Why Queen Cleopatra was definitely not Black

Full story: The Westside Gazette

Watching a local television program recently, I heard Spike Lee express his belief that Queen Cleopatra of Egypt was Black.
Comments
9,701 - 9,720 of 9,917 Comments Last updated May 16, 2014
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10481
Feb 12, 2013
 
Jeff wrote:
<quoted text>
Cleopatra's mother was as white as she was, they both belonged to the Ptolemaic Dynasty. There was nothing 'African' about any of the Ptolemies, they were Europeans in ancestry.
One of the very first posters in this thread wrote Cleopatra's mother was black. I almost believed it !
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10482
Feb 12, 2013
 
Jeff wrote:
<quoted text>
You are full of it. Cleopatra was as white as her name. Stop trying to claim a Queen who was of European ancestry cause you sound very foolish.
I think you don't even need to reply to this kind of stupidity. To them black Africans, and only them, are brothers/sisters. This tells you enough, doesn't it ? It's a racial thing, that's all it is. They insist on race which is everything to them. In whole Africa you can probably count one the fingers of one hand the number of black Africans who would consider non-black human as brothers/sisters (let alone white humans).
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10483
Feb 12, 2013
 
roland wrote:
Hello everyone, Cleopatra well for a start there was seven Cleopatras, the one everyone argues about was the last one Cleopatra VII born 69BC in Alexandria. Arguing what color she was just goes to show how far humanity has sunk, back then there wasn't such a big thing about color as the Greeks held the Egyptians in very high esteem, look at various greek writers for examples.
Solon the Lawgiver for one, visited Egypt and its city of Sais where he talked to high priests who told him about Atlantis. He never seems to have mentioned one of those high priests being black. The patron goddess of Sais was Athena (which they knew under another name), the same one as that of the city of Athens. Do you know any black culture worshipping Athena ?
[quote]She was more than likely a combination of African, European and Middle Eastern as Alexander encouraged the mixing of his troops with all the lands they conquered. This was a way of making sure his men and the conquered nations bonded so the empire which he started would be cohesive and not prone to uprisings.[/quote]
Yes, but it was several generations (more than 200 years) from Alexander to Cleopatra. What do you know about the Ptolemees' faithfulness to Alexander's edicts and regulations tens and hundreds of years after he died ?
[quote]The only reason the myth that the Egyptians are Caucasians was started because Jean-François Champollion decipered the hieorglpys giving people the chance to see just how influential the egyptians were.[/quote]
It doesn't follow from this that the ancient Egyptians were Caucasians, and I never saw it stated either. On the contrary, it is known the ancient Egyptians were close to the ancient Lybians if not the same (which means berber) although I have seen it stated that some of their characteristics tended towards the African (which is a long way from "being black" proper).
[quote]This is why Greece had its centre of learning in Egypt, the place where Cleopatra was born, its also why the only thing Greek about Alexandria was the language its citizens spoke, all the artifacts dug up are in the Egyptian style and the way Cleopatra VII dressed, used oils and make-up was Egyptian.[/quote]
It is known that, in later times when Egypt was in its decline (i.e. in Cleopatra's own time) it received other influences. They "invented" a new divitinity (Apis) which was not Egyptian in origin.
[quote]How many other empires have their centre of learning on foreign soil, in my country England our centre of learning was always in Oxford and Cambridge even when we had a massive empire.
The Greeks based most of their culture on the Egyptians, Rome based most of its culture on the Greeks, Northern Europe based most of its culture on the Romans and America based most of its culture on the Northern Europeans this is why Egypt has been altered to give it a more Middle Eastern and European appearance belittling its African multi-cultural heritage.[/quote]
This is a big oversimplification.
First of all, I doubt ancient Hellas had one "center of learning" and although they certainly had scholars in Egyptian cities, this doesn't imply Egypt as a country was their one and only, and whole "center of learning." The Greeks also did not base "most of its culture on the Egyptians. There certainly were cultural exchanges - in a later stadium - but the Hellenes did not need the Egyptians for their culture. For one thing, look at their respective religions. How more different could they be ? The Egyptian with its somber outlook on death and the afterlife, and the Greek with their frivolous Gods and Goddesses which had an almost person-to-person relationship with you.

(second part in next post)
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10484
Feb 12, 2013
 
(second part of reply to roland)

Romans did not base their culture - whether in whole or most of it - on Greek culture. It was a combination of Latin and Etruscan in the beginning and for several centuries, and later absorbed influences from other cultures, Greeks included. So it was not BASED on Greek culture. But somewhere around the time it became an Empire, Greek culture was indeed highly respected. There was in particular one emperor (forgot who) who knew Greek culture very well and spoke and read Greek fluently.
The same thing goes for your oversimplification about northern Europe which did NOT "base" most of its culture on the Romans. They were subjected to Roman influence in differing degrees, that's all.
And so on. You can see these sweeping generalizations of yours don't stand the test of a little bit of education.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10485
Feb 12, 2013
 
This shows to what length some people will go just to make someone shut up whose opinion disagrees.

I replied to this post by "roland" but had to cut its last part off as it was too long. By the time I sent the second part and it appeared in the forum, I saw my first part posted just above it. It was already posted. One moment after, however, sudddenly it wasn't there anymore. It had just disappeared and it is clear to me it was deleted by someone who either hacked the forum or had access to its servers.

It was, as you can deduce, about 4000 characters long in which I disproved some of those overly sweepingly generalizations of "roland". Needless to say, I hardly feel like writing it all over again. Sorry...

The part of roland's post I was addressing in that first post was this (the second part begins with Roman culture).
roland wrote:
Hello everyone, Cleopatra well for a start there was seven Cleopatras, the one everyone argues about was the last one Cleopatra VII born 69BC in Alexandria. Arguing what color she was just goes to show how far humanity has sunk, back then there wasn't such a big thing about color as the Greeks held the Egyptians in very high esteem, look at various greek writers for examples. She was more than likely a combination of African, European and Middle Eastern as Alexander encouraged the mixing of his troops with all the lands they conquered. This was a way of making sure his men and the conquered nations bonded so the empire which he started would be cohesive and not prone to uprisings.
The only reason the myth that the Egyptians are Caucasians was started because Jean-François Champollion decipered the hieorglpys giving people the chance to see just how influential the egyptians were. This is why Greece had its centre of learning in Egypt, the place where Cleopatra was born, its also why the only thing Greek about Alexandria was the language its citizens spoke, all the artifacts dug up are in the Egyptian style and the way Cleopatra VII dressed, used oils and make-up was Egyptian. How many other empires have their centre of learning on foreign soil, in my country England our centre of learning was always in Oxford and Cambridge even when we had a massive empire.
The Greeks based most of their culture on the Egyptians, Rome based most of its culture on the Greeks, Northern Europe based most of its culture on the Romans and America based most of its culture on the Northern Europeans this is why Egypt has been altered to give it a more Middle Eastern and European appearance belittling its African multi-cultural heritage.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10486
Feb 12, 2013
 
Sorry folks. I see they have put it in again meanwhile.
Oh well...

Since: Nov 12

Romania

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10487
Feb 12, 2013
 
Justanyone wrote:
<quoted text>
The first Ptolemy, who founded the dynasty, also was one of Alexander's generals who divided his empire between them after his death (just as they murdered his wife Roxanne and his child, just in case).
And didn't you know Jesus was black ? Pastor Wright said so, so it must be true.
And last but not least, don't forget Desmond Tutu yelled at the congegrated audience at the opening of the South-African World Cup : "We are all Africans !"
So it must be true we are ALL Africans.
Mate, I live in Europe, so I know who Roxy and the rest were. PTOLEMAIOS was of course Alexander's friend and greek like him. DES HIT TU TV is a krap SOB.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10488
Feb 12, 2013
 
Mr dan gathendu wrote:
Tackling ancient egypts race is now an embarrassing topic. Recent discoveries that other black civilizations preceded or pararelled hakaptah(ancient Egypt)are indubitable.
The olmec Negro civilization of Yucatan in Mexico, Canaanite-Phoenicia, dravidain(Harrapa and mohenjo dero of ancient India),sumeria of Mesopotamia, pre hellen Greece(dogons),
WTF ???

Man man man...
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10489
Feb 12, 2013
 
-Piper- wrote:
<quoted text> Mate, I live in Europe, so I know who Roxy and the rest were. PTOLEMAIOS was of course Alexander's friend and greek like him. DES HIT TU TV is a krap SOB.
If only all Europeans were as highly educated as you are....

Since: Nov 12

Romania

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10490
Feb 12, 2013
 
Justanyone wrote:
<quoted text>
If only all Europeans were as highly educated as you are....
If all Aa's would be as highly educaded esp somebody with brain.

Since: Nov 12

Romania

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10491
Feb 12, 2013
 
Justanyone wrote:
<quoted text>
If only all Europeans were as highly educated as you are....
Unfortunately, we're much more educated than americans.
Afrocentism and Eurocentrism is something we don't know bout! And care less!
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10492
Feb 12, 2013
 
-Piper- wrote:
<quoted text> If all Aa's would be as highly educaded esp somebody with brain.
Aa's ?
Sorry, don't get your meaning.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10493
Feb 12, 2013
 
Simon Says wrote:
<quoted text>Where you think you learned your information from? Some aliens from other planets. O yea, you did probably because our history says we came and conquered this planet thousands of years ago. So black people were the aliens who taught you everything if you want to get technical. IAnywho, Peace and Love and Don't misjudge.
Peace and Love indeed. Haha.

Black people aliens ? Well, that would explain a lot, wouldn't it.

But no, I for one am not buying this. It is people like you who are getting this sort of ideas put into their heads by some with an agenda, and you are falling for it in droves as it sounds so... good.

No, believe me, we share a common history on earth and we just have to make the best of it we can, that's about all.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10494
Feb 12, 2013
 
Faith wrote:
Cleopatra was as black as the ace of spades. It's a matter of historical record.
So show the records.
Give us a link.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10495
Feb 12, 2013
 
Faith wrote:
<quoted text>I have a degree in anthropology. You will have to take my word for it.
First, the preposterousness of your claims is an insult to our intelligence.
Second, your claim of having a degree in anthropology without however be willing to provide references as any academic would is another one.

You are, simply put, a fraud and an impostor.
I only hope not all of you afrocentrists are like that.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10496
Feb 12, 2013
 
Jeff wrote:
<quoted text>
C/s and Of course, I believe in respecting everyone's ethnic origins.
That goes without saying and it's what everyone should do.
But when they also expect you to "respect" just plain stupidity and arrogance it goes a little too far.
Justanyone

Belgium

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10497
Feb 12, 2013
 
Nimrod son of Kush wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree with you on the fact that Cleopatra was not black and had no connection to black people though she was neither white nor arab...but you don't have to portray us as a people who,lacking civilisation are so eager to claim others'.Next time you express your opinion do it without spitting on our race because we are not desperate enough to claim anything that had nothing to do with us.
And please..Keep Nubians out your filthy mouth.
From what you are writing here it looks like you do believe in race ?
And yes, from posts here it is obviously some of you ARE desperate enough to claim (almost) anything that had nothing to do with you...

And it also looks like it is you who are spitting on us. I don't see why that other poster would have a filthy mouth.

Since: Nov 12

Romania

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10498
Feb 14, 2013
 
Justanyone wrote:
<quoted text>
Aa's ?
Sorry, don't get your meaning.
Sorry, my english...:^D I kinda "mind translate" from my language into english when in hurry.
Wanna say those AA's who post such krapy claims (Cleo black, Charlemagne black etc , that's all.:^)
Btw, I'm some highly educated person cos I'm quite young, but its common sense.

Since: Nov 12

Romania

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10499
Feb 14, 2013
 
-Piper- wrote:
<quoted text>
Btw, I'm **NOT** some highly educated person cos I'm quite young, but its common sense.
Corrected .
Lena

Canberra, Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10500
Feb 14, 2013
 
-Piper- wrote:
<quoted text> Sorry, my english...:^D I kinda "mind translate" from my language into english when in hurry.
Wanna say those AA's who post such krapy claims (Cleo black, Charlemagne black etc , that's all.:^)
Btw, I'm some highly educated person cos I'm quite young, but its common sense.
Cleopatra was greek Macedonian queen, the black can whine all they want it wont change anything, ala greka!!

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

Type in your comments below
Name
(appears on your post)
Comments
Characters left: 4000

Please note by clicking on "Post Comment" you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Other Recent Numidia Discussions

Search the Numidia Forum:
Title Updated Last By Comments
PA Who do you support for U.S. Senate in Pennsylva... (Oct '10) 1 hr Big Daddy 3,812
firewood for sale in Elysburg 9 hr BDC 1
PA Who do you support for Governor in Pennsylvania... (Oct '10) Wed More Settled Science 51,184
4th street in 1910 census Jul 18 gelly 1
Girl Dies at amusment park (Jul '07) Jun '14 Unknown 172
african americans at knoebels (Jun '13) May '14 Answer man 4
Centralia's last 9 residents fight eviction (May '10) May '14 white man 6
•••
•••
•••
•••

Numidia Jobs

•••
Enter and win $5000
•••
•••

Numidia People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

•••

Numidia News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in Numidia
•••

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]
•••