The Deafness Before the Storm

“Mind over Matter”

Since: Oct 09

Location hidden

#21 Sep 14, 2012
Now we know he has cataracts :):):)
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#22 Sep 14, 2012
Wabash wrote:
I am aware of Nazi references by both parties. Those inferences should not be made. I gather my news from more than one outlet. You indicated that you googled for my previous article, but apparently didn't feel the need to do so in regards to only question I asked, nor did you offer your personal opinion in your last response. Again, quite telling.
Your original post carries more weight in your own mind. There is much which written which refute it's points also.
I am outta here for today. Have a great weekend.
How can you compare written intelligence memos and testimony from people like Richard Clark to anonymous sources. Why hasn't the main stream media picked up on this..........because it probably isn't true.

Why would I waste time on any Nazi references?

Your comparison of the months of warnings Bush got prior to 9/11 to the supposed 48 hr. Libyan attack warning is wild. As more Bush warnings get declassified(the basis of my article) the evidence will be even more damning. Apples and oranges..........
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#23 Sep 14, 2012
Busted, Wabash you've been HAD!

After this past Tuesday’s armed attack at our U.S. embassy in Benghazi, Libya which killed four Americans, including Ambassador Chris Stevens, the right wing media are now echoing the same line and attack almost word for word against President Obama.

They're saying that President Obama and the State Department were warned that a jihadist group at the Libyan embassy planned to use the protest as a cover for an armed attack.

Who are all these right wing "media" outlets quoting? They're quoting a story in a right wing newspaper in England called the U.K Independent.

When you do a search on Google using "America was warned of embassy attack but did nothing", almost every one of the links shown are right wing extremist sites and right wing conspiracy sites, such as Infowars and WND (World Net Daily).

And just as you have seen Republicans in congress repeating the exact language or talking points when they are pushing an issue, which is then echoed on Fox News, the same is true with these right wing extremist sites on the internet.

When you read the U.K. Independent story, and then look at the stories that show up on your Google search, you'll see that all of them can be traced back to the U.K. Independent story, a true echo chamber.

And then the conspiracies and misinformation bleed into the mainstream media which you will see in today's White House press briefing, the video of the briefing is posted with this article.

During today's White House press briefing, Press Secretary Jay Carney flatly denied the report that the Obama administration was warned about the attack on the Libyan consulate that killed four Americans, including the U.S. ambassador.“The report is false”, said Jay Carney.

"I have seen that report, and the story is absolutely wrong. We were not aware of any actionable intelligence indicating that an attack on the U.S. mission in Benghazi was planned or imminent." said Carney.

Jay Carney was referring to the U.K. Independent report which the White House press is now also citing. It just keeps going and going.

The story in the U.K. Independent said, "According to senior diplomatic sources, the U.S. State Department had credible information 48 hours before mobs charged the consulate in Benghazi, and the embassy in Cairo, that American missions may be targeted, but no warnings were given for diplomats to go on high alert and 'lockdown,' under which movement is severely restricted."

Asked if there was any intelligence, actionable or not, about a possible attack in Libya, Carney said:

"There was no intelligence that in any way could have been acted on to prevent these attacks. The report suggested that there was intelligence that was available prior to this that led us to believe that this facility would be attacked, and that is false."

Carney was asked about the security at the consulate in Benghazi, Libya:

"There was a security presence. It was, unfortunately, not enough to resist the attacks that we saw and resulted in the tragic loss of life, but there was security."

Carney added: "The president has ordered that we review all of our security arrangements for embassy facilities and other diplomatic facilities around the world."

Why are you seeing these attacks on President Obama? Because Republican Presidential candidate Mitt Romney politicized the attacks which killed four Americans before he had more information and used the dead as a backdrop for a press conference.

The mainstream media which is most everything that is not right wing, have condemned Romney for politicizing the deaths of four Americans. Now these right wing “media” outlets are trying to change the subject and media focus from Romney onto Obama.

This is a tactic that the right wing media is very good at, and they have deployed this maneuver numerous times.

Kendallville, IN

#24 Sep 24, 2012
Smart Girl wrote:
You will surely admit that the anti Islam movie is the reason for the worldwide attacks?
Just checking to see if your position has changed now that the administrations has.
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#25 Sep 24, 2012
Wabash, your source has been proved to be bogus! Give it up!

Kendallville, IN

#26 Sep 24, 2012
Nothing bogus about it, especially in light of the adminstrations position change. Have you not been following this? The White House has backed off considerably from its intial response. This has been reported on CNN, ABC, NBC, Fox and just about everywhere else. This administation has jumped the gun with responses in the past without having all or hardly any of the facts in order to save face. It is being shown to have done so once again.
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#27 Sep 24, 2012
You're trying to resurrect a dead hose for further beating,ulrich. This story is old news. Move along...........

United States

#28 Sep 24, 2012
Further beating? You seem to be hoping by closing your ears and eyes it will go away.

Kendallville, IN

#29 Sep 24, 2012
That does seem to be the Democratic party line though. I've noticed it more and more this past year. "Move along. Nothing to see here."

Kendallville, IN

#30 Sep 24, 2012
How about a brand new topic then. With the unrest in the Middle East, why wouldn't President Obama meet today with other presidents and prime ministers instead of taping an episode of The View. A few days ago, Netanyahu asked to meet with Obama. He said he didn't have time, yet found time to meet with the Muslim Brotherhood and do an interview on Letterman. Do you think the priorities are in line?

Kendallville, IN

#31 Sep 24, 2012
And btw, the thread topic is much older news than Libya. Our President has had 3 1/2 years to make policy, 2 of which he had a Democratically controlled House and Senate. Basically a blank check to put into place anything he wanted. What happened?

Are you aware that Obama, just last week stated that Fast and Furious was started under the Bush administration? Blatant lie. Quite frankly, the "Blame Bush" rhetoric is getting old.

“Mind over Matter”

Since: Oct 09

Location hidden

#32 Sep 24, 2012
The Deafness Before the Storm

" The Deafness " definitely applies to boring Karl the plagiarist.....
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#33 Sep 24, 2012
Wabash wrote:
And btw, the thread topic is much older news than Libya. Our President has had 3 1/2 years to make policy, 2 of which he had a Democratically controlled House and Senate. Basically a blank check to put into place anything he wanted. What happened?
Are you aware that Obama, just last week stated that Fast and Furious was started under the Bush administration? Blatant lie. Quite frankly, the "Blame Bush" rhetoric is getting old.
Six bluedog Dems(DINOS) prevented a filibuster-proof 60 votes to break the GOP obstruction.

Bush first had operation gunrunner,then Wide Receiver. Fast and Furious was just a continuation with a new name. The lastest investigation cleared Holder and blamed ATF. Wrong again wabash/ulrich!

"Another of those criticized, Justice Department career attorney Jason Weinstein, resigned. Weinstein was a deputy assistant attorney general in Justice's criminal division in Washington.

"Weinstein was the most senior person in the department in April and May 2010 who was in a position to identify the similarity between the inappropriate tactics used in Operations Wide Receiver and Fast and Furious," the report said. ATF agents in Arizona conducted Wide Receiver in 2006 and 2007 and began Fast and Furious in October 2009."
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#34 Sep 24, 2012
Another GOPer witch hunt by Darrel Issa

Holder cleared on ‘Fast and Furious’

By Anna Fifield in Washington
The US justice department said it had found no evidence that Eric Holder, the attorney general, knew anything about the botched “Fast and Furious” gun-smuggling operation that put American weapons in the hands of Mexican drug cartels.

However, the internal review recommended that 14 employees should be disciplined for their roles in the programme, including Lanny Breuer, who leads the department’s criminal division.


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The long-awaited report into the controversy concluded that the operation was “seriously flawed and supervised irresponsibly” by federal officials in the border state of Arizona.

Mr Holder said that “the key conclusions are consistent with what I, and other Justice Department officials, have said for many months now”.

The “Fast and Furious” operation was started during the Bush administration and was conducted by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF), which tried to monitor weapons bought by Mexican drug cartels.

However, it lost track of more than 2,000 guns it had allowed fake buyers to take over the border, and two of the missing firearms were found at the scene where Brian Terry, a US border patrol agent, was killed in 2010.

The Republican-led House of Representatives in June held Mr Holder in contempt over the botched operation, accusing him of obstructing Congress’s investigation, marking the first time a sitting cabinet member had been censured in this way.

But in a 471-page report, Michael Horowitz, the justice department’s inspector general, concluded that there was “no evidence that ... Holder was informed about Operation Fast and Furious, or learned about the tactics employed” before Congress began asking him for information about it last year.

However, Mr Horowitz faulted the ATF agency for “a series of misguided strategies, tactics, errors in judgment, and management failures”. He singled out Mr Breuer for not recognising the shortcomings in the operation, during which ATF agents allowed suspected gun traffickers for Mexican drug cartels to take guns across the border, hoping they could then track the weapons to cartel kingpins.

The report said that no federal official, either in Arizona or Washington, tried to put a stop to the operation until two of the weapons that were supposed to be tracked were found at the scene where Mr Terry was shot dead.

Some of the officials cited in the report stepped down on Wednesday.

Ken Melson, who was acting director of ATF at the time, was retiring effective immediately, the justice department said, while Jason Weinstein, another official who was faulted for not alerting Mr Holder to the problems, resigned.

Mr Holder hit out at Republicans on Capitol Hill who had tried to tarnish his department over the incident.

“It is unfortunate that some were so quick to make baseless accusations before they possessed the facts about these operations – accusations that turned out to be without foundation and that have caused a great deal of unnecessary harm and confusion,” he said in a statement.

But Darrell Issa, who leads the House oversight committee that started the contempt proceedings against Mr Holder, was not backing down.

Valdosta, GA

#35 Sep 24, 2012
Fast and furious was put into operation in 2009. Sorry, your busted. There is documentation of such. There aint't no getting around it. Where do you get your news? Can you possibly interpret something on your own, then express it in your own words? This copy and paste stuff is not very intellectually stimulating. Also, it is a sad state of affairs when one doesn't know what is going on in his own department. Is Holder that ill informed or plain stupid? Who or what is (an) ulrich?
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#36 Sep 25, 2012
I have documentation..........your source is your ass! The ATF has its own boss. The operation started under BUSH..........only the name was changed. This is another Darrel Issa witch hunt and the GOP lost another one!
Smart Girl

Claremont, IL

#37 Sep 25, 2012
Wabash/ulrich,your whole premise is bogus yet again!
Fast And Furious Report: No Evidence DOJ Leadership Knew Of Gunwalking Tactics

Ryan J. Reilly-September 19, 2012, 2:15 PM5914
UPDATED: September 19, 2012, 6:05 PM

There is no evidence that Attorney General Eric Holder and high-ranking officials at the Justice Department knew that guns were allowed to “walk” during an ATF operation known as Fast and Furious, according to a report released on Wednesday afternoon by the department’s internal watchdog.

Following a 19-month investigation, the Inspector General found that the decision not to take action against low-level “straw purchasers” was made by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) and the Arizona U.S. Attorney’s office. Their decision, according to the report,“was primarily the result of tactical and strategic decisions by the agents and prosecutors, rather than because of any legal limitation on their ability to do so.” Dennis Burke, the head of the U.S. Attorney’s office at the time, resigned from his position in August 2011.

The IG report is considered to be the most comprehensive and least partisan account of the scandal available to date. Unlike investigators with Rep. Darrell Issa’s House Oversight Committee, DOJ investigators had access to criminal investigation files.

Fast and Furious was the Arizona component of a broader effort to combat gun trafficking known as Project Gunrunner, which had previously come under fire from the Inspector General for failing to net “higher-level traffickers, smugglers, and the ultimate recipients of the trafficked guns.” Instead of going after the straw purchasers during Fast and Furious, ATF investigators allegedly made an effort to find the kingpins of the operation and deal a bigger blow to the trafficking network. But in doing so, agents lost track of many of the weapons, allowing them to flow into the hands of criminals on both sides of the border. One of the weapons connected to the investigation was found at the scene of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry’s murder in December 2010.

As a result of the report, former acting ATF Director Ken Melson resigned from his latest position as an advisor on forensic science issues at the Justice Department. Likewise, Deputy Assistant Attorney General Jason Weinstein also resigned despite strongly disagreeing with the report’s conclusions.

The National Rifle Association and a number of Republican members of Congress have floated a bizzarre and far-fetched conspiracy theory that the Obama administration purposefully allowed weapons to “walk” to Mexico in an effort to boost the number of U.S. weapons found in the country and increase political support for gun control. Not surprisingly, the Inspector General found no evidence that ATF’s Phoenix office initiated Fast and Furious to obtain legislation requiring gun dealers to report bulk rifle sales, as they already do with handguns.

The report also found high-ranking DOJ officials did not purposefully provide false information in a Feb. 4, 2011 letter to Congress that responded to questions about the operation. The report found that Burke as well as then-Acting ATF Director Ken Melson and ATF Deputy Director Billy Hoover provided the information the officials relied on and “failed to exercise appropriate oversight of the investigation, and to some extent were themselves receiving incorrect or incomplete information from their subordinates about it.”

In comments aimed at Issa and other House Republicans, Holder said it was “unfortunate that some were so quick to make baseless accusations before they possessed the facts about these operations — accusations that turned out to be without foundation and that have caused a great deal of unnecessary harm and confusion.”

Kendallville, IN

#38 Sep 25, 2012
Cut and paste opinion piece from the far left TPM site. No words of your own. You really need to broaden your news sources. Fast and Furious was started in October 2009. That is fact. Testimony from Dems before Congress verifies it.

Kendallville, IN

#39 Sep 25, 2012
And again, who or what is ulrich?

Kendallville, IN

#40 Sep 25, 2012
And one final question. If you chose to answer it factually, your fallacy is exposed. If you chose to be untruthful, there is no longer any need to debate.

What year was Operation Gun Runner terminated?

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