Bank Heist Suspect Shot Dead After Chase

Bank Heist Suspect Shot Dead After Chase

There are 272 comments on the Hartford Courant story from Mar 4, 2008, titled Bank Heist Suspect Shot Dead After Chase. In it, Hartford Courant reports that:

A suspect in a 24-hour crime spree that included a sexual assault and a bank robbery in West Hartford was shot and killed in Hartford Monday after leading state police on a car chase and threatening troopers ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Hartford Courant.

Lady Justice

Taunton, MA

#30 Mar 4, 2008
The good guys won this time.
get a job if u want money

Taipei, Taiwan

#31 Mar 4, 2008
reading these messages makes me change my position, we don't need more police, we just need to get there fat, lazy (just observation look at the pic, huge group standing around looking anything but efficient, and in shape) buts off their p.c.'s, and out doing there job! Why do something the hard way when you got a license to kill. Florida cop, with that stalinistic attitude we can only hope your next on your own list. Its amazing how many of you cops hate the constitution that I would assume you swore to protect.
get a job if u want money

Taipei, Taiwan

#33 Mar 4, 2008
BTW more than one way to stop a creep, what about non-leathal guns, rubber bullets, or those bean bag guns? Also, how big was the knife? I would think anyone as highley trained as our police are, or should be, should easliy be able to knock the jerk out with his 18 inch billieclub before the knife even got within reach of his precious self.
local

Broad Brook, CT

#35 Mar 4, 2008
Dave Smith, the Senior Instructor for Calibre Press, and one of the most prolific law enforcement writers and tacticians in the business, recently wrote an article that attempted to dismiss a myth that has been perpetuated by many over the years. That myth deals with the venerable “21-Foot Rule.” Recognized by nearly everyone in the law enforcement profession, the rule, as Dave pointed out, has been widely misinterpreted.
For those of you who may be unfamiliar with the rule, it addresses defeating a knife attack, and it accurately points out the following important fact: An average subject armed with a knife and charging at an average police officer can cover a distance of 21 feet in less time than it takes that officer to recognize the threat, draw his/her firearm, locate center mass, and fire rounds at the target.
The myth is that the rule advocates that when a subject wielding an edged weapon is positioned at any distance less than 21 feet from an officer, that officer can justifiably shoot the person with the knife.
Hopefully the vast majority of officers recognize that this myth is exactly that — a myth. The 21-Foot Rule never was intended to convey that message. Dave Smith, in his article, pointed out this fact. He clarified that, without further variables such as: charging, verbal/nonverbal indications of intent to attack, the ability to carry out the threat, etc., then deadly force is most certainly not justified.
In addition to Dave Smith’s efforts, the Force Science Research Center (FSRC) at Minnesota State University-Mankato headed by Director Dr. Bill Lewinski reexamined the 21-Foot Rule in 2005. They examined the rule from multiple perspectives. As always the research was exceptional and their findings are a must read for everyone in law enforcement. Among many other aspects of knife attacks the FSRC measured action and reaction times of live subjects. They tested how long it took the average officer to draw from a snapped Level II holster and fire one, two, and three rounds at center mass. The fastest officer required 1.31 seconds to draw and get off one round. The slowest officer tested required 2.25 seconds to do the same.
Their tests also revealed that “the average suspect with an edged weapon raised in the traditional "ice-pick" position can go from a dead stop to 21 feet on a level, unobstructed surface offering good traction in 1.5-1.7 seconds.”
What does this all mean? Simple: a committed offender with an intention to stab a police officer has a distinct advantage when in a position that is closer than 21 feet. Their will to kill, as well as their lack of conscience, morals, and ethics, enables their predatory behavior to emerge making for a very dangerous individual.
West Hartford

United States

#36 Mar 4, 2008
"Yahoo, makes my day, good riddance to bad rubbish."
"Nice shot!
One less criminal."
To all you idiots who are talking shit you sound like conservative white trash. Obviously it was not called for, not only was he holding a knife, IT WAS A PEN KNIFE. Im from west hartford and I actually knew this kid pretty well. Its actually pretty sad how hard his life was, In and out of jail, got into drugs at a young age. Anyways theres no way he should have been fucking killed I can guarantee that. Dont be so insensitive to the situation.
dummy

Hartford, CT

#38 Mar 4, 2008
Jesus, he doesn't even need the knife. He's a dangerous fleeing felon. The knife just makes it more justified.

If someone is welding a knife, and not dropping it...I'm shooting his ass and going home to my family.

I'll leave it up to a-holes on the message board to knife fight them.

Next you'll add that they didn't say "please"...so it must have not been justified.
William Howard Taft

West Hartford, CT

#39 Mar 4, 2008
Well done Hartford PD. Another career loser taken off our streets!
BETS

Boston, MA

#40 Mar 4, 2008
West Hartford wrote:
"Yahoo, makes my day, good riddance to bad rubbish."
"Nice shot!
One less criminal."
To all you idiots who are talking shit you sound like conservative white trash. Obviously it was not called for, not only was he holding a knife, IT WAS A PEN KNIFE. Im from west hartford and I actually knew this kid pretty well. Its actually pretty sad how hard his life was, In and out of jail, got into drugs at a young age. Anyways theres no way he should have been fucking killed I can guarantee that. Dont be so insensitive to the situation.
Someone died, that's always tragic, but this man raped a women, stole her car, stole her credit cards, became a federal felon by robbing a bank, led police on a high speed chase, ran from police, stopped an confronted them with a knife, refused orders to drop the knife and advanced towards the troopers with knife in hand. I just can't seem to muster up any sympathy...sorry
get a job if u want money

Taipei, Taiwan

#41 Mar 4, 2008
dummy has a fitting name, I think you should go back to what you do best, writting traffic tickits and hiding behind your gun, and badge. I feel sorry your kids have such a coward for a father. If you put your safety, above upholding the law, maybe you might consider tranferring to the DOT and pick up trash on the side of the road, and scrapping up dead animals.
west hartford girl

Mystic, CT

#42 Mar 4, 2008
i'm also from west hartford and actually was in this kid's year in school. i certainly am not one for police violence but i also know the girl who was the victim of the sexual assault, and it certainly sounds from everything i'm hearing that he more or less committed suicide by police. i mean, they tell you to drop your knife and you don't? what do you think is going to happen? that's the moment when if you want to live and be arrested, you'll drop the knife.

joe bak did have a hard life full of crime and drugs, but you can't really say he didn't choose that life. whatever drug he was hyped up on sunday to monday probably had a big hand in any actions he took.

my heart goes out to the rape victim and joe bak's family. i don't think this is either some huge police triumph or excessive use of force. it's just sad and a reminder that towns like west hartford still can't guarantee turning out happy law abiding kids.
AGAIN

United States

#43 Mar 4, 2008
NO PLEA BARGENING ON THIS ONE!!!

“Yes, w htfd has a "po" side”

Since: Apr 07

west hartford- the "poor" side

#44 Mar 4, 2008
"He was sentenced last August to a 12-year prison sentence for a 2005 first-degree robbery in West Hartford; he was released at the time of sentencing, credited with time served — about two years — and placed on probation for five years."

THIS is the crap that has to stop! He should have had to serve the entire sentence. Then the woman he assaulted would have been spared-and at least his family would be able to visit him in jail instead of at his grave.
Jimmy The Greek

New Haven, CT

#45 Mar 4, 2008
What's up with the fat, sloppy cop in the picture? Dude, less cheeseburgers and more sit-ups.
george

Round Rock, TX

#46 Mar 4, 2008
Killing the guy because he refused to drop a knife? They could have tasered him. The could have shot him in the leg. This was murder once removed.
BETS

Boston, MA

#47 Mar 4, 2008
get a job if u want money wrote:
dummy has a fitting name, I think you should go back to what you do best, writting traffic tickits and hiding behind your gun, and badge. I feel sorry your kids have such a coward for a father. If you put your safety, above upholding the law, maybe you might consider tranferring to the DOT and pick up trash on the side of the road, and scrapping up dead animals.
"feel sorry your kids have such a coward for a father. If you put your safety, above upholding the law,"

What law?
BETS

Boston, MA

#48 Mar 4, 2008
george wrote:
Killing the guy because he refused to drop a knife? They could have tasered him. The could have shot him in the leg. This was murder once removed.
I'm curious, why did you leave out the part about him threatening the Troopers and about refusing commands to drop the knife? Of course, your way makes it sound better for those who want to believe this guy was a "poor victim" They should have waited until he got closer to stab one of them first, or tried to shoot him in the hand. It would have been easy to do after a high speed chase of a rape and bank robbery suspect. You probably do it all the time. Which one hour cop show did you get this from? Perhaps all cops should now carry knives to even the playing field. That way cops won't ever have the upper hand. Then you'll be happy!
Ex-cop

Winsted, CT

#49 Mar 4, 2008
Tasers work well against a knife-wielding suspect when he is passive or just waving the knife around, but if someone with a knife is advancing on you, a Taser will not stop him in time.
bbj wrote:
This would have been a great time to use the Taser. I don't think the Death Penalty fits the crime in this case. Do they not have Tasers?
Ex-cop

Winsted, CT

#50 Mar 4, 2008
Visitor,

Police have done the drills over and over again in training. They have studied thousands of deadly altercations. One gunshot does not "stop" someone. I will give you a gun with wax bullets (used for training)and I will start fifteen feet from you with a rubber knife. 9 out of ten times I will be able to "cut" you before the placement of your shots would stop me.

This is real life and not the movies. A bullet to the body does not throw a person back against a wall. They often continue to move forward with the same momentum. We have seen men continue to run 100 feet even when bullets destroyed their hearts. Yes, they eventually died, but they can still shoot and swing a knife in the 10 seconds it takes to bleed out.
visitor wrote:
Once again, I am totally amazed at these comments about how the cops were in such danger, had to take control of the situation, etc. The guy had a KNIFE, for chrissakes. If he had a gun, their lives would defintely have been in danger, and shooting him would have been justified. They had him surrounded, they all had guns, he had a knife. Where is the real danger here? It doesn't matter what he may have been guilty of doing prior to this; he had a knife, they had GUNS.
An Idle Observer

Newington, CT

#51 Mar 4, 2008
Obvious wrote:
Ok, the guy had a knife and a bunch of state troopers and hartford police had guns...what is the threat here again? Couldn't they have shot him in the leg to keep him from running away?
And then he bleeds to death because they hit the femoral artery? Stop watching westerns. Cops are trained to shoot at center mass, i.e. the largest target available. "Wingshooters" only exist onVersus and in Buffalo Bill's wild West Show.
Louie

Wallingford, CT

#52 Mar 4, 2008
One less POS to clog the "justice" system. We need more of this, and less BS in the courts with lawyers making fortunes at taxpayer expense.

Bullets are much cheaper than freaking lawyers.

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