Who says Mormons aren't Christians?

Oct 12, 2011 Full story: CNN 32,006

Editor's note: Dean Obeidallah is an award-winning comedian who has appeared on TV shows such as Comedy Central's "Axis of Evil" special, ABC's "The View," CNN's "What the Week" and HLN's "The Joy Behar Show." He is executive producer of the annual New York Arab-American Comedy Festival and the Amman Stand Up Comedy Festival.

Full Story
MORMON vs M00NBAT

Olivehurst, CA

#31947 Jan 26, 2014
With the DIFFERENCE in THOSE TWO POSTS [sorry reader accidentally double posted]

being

http://www.egyptology.escholar.info/images/im...

TELL the ANCIENT EGYPTIANS your problem with their Alphabet having LETTERS IN IT YOU DON'T LIKE.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31949 Jan 26, 2014
pearl wrote:
C Not reading what I'm writing
D. Not capable of following a train of thought that isn't already implanted in your skull.
You ramble, your inconsistent, and when you demonstrate your incompetence of understanding and or dialogue you consistently try to pass it of as someone elses failure.
Ahhhh, the above describes you well. Well described :)

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31950 Jan 26, 2014
pearl wrote:
<quoted text>Again these posts just seem to zoom past your head. Your complete lack of comprehending my posts, then claiming "That was your statement of what you meant." and all the while insisting I should NOT interpret your posts literally, or other than what the say is becoming a drag. I just wanted to make note of that fact.
Talk about zooming, read your own replies sometime, just suggesting :)

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31951 Jan 26, 2014
pearl wrote:
<quoted text>I have an experiment we could try. Go to your vehicle and eliminate one of the tires. Next time you try to drive it we can see if there is change.
But once again you didn't follow the concept, so I'll state it thus; try to change the instinct to defecate,{for the sake of argument and in your context I will stipulate for the moment that it is an instinct } in fact try to change it by forbidding it. Can't do it you say? Could it be, because you can't change human nature by forbidding it?
Bad example. Of course to eliminate can produce a change to what was. But that's not the context I was using change in relation to human nature/instinct. You interjected the word eliminate, not I.

A. You began this conversation by stating human nature/instinct CAN'T BE CHANGED(not eliminated). I used capitols so you could digest what YOU said.
B. You than began to use the word ELIMINATE in conjunction with CHANGE regarding human nature/instinct as you did in the above post.
C. Are you on line so far? Are you following the conversation as you said it?
D. The example of defecation is human nature/instinct.
E. I can't think of a single human instinct that isn't predicated on what we call an 'urge'. The urge to mate, the urge to be aggressive and fight, the urge to make sounds, the urge to roam about, the urge to eat, the urge to piss and crap, the urge to exist, urges, urges, urges. Get it?
F. You assume human nature/instinct can be wrapped up into a small definition as you wish to have it to say human nature/instinct can't be changed. It will never work as you define it.
G. The fact is that raw human nature/instinct unguided by laws and traditions and rules are nothing but urges given to us through our DNA.
H. And urges belonging to human nature/instincts factually can be changed, manipulated, regulated, etc in how they take place in our lives and when they take place.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31952 Jan 26, 2014
pearl wrote:
<quoted text>Do you even think this stuff through? If laws changed humans nature from killing at will to not killing at will, and there's been various laws against killing for eons and the laws is suddenly eliminated {that means to abolish or remove, take away} and people started killing at will, then the nature to kill was still there, it hadn't changed, it was right there just beneath the surface,
Please read what you just asked me. Would you?
A. Human nature/instinct allows for an urge in one human to kill another.
B. If a human can adapt something among other humans instructing them not to act on that urge and they respond to that adaption so when feeling the urge to kill another they make a decision not to because of the adaption, that is an obvious change in human nature/instinct concerning killing others. Do you understand?
You've changed your original statement of this conversation from human nature/instinct can't be changed to it also not being eliminated and forbidden. And now you make a claim if human nature/instinct has went from it's raw form to an adapted/changed form to it's raw form than it was always there meaning no change? As you would say with reflection to your past example that I'll parallel, thats like saying a car is nothing but dirt and oil because that's what it primarily came from. Well fricking yes! But the dirt and oil were changed from their natural state to be something else though both things still exist but in a different form. lol....I spoke of changing how human nature/instinct acts in a human. I said nothing of abolishing or removing or eliminating it. You stated those things to deviate from what you first said.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31953 Jan 26, 2014
concerned in Brasil wrote:
<quoted text>
Why you are a loser and your faith is false.
An Example of 100's
I state you believe in a different Jesus than Christians do, like the Hindu's do like Muslims do.
YOU state prove it.
So I post copy and paste from an article that references the BofM J&D the bible because they are some 6000-8000 characters and to type all of it would take hours.
They are all footnoted from the original books all of which you should own as an LDS I own a copy of everything I have posted and sourced.
The fact that you dismiss the truth solely on the basis that I have cut and pasted an item shows your are Stupid a loser and that you have no ability to defend your faith.
If your faith was true my quotes my cut and pastes false you would point out the errors but you can't so the only thing left for a Prideful sinner to do who is caught up in Rebellion is slander and name call. To mud sling to try and make cut and pasting some how evil.
What a loser attempt that is.
You're nothing but a two bit paste hustler. You're factually scared to square off and debate anything anyone makes a challenge to you to debate. I asked you questions twice now so we can debate and you out of fear and trembling refuse to debate. You're nothing but a two bit paste hustler.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31954 Jan 26, 2014
pearl wrote:
<quoted text>You know, you are really all over the board. Your claims stretch and retract like a rubber band. Here's a short list;
1. Those things we as humans are born with. Like defecating and fighting and eating and having sex. Those are all human nature/instincts in their raw form.
2. Killing, sex, personal interactions with each other tribe against tribe, that's all human behavior.
3. To kill is instinct.
4 Killing...that's all human behavior.
5. I further explained the difference between human instinct and behavior.
6. Human behavior {not human instinct as I corrected myself a few pages back} can be changed by laws.
6a. You claimed human instinct couldn't be changed, I disagreed.
7. Anything beyond instinct to fight or flight to exist is termed human behavior.
You must realize that your arguments are confounded and twisted right? You must see how vacuous those claims become when you can't keep them coordinated.
Mankinds behavior is based in incentive, Mankinds nature is based in instinct and each concept performs within their parameter.
So yes, lets wrap this up.
Show me how you change mankinds nature to be creative by forbidding it.
Demonstrate how you change mankinds nature to be spiritual by outlawing it.
Explain how outlawing mankinds innate curiosity changes that nature.
And surely by your claim mankinds nature/instinct to reason be forbidden thus changed.
Give us a strategy for changing mankinds self awareness by forbidding it.
And while your at it, prove to us that if you outlaw freedom to an entire culture of people, that they will change and not want freedom.
And yes, please exhibit how you can change mankinds inborn nature to adapt by forbidding it.
Bodily function? Forbid blushing, outlaw sweating, make a law against goosebumps while listening to a live symphony.
Mankinds behavior is based in incentive, Makninds nature is based in instinct. Learn the difference. Only then will you be capable of a coherent dialog. I'm bout done, you?
Ahhhh, we've both been all over the board. Here's a nice little summary for you. See if you agree.
You believe that human nature/instinct to do whatever humans do is unchangeable, also meaning they can't be altered.
I disagreed. I said human nature/instinct can be altered/changed in it's performance. I gave many examples. But I never said human nature/instinct could be eliminated as now you state it, except by the death of the human. As long as the brain is alive, it will always process it's raw human nature/instinct called urges even if a body is comatose.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31955 Jan 26, 2014
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
Didn't see any child molesters in that list.
No there was none in it. I forgot to include Peter for attempted murder among him also being an out right liar of saying he didn't know Jesus to save his hide from death with the other eleven and who knows how many other believers running and hiding to save their hides instead of standing up for their belief in Jesus and going to death with him. Yeah, a whole lot of faithful diligent follow you to the end types there that God chose huh? They all ran like cowards when the heat got hot. How come you're not criticizing God for having such a comparable lack of inspiration for not choosing real faithful followers 2000 years ago instead of a bunch of deserters and doubters?
Seems you set aside the fact that no matter if it's stated (be it true or false) one was called of God, like Moses and Abraham and David and Peter etc, what one does after said calling usually comes back to personal choice that shouldn't call into question God's judgement capabilities. But I understand you would question God's abilities whether God is in the equation or not.
That bishop, regardless if God, Satan or he himself called him to be a bishop isn't the point. The point you obviously side step is that this bishop made a very wrong choice of his own. Just like Moses when he chose to disobey God's command. Just like when David chose to break the laws of God he taught to his people. Just like Solomon married more wives than he was suppose to marry. Just like Peter chosen of God tried to murder a man. Just like Peter chosen by God lied that he knew God.
Fricking quit twisting info for your own twisted need.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31956 Jan 26, 2014
Dana Robertson wrote:
As usual, you are the only one here given an intelligent response, so I'll address this in the same manner.
<quoted text>
And as that is your personal belief, I'm not debating that. What I'm pointing out is what the LDS church is claiming.
<quoted text>
I'm not asking for perfection at the Bishop's level. I'm just asking why God would put a child molester in that position to begin with? God would certainly know the man's heart. And what I'm really debating here is whether or not God even had anything to do with the process at all. Mormonism is teaching trust where it honestly shouldn't always be given. It isn't men doing the calling, but God. If you can't trust God who can you trust? But I see the whole system as big lie. There is no revelation, there is no priesthood, just people depending on feelings and impressions, and because of it the perverts can get in, just like in the Catholic church.
<quoted text>
We take a man's word on whether or not he is called of God, but we watch his actions and works to judge it true or not. We don't put our faith in his works but in our relationship with Jesus Christ. We don't look to any living man on the level Mormons do their Prophets, as being to only spokesman for God on Earth.
Back to your old crap, somethings just don't change and that's sad.

You posted info that a Mormon bishop molested a child. Your response?
"Yeap, the God of the Mormon church is really good at picking those Bishops."

You now state...
"I'm not asking for perfection at the Bishop's level. I'm just asking why God would put a child molester in that position to begin with? God would certainly know the man's heart. And what I'm really debating here is whether or not God even had anything to do with the process at all."

Now apply your reasoning to the people God chose to head and lead his church 2000 years ago that attempted murder, lied and denied knowing God, deserted him like cowards to run and hide to avoid death, doubted the very teachings God taught them from his own lips and out right denied they'd take place by disbelieving they had taken place.

Now switch your question to be applicable to 2000 years ago.

"I'm not asking for perfection at the apostles level. I'm just asking why God would put an attempted murderer and liars and cowards and disbelievers in all of those positions to begin with? God would certainly know every man's heart. And what I'm really debating here is whether or not God even had anything to do with the process at all."

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#31957 Jan 26, 2014
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
Here is why I think the charge is fair. Mormonism teaches it's leaders are called by God through the power of the priesthood, by revelation.
I'll even back up to your other statement and make a comparison for you to consider to consider the relevance of what you said as it reflects Christianity also.
We have people in various Christian churches for example that pray together asking God to reveal to them who should be a new or replacement minister for their church. We also have individuals, you for instance that claim God led them to his truths from the errors of their thinking so they could worship him as he want's it done.
In both instances we have people doing what Mormons claim to do, using prayer to God to sustain hopefully righteous people to a calling they believe God gave inspiration for in that choice.
Well lets look at you for instance. You claim God led you to be the Christian you say you are. And after one examines your recent past dark filthy statements one would say that's anything but the truth and God did no such thing with you if we use the same logic you used for that bishop follow?
I could give a list of Christians over the last fifty years as others call them who many believed God called them to be ministers in all fifty states of various religions and were what people called "good, loving, caring" ministers till they were arrested for murder, rape, sexual assault, theft, etc. Should we just make your claim that God had nothing to do with a single one of those people and the Christian calling they had received, they and others claimed came from the inspiration of God?
The obvious answer is no. The entire Bible is a testament that God converts the unrighteous to do his righteous work and the righteous to do his righteous work. But we also know each one of those persons after receiving their calling made decisions that went totally against what God wanted from them and that doesn't mean God made a mistake in whom he called.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#31958 Jan 26, 2014
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
No there was none in it. I forgot to include Peter for attempted murder among him also being an out right liar of saying he didn't know Jesus to save his hide from death with the other eleven and who knows how many other believers running and hiding to save their hides instead of standing up for their belief in Jesus and going to death with him. Yeah, a whole lot of faithful diligent follow you to the end types there that God chose huh? They all ran like cowards when the heat got hot. How come you're not criticizing God for having such a comparable lack of inspiration for not choosing real faithful followers 2000 years ago instead of a bunch of deserters and doubters?
If I was debating that Bishop's had to be perfect or sinless, you would have a point. But I'm not. All things are not equal, despite your need to save perversion, and perverts.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#31959 Jan 26, 2014
Livinginthelandofcrazy wrote:
<quoted text>
I going to try and address your questions and points in order. The answers I give are based on my experiences and personal belief.
As far as that man being a "child molester..." There is nothing worse in my opinion than a grown adult who abuses and hurts a child. They are the lowest of the low, and as such deserve the fullest penalties of the law. That being said, I do not know the full story of this man, nor do you. We are automatically assuming he is a child molester based on an article. Trial by media. I'm not saying he isn't, I'm saying we don't have all the information. However, you are right when you say that only God knows what's in a man's heart. You don't, and I don't. What we do know is based on interaction and personal experience with people. Certainly we know by that experience, people are inherently flawed and capable of evil. People walk right before us everyday hiding what is truly inside them. Many are great manipulators and have great interpersonal skills that they've mastered and use to deceive and victimize others. When we discover this we are shocked, in denial, hurt, and angry, especially when they are placed in a position of leadership and respect. These people are everywhere, even in the LDS Church.
"It isn't men doing the calling, but God. If you can't trust God who can you trust?"
Yes, and no. As members of the Church we rely on our leaders to use inspiration and prayer to make proper decisions and choices. But again, anytime you add "man" into the equation you're going to get imperfection. Now, I've already said it was my opinion that this is not always done. This could be one of those instances, or situations. Only the Stake Presidency who called this man knows. I would choose (hope) to believe that they made the decision based on prayer and inspiration, but that they were deceived by a man who was very deceptive and cunning. Maybe one or two of the Stake Presidency felt something was amiss. We don't know. We just don't know. I know you see the whole system as a big lie, especially based on your childhood experiences with your father. I wouldn't expect any different. I think by now you know that. However, I've had some really good Bishops. Bishops who I believe were truly inspired and tried their best to lead by example and fulfill their callings the best that they could. I've also had some that were not. Were they doing their best? I don't know. Maybe they were, maybe they weren't. Only they and Heavenly Father know.
Just for the record, I've also had some really good Bishops I can point to, but I think they got the office by the same way the bad ones got into office, some Stake President using his feelings and in some cases just trying to fill an office that may be empty. The odds are the same for getting a good one as for a bad one, but I see no divine inspiration involved in the process. Looking back, the number of Bishops I would considered bad vs. good would around 50-50.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#31960 Jan 26, 2014
Never had one as hideous as a child molester, though. A special kind of sick in my book beyond what I would even consider a bad Bishop.
concerned in Brasil

Europe

#31961 Jan 26, 2014
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
You're nothing but a two bit paste hustler. You're factually scared to square off and debate anything anyone makes a challenge to you to debate. I asked you questions twice now so we can debate and you out of fear and trembling refuse to debate. You're nothing but a two bit paste hustler.
More name calling more attempts at trying to vilify those who show your faith is based on lies and thus false.

The thread is about whether LDS members are christian, all you do is ask questions off topic and then say someone is not willing to debate.

I am here to debate the premise of this thread nothing more nothing less.

To post from verifiable footnoted cut and pastes is 100% legitimate, the problem is you have is your inability to refute the information in the cut and pastes so all we get from you is your above post of mud slinging and name calling.

I have cut and pasted from Mormon.org J&D and what you name call anti-mormon.

I am sorry but you are Anti-Jesus as he is revealed in the Bible.
Thus you as an LDS member are Anti-Christian and pro-mormon I however am a Christian and Pro Jesus Pro Truth.

You can't refute the facts so you get all nasty that is your issue not mine deal with it.

“Duty is a Privilege!”

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#31962 Jan 26, 2014
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
Just for the record, I've also had some really good Bishops I can point to, but I think they got the office by the same way the bad ones got into office, some Stake President using his feelings and in some cases just trying to fill an office that may be empty. The odds are the same for getting a good one as for a bad one, but I see no divine inspiration involved in the process. Looking back, the number of Bishops I would considered bad vs. good would around 50-50.
Have you ever been involved in the process? I will answer that question for you... it's a big fat NO.

All you have regarding this is your speculation - your opinion. Oh, let's not forget those are biased opinions just like the information from those anti-Mormon sites you and concerrned about copy and paste from.
concerned in Brasil

Europe

#31963 Jan 26, 2014
sportxmouse wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you ever been involved in the process? I will answer that question for you... it's a big fat NO.
All you have regarding this is your speculation - your opinion. Oh, let's not forget those are biased opinions just like the information from those anti-Mormon sites you and concerrned about copy and paste from.
Everyone is Biased you especially you as your posts make evident all on their own.

The question is this, are ones bias's justified, do the facts the historical and biblical affirm our predispositions or not.

With regards to the question of whether LDS Mormons are Christians clearly they are not.

RDLS LDS for their frist 100+ years of history want no association with being Christian its only today now that your Sect is more corporation a business than a fellowship has it become more important in marketing the brand.

www.fairmormon.org & Mormon.org are Anti -Truth and Anti-Christian and Anti-Biblical Jesus sites you don't see me getting all nasty and demonizing LDS for posting from them like LDS do when I post from Christian sites.
Mormon vs Idol Worshipper

Olivehurst, CA

#31964 Jan 27, 2014
He says he doesn't know Judas Iscariot was one of the 12 Apostles of Jesus Christ.
267 pages.
Thirty years he says he's pored over this book correcting errors wherever he found them among us.

Judas Iscariot wasn't ever an apostle of Jesus Christ.

LUKE 6:13-16:

Luke 6:13-16
King James Version (KJV)
13 And when it was day, he called unto him his disciples: and of them he chose twelve, whom also he named apostles;

14 Simon,(whom he also named Peter,) and Andrew his brother, James and John, Philip and Bartholomew,

15 Matthew and Thomas, James the son of Alphaeus, and Simon called Zelotes,

16 And Judas the brother of James, and Judas Iscariot, which also was the traitor.
=======
LUKE 22:3
King James Bible
"Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve."

=======
You also claim God didn't cause Mary to have His own Son.

Your idol has abandoned you to your fate: denying God has a Son named Jesus Christ.

One manipulating lie after another. And for what? To SPREAD the NEWS,

GOD has GENDER ISSUES He doesn't understand and He was LYING when He let Jesus represent Him as "Man"

And LYING when He represented Himself as the SON of Man.

LYING.
GOD is LYING about His GENDER.
You have come here to tell us

JUDAS WASN'T ONE of The TWELVE APOSTLES, and WE aren't to BELIEVE that STORY about JESUS CHRIST being the SON of MAN born of a completely normal woman Mary.

That SHE WASN'T PREGNANT with the FATHER of JESUS' child.

IT was ALL a BIG SCAM because GOD DOESN'T KNOW HOW to EXPLAIN IT
so HE made up this ENORMOUS RING of DECEPTIONS
to CONCEAL the fact

He's not a man
He doesn't have sons
He doesn't have daughters

It's ALL a LIE.
==========
If you're as disgusted with these people in person as you are online you're not the only person to realize one of the worst things about pagan Christianity is the pagans.

You don't have to listen to stories like this man who is here to tell us "God is a Space Alien who doesn't know He's not a man."

You can read for yourself, the records of Jewish prophets who fled Jerusalem for their lives from the region for telling the local Jewish leaders their dangerous politics would lead to a national disaster.

They prayed, and they fasted, and they read their own scriptures, as they fled the Jerusalem area to sail, to the New World.

There they recorded their lives in both secular national records and in priestly spiritual records they appended to their own.

These spiritual records they made are the history of their obedience to God, for several hundred years as they used their disciplined lifestyle to defeat all those who were dissatisfied with the disciplined religious life.

At the end they were destroyed. Before they were,

their last national leader,

a man named Mormon,

commissioned a copy of their spiritual obedience and behavior related
to obedience, to the God who saved them to the new land,
to be made and hidden:

A copy of their scriptures.

Mormon.org
concerned in Brasil wrote:
<quoted text>
Squirming around lying is the idolator way. The scriptures lie, God isn't a man, he's a space alien. Mary wasn't pregnant with the SON of GOD that's a LIE.
There were no ''sons of God shouting for joy before this world was like Job 38 says.
That's a bald faced lie by the bible and God's prophets. They don't know God isn't really a MAN and that He is CONFUSED abowt His GiNDuR.
Mormon vs Idol Worshipper

Olivehurst, CA

#31965 Jan 27, 2014
For a bisexual ex Mormon who came to the left coast to gin up a Bible oriented homosexual pick-up site your sensibility about perversions have a lot to be desired vis-a-vis the normal people in society.

Your flag of surrender was flown when Judas turned on Jesus, hick.

We know you Confederate people have strange ideas about what perversion is.

Now though you can't hide behind the fact you're in hate-bait Cone Shaped Hat Country.

You declared it's impossible for a man chosen of God to sin deeply if he was really chosen by God:

denying the HISTORY of SAUL being disobedient while yet one of God's chosen
denying the HISTORY of DAVID being disobedient while yeat one of God's chosen
denying the HISTORY of JONAH being disobedient while yet one of God's chosen
denying the HISTORY of JUDAS ISCARIOT being disobedient while yet one of God's chosen.
denying the HISTORY of PETER being disobedient while yet one of God's chosen.
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm into seriously perverted man on man action so denying the Scriptures is my basic deal. If evil can be done I'm here to say I see no problem with it. Anything that is inconvenient to me, treat like it's a parent not wanting me to take their son for ice cream: pretend that doesn't exist.
Mormon vs Idol Worshipper

Olivehurst, CA

#31966 Jan 27, 2014
Yeah we know: if you were still in Tennessee you'd ride over and burn a cross on my lawn.

You're not in Tennessee hillbilly so claiming you're immune to normal humanity no longer applies to you.
Mormon vs Idol Worshipper

Olivehurst, CA

#31967 Jan 27, 2014
If you were still in Tennessee you'd probably be on a sexual predator list.

You admit outright you got run off for ''counseling'' young men about your homosexuality.

That's never a good sign for a fake self appointed amateur preacher to get run off from a Church for pigeonholing young boys to "chat" about your homosexuality.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

North Salt Lake Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
LDS Apostle visited Tonga (Feb '14) 11 min Sambrotherofnephi 18,861
Why Are THere So Many Gay Mormons ??? 2 hr Just Lisa 3
Review: AMSCO Windows (Jan '10) Oct 19 Disgrundled 65
Review: Holladay Family And Laser Dentistry Oct 17 bcgrooves 1
Review: Poorman's Heating & Air (Mar '14) Oct 16 R Byte 2
School Marketing Research Survey Oct 15 Time2workout 1
in town looking for company Oct 15 gman 1
North Salt Lake Dating
Find my Match

North Salt Lake Jobs

North Salt Lake People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

North Salt Lake News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in North Salt Lake

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]