Does Neewollah conform to ADA mandates?
Bottom Line

Aransas Pass, TX

#21 Sep 15, 2012
me wrote:
Is this seriously an argument? First of all in order to make a ramp compliant there is no need to tear down the whole thing,just readjust it. Second of all if your working through a disability good for you, but don't condemn those who are so disabled that they cannot work through it. Third of all it is the law to be ADA compliant and the city did not do it so they should have to fix it. And yes I do understand that we end up paying for it but as the law requires so be it! And if u really feel that neewollah is dev worship you are an idiot because the history behind is to keep the kids from causing mischief...furthermore it is part of what makes our community unique, although I do sometimes feel its inconvenience I feel it would be heartbreaking to lose such a tradition. I have family on both sides of the "disabled" spectrum, one who is genuinely disabled and one that is just drawing a check because they can....it breaks my heart either way....sometimes I just wish people on topix would have more compassion! Get off your high horses And a walk a mile in the shoes of others then see how it freaking feels!
How do you suggest readjusting a concrete ramp that is minutely out of compliance? Like so many things, it CAN'T be readjusted, it has to be rebuilt.

I wish the disabled people of this town would HAVE SOME COMPASSION for people barely making it buy or unemployed because of the economy, and appreciate the GIGANTIC TAXES they're having to pay for ADA, instead of disabled people trying to stir up more ADA-related problems with Neewollah.
historian

Coffeyville, KS

#22 Sep 15, 2012
CC Biggs wrote:
Well, from reading this thread my thinking is some people are itching to file a big fat lawsuit on Neewollah, vendors and Independence. If I were a vendor I wouldn't set foot into Independence, to much of a risk of a lawsuit. These folks (vendors)are for the most part small business' which could not absorb even the opening salvo of legal action. It might be a pretty bleak looking Neewollah this year. On the other hand, the lawyers look to have a dandy time!
It looked pretty bleak last year.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#23 Sep 16, 2012
Bottom Line wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you suggest readjusting a concrete ramp that is minutely out of compliance? Like so many things, it CAN'T be readjusted, it has to be rebuilt.
I wish the disabled people of this town would HAVE SOME COMPASSION for people barely making it buy or unemployed because of the economy, and appreciate the GIGANTIC TAXES they're having to pay for ADA, instead of disabled people trying to stir up more ADA-related problems with Neewollah.
I don't see how asking Neewollah to conform to a 20 yr old Federal Law is stirring up problems. Like downtown businesses, they too are required to remove barriers and become compliant. Take for instance Daylight Donuts, they did a major remodel of their business, but did not make their restaurant accessible to persons using wheelchairs or other assistive devices, their rest rooms are also not compliant, no one in a wheelchair can enter the business to have coffee or a donut with friends and family. The post office is another, the door entryway is non- compliant, there are major violations that could be corrected at most or all businesses in town, but like their city governments mentality, of "that doesn't apply to us" it will most likely come back to bite them in the backside.
seriously

Coffeyville, KS

#24 Sep 16, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
The bandstand downtown has come in to question if it conforms to ADA standards. Also areas of the sidewalks and streets that have barriers like hoses and picnic tables hampering access to the downtown area for people with a handicap covered under the ADA. Interesting points, what measures are in place to make the bandstand accessible, and the carnival and vendor areas?
Who gives a flying f---?
Bottom Line

Aransas Pass, TX

#25 Sep 16, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
<quoted text>I don't see how asking Neewollah to conform to a 20 yr old Federal Law is stirring up problems. Like downtown businesses, they too are required to remove barriers and become compliant. Take for instance Daylight Donuts, they did a major remodel of their business, but did not make their restaurant accessible to persons using wheelchairs or other assistive devices, their rest rooms are also not compliant, no one in a wheelchair can enter the business to have coffee or a donut with friends and family. The post office is another, the door entryway is non- compliant, there are major violations that could be corrected at most or all businesses in town, but like their city governments mentality, of "that doesn't apply to us" it will most likely come back to bite them in the backside.
In case you've been too selfish to notice, some Independence businessmen are hurting in this economy too and some are barely able to hold on. Since you're such an expert, how do you suggest a business man who's barely keeping his doors open pay for all these thousands of dollars in remodels? Do you think money grows on trees? If you're so concerned, why don't you and some other ADA supporters do some fundraisers that will help these businesses afford to make the changes you want them to make? Or are you just one of those people who want to sit around on disability or welfare looking for trouble and throwing a non-stop pity party for yourself? I have no doubt whatsoever, if someone with a wheelchair needed to enter either the donut shop or the Post Office, someone would be more than glad to help them. I grew up during the polio outbreak, so there were many people disabled because of polio. Everyone understood their challenges and eagerly helped them WITHOUT ANY INVOLVEMENT FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, ADA IMPROVEMENTS, OR SKY HIGH TAXES.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#26 Sep 16, 2012
Bottom Line wrote:
<quoted text>
In case you've been too selfish to notice, some Independence businessmen are hurting in this economy too and some are barely able to hold on. Since you're such an expert, how do you suggest a business man who's barely keeping his doors open pay for all these thousands of dollars in remodels? Do you think money grows on trees? If you're so concerned, why don't you and some other ADA supporters do some fundraisers that will help these businesses afford to make the changes you want them to make? Or are you just one of those people who want to sit around on disability or welfare looking for trouble and throwing a non-stop pity party for yourself? I have no doubt whatsoever, if someone with a wheelchair needed to enter either the donut shop or the Post Office, someone would be more than glad to help them. I grew up during the polio outbreak, so there were many people disabled because of polio. Everyone understood their challenges and eagerly helped them WITHOUT ANY INVOLVEMENT FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, ADA IMPROVEMENTS, OR SKY HIGH TAXES.
There are federal grants and also low interest loans available to businesses to assist them in becoming compliant, your anger should be focused towards the city, and the businesses that selfishly put themselves in the position of non-compliance for 20 years. The city has received grant money, but still hoodwinked the voters into choosing a sales tax or property tax to pay for their negligent non planning, and if you read the fine print, that sales tax you voted for is not just for ADA, but basically the commission can use it for whatever they wish. chill out and open your mind, look at what's happening around you.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#27 Sep 16, 2012
seriously wrote:
<quoted text>
Who gives a flying f---?
You should.

Since: Sep 12

Independence, KS

#28 Sep 17, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
<quoted text>You should.
Just curious- how much time do you spend downtown, during this event?Funny how there are so many victims in this down. We see more people blaming everyone else and expecting a free handout around here then we've seen anywhere.
if they exerted half theenergy they do bitching about it being all against them as they did trying to HELP out it would be amazing.

My busines is not ADA compliant, and I have no intention of being that way either. It's cost-prohibitive for a small business to invest the money they ask you to for a "maybe" customer or 2 a year. You want to sue me? Fine, go ahead, you'll be the new proud owner of my business and now YOU have to fork over the money to be compliant, because I will come back and SUE YOU.
Bottom Line

Aransas Pass, TX

#29 Sep 17, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
<quoted text>There are federal grants and also low interest loans available to businesses to assist them in becoming compliant, your anger should be focused towards the city, and the businesses that selfishly put themselves in the position of non-compliance for 20 years. The city has received grant money, but still hoodwinked the voters into choosing a sales tax or property tax to pay for their negligent non planning, and if you read the fine print, that sales tax you voted for is not just for ADA, but basically the commission can use it for whatever they wish. chill out and open your mind, look at what's happening around you.
Ever tried applying for a federal grant? It's so complicated that EVEN THE CITY HAS TO PAY SOMEONE A LOT OF MONEY TO FILL OUT ITS GRANT APPLICATIONS. If it's that complicated and that expensive, how is the average business person supposed to apply for a grant?

Take a look at some of the buildings downtown and you'll see they are gradually looking horrible or falling apart because the owners can't afford to properly maintain them. If they can't afford to maintain them, whose going to loan them money to make ADA improvements? If they DO get the low interest loans, how are they supposed to pay them if they're already having financial problems in just keeping their doors open?

The city did receive grant money, but it never could have received enough grant money to pay for all the ADA improvements, that's why it had to raise our taxes. It is true that some of the new taxes will be spent on things other than ADA, but chances are, if we were not being forced to make the ADA improvements during the worst economic downturn in American history, the city would not have even considered raising our taxes. The ADA situation gave them the opportunity to do so, so they did it.

I can assure you, I am looking around. What I'm seeing is a bunch of ungrateful people like you, who want other people and businesses who are having a tough time financially, to spend money they don't have to accomodate a small group of people. Why don't you appreciate the sacrifices EVERYONE is having to make for ADA improvements and let all your complaining about Neewollah, the donut shop, and everything else rest until the economy improves and people/businesses have more money to feed their families and pay their bills?

As I said before, if this bothers you so much, then get a group of like-minded people and do some fundraising that will pay for some of the improvements you want made. Something tells me, you won't do it because you, like so many others, want to look for ways to cause trouble, instead of being a part of the solution.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#30 Sep 17, 2012
WTF1966 wrote:
<quoted text>
Just curious- how much time do you spend downtown, during this event?Funny how there are so many victims in this down. We see more people blaming everyone else and expecting a free handout around here then we've seen anywhere.
if they exerted half theenergy they do bitching about it being all against them as they did trying to HELP out it would be amazing.
My busines is not ADA compliant, and I have no intention of being that way either. It's cost-prohibitive for a small business to invest the money they ask you to for a "maybe" customer or 2 a year. You want to sue me? Fine, go ahead, you'll be the new proud owner of my business and now YOU have to fork over the money to be compliant, because I will come back and SUE YOU.
Cost prohibitive you say? Instead of picking and choosing which laws you will or will not abide, why not sell your business, or sell your residence if you can't pay your expenses? Why not refuse to pay sales taxes for a year or so, it worked for the small grocery on east Main didn't it? Oh wait, poor example. This has nothing to do with victims, or bitching, it has everything to do with if you own a business, you must make it accessible, remove the barriers, it's as simple as that.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#31 Sep 17, 2012
Bottom Line wrote:
<quoted text>
Ever tried applying for a federal grant? It's so complicated that EVEN THE CITY HAS TO PAY SOMEONE A LOT OF MONEY TO FILL OUT ITS GRANT APPLICATIONS. If it's that complicated and that expensive, how is the average business person supposed to apply for a grant?
Take a look at some of the buildings downtown and you'll see they are gradually looking horrible or falling apart because the owners can't afford to properly maintain them. If they can't afford to maintain them, whose going to loan them money to make ADA improvements? If they DO get the low interest loans, how are they supposed to pay them if they're already having financial problems in just keeping their doors open?
The city did receive grant money, but it never could have received enough grant money to pay for all the ADA improvements, that's why it had to raise our taxes. It is true that some of the new taxes will be spent on things other than ADA, but chances are, if we were not being forced to make the ADA improvements during the worst economic downturn in American history, the city would not have even considered raising our taxes. The ADA situation gave them the opportunity to do so, so they did it.
I can assure you, I am looking around. What I'm seeing is a bunch of ungrateful people like you, who want other people and businesses who are having a tough time financially, to spend money they don't have to accomodate a small group of people. Why don't you appreciate the sacrifices EVERYONE is having to make for ADA improvements and let all your complaining about Neewollah, the donut shop, and everything else rest until the economy improves and people/businesses have more money to feed their families and pay their bills?
As I said before, if this bothers you so much, then get a group of like-minded people and do some fundraising that will pay for some of the improvements you want made. Something tells me, you won't do it because you, like so many others, want to look for ways to cause trouble, instead of being a part of the solution.
Making a business accessible is the responsibility of the business owner, you can't solve all area problems with a poker run, as much as you think you can.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#32 Sep 17, 2012
CC Biggs wrote:
Well, from reading this thread my thinking is some people are itching to file a big fat lawsuit on Neewollah, vendors and Independence. If I were a vendor I wouldn't set foot into Independence, to much of a risk of a lawsuit. These folks (vendors)are for the most part small business' which could not absorb even the opening salvo of legal action. It might be a pretty bleak looking Neewollah this year. On the other hand, the lawyers look to have a dandy time!
The saddest part of it all is the fact that a typical business owner will spend two, or three times to retain a lawyer to fight a compliance matter that they will always lose, than to just make the adjustments, remove the barriers, and become compliant.
Take a hike

Independence, KS

#33 Sep 17, 2012
Indy truth when did obesity become a disability? Most of the so called disabled in this town that are always complaining are just that, not disabled but obese. By the way does Neewollah even come under ADA since there are no permanent structures. Why arent you bitching about the state fairs and other annual events?

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#34 Sep 17, 2012
Take a hike wrote:
Indy truth when did obesity become a disability? Most of the so called disabled in this town that are always complaining are just that, not disabled but obese. By the way does Neewollah even come under ADA since there are no permanent structures. Why arent you bitching about the state fairs and other annual events?
You think obese individuals are all disabled? So called disabled, it is statements like these that have made it necessary for a federal mandate because of those that do not have a clue. People in Independence always seem to go down this path, not using the good gift that God gave them in the form of a brain to figure that chances are, if someone is disabled and cannot walk much or exercise like a well individual, then they might just gain some weight along the way. And yes, vendors must comply. The Bandstand also as it is a public event.
Take a hike

Independence, KS

#35 Sep 17, 2012
Well those who can, should use the good gift God gave them (in the form of exercise) instead of stuffing more donuts and pop in their faces. No exercise and gaining more weight does not alleviate the problem it just makes it worse. Go to walmart and see for yourself. The people who need the motor carts rarely get them, as in the elderly who use walkers or others who use cane. Its the ones who need a few more paces during the day other than going to the fridge who take them, just to get another bag of cheetos and a case of pepsi, or a box of twinkies.

Since: Sep 12

Independence, KS

#36 Sep 17, 2012
indy Truth:
Do you even go to any of the events during Neewollah?

just noticed you been griping about it nonstop but do you actually go and spend money there?

People(vendors) that happen to read posts like this are NOT coming here for fear of radical idiots itching to pull the lawsuit card. I wouldn't set up anywhere I was afraid of being sued while just trying to make a dollar.

People like you ruin these events and scare away people that would spend money here.

Like so many others have said- try to help resolve the problem, not make it bigger- it's obvious you have plenty of free time on your hands.
Take a hike

Independence, KS

#37 Sep 17, 2012
Please post the portion of the ADA mandates that you would say pertain to Neewollah. And yes I think there are some people that are obese and are truly disabled and then there are those that are disabled by choice just like there some that are truly unemployed and those that are unemployed by choice. The latter of both are those that are constantly the victims of something.
Opinion

Aransas Pass, TX

#38 Sep 17, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
<quoted text>You think obese individuals are all disabled? So called disabled, it is statements like these that have made it necessary for a federal mandate because of those that do not have a clue. People in Independence always seem to go down this path, not using the good gift that God gave them in the form of a brain to figure that chances are, if someone is disabled and cannot walk much or exercise like a well individual, then they might just gain some weight along the way. And yes, vendors must comply. The Bandstand also as it is a public event.
I get furious when I go to Wal-Mart and see 300+ pound "disabled" people using the battery-operated carts while older, frailer shoppers have to walk around that big store trying to buy their groceries. Maybe if they got off their lazy rears and exercised, they could lose weight, their disability would improve, and older people could have use of those carts at Wal-Mart. Quite frankly, these people aren't disabled, they're LAZY.

Since: Oct 10

Independence, Kansas

#39 Sep 17, 2012
With Indy Truth so in the know about the ins and outs of ADA, I would like to see him (or her) use those energies to HELP businesses write grants so that they could become ADA compliant. I imagine it could even earn some money for time spent if successful.

The attitude seems to be that if you as a business person don't comply that we are going to stick it to you and dance on your businesses grave. I don't see how that attitude helps anyone. Most businesses operate in ignorance of laws like ADA because they are just trying to make through another month without any major problems.

Try to help each other and both the businesses AND the disabled will end up winning.

Just a thought.
Bottom Line

Aransas Pass, TX

#40 Sep 17, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
<quoted text>Cost prohibitive you say? Instead of picking and choosing which laws you will or will not abide, why not sell your business, or sell your residence if you can't pay your expenses? Why not refuse to pay sales taxes for a year or so, it worked for the small grocery on east Main didn't it? Oh wait, poor example. This has nothing to do with victims, or bitching, it has everything to do with if you own a business, you must make it accessible, remove the barriers, it's as simple as that.
Let me get this straight: Although a businessman is paying his bills, he is barely staying afloat. However, in your opinion, since he can't make ADA improvements, he should close his doors which costs his employees their jobs, costs the community a local business, and costs taxpayers another contributor to the tax base. Everyone loses, but that's ok with you because at least he isn't preventing people with disabilities from entering his store. I already said you're a trouble maker, but I think you're also a self-centered idiot, like so many of the questionable "disabled" people in Independence. I've known many people who are TRULY DISABLED and have NEVER heard them complain about any of the things you're griping about. Personally, I think you need to change your name because you're not looking for the TRUTH, you're looking only to make trouble for everyone in Independence. By the way, are you going to do some fundraisers to help business men make ADA improvements as I have suggested before?

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