Berlin, Adult Novelty Store Face Off ...

Berlin, Adult Novelty Store Face Off In State Supreme Court

There are 75 comments on the Hartford Courant story from Apr 15, 2008, titled Berlin, Adult Novelty Store Face Off In State Supreme Court. In it, Hartford Courant reports that:

The hearing on "VIP of Berlin LLC v. Town of Berlin et al" was the latest round in a dispute over the legality of the town's ordinance regulating the location of sexually-oriented businesses, including strip ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Hartford Courant.

Imagine no religion

Newington, CT

#46 Apr 15, 2008
Beckie wrote:
<quoted text>
A business is a business. No one complained when it was a furniture store. Why such a big issue now that it's an adult store? Hasn't dateline proved all the true pervs are getting their fix online at home? So what you're upset about is that a van load of females might roll into your neighborhood to get party favors for a bachlorette party? You think this will affect your property values? If yes, please explain how. A thriving (thats thriving not throbbing) business should be beneficial to all parties involved including the town and neighborhood. Heck I'd love it if an adult store opened up across the street from me. At least then I'd have someplace to close by to "window shop" and pass time at on yet another boring weekend day in Connecticut.
Not the point. Berlin has the right to zone businesses, and clearly the zoning board is listening to its constituency. And I agree with Next Door Neighbor. Every single one of you would be fighting this store if it wanted to build next to your home. Just accept the fact that their property rights take precedence here. And the fact that other such businesses may be located at other parts on the turnpike is irrelevant. For all we know, those businesses are in conformity with the buffer requirement, or, if they are not, were built before the ordinance was passed. What the people of Berlin wish to allow in proximity to their private residences is for the people of Berlin to decide, not you.
Chuck

Minneapolis, MN

#47 Apr 15, 2008
Lisa wrote:
I'm all for it. The state is backwards. How come I cant buy booze on Sunday but I can gamble, shop, go to adult bookstores, etc???
Correction.

How come I can't buy booze at a package store on Sunday and take it hoe to drink, but I can go to a bar and get wasted then I can casually drive how.
KML80

Pelham, NY

#48 Apr 15, 2008
capitalism is a wonderful word. prostitutes were among the first capitalists.
Mother of Children wrote:
<quoted text>
You're a misogynist. Women who support LEGAL businesses are called "Capitalists", which still isn't considered a dirty word on this forum.
Elvis

Hartford, CT

#49 Apr 15, 2008
KML80 wrote:
Yeah, taking pictures of patrons is really not fair. They arent't doing anything illegal, and you could potentially cause a lot of damage to someone's family doing that. The issue is whether the establishnment should be there in the first place...
Anyway, are there really still motels there that have mirrored ceilings and charge by the hour? Which ones??
Hunny you have got to get out more if you think those hotels don't exist! The Grantmore and the Carrier and the Flamingo are some that are well known for hot tubs, mirrors and 24hr porn. The Flamingo may technically be in Meriden? But they also specialize in "theme rooms".
Elvis

Hartford, CT

#50 Apr 15, 2008
KML80 wrote:
not one good argument? declining property values, prostitution, onsite sexual activity and disease transmission...
Kids that see establishments like this don't need tlo enter them to be harmed. Just the existence of the business near their neighborhood implies to children that these are acceptable and legitimate establishments.
These are in fact acceptable and legitimate establishments! Just because your personal moral views do not condone these businesses does not mean that they are illegal. They have just as much right to be in business as say a package store. Based on your logic shouldn't we be more worried as a society about kids being exposed to alcohol and all of the evils that can come with drinking? Violence, crimnal behavior, "loose women" spreading disease, etc...????

Have you ever even been by a VIP store in CT? Other than a sign outside saying VIP the windows are blocked out and you would never even know what was inside.

You make me chuckle with the thought of "onsite sexual activity" taking place. No such thing would take place unless it is outside the building, this is not a place that has "back rooms" for that sort of thing. This is not a strip club. And you are just as likely to run into a couple "doing it" in a McDonald's parking lot as the VIP parking lot.

And as far as the protitution goes, they already have that problem regardless if VIP is there.

Since: Jun 07

Annandale, VA

#51 Apr 15, 2008
As a former resident of Connecticut I do not think the town should turn away potential tax revenues and jobs. It’s not like jobs are pouring into the state or into Berlin. If the residents turn away the business then they should not complain about higher taxes. Berlin residents are trying to portray themselves as an affluent moral town. They forget they are not living in Weston or Wilton CT, they are a middle class town that has operated sex type business in the past and present. VIP is like Fredrick’s of Hollywood or Victoria Secrets. It’s nothing like a shop you would find on 42nd Street in NY before Rudy cleaned it up. There are no peep shows going on in the backroom. Just because you do not morally find it as an appropriate store it does not mean others will agree with you. If you don’t like the store then don’t shop there. There is more danger on the internet for your children then if your town has a VIP store in it. Parents are worried about their children will be exposed to sex if the store opens I suggest don’t take them shopping there. Or perhaps you might want to talk to them about sex so they are informed considering most news reports state that children are experimenting with sex already in junior high.
Who Leo

United States

#52 Apr 15, 2008
Beckie wrote:
Thank you, Beckie.
Fight a real Problem

North Kingstown, RI

#53 Apr 15, 2008
Adult Book stores are not Illegal. Last I checked this is a free country, so they tell me. I feel my freedoms are slowly being taken away, If we can get the hippocritical church and all of its followers to wake up and get a brain, think for themselves instead of being mindless robots (minions), this could be a nice country again. I have traveled extensivly around the world for both business and leisure, adult and sex themed business are not harassed like they are here and last I checked their crime rates are not any worse than ours, and when it comes to gun violence, we rate the highest. Churchs don't want adult stores or any adults businesses, but they will rape young boys and hide behind the church and when caught, they get a slap on the hand. Hippocrites. Why don't we spend our resources on education, healthcare, energy instead of wasting 10's of thousands of dollars fighting worthless hippocritical minions.
A Mom

Wallingford, CT

#54 Apr 15, 2008
The day VIP or Penthouse Boutique wants to become your next door neighbor, all of you people can give your opinion.
I have been in VIP, and while there is much novelty, there is also a hardcore porn video section the size of Blockbust video. There is a large room size section of steel bladed knives and bongs. So, this is not Fredricks of Holywood, Victorias Secret or Spencer Gifts here.
There actually IS no law stating that you have to be over 18 to enter these stores. The AG looked it up. They are not *carding* anyways.
The Flamingo, Grantmoor and whatever other hotels mentioned are not IN Berlin. Yes, there have been prostitutes arrested in hotels on the turnpike. Does that mean we deserve a huge porn store too? Nice combo.
As a tax paying property owner, the argument of declining property values is legit. A Furniture store hardly carried the same baggage an adult shop does.
To the person griping about churches, etc., has anyone on this post even mentioned anything about religion? I certainly have not. I havent even mentioned protecting children, etc. This is about the right to ZONE! DUH!
A LOSER MOM

United States

#55 Apr 16, 2008
IF THEY SUBDIVIDED THE LAND AND IT WAS 300 FT FROM YOUR HOUSE WOULD YOU HAVE A PROBLEM THEN. SURE YOU WOULD BE THEN ARGUEING FOR THE LAW AT 300 FT. THE DEVELOPER CAN SIMPLY DIVIDE THE PROPERTY IN TWO AND PUT IN A SMALLER STORE AND BE WITHIN THE REGS. YOUR ARGUMENBT HOLDS NO VALUE THAT YOU WERE THERE FIRST. THIS IS LIKE SAYING THE INDIANS WERE HERE FIRST SO THE OWN THE LAND OR THE DRUG DEALERS HOUSE WAS THERE FIRST SO YOU SHOULD MOVE BECAUSE WE LIKE OUR DEPRESSED NEIGHBORHOOD. A FEW MONTHS BACK SOME LOSER BOUGHT A HOUSE NEXT TO A FARM AND COMPLAINED ABOUT THE SMELL AMONG AND A MILLION OTHER THINGS THAT GO WITH A FARM. IT DOES NOT MATTER YOU WERE THERE FIRST OR SECOND WHAT MATTERS IS IF THIS WILL BE PERMITTED BY THE LAW THAT THE TOWN PASSED. EVEN IF THE LAWSUIT IS WON OR LOST WATCH OUT FOR THE SUB-DIVIDE SLICE AND THEN A BUILD OR WORSE YET IF THEY BUY UP THE HOUSES AROUND YOU AND THEN SUBDIVIDE. MAYBE YOUR NEIGHBORS WILL GET PAID AND I WOULD BET YOU WOULD TAKE THE MONEY TO AND THEN COMPLAIN IN ANOTHER NEIGHBORHOOD BUT YOU WOULD LIVE THERE SECOND SO IT WOULDNT MATTER. DONT FORGET THAT THE TOWN ZONED THIS A COMMERCIAL AREA AND THEN AMENDED THE LAW TO EXCLUDE A BUISNESS. DID YOU KNOW THAT THE AREA WAS COMMERCIAL WHEN YOU MOVED IN? PLEEEEASE TELL US WHAT BUISNESS WOULD BE APPROPRIATE THERE. SOME MOM AND POP PORN STORE? HOW ABOUT A FREDRICKS OF HOLLYWOOD? IS A GUN SHOP OKAY THERE? HOW ABOUT A DOCTORS OFFICE? A LIMO COMPANY OR TAXI COMPANY? PLEASE SPEAK UP AND TELL US WHAT YOU WOULD SAY WOULD BE A GOOD BUISNESS!
Berlin Drive In

AOL

#56 Apr 16, 2008
A Mom wrote:
The day VIP or Penthouse Boutique wants to become your next door neighbor, all of you people can give your opinion.
I have been in VIP, and while there is much novelty, there is also a hardcore porn video section the size of Blockbust video. There is a large room size section of steel bladed knives and bongs. So, this is not Fredricks of Holywood, Victorias Secret or Spencer Gifts here.
There actually IS no law stating that you have to be over 18 to enter these stores. The AG looked it up. They are not *carding* anyways.
The Flamingo, Grantmoor and whatever other hotels mentioned are not IN Berlin. Yes, there have been prostitutes arrested in hotels on the turnpike. Does that mean we deserve a huge porn store too? Nice combo.
As a tax paying property owner, the argument of declining property values is legit. A Furniture store hardly carried the same baggage an adult shop does.
To the person griping about churches, etc., has anyone on this post even mentioned anything about religion? I certainly have not. I havent even mentioned protecting children, etc. This is about the right to ZONE! DUH!
It was enlightening and informative that you went in and took a look for yourself. Basically, it's an adult store. Would kids want to go in? Highly doubtful. Would management allow them in? I doubt it. Nothing they are selling is illegal, nor, have I heard that anything illegal goes on at their Hartford Location. Would I want them as neighbors? If my property was zoned for commercial and I was stupid enough to buy it either near or close to, a commercial zoned piece, so be it.
There seems to be so much drama in Berlin about a VIP store. It wasn't all that long ago, the Berlin Drive in could be seen by any passerby, including a chid, riding in the family car after dark. Has Berlin changed it's image as being the smut of the pike? You can thank all your old starched politicians for allowing these businesses and this type of zoning. On the other hand, there's really no need for all this reaction over VIP. It's not a whore bordello.
Been There

Indian Orchard, MA

#57 Apr 16, 2008
Lisa wrote:
I'm all for it. The state is backwards. How come I cant buy booze on Sunday but I can gamble, shop, go to adult bookstores, etc???
Why? Because back in the old days of local little mom & pop package stores, they didn't want to work on Sundays.

The liqour dealers got together and paid off the Legislature thru donations and support in order to keep it that way.
mom

Hartford, CT

#58 Apr 16, 2008
NEXT DOOR NEIGHBOR -

Good Luck in your fight against this. I know this has been going on for a while. Anyone who says they wouldn't care if a business open until 2:00 am were next to them is an idiot or a liar.
(any business) Anyone saying they wouldn't care if an this particulat business was next to them is .... don't even know what to call them, but not normal that's for sure!

Good Luck again....

“Just be”

Since: Apr 08

Torrington

#59 Apr 16, 2008
Come on people, grow up! If you don't like it don't go in. There's an In The Mood here in Torrington and there's no big flashy signs. It doesn't draw any extra attention and YES I have been in there and, NO, its NOT filled with Porncrazed addicts foaming at the mouth or drug users or children. Its just like any regular store but with dark windows so children and weak hearted elderly can't see everything thats inside. And I even got carded upon entering the store!
BallBags

Hartford, CT

#61 Apr 16, 2008
Been There wrote:
The liqour dealers got together and paid off the Legislature thru donations and support in order to keep it that way.
That's a load of BS, and you know it. Only this state has done this. everybody has to go to the adjacent states in order to get their booze(NY, RI, MA) if they didn't want to work on Sundays, they could've just hired someone and stop being such money grubbers.

It was becuase of religion back in the days, not the liquor dealers.

It's all about business, and CT seems to be too incompetent to let business flow without goign through so much red tape to make the business go on to the next state.
Good for you Nikki

AOL

#62 Apr 16, 2008
nikkita wrote:
Come on people, grow up! If you don't like it don't go in. There's an In The Mood here in Torrington and there's no big flashy signs. It doesn't draw any extra attention and YES I have been in there and, NO, its NOT filled with Porncrazed addicts foaming at the mouth or drug users or children. Its just like any regular store but with dark windows so children and weak hearted elderly can't see everything thats inside. And I even got carded upon entering the store!
Thanks Nikki for your response. You sound sensible and mature. The people in Berlin P&M about anything and everything, yet, they don't even support their local merchants. Whether it's a VIP or a candle shop, they won't shop there, so I'm wondering what all the shouting and drama is about. They could move next door to me if they want. At least I'll be able to run next door on a Saturday Night and get a good porn flick for me and the wife to view because there's absolutely NOTHING on TV anymore. Have a good day!
Been There

Indian Orchard, MA

#63 Apr 16, 2008
BallBags wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a load of BS, and you know it. Only this state has done this. everybody has to go to the adjacent states in order to get their booze(NY, RI, MA) if they didn't want to work on Sundays, they could've just hired someone and stop being such money grubbers.
It was becuase of religion back in the days, not the liquor dealers.
It's all about business, and CT seems to be too incompetent to let business flow without goign through so much red tape to make the business go on to the next state.
Yes, religion played a part in it. But, it's not BS. My family owned a package store. While you have a point about hiring help to work, we played hell finding someone (honest) willing to work. Therefore, if it was open 7 days a week, we had to work it.

“Just be”

Since: Apr 08

Torrington

#64 Apr 16, 2008
Good for you Nikki wrote:
<quoted text>
They could move next door to me if they want. At least I'll be able to run next door on a Saturday Night and get a good porn flick for me and the wife to view because there's absolutely NOTHING on TV anymore. Have a good day!
LOL Thanks for your support! Good to see other couples comfortable enough to explore a little. Have a sparkling day!

Since: Jul 07

Newington, CT

#65 Apr 16, 2008
Imagine no religion wrote:
<quoted text>
Not the point. Berlin has the right to zone businesses, and clearly the zoning board is listening to its constituency. And I agree with Next Door Neighbor. Every single one of you would be fighting this store if it wanted to build next to your home. Just accept the fact that their property rights take precedence here. And the fact that other such businesses may be located at other parts on the turnpike is irrelevant. For all we know, those businesses are in conformity with the buffer requirement, or, if they are not, were built before the ordinance was passed. What the people of Berlin wish to allow in proximity to their private residences is for the people of Berlin to decide, not you.
Berlin already zoned that building for business. A business is in there right now. In fact a fireworks business. With bright shiny displays to lure children. I'd be a lot more concerned about my kids being that close to flammable toys than an adult store with blacked out windows where kids aren't allowed. Why is it because YOU are bothered by an adult store you assume the rest of the state is? Porn is a multi billion dollar business (per year), clearly a lot more people than drug addicted knife wielders shop at VIP. What the people of Berlin decide sets a precedent for the rest of the towns in the State and we certainly don't want to send a message that we discourage business in Connecticut. We've already lost enough as it is.
BallBags

Hartford, CT

#66 Apr 17, 2008
Been There wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, religion played a part in it. But, it's not BS. My family owned a package store. While you have a point about hiring help to work, we played hell finding someone (honest) willing to work. Therefore, if it was open 7 days a week, we had to work it.
Hey, as long as you can do it, do it. I have no problems with that. I know there are some people willing to work now, with this F*d up economy in CT.

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