Odenton Forum

Family of drowned boy sues country club

Jul 21, 2006 Baltimore Examiner 60
Surrounded by photographs of their dead son, the parents of Connor Freed, the 5-year-old Davidsonville boy who drowned in a Crofton pool last month, announced Thursday a $20 million wrongful death lawsuit ... Read more ...

anonymous of Englewood, CO on Jul 21, 2006

i understand what this family is going through but what they fail to realize is that they arent the only ones affected. the lifeguard at this facility is going to be tramitized for life. i feel as though the person who brought him to the pool is equally at fault. lifeguards are there to HELP watch everyone. the five year shouldnt have went to the bathroom by himself. there are more than one person at fault and the family needs to recognize that. sorry to say but the little boy didnt die at the pool, the lifeguard did what she/he was trained to do and accidents do happen.

anonymous of Auburn Hills, MI on Jul 22, 2006

actually the little boy did die at the pool...he was braindead as soon as they pulled him out of the water..they just announced it an hour after b/c they were trying everything possible to bring him back. i feel as though it is a lifeguards duty to look out for the children/adults swimming in that pool. that is their job, that is what they are there for, and that is what their paid for. They aren't even the one's who noticed that he drowned. He didnt just instantly drown. I'm sure he splashed around, yelled, or at least called for help. If there were "four" lifeguards on duty someone should have realized he wasnt safe before a little girl already noticed he was dead...
anonymous wrote:
i understand what this family is going through but what they fail to realize is that they arent the only ones affected. the lifeguard at this facility is going to be tramitized for life. i feel as though the person who brought him to the pool is equally at fault. lifeguards are there to HELP watch everyone. the five year shouldnt have went to the bathroom by himself. there are more than one person at fault and the family needs to recognize that. sorry to say but the little boy didnt die at the pool, the lifeguard did what she/he was trained to do and accidents do happen.

Anonymous of Denver, CO on Jul 24, 2006

First of all, if you read the original stories that the general manager of Crofton Country Club told (read the newspapers) 1. there were four lifeguards on duty and they were all on post 2. the lifeguard pulled him out of the pool quickly 3. we used all necassary devices and techniques to save the childs life 4. all lifeguards responded appropriately and quickly. The REAL truth... there were 40 to 50 kids in the pool with ONE lifeguard on duty, the other three lifeguards were not even around the pool deck and not watching the pool. The general manager was nowhere to be found and is required to be on the grounds. 2. The lifeguard in the chair, after noticing the boy floating in the pool (probably for 4 or 5 minutes) began to blow the whistle at him, thinking he was playing a game and continued to sit and not respond in her chair. 3. After a little girl and two members finally pulled the boy out of the pool, the lifeguard in the chair STILL did not respond and pool members had to go get the other lifeguards that were not at their posts and also call the general manager and explain to them that they better respond quickly because there was a boy on the deck that had drowned. 4. Finally after responding, the lifeguards that came to the boy to provide first aid, began to incorrectly perform CPR as documented on the 911 tapes. 5. Furthermore, the lifesaving apparatus which the general manager said he used, never was used by the GM or any of the lifeguards.
Yes, people are responsible for their children but if you allow your child to go to a pool which is protected by LIFEguards you can reasonably expect that the personel of the pool can provide maybe one of the following, and the child would not have died. 1. Correct lifeguard supervision, atleast 3 lifeguards on duty. 2. Constant supervision of the pool. 3. Quick response to ANY emergency situations. 4. Knowledge of CPR techniques and lifesaving procedures. 5. Knowledge of how to use difibulator on premise, which is simple to use. 6. Overall emergency techniques and procedures to be followed in case of situations like this.
So, yes, your comments may be correct if ONE of these things was done. But in totality, the non performance of all the aforementioned problems caused the death of the little boy. And, if you have a child that you bring to a guarded beach, pool, playground, etc, and the club provides a false sense of security, then why have lifeguards at all? The parents would be better off knowing that the lifeguards would provide no help in times of emergency and therefore would not let their children go to clubs such as this at all.
If you read the latest newspapers, the parents did not blame the lifeguard, they blamed the lack of training provided by the pool and the Country Club.
anonymous wrote:
i understand what this family is going through but what they fail to realize is that they arent the only ones affected. the lifeguard at this facility is going to be tramitized for life. i feel as though the person who brought him to the pool is equally at fault. lifeguards are there to HELP watch everyone. the five year shouldnt have went to the bathroom by himself. there are more than one person at fault and the family needs to recognize that. sorry to say but the little boy didnt die at the pool, the lifeguard did what she/he was trained to do and accidents do happen.

Anony of Schuylkill Haven, PA on Jul 26, 2006

WHAT?! That is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. That's like saying "Oh, sorry about your son that was shot, but think about how the person who shot him feels? Now he has to go to jail!" Obviously the lifeguards did NOT know what to do, or he would still be here today. If you watch the news and read the latest articles, everything that they did was done the wrong way. The family said in every recent article that they do NOT blame the lifeguards, they blame the lack of training. They obivously weren't trained for something like this; and this incident proves it.
anonymous wrote:
i understand what this family is going through but what they fail to realize is that they arent the only ones affected. the lifeguard at this facility is going to be tramitized for life. i feel as though the person who brought him to the pool is equally at fault. lifeguards are there to HELP watch everyone. the five year shouldnt have went to the bathroom by himself. there are more than one person at fault and the family needs to recognize that. sorry to say but the little boy didnt die at the pool, the lifeguard did what she/he was trained to do and accidents do happen.

Amanda of Jackson, MI on Jul 26, 2006

anonymous wrote:
i understand what this family is going through but what they fail to realize is that they arent the only ones affected. the lifeguard at this facility is going to be tramitized for life. i feel as though the person who brought him to the pool is equally at fault. lifeguards are there to HELP watch everyone. the five year shouldnt have went to the bathroom by himself. there are more than one person at fault and the family needs to recognize that. sorry to say but the little boy didnt die at the pool, the lifeguard did what she/he was trained to do and accidents do happen.
Connor actually was dead on scene. The media made a mistake.

Anonymous of AOL on Jul 28, 2006

The pools lack of training is 100% at fault for the boy's death. No they didn't push him in(as far as i know), No they didn't tell him to jump in. BUT if they were trained like a life guard is suppose to than the 5yr old would still be here today. I do not blame the family at all for sueing the country club. It will not bring there loved one back, but it could possibly save another one's life.

anonymous of Woodstock, MD on Jul 29, 2006

Anonymous wrote:
The pools lack of training is 100% at fault for the boy's death. No they didn't push him in(as far as i know), No they didn't tell him to jump in. BUT if they were trained like a life guard is suppose to than the 5yr old would still be here today. I do not blame the family at all for sueing the country club. It will not bring there loved one back, but it could possibly save another one's life.
What about the guy who brought the kid and went to his car, leaving the boy alone? Why would he not accept at least part of the blame? If he had not left that boy alone then he would be alive today. How is that different than the lifeguards?

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 1, 2006

anonymous wrote:
<quoted text>
What about the guy who brought the kid and went to his car, leaving the boy alone? Why would he not accept at least part of the blame? If he had not left that boy alone then he would be alive today. How is that different than the lifeguards?
bad info......the guy was on the pool deck @ the time and helped pull the boy out

Anonymous of Ypsilanti, MI on Aug 3, 2006

I have had lifeguard training from that particular company and it was thorough and good. I have had the chance to see many pool companies in action and believe me, this is one of the best. I am very sad that this horrific accident happened under their supervision. Having been a lifeguard and having supervised many others, I now know that many lifeguards are not as worried about the safety of the public as they should be and, quite frankly, can be very lazy and careless at times. Please remember every time you go to a pool that you are putting your well being (and that of your family) in the hands of a TEENAGER. They do not always make the best decisions. There is only so much training that can be done. I do not blame the pool company at all, even though I no longer work for them.

anonymous of Tracys Landing, MD on Aug 4, 2006

anom wrote:
<quoted text>bad info......the guy was on the pool deck @ the time and helped pull the boy out
Pulled the kid out yes...but he left the boy unattended in the bathroom after removing the boy's floaty vest...the boy heard the whistle signaling the end of the adult swim and off he ran into the pool. Where was the guy then?

anonymous of Tracys Landing, MD on Aug 4, 2006

Anonymous wrote:
I have had lifeguard training from that particular company and it was thorough and good. I have had the chance to see many pool companies in action and believe me, this is one of the best. I am very sad that this horrific accident happened under their supervision. Having been a lifeguard and having supervised many others, I now know that many lifeguards are not as worried about the safety of the public as they should be and, quite frankly, can be very lazy and careless at times. Please remember every time you go to a pool that you are putting your well being (and that of your family) in the hands of a TEENAGER. They do not always make the best decisions. There is only so much training that can be done. I do not blame the pool company at all, even though I no longer work for them.
So right...the man who brought the boy was not a teenager. He made the first fatal mistake. But if people assume he is suffering now...so are the teenagers.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 5, 2006

anonymous wrote:
<quoted text>
Pulled the kid out yes...but he left the boy unattended in the bathroom after removing the boy's floaty vest...the boy heard the whistle signaling the end of the adult swim and off he ran into the pool. Where was the guy then?
ARE YOU BLAMING THIS ON THE CHILD? First of all, the boy DID NOT just run and jump into the pool. There's been many witnesses who say the boy was extremely careful all day, he was the kind of child who was VERY cautious with everything he did and more than once during the day went up to the man to ask him to tighten his vest. He wouldn't even get into the shallow end without his vest. Yes, the man who brought him to the pool was definitely at fault for letting the kid go to the bathroom by himself, but an accident like this could've happened to ANYONE. And LIFEguards are supposed to be there to know what they're doing to help bring the child back. All he needed was a good couple of breaths and CORRECTLY done CPR and he would've been brought back. Even if the boy HAD run and jumped into the pool -- where was the lifeguard to tell him to stop running? A lifeguard, of all people, should notice children running around the pool. That's their JOB, that's what they get payed for. How many people let children go to the bathroom by themselves? Alot. Are you a parent? How would you feel if this happened to you? Just think about that. Because of a lifeguards lack of training; and/or not knowing what to do, they have to live without watching their little boy grow up, and live without him for the rest of their lives. There is no other word for this but tragic. And the sad thing was, it should've been prevented. There was many different opportunitys for this tradegy to be prevented, and none of them were taken into action before it was too late.

Ashley of Lilburn, GA on Aug 6, 2006

True Connor probably shouldn't have gone to the bathroom himself, or should've been told to go back to his guardian before getting back in the pool, but lots of children younger than Connor go to the bathroom by themselves. Their friend is not at fault for taking him, but I guarantee you he blames himself. The lifeguard and pool is most definitely at fault. There should have been more lifeguards actually at their post. Even if the lifeguards did have good training, there should have been a supervisor to notice they were being lazy and reprimand them. Hopefully this will keep them from being lazy in the future. As for the lifeguard freezing up and doing nothing, that's just wrong. You should not be a lifeguard if you are not capable of reacting to save a life. This pool needs to reevaluate their lifeguards and let go of the ones that are not up to the task. As should all pools.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 6, 2006

Anonymous wrote:
I have had lifeguard training from that particular company and it was thorough and good. I have had the chance to see many pool companies in action and believe me, this is one of the best. I am very sad that this horrific accident happened under their supervision. Having been a lifeguard and having supervised many others, I now know that many lifeguards are not as worried about the safety of the public as they should be and, quite frankly, can be very lazy and careless at times. Please remember every time you go to a pool that you are putting your well being (and that of your family) in the hands of a TEENAGER. They do not always make the best decisions. There is only so much training that can be done. I do not blame the pool company at all, even though I no longer work for them.
I have also had plenty of lifeguard training and if this situation happened at our pool, not only would all the lifeguards have been fired on duty, but also the pool operator. There were many opportunities for the lifeguards to save the child (as lifeguards know, the simplest one would've been to blow the whistle and tell the boy to move to the 3 feet, something which is done 100's of times a day) But, obviously, the staff of this pool was poorly trained and now are suffering because they did not react when they were supposed to. It seems to me that this pool is poorly run and that probably starts with a pool operator (Where was the pool operator when this all happened?)

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 6, 2006

Anonymous wrote:
I have had lifeguard training from that particular company and it was thorough and good. I have had the chance to see many pool companies in action and believe me, this is one of the best. I am very sad that this horrific accident happened under their supervision. Having been a lifeguard and having supervised many others, I now know that many lifeguards are not as worried about the safety of the public as they should be and, quite frankly, can be very lazy and careless at times. Please remember every time you go to a pool that you are putting your well being (and that of your family) in the hands of a TEENAGER. They do not always make the best decisions. There is only so much training that can be done. I do not blame the pool company at all, even though I no longer work for them.
I have also been a lifeguard for many years and if this happened at our pool (It would never have happened because of the many missed opportunities) The whole staff that was on duty, including the operator, would be responsible and would have been fired. Obviously, the lifeguards at that pool were not trained well and did not know how to respond to ANY situations, let alone a drowning. And by the way, many kids come to the public pool every day without parents or guardians and we watch them as lifeguards because it's our responsibility to make sure that no one drowns or gets hurt.

anom of Riva, MD on Aug 7, 2006

anom wrote:
<quoted text>
ARE YOU BLAMING THIS ON THE CHILD? First of all, the boy DID NOT just run and jump into the pool. There's been many witnesses who say the boy was extremely careful all day, he was the kind of child who was VERY cautious with everything he did and more than once during the day went up to the man to ask him to tighten his vest. He wouldn't even get into the shallow end without his vest. Yes, the man who brought him to the pool was definitely at fault for letting the kid go to the bathroom by himself, but an accident like this could've happened to ANYONE. And LIFEguards are supposed to be there to know what they're doing to help bring the child back. All he needed was a good couple of breaths and CORRECTLY done CPR and he would've been brought back. Even if the boy HAD run and jumped into the pool -- where was the lifeguard to tell him to stop running? A lifeguard, of all people, should notice children running around the pool. That's their JOB, that's what they get payed for. How many people let children go to the bathroom by themselves? Alot. Are you a parent? How would you feel if this happened to you? Just think about that. Because of a lifeguards lack of training; and/or not knowing what to do, they have to live without watching their little boy grow up, and live without him for the rest of their lives. There is no other word for this but tragic. And the sad thing was, it should've been prevented. There was many different opportunitys for this tradegy to be prevented, and none of them were taken into action before it was too late.
What your missing is that the boy was five and spent all day in a floating device...he became used to having it...he jumped into the pool because he had been doing it all day...the guardian should not allow a boy of that age or one who lacks swimming ability to go in the deep end...EVER! It is not the boy's fault (and I never said ti was)...but it is the guardian's fault...people become complacent when they use floatation devices...and the pool is at fault for allowing the original rule to be waved...this pool had a rule that NO child requiring a floatation device could be in the deep end...the devices were banned from the pool. Two years ago they changed that rule because parents complained. All of this lead to the drowning. As for NO running rules...they exist and the guards call kids on it all the time...but when that whistle blows, the kids run into the pool, they are either sitting on the side of the pool waiting or on the chairs on the side of the pool waiting. This boy was in the bathroom...but he obviously came out of the bathroom...where was the guardian (at his car in the parking lot!) If he had been there...would it not have been his inclination to tell this child NOT to run...yes I am a parent...my children are never out of my sight at the pool...no five year old should go unattended to a bathroom - do you send your five year old into the bathroom at a mall or store? It is unsafe, plain and simple for lots of reasons. And the guards noticing that the child was in the deep end...this kid had a vest on all day, he was not a regular member of the pool, os the guards did not know him...without the vest, my guess is he looked very different, so how are they to notice he is the boy who couldn't swim? That said, he may very well not have struggled...if he sunk in the deep end but had been prepared to float, as he had all day in his vest, then he likely swallowed water immediately...no struggling...all the people around the pool, including the middle school kids in the water, never saw the boy struggle - so how could the lifeguard? Yes freezing at the point that they were called to action is a critical mistake, so they are not blameless...but lets put the blame where it belongs...on everyone involved.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 7, 2006

anom wrote:
<quoted text>
What your missing is that the boy was five and spent all day in a floating device...he became used to having it...he jumped into the pool because he had been doing it all day...the guardian should not allow a boy of that age or one who lacks swimming ability to go in the deep end...EVER! It is not the boy's fault (and I never said ti was)...but it is the guardian's fault...people become complacent when they use floatation devices...and the pool is at fault for allowing the original rule to be waved...this pool had a rule that NO child requiring a floatation device could be in the deep end...the devices were banned from the pool. Two years ago they changed that rule because parents complained. All of this lead to the drowning. As for NO running rules...they exist and the guards call kids on it all the time...but when that whistle blows, the kids run into the pool, they are either sitting on the side of the pool waiting or on the chairs on the side of the pool waiting. This boy was in the bathroom...but he obviously came out of the bathroom...where was the guardian (at his car in the parking lot!) If he had been there...would it not have been his inclination to tell this child NOT to run...yes I am a parent...my children are never out of my sight at the pool...no five year old should go unattended to a bathroom - do you send your five year old into the bathroom at a mall or store? It is unsafe, plain and simple for lots of reasons. And the guards noticing that the child was in the deep end...this kid had a vest on all day, he was not a regular member of the pool, os the guards did not know him...without the vest, my guess is he looked very different, so how are they to notice he is the boy who couldn't swim? That said, he may very well not have struggled...if he sunk in the deep end but had been prepared to float, as he had all day in his vest, then he likely swallowed water immediately...no struggling...all the people around the pool, including the middle school kids in the water, never saw the boy struggle - so how could the lifeguard? Yes freezing at the point that they were called to action is a critical mistake, so they are not blameless...but lets put the blame where it belongs...on everyone involved.
It's not the people at the pool, or the kids at the pool having fun, it's the person trained to watch the pool, whether the person has a floaty on or doesn't have a floaty on. That person is called the LIFEguard (and it sounds to me that the general manager didn't take his job seriously so that's probably why the lifeguards didn't either)

A Lifeguard of San Jose, CA on Aug 7, 2006

The parents should of not let him go to the pool with someone that couldn't handle the responsibility of watching a 5 year old boy. Even if he was only out of sight for 20 seconds thats all it takes for someone of any age to drown. You should never leave children unattended because accidents happen especially a child who can't swim. The parents say they don't put any blame on the person who was supposed to be watching their child but I think its just easier to attack the lifeguards. I feel bad for the guards, being a lifeguard my self. I chose to do what I do because I like to help people and keep them safe regardless of training and I'm sure the guards there did not intend for this to happen. We all hope something like this will never happen at our pool. Its a horrible thing but accidents happen all the time. at the pool or anywhere else. Even if the guard blew the whistle at the boy for running there is the same chance of survival for a 5 year old who can't swim by himself in the pool. Bottom line a 5 year old who can't swim shouldn't have been left alone at a crowded pool.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 8, 2006

The fact of the matter here is that the lifeguards wouldn't HAVE to live with that guilt, if they would've done their job correctly in the first place. I put the blame 50% on the man who brought him to the pool and 50% on the lifeguards. Because this accident could've happened with ANYONE... it's a very normal thing for parents to let their child go the pool, or anywhere, with friends/family. Yes, accidents DO happen. But when you bring your child to a PUBLIC pool -- you expect for the lifeguards to know what they're doing in the case of an emergency. And obviously, they didn't.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 9, 2006

dr renntiger wrote:
Sue the parents for not taking care of there kid.
thats clever....hey do you have rifles....maybe we can head over to waco and take on the govt.

beth of AOL on Aug 14, 2006

dr renntiger wrote:
Sue the parents for not taking care of there kid.
EXCUSE ME, sue the parents for not taking care of there kid .. ONE the parents were not there, he was with a trusted family friend. havint you ever let your child go with a familys friend? YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY ARE GOING THROUGH, LET ALONE WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. so next time you make a stupid comment like that, think about it and think .. what if it was you, would u want people too say that about you. they loved there son, they still do. they are sueing so other kids don't have a accident like this.

Amanda of Jackson, MI on Aug 15, 2006

The parents do not blame their friend that took Connor to the pool. Their friend is so beat up over it it is indescribeable how he feels. They dont even blame the lifeguards! They blame the people who trained the lifeguards. Alot of the money they are suing for is being donated to training lifeguards. They didn't even know how to use the AED....It tells you what to do. It even has a picture as to where to put the pidi pads on a child.
A Lifeguard wrote:
The parents should of not let him go to the pool with someone that couldn't handle the responsibility of watching a 5 year old boy. Even if he was only out of sight for 20 seconds thats all it takes for someone of any age to drown. You should never leave children unattended because accidents happen especially a child who can't swim. The parents say they don't put any blame on the person who was supposed to be watching their child but I think its just easier to attack the lifeguards. I feel bad for the guards, being a lifeguard my self. I chose to do what I do because I like to help people and keep them safe regardless of training and I'm sure the guards there did not intend for this to happen. We all hope something like this will never happen at our pool. Its a horrible thing but accidents happen all the time. at the pool or anywhere else. Even if the guard blew the whistle at the boy for running there is the same chance of survival for a 5 year old who can't swim by himself in the pool. Bottom line a 5 year old who can't swim shouldn't have been left alone at a crowded pool.

Amanda of Jackson, MI on Aug 15, 2006

You're retarded
dr renntiger wrote:
Sue the parents for not taking care of there kid.

VFC of Baltimore, MD on Aug 16, 2006

The situation is a great tragedy, however it underlies everything America has become.
The quote made above "they are sueing so other kids don't have a accident like this" scores the point. The kid did not have an accident because the lifeguards were not trained. The kid had the accident because he wasn't being watched. There were many points of failure before the lifeguard had a chance to react. I take my kids to the neighborhood pools all the time. At no point do I ever let my younger one walk away from our chair without his life vest on, because accidents happen (even during adult swim). At no point do my children go to the bathroom alone, because accidents happen. And at no point do I expect a lifeguard to be able to keep an eye on everyone and everything in a full pool. At the end of the day the kid is the responisibility of the parent, or in this case, the guardian. Don't read this as pointing blame towards him, just acknowledging that accidents happen and that if you are going to sue the lifeguard trainers or the lifeguard or country club, you're missing the many points of failure before them.
How about the people involved in the incident do public speaking on child safety, why it is so important not let our children out of our sight? Or pool safety, always keep the floaties on. This is America, the land of the internet wacko and child molester, our kids should be in our sights at all times, especially in public places. Our society has a tendency to get complacent, and I think we're very complacent about our children. I go to the pool and sometimes I'm amazed at the lack of attention paid to the children by the parents, the kids be off on the other side of the pool with the parents talking, chatting, whatever, but not watching the kids. I don't understand how people are comfortable doing that. I've even heard people say that someone else will watch them when asked who's watching their kids. Would we be so lax with our wallets?
Hopefully, instead of trying to place blame, everyone in this community should try to take something valuable from this incident, or that poor little boy will have been lost in vein.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 16, 2006

^ Yes, you make some great points. And your completely right, the person should've been watching the child better. And I know the person is completely blaming himself. Anybody would. But, when you send a kid to the bathroom three times periodically through the day and they come back every time, your expecting the same thing to happen again. Why would you think anything differently? If the parents had been there that day, I'm sure things would've been completely different. But in the end, it COULD'VE happened with anyone, and your expecting the lifeguards to know what to do in the case of an emergency, and they completely didn't. From the reports, the child was pulled out of the pool by two members (including the person who was with the boy) as the lifeguard continued to sit in her chair, freezing up. That just shows lack of training/lack of knowing what to do. Each member tried to do CPR on the child, but didn't know what to do (thats not their job to know what to do) and the child threw up, and then all he would've needed was a couple good breaths and correctly done CPR, and it wasn't done. By the time the lifeguards actually came over, 4 minutes or so had gone by, and the child was done. The boy was laying there helplessly, dying, and the lifeguards did not know what to do. From what I've heard and read, the parents were extremely overprotective and was out of their hands for two hours during the day, and this happens. You can't place blame on the parents, nearly every parent lets their child go with somebody else at one point. If your letting your child drive in a car with somebody else, that's just as risky - if not more. When you think your letting your child go to a Country Club where there's supposely trained lifeguards, you never think this could happen. Usually drownings happen in your own backyard, under the parent's watch, from a parent just turning their eyes for a second. The pool had become very laxed with their guards, and felt invincible as if nothing bad could ever happen at their pool. And when it did, they didn't know what to do and it cost the child his life.

VFC of United States on Aug 20, 2006

I read what youíre saying, anom, if the lifeguard did not know how to react, or did not react, that is shameful. And I take nothing away from the person blaming himself, as it CAN happen to anyone. A few things do stand out at me though.
1. The following quote is a testament to my point about complacency..Ē But, when you send a kid to the bathroom three times periodically through the day and they come back every time, your expecting the same thing to happen again. Why would you think anything differently?Ē
Complacency such as this is the cause of 90+% of fatal accidents in life, to the guys zipping in and out of traffic on 295 until he nicks the car in front of him killing himself and a family of four; to the guy who had the last drink because he drove home drunk every night before, then he kills someone on the way home; to the country that thought 9-11 could not happen to them. Complacency is a killer. To question why someone wouldnít expect the same result every time is COMPLACENCY at itís best. Would we leave our wallets out of our sights in a public place as long as weíll let our young children out of our sights?
2. Blaming the training to me seems like too much of a generalization, unless there is proof the training wasnít done. People react to highly stressful situations differently, and most of the time a person knows how he/she will react in a high stress encounter. It is this persons individual responsibility to use common sense and not take on the position that will put them in a high-stress situation, however, the complacency side of someone will say,ďwhat are the chances that will happen to me?Ē Itís a summer job. Itís easier in our country to point blame at a generalization, but not an individual instance. Letís not lose sight of the causes of these tragediesÖ..
3. Iím a product of our society and I put little faith in people I do not know. Once I get to know someone I will put faith in them. Gone are the days where youíre respected until you lose it. These are the days where you need to earn respect. Many of these lifeguards are very well qualified, but I donít know the person behind the qualification until I interact with the person. These kids are taking on a summer job. Theyíre trained, sure, but how will this teenager react in an emergency situation? To me, the real travesty of that day is the fact that NO ONE AT THE POOL KNEW WHAT TO DO AS THEY WATCHED THE POOR BOY DIE. As anom stated, FOUR MINUTES WENT BY AND NO ONE KNEW HOW TO SAVE THAT KID. As a community we should be ashamed of ourselves. We only get one shot at this thing called life and we should all be able to save the lives of the ones we love, or help the ones we donít know. CPR training is inexpensive and an investment that may save your family a huge loss, or save someone elseís family a huge loss. This website I found on a quick internet search. I encourage anyone who has any regular contact with children to get CPR qualified. ITS NOT THAT HARD. And tragedies like this one can be avoided.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 20, 2006

"Complacency such as this is the cause of 90+% of fatal accidents in life, to the guys zipping in and out of traffic on 295 until he nicks the car in front of him killing himself and a family of four; to the guy who had the last drink because he drove home drunk every night before, then he kills someone on the way home; to the country that thought 9-11 could not happen to them. Complacency is a killer. "

Your completely right. I totally agree.

The only thing I sort of disagree with is about how each person/lifeguard is different. It was bluntly obvious that NONE of the lifeguards knew what to do; which therefore proves that training was obviously lacking in that factor. There was four lifeguards on DECK, only one in her chair. That first thing right there proves something's wrong with that picture. When you have 30-40 people swimming in a pool, you need more than one guard up in the chair. And when an emergency situation came about, the one in her chair did NOTHING. And the other three came too late, still not knowing what to do. Doing so much as placing a mask on the child, to breath through a hole, and giving infant CPR with two fingers. That proves they had NO idea what to do.

And I completely agree that EVERYONE should know CPR, it's such a simple thing and it could've saved the child's life.

anom of Temple Hills, MD on Aug 23, 2006

Actually this info is correct - he left the boy to go to his car. The boy jumped in the pool while he was in the parking lot. A large part of the responsibility has to fall on this caretaker - the lifeguards are just a fail safe beyond this. All parties involved failed this little boy!

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 23, 2006

^

So, your saying... that ALL the kids that jump in the pool every minute of every day, with 90% of their parents/guardians not watching, is gonna drown .. but no, it's okay... it's all these parents fault. The lifeguards don't have anything to do with it.(Sarcasm)

Are you not getting..

That the LIFEGUARDS DID NOT KNOW WHAT TO DO. YES, it's the guardians responsibility to watch their kid. But the lifeguards (NONE of them) knew what to do! It's complete and total negligence. IT'S A LIFEGUARDS JOB! Thats why you HAVE lifeguards! Do you know how many parents let their kid go to the pool everyday by themselves? Lifeguards arent paying attention to whose parents are there... their supposed to be watching the pool and obviously they weren't.

So your saying.. if a kid dies at school, its the parents fault? It's basically the same. It's private, guarded, protected... kids play in the playground every day at school. So if the parents aren't there to watch their kid, its their fault. Pools have lifeguards, schools have teachers.

If you wanna take your kid to a place thats not protected you go to a lake or an ocean. It's a community, COUNTRY CLUB LIFEGUARDED POOL. You expect them to know what their doing in an emergency.

So the lifeguard didn't save the little boy because his guardian wasn't there? That's the logic your throwing out. The lifeguard should've known what to do regardless of who was watching the kid. Thats the lifeguards job. How do they even know if the guardian was there? Their job is to watch the pool.

Pools might as well not have lifeguards, if their not gonna know what to do. It'd be better for the parents to know their all on their own when it comes to saving their kid.

anonymous of Owings Mills, MD on Aug 24, 2006

anom wrote:
^
So, your saying... that ALL the kids that jump in the pool every minute of every day, with 90% of their parents/guardians not watching, is gonna drown .. but no, it's okay... it's all these parents fault. The lifeguards don't have anything to do with it.(Sarcasm)
Are you not getting..
That the LIFEGUARDS DID NOT KNOW WHAT TO DO. YES, it's the guardians responsibility to watch their kid. But the lifeguards (NONE of them) knew what to do! It's complete and total negligence. IT'S A LIFEGUARDS JOB! Thats why you HAVE lifeguards! Do you know how many parents let their kid go to the pool everyday by themselves? Lifeguards arent paying attention to whose parents are there... their supposed to be watching the pool and obviously they weren't.
So your saying.. if a kid dies at school, its the parents fault? It's basically the same. It's private, guarded, protected... kids play in the playground every day at school. So if the parents aren't there to watch their kid, its their fault. Pools have lifeguards, schools have teachers.
If you wanna take your kid to a place thats not protected you go to a lake or an ocean. It's a community, COUNTRY CLUB LIFEGUARDED POOL. You expect them to know what their doing in an emergency.
So the lifeguard didn't save the little boy because his guardian wasn't there? That's the logic your throwing out. The lifeguard should've known what to do regardless of who was watching the kid. Thats the lifeguards job. How do they even know if the guardian was there? Their job is to watch the pool.
Pools might as well not have lifeguards, if their not gonna know what to do. It'd be better for the parents to know their all on their own when it comes to saving their kid.
What your missing is...the guardian let the child become used to a floatation device all day. The guardian took that device off the child. The guardian left the child unattended without the floatation device. I count 3 major mistakes there.

Now imagine, as horrible as this is...the child who is used to jumping in a pool and immediately floating, hears the whistle, jumps in the pool. Sinks to the bottom and swallows water immediately. He never surfaces...he never struggles above water, and he is surrounded by other people on the surface, do lifeguards have xray vision? Did they know to watch this child because he was wearing a floatation device all day? The rule that allowed the child to wear it in the first place in the deep end is a mistake and that is attributed to the pool manager, so I do see this as a major liability.

NOW...the child drowned because of those mistakes...the lifeguards were inadequate and were unable to save him. That is a mistake as well, but the situation would NEVER have occurred if you remove the mistakes of the guardian from the situation.

So sue the lifeguard company to make them train the lifeguards...great, sue the pool to make them put strict rules in place...great. Why do they "NOT BLAME" the guardian? Makes nop sense to me what so ever.

anom of Columbia, MD on Aug 24, 2006

I can count 6 mistakes that the lifeguards did.

Step1- Lifeguard sees a child floating, blows the whistle at him, thinking he's playing. Has NO idea what to do.

Step2- the guardian and another member pull boy out of the pool. Member starts giving mouth to mouth. Boy pukes. Still no lifeguard around.

Step3- NO ONE knows how to do CPR correctly.(Everyone should, in reality) BUT, its the lifeguards job to know how to do that, right? Right.

Step4- A member calls 911, lifeguard in the background (as you hear on the news 911 tapes) and asks if there's a defibulator there. "Yes, but we're not allowed to use it."

Step 5- Minutes already wasted, one lifeguard still in her chair, member goes to GET the other lifeguards, as they were in the offices goofing off.. they come out.

Step6- They place a MASK on the child, which is for someone with AIDS or an infant. A lifeguard should know that. Their blowing air through a tiny hole, and the boys chest is not rising.(As quoted on the 911 tapes) Obviously, their doing wrong CPR. And obviously nobody knew what to do.

Everything that could've went wrong that day... went WRONG. The child had a chance to LIVE and if the lifeguards would've known what to do.. i guarantee you he would still be here.

Yes, the guardian made some very bad mistakes. But in the end, the lifeguards made more. They clearly had no idea what to do in the state of an emergency. And may I ask, how you seem to KNOW that the guardian left the child unattended? That was never in any articles or stated for a fact.

"The rule that allowed the child to wear it in the first place in the deep end is a mistake and that is attributed to the pool manager, so I do see this as a major liability."

That's excatly right.

The parents are not sueing the lifeguard herself, or any one person individually.

If the pool general manager had been strict, the lifeguards probably would've too. The pool felt invincible to the fact that something like this COULD happen at their pool, and became very laxed about everything.

Lifeguarding is NOT just a fun, summer job. You have to take it seriously. Kids lives are in danger every second that they are up in that chair and they need to take it seriously and KNOW what to do in the case of ANY emergency.

VFC of United States on Aug 24, 2006

Anom,
I have a feeling that you are closely involved in this situation, maybe a family member or family friend of the boy's family or guardian's family.
This isn't a forum to bring out more hurt, but to find solutions as a community to prevent these accidents in the future.
The lifeguards failed, I think that is obvious, although I was not there and I did not listen to 911 tapes. It sounds like one big Cluster went on at the pool that day, and the lifeguards, who should be able to respond to these situations, failed the boy and the community. There is no excuse for that.
Anonymous also makes a valid point however, different decisions made prior to the lifeguards actions could have prevented horrific events that took place. I donít want to place blame on the guardian, but lets not miss the valid points.
Iím new to the area, lived here a year, and after living 10 years overseas I Ďve observed many things that have changed in our society that are applicable to not necessarily this incident, but the daily complacency that causes these kinds of accidents.
1. I frequent these pools often, and I notice a LARGE majority of parents/guardians are NOT watching their children in or around the pool. I've observed this: Parents and Guardians (not all) act as if once they are on the pool grounds that the lifeguards are there to handle, watch, discipline and caretake the kids. I've seen parents with their backs turned away from the pool so they can face the sun while their kids, sometimes as young as 2 (in a floatie) jumps in and out of the pool. I've seen parents go to the bathroom, while their young children continue to play in the pool. I've seen young children go to the bathroom alone, without the parents even watching to see they get to door OK. This is a problem, and itís a reflection of our society. Iíve seen these same people watch their wallets, carry their wallets with them to the bathroom and they surely don't leave their wallets sitting alone. They don't trust the lifeguards or the people at the pool enough to leave their wallets out in the open, but they will trust these people with the lives of their children while they are not watching. If they do leave their valuables, they look over their shoulder every other minute to ensure their valuables are still there. NO ONE should assume that when you go to these pools that the lifeguards take over responsibility for watching their children. As Iíve stated before, they are Kids themselves on a Ďsummer jobí, and even though they should, they donít all take it seriously. How often do teenagers take anything seriously? Thatís why movies like ĎDate Movieí and ďJust another Teenage Movieí are hits with teenagers. Nothing against teenagers, Iím just a realist.
2. I constantly hear the lifeguards shouting 'WALK! WALK! WALK!' to the kids at the pool. I never here the parents say it. You may hear my booming voice telling my kids not to run around the pool, because I don't want them to have an accident; it's dangerous and it's not anyone else's responsibility except for mine to ensure the safety of my children. The lifeguards should be watching the pool, but unfortunately, thanks to the parents that are not watching their kids, the lifeguards spend most of their time telling kids to ĎWALKí.

VFC of United States on Aug 24, 2006

3. This comment troubles me.
Do you know how many parents let their kid go to the pool everyday by themselves? Lifeguards arent paying attention to whose parents are there... their supposed to be watching the pool and obviously they weren't.
How many parents let their kids go to the pool by themselves? I certainly hope weíre not talking about young children, as is the case we are discussing.
I donít want to address too much more from that response because I believe it was written in emotional haste.
4. It seems our Society today likes people to think for them. The news tells people what to think. The politicians tell people what to think. We are so propagandized in this country that Slobodan Milosovic would be proud.
With this in mind, I do not need a pool manager to think for me regarding the safety of my children. A rule saying Ďno floaties in the deep endí is irrelevant. If a kid is being properly watched, they should be allowed to swim anywhere in the pool with their floaties on. To even hint at fishing for blame on a rule like that just wipes personal responsibility off the map. Thatís what our society is missing today. Personal responsibility.
Letís pay better attention to our surroundings. Letís keep our Situational Awareness at a high level, especially when concerning our children. Letís never assume anything, and expect anything. Letís support each other as a community and Letís all get CPR certified.
Parents, Guardians, Lifeguards and everyone else can learn valuable lessons from these horrific events if we look for the lessons.

VFC of United States on Aug 24, 2006

Anom,
I have a feeling that you are closely involved in this situation, maybe a family member or family friend of the boy's family or guardian's family.
This isn't a forum to bring out more hurt, but to find solutions as a community to prevent these accidents in the future.
The lifeguards failed, I think that is obvious, although I was not there and I did not listen to 911 tapes. It sounds like one big Cluster went on at the pool that day, and the lifeguards, who should be able to respond to these situations, failed the boy and the community. There is no excuse for that.
Anonymous also makes a valid point however, different decisions made prior to the lifeguards actions could have prevented horrific events that took place. I donít want to place blame on the guardian, but lets not miss the valid points.
Iím new to the area, lived here a year, and after living 10 years overseas I Ďve observed many things that have changed in our society that are applicable to not necessarily this incident, but the daily complacency that causes these kinds of accidents.
1. I frequent these pools often, and I notice a LARGE majority of parents/guardians are NOT watching their children in or around the pool. I've observed this: Parents and Guardians (not all) act as if once they are on the pool grounds that the lifeguards are there to handle, watch, discipline and caretake the kids. I've seen parents with their backs turned away from the pool so they can face the sun while their kids, sometimes as young as 2 (in a floatie) jumps in and out of the pool. I've seen parents go to the bathroom, while their young children continue to play in the pool. I've seen young children go to the bathroom alone, without the parents even watching to see they get to door OK. This is a problem, and itís a reflection of our society. Iíve seen these same people watch their wallets, carry their wallets with them to the bathroom and they surely don't leave their wallets sitting alone. They don't trust the lifeguards or the people at the pool enough to leave their wallets out in the open, but they will trust these people with the lives of their children while they are not watching. If they do leave their valuables, they look over their shoulder every other minute to ensure their valuables are still there. NO ONE should assume that when you go to these pools that the lifeguards take over responsibility for watching their children. As Iíve stated before, they are Kids themselves on a Ďsummer jobí, and even though they should, they donít all take it seriously. How often do teenagers take anything seriously? Thatís why movies like ĎDate Movieí and ďJust another Teenage Movieí are hits with teenagers. Nothing against teenagers, Iím just a realist.
2. I constantly hear the lifeguards shouting 'WALK! WALK! WALK!' to the kids at the pool. I never here the parents say it. You may hear my booming voice telling my kids not to run around the pool, because I don't want them to have an accident; it's dangerous and it's not anyone else's responsibility except for mine to ensure the safety of my children. The lifeguards should be watching the pool, but unfortunately, thanks to the parents that are not watching their kids, the lifeguards spend most of their time telling kids to ĎWALKí.

VFC of United States on Aug 24, 2006

3. This comment troubles me.
Do you know how many parents let their kid go to the pool everyday by themselves? Lifeguards arent paying attention to whose parents are there... their supposed to be watching the pool and obviously they weren't.
How many parents let their kids go to the pool by themselves? I certainly hope weíre not talking about young children, as is the case we are discussing.
I donít want to address too much more from that response because I believe it was written in emotional haste.
4. At the expense of babbling, it seems our Society today likes people to think for them. The news tells people what to think. The politicians tell people what to think. We are so propagandized in this country that Slobodan Milosovic would be proud.
With this in mind, I do not need a pool manager to think for me regarding the safety of my children. A rule saying Ďno floaties in the deep endí is irrelevant. If a kid is being properly watched, they should be allowed to swim anywhere in the pool with their floaties on. To even hint at fishing for blame on a rule like that just wipes personal responsibility off the map. Thatís what our society is missing today. Personal responsibility.
Letís pay better attention to our surroundings. Letís keep our Situational Awareness at a high level, especially when concerning our children. Letís never assume anything, and expect anything. Letís support each other as a community and Letís all get CPR certified.

anonymous of Galesville, MD on Aug 25, 2006

anom wrote:
I can count 6 mistakes that the lifeguards did.
Step1- Lifeguard sees a child floating, blows the whistle at him, thinking he's playing. Has NO idea what to do.
Step2- the guardian and another member pull boy out of the pool. Member starts giving mouth to mouth. Boy pukes. Still no lifeguard around.
Step3- NO ONE knows how to do CPR correctly.(Everyone should, in reality) BUT, its the lifeguards job to know how to do that, right? Right.
Step4- A member calls 911, lifeguard in the background (as you hear on the news 911 tapes) and asks if there's a defibulator there. "Yes, but we're not allowed to use it."
Step 5- Minutes already wasted, one lifeguard still in her chair, member goes to GET the other lifeguards, as they were in the offices goofing off.. they come out.
Step6- They place a MASK on the child, which is for someone with AIDS or an infant. A lifeguard should know that. Their blowing air through a tiny hole, and the boys chest is not rising.(As quoted on the 911 tapes) Obviously, their doing wrong CPR. And obviously nobody knew what to do.
Everything that could've went wrong that day... went WRONG. The child had a chance to LIVE and if the lifeguards would've known what to do.. i guarantee you he would still be here.
Yes, the guardian made some very bad mistakes. But in the end, the lifeguards made more. They clearly had no idea what to do in the state of an emergency. And may I ask, how you seem to KNOW that the guardian left the child unattended? That was never in any articles or stated for a fact.
"The rule that allowed the child to wear it in the first place in the deep end is a mistake and that is attributed to the pool manager, so I do see this as a major liability."
That's excatly right.
The parents are not sueing the lifeguard herself, or any one person individually.
If the pool general manager had been strict, the lifeguards probably would've too. The pool felt invincible to the fact that something like this COULD happen at their pool, and became very laxed about everything.
Lifeguarding is NOT just a fun, summer job. You have to take it seriously. Kids lives are in danger every second that they are up in that chair and they need to take it seriously and KNOW what to do in the case of ANY emergency.
I certainly hope that you do not live your life expecting others to protect you and your family...you will be sorely disappointed. Just as this family is.

VFC of United States on Aug 25, 2006

well said, anonymous from Baltimore.

VFC of Clarksville, MD on Aug 27, 2006

Wow, I just actually read the article about this incident. Although I believe the managers of these pools are idiots, to blame them for this incident is ridiculous, and to state in the lawsuits that it was the Lifeguards that were complacent is neglagent in itself. Everyone in the pool that day was complacent. Learn from it, all of us.

A lifeguard of San Jose, CA on Aug 27, 2006

How do we know that the life guards did what they were trained to do? From what I hear the Guard "froze up". I don't think thats what they were trained to do. It's not a question of training.

A lifeguard of Rochester, NY on Oct 3, 2006

anom wrote:
I can count 6 mistakes that the lifeguards did.
Step1- Lifeguard sees a child floating, blows the whistle at him, thinking he's playing. Has NO idea what to do.
Step2- the guardian and another member pull boy out of the pool. Member starts giving mouth to mouth. Boy pukes. Still no lifeguard around.
Step3- NO ONE knows how to do CPR correctly.(Everyone should, in reality) BUT, its the lifeguards job to know how to do that, right? Right.
Step4- A member calls 911, lifeguard in the background (as you hear on the news 911 tapes) and asks if there's a defibulator there. "Yes, but we're not allowed to use it."
Step 5- Minutes already wasted, one lifeguard still in her chair, member goes to GET the other lifeguards, as they were in the offices goofing off.. they come out.
Step6- They place a MASK on the child, which is for someone with AIDS or an infant. A lifeguard should know that. Their blowing air through a tiny hole, and the boys chest is not rising.(As quoted on the 911 tapes) Obviously, their doing wrong CPR. And obviously nobody knew what to do.
Everything that could've went wrong that day... went WRONG. The child had a chance to LIVE and if the lifeguards would've known what to do.. i guarantee you he would still be here.
Yes, the guardian made some very bad mistakes. But in the end, the lifeguards made more. They clearly had no idea what to do in the state of an emergency. And may I ask, how you seem to KNOW that the guardian left the child unattended? That was never in any articles or stated for a fact.
"The rule that allowed the child to wear it in the first place in the deep end is a mistake and that is attributed to the pool manager, so I do see this as a major liability."
That's excatly right.
The parents are not sueing the lifeguard herself, or any one person individually.
If the pool general manager had been strict, the lifeguards probably would've too. The pool felt invincible to the fact that something like this COULD happen at their pool, and became very laxed about everything.
Lifeguarding is NOT just a fun, summer job. You have to take it seriously. Kids lives are in danger every second that they are up in that chair and they need to take it seriously and KNOW what to do in the case of ANY emergency.
this is so retarded. you are allways supposed to wear a mask. usually people with AIDs don't wear signs. and the girl in the audio tape was one of the lifeguards. get your facts right.
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