There are 32028 comments on the Dayton Daily News story from Feb 5, 2008, titled Our recommendation: Springboro voters should say 'yes' the first time to school levies. In it, Dayton Daily News reports that:
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#22880 Jan 7, 2013
As I recall Mr. George Long explaining at one of the budget and finance committee meetings, he received either 600 or 900 applications for one teaching opening in our school district. The number was insane, but goes to show there are plenty of teachers willing and able to employ their chosen craft.
#22881 Jan 7, 2013
"G.L." is no longer employed by Springboro schools, habitual "B.S." being one of the key reasons.
#22882 Jan 7, 2013
All due respect to personal opinions on procedures that our BOE could take to pursue greater achievements for our students...
as for me and my household of voters, we will trust the judgement of the BOE majority vote IF the decision is made to hire the consultant group. Investing taxpayer dollars for the expertise of an unbiased professional consultant group is NOT wasteful spending.
No personal judgement here on our school treasurer's expertise, but the fact is that the treasurer is a part-time school employee and isn't she contracted for overtime pay IF her expertise is needed by the board beyond her part time work hours; it is a fact that the treasurer is capable; but it is the OPINION of some taxpayers that the treasurer has a biased OPINION (and that her opinion leans toward the SEA agenda which opposes charter schools). It is a fact that our school treasurer strongly opposed the school boards decision not to waste our money paying OSBA membership fees. And it is a fact that in public meeting, union activist Lisa Babb has proposed to the Board that our school treasurer should be paid more money IF she is expected to keep the separate "Athletic Funds" separately from general fund in compliance with board by laws and poliicy.
Researching the advantages of charter schools to our students, in my opinion, should not be left to the routine responsibilities of our school treasurer (who is already over-worked, according to the public opinion of union activist, Lisa Babb).
Remember the January 10, 2013, school board meeting is on THURSDAY, when we can all learn more facts.
#22883 Jan 7, 2013
If all of our children are gifted, why are so few taking Advanced Placement coursework and exams?
Passing those courses translates to FREE college credits and money in Mommy and Daddy's bank account.
Why are we so far below our peers? I mean, Lebanon has 46% of its students in those programs. I thought we were supposed to be so much better than everyone else?
Could it be that 37% of our kids in all grades are failing basic Reading?
Could it be that 38% of our kids in all grades are failing basic Math?
Percentages from the latest Ohio Department of Education report card
Oakwood High School is ranked 13th within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Oakwood High School is 63 percent.
Kings High School is ranked 30th within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Kings High School is 47 percent.
Lebanon High School is ranked 31st within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Lebanon High School is 46 percent.
Waynesville High School is ranked 65th within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Waynesville High School is 37 percent.
Bellbrook High School is ranked 48th within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Bellbrook High School is 35 percent.
Centerville High School is ranked 56th within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Centerville High School is 30 percent.
Springboro High School is ranked 110th within Ohio. Students have the opportunity to take Advanced Placement® coursework and exams. The AP® participation rate at Springboro High School is 20 percent.
#22884 Jan 7, 2013
I have been miscalculating the damage being done by our current educational system.
I have been using the entire student population of 5493 in the Springboro school system to generate my percentages. This is an error because sophomores, juniors, and seniors are not reflected in the testing modalities. These high school students, quite simply, do not take the tests. Thus, the sophomores, juniors, and seniors are not represented in the final calculations except as a dilutant.
Subtract out the roughly 1100 sophomores, juniors, and seniors who do not take the tests and your new denominator becomes 4393 students taking the test rather than 5493 total student body population of the school district.
Our test results in that light sink from bad to abysmal
Reading from the last report card goes from 37% to actually 46%
(2030 students scoring BELOW 63%/ 4393 students taking the tests)
Math from the last report card goes from 38% to 47%
(2060 students scoring BELOW 60%/ 4393 students taking the tests)
There is little chance that those children will pick it up later in their educational careers. They will thus be precluded from participating in the highest level courses that would mean SAVINGS for Mom and Dad when footing the college bill.
Who is being cheated here?
The students are the main victim of this fraud, for they will pay for the rest of their lives.
The parents are the ones having to pay extra in an attempt to gain what was once lost in regards to educational opportunities. More college tuition payments for what was supposed to have been learned in high school.
The taxpayers who are in good faith are funding a program that comes up short for everyone but a select few.
#22885 Jan 7, 2013
The source material for high school rankings in our area and the criteria for which they were developed.
The source material for our collective test results in the Springboro School District. A little basic math and a few minutes of your time will verify those results that I have posted.
#22886 Jan 7, 2013
Your "overworked" treasurer is currently also treasurer at 3 charter schools. I don't think she takes a union stand, seeing as she works both sides.
#22887 Jan 7, 2013
Point well taken. Again, no disrespect to the expertise of our school treasurer; but my own opinion, as a resident with one vote in this school district, stands firm that our school treasurer is not without projecting personal opinion of favoring the self-interest SEA agenda, over the best interest of our school children and community as a whole.
Another point, fact is, our current part-time school treasurer is one of the few remaining school employees, who along with board member Don Miller, are among those in leadership who obviously did not have our students best interest as priority over the booster board officials and sports coaches scamming of our students' sports fees.
#22888 Jan 7, 2013
Thank you so much for accomplishing the long overdue task of laundering a lot of the "stinc" out of Distinction.
#22889 Jan 8, 2013
As an average citizen listening to the charter schools presentation at the last school board meeting, I caught the projection of exciting possibilities that our resourceful school district has to offer students opportunity of higher achievements (beyond our status quo district rating of "has been a National Blue Ribbon school and has been excellent with distinction.)
We do have a firm educational foundation, built by Springboro families, taxpaying homeowners, good teachers and district leadership. So my thoughts were "why would anyone object to investing our school tax dollars researching ways to provide our students greater educational achievement?"
You see, at that time, I did not know that charter schools offered all highly qualified educators the Right to Work without their salaries being heavily taxed by the teachers unions. So, when a Springboro mom spoke up in favor of keeping our kids school tax dollars in the "public" school classrooms, I could see clearly that the opposition to charter schools holds the Teachers Union "collective self-interest of money and power" as priority over the best interest of our individual student's educational achievements.
I don't agree that the Teachers Union should "own" our children's
school tax dollars to be used solely for the union's "collective" self interest; so that's why I do not think that our school board is wasting my hard-earned school tax dollars investing in consultants researching opportunities to provide greater individual achievements for all our students.
#22890 Jan 8, 2013
Bestowing the label of excellence on districts that do little to provide for students beyond basic proficiency helps no one. Even in elite, affluent suburbs, communities are lulled into complacent acceptance of the status quo even as their children perform at a level nowhere near excellent.
This phenomenon is nicely explained by Jay Greene, coauthor of
When the Best Is Mediocre:
State accountability systems and the desire to rationalize the lack of quality options have encouraged the elites to compare their affluent suburban districts to the large urban ones in their state. These inappropriate comparisons have falsely reassured them that their own school districts are doing well. This false reassurance has also perhaps undermined the desire among the elites to engage in dramatic education reform. As long as the elites hold onto the belief that their own school districts are excellent, they have little desire to push for the kind of significant systemic reforms that might improve their districts as well as the large urban districts. They
may wish the urban districts well and hope matters improve, but their taste for bold reform is limited by a false contentment with their own situation.
Radio audiences laugh at the imaginary Lake Wobegon, where all students are above average, but Ohio has taken things to a level that some have described as Lake Wobegon on steroids, and the damage to the educational system is becoming evident. It is time to take an honest look at state
standards and to see how these “excellent” districts are truly performing. Parents, policymakers, and the general public no longer can afford to pretend that the emperor is clothed. It is time to take a look at the ugly, naked truth about the accountability system in Ohio.
#22891 Jan 9, 2013
Based on recent TV news reports and website news articles and public comments, that I have read about charter schools being pursued in Springboro, it is understood that the real "political battle" of Springboro union activists against the BOE elected majority is what it's all about to the Springboro Education Association (which is struggling mightily to empower itself with increased power and control over our kid's classroom teachers and school tax dollars).
The SEA political battle to hold our locally elected school board representatives ACCOUNTABILE to the governing restrictions of the Ohio School Board Association (instead of accountability to local school district taxpayers who have a responsibility to "govern ourselves" making financial decisions that ensure the best quality classroom education, while living within the means of our community resources).
NOW is the time for all concerned conversatives to get going in pursuit of higher achievements for all our children's future. Springboro self-interest union activists will never stop spreading lies that our "status quo" school district ratings are good enough for Springboro students; and that all things bad in our school district are the Springboro Board of Education representatives that are putting our children's classroom education first, in the best interest of doing what's right for our school children and commununity as a whole.
Let us not be taken in by these Springboro union activists (whose priority is NOT pursuing higher individual acedemic achievements for all children) but whose priority it is to pursue the same old politics of personal destruction undermining the integrity and character of all our school members who stand for our children FIRST budgeting, and refuse to bow to the union masters.
#22892 Jan 9, 2013
YES this group started a PETITION, yes another one. They are OSBA supporters because OSBA is an arm of the union. So do you know where they come from now? OSBA and the OEA have joined forces to stop education reform have lobbiests that lobby against school choice, lobby against our kids getting better than what they are getting. Everyone please see this article see the truth and see the lies you have been told about the quality of your childs education for years. WHY? Think of the agendas who wants you to think everything is hunky dori, everything they do is great and don't ask questions. OEA and OSBA that's who.
#22893 Jan 9, 2013
I had no idea, now I am very frustrated. This is what Lisa Babb and others with her want to cover up with the "everything is great here in la la land"? According to her and her fellow bullies, "we are great so why mess with greatness"? Remember Lisa is a Teacher for public schools.
I think I am one of the last to know this stuff, is this why home schoolers went from 8 in 2009 to 200 today. So in just two years parents chose to educate at home rather than keeping them in a failing system. These parents want more for their kids shouldn't we?
#22894 Jan 9, 2013
Remember after all that her husband is a teacher at Lakota. Can you be impartial about decisions if you work for charter schools and the union at the same time? Just asking. Maybe so.
#22895 Jan 9, 2013
You are sooo right. Lisa and her workers are working to sway public opinion, this is negotiations 101. Since the union feels the pressure they grasp with their minions to work public opinion to win sentiment and hopefully strike a win with the voters. The OEA can not let Springboro fiscal soundness get out there because it sets a president that they can not have in this State. Lisa says she is a Christian yet supports the union mantra and more union power. The teachers union sends the majority of their money to democratic causes and candidates including murdering unborn= pro choice candidates yet does not support choice of parents in education. I am very confused here. So supports teh pro choices of democratic union activism yet does not believe children should have alternatives to the "public education she believes in.
#22896 Jan 9, 2013
I can guarantee you in 2009 there were a lot more than 8 kids being home schooled in Springboro.
The job of home schooling a child is no walk in the park. We've lived in this area for over 20 years. During this time we've met many parents both inside and outside of Springboro schools who have chosen to home school. Some of them were starting to home school in order to attempt to fix a "bad situation" at public or private school. Others were brand new parents with children entering kindergarten age.
Some of these homeschool stories have been successful, while many others haven't. The successful ones usuallly involve a parent who possess not only an ability to teach, but more importantly God-given PATIENCE.
Then there have been a number of absolute home schooling horror stories. One involved a teaching parent that quite frankly had no idea what she was getting into because she wasn't mature or patient enough to be her kids full time teacher. Another situation involved a very talented parent whose strong efforts ended up in complete ruins only because of interference by the spouse substance abuse problem.
Another local family we know was successful in graduating their children through home schooling. Their kids are well past graduation age and still can't support themselves. This is unfortunate because they are very bright, friendly people. I suspect a lot of their current problems may have something to do lack of personal growth opportunities and lack of good peer socialization because of their oppressive helicopter parents.
#22897 Jan 9, 2013
One factor that can influence the percentage of kids taking AP classes is the breadth of the subject offered as well as the number of actual classes held. I know that one of my kids was not able to take an AP class because it was full therefore, his not able to take that class negatively impacted Springboro's percentage. Also, Springboro's AP offering is narrower than that offered at other schools. We probably have more than some and I know we have less than others. That would also impact the number and percentage of kids taking classes. You have to be careful with these stats as it's not straight apples to apples from school to school. It could be that if we had more sections of a particular AP class and/or a wider offering, that our percentage could be higher, or even lower.
#22898 Jan 9, 2013
Above judgement is so typical of the Springboro union activists -- just blame the parents for "withholding" those school tax dollars stamped on that child's forehead by the greedy union masters of Springboro Education Association ...
btw-- lots of college-educated young adults,(even those who graduated from excellent with distinction high schools),
are coming home from graduation to live with their parents, instead of starting their careers -- because there are NO jobs for these young adults and no money to pay back those "higher education" loans.
#22899 Jan 9, 2013
Don't forget that offering AP courses costs money (teachers must be specially trained by The College Board in order to teach AP courses), requires different textbooks purchases, and impacts the class sizes of non-AP courses being offered. For example, if Teacher A and Teacher B are both teaching 2 classes of Physics (just a hypothetical example) in 2012-2013, but in 2013-2014, Teacher A teaches a secion of AP Physics, there is one less section of regular Physics for students to take. Generally speaking, fewer students will take an AP course than a regular course, meaning the AP Physics class may only have 15 students in it, instead of 25. This results in larger classes in the three "regular" courses. Obviously, in this example, the increased number of students isn't catastrophic, but if it happened for multiple classes in multiple subject areas, it would make a difference.
Also of note, specifically impacting the statistics mentioned earlier, Springbor students who take AP courses are not required to take the AP exam for the course they are AP course they are taking (it is optional and those who take the test must pay for it themselves). In most of the schools mentioned in the statistics provided, all students enrolled in the course are required to take the AP exam and the cost is absorbed into class fees. Requiring them to take the exam encourages them to take the class seriously and enables the teachers to go into greater depth in their instruction.
I'm sure you will question my source for this information...it is from The College Board (the company that makes the AP tests), analysis of budget reports, and questioning the adminstrators at Springboro. A detailed analysis for Springboro's AP courses (including their cost to the district) was completed during the 2008-09 Program Analysis Project. Surely it is a matter of public record and can be requested from Central Office. At the time, offering AP courses was found to be incredibly cost-effective. Requiring students to take the courses seriously and take the exams was "not within the spirit of Springboro High School's Philosophy" and was not pursued.
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