a problem than if a it was a straight couple. And it would actually be far more appropriate since most kids don't hear about that stuff in a positive light.

Religious traditions are hostile to this idea, which creates a hostile environment for homosexuals. We need to change that.

“Question, Explore, Discover”

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#107343 Jun 22, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
No it is not derived from another church. It claims to be a restoration of the original church that Jesus started. Protestants came from protesting the Catholic Church. This is not the case with the LDS church. Understand?
You do understand that Protestantism is exactly what you're describing right? That's the whole point.

So your church making the claim that it has the direct line to god is not different than any other church doing the same god-damn thing.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#107345 Jun 22, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Any time I have looked it up, I find that there is no conclusive evidence. That's what science says. If there are a few scientists that say one way, and others that say another, then it should not be taught, because they don't know. Either way they taught it would be leaning towards a bias.
I know enough about nature to know that whether we can agree on a creator or not, procreation cannot take place with same gender sexual intercourse. The result is the same as when Kelly Bundy accused her little brother of planning a family with his pillow.
One of the most successful species on earth, has large groups of individuals who never procreate, ants. Ants are the most abundant species on the planet.
Marriage is not just about procreation. Relationships are not just about procreation.
Their are seven billion humans on the planet. Having a few gay persons around is not going to keep the population from dwindling.
If a gay person helps a relative raise a his child, he has been a part of the system that reproduces his genes. You see, our relatives are part of our genetic makeup, thus helping them to survive and reproduce is part of the system. This is why ants have large groups of worker ants that never procreate.
If Bud Bundy helped to raise a child Kelly Bundy produced, he would be propagating many of his own genes by way of helping them to survive. Reproduction needs survival of the offspring for the gene pool to continue. You forget that critical part, survival.
Evolution has two major parts, procreation and survival. Leave half of the equation out and you just make no logical sense. Homosexuals can be integral in that half of the equation.
I have pointed this out before, but as usual, you ignore the facts and points that prove your claims as invalid.
Try actually addressing the points as if you have something solid to stand on. As of yet, you run from them on a regular basis as if your beliefs are weak and have no support.

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#107346 Jun 22, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
No, this was a college course. It was part of the curriculum.
I was flipping channels when I heard the news. I kept flipping.
And the slope thing is most usually accurate. Look at piercings. I personally do not care if someone wants to poke holes all over themselves. To each his own, but I can guarantee that our society does not find it acceptable yet, because it limits their professional career greatly.
You failed to demonstrate what the slippery slope of piercings were.
Piercings on an excessive level in our society have always been problematic for many careers. So I see no slip or slope.

Even if some things do have a slippery slope, which I can agree that it happens, you cannot claim gay marriage will certainly cause one. Now you can worry about it all you wish, but you have yet to demonstrate with logic and reason how gay marriage is comparable to bestiality.

Not all changes cause a negative slippery slope.
Perceived possible slippery slopes are not a good reason to keep rights or privileges unequal.

I have no doubt that those who made up the idea of keeping women out of the priesthood were worried about the slippery slope of women in power this might lead towards.

“Speaker of Mountain Wisdom....”

Since: Jan 10

London, KY

#107347 Jun 22, 2013
Yiago wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't understand why people can't get this.
When two adults have a relationship it is a mutual activity. Human sexuality is on a wide spectrum and it does include some very harmful things, such as bestiality. But bestiality is not a consensual adult relationship. For fuck's sake it involves two species.
The slippery slope I was referring to is when people assume that acceptance of homosexuality (mutual adult consent) leads to bestiality (animal rape).
Do you understand the difference? You are making a categorical error in your logic.
But the Slope is there, oiled and ready because the argument you make can also apply to 1 guy and 20 woman, 1 woman and 20 guys, 10 guys and 10 women...(mutual adult consent)... which then can Glide to segments thinking a 18 year old guy having sexual contact with a 16 year old girl is ok, or a 20 year old girl and a 16 year old boy... Or a 19 year old boy with a 15 year old boy... is ok because maturity is not a age thing.... Which can lead to a woman not seeing the problem with her Adult German Shepard showing her mutual adult consent ....

There is no error in my logic as all of the above has been at past points in human history Acceptable due to Social Norms of the time and the Only factor that sets the bar for a Heterosexual lifestyle is the social accepted norm of the time and the generalized movement of that social accepted norm historically slipped and slid in both directions...

“Breaking the spell ”

Since: Dec 10

of the puppet master

#107348 Jun 22, 2013
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
This is prophesied in the New Testament. We are told that before the second coming there would be a falling away from the church. We are also told that the heavens will be rolled up as a scroll (God will not directly speak to man. Ie. prophets) for a time. And we are also told there will be a restitution of all things.
I'm not saying He screwed up anything. I'm saying He fulfilled the prophesies.
Predicting a "falling away from the church" is not a prophesy, it is a prediction that would be in line with all religious history. It is an educated guess.

A prophesy would be something like claiming their would never be a falling away, and the prediction held true. This would truly be amazing and contradictory to all historical events.
But as usual, your religion is like all others.

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