Fight over Mt Joy parkland heats up

Fight over Mt Joy parkland heats up

There are 37 comments on the Evening Sun story from Oct 30, 2009, titled Fight over Mt Joy parkland heats up. In it, Evening Sun reports that:

Mount Joy Township officials on Friday issued a written response to a group of residents who, they say, have mischaracterized the township's proposed comprehensive park program, and, in the midst of a race for two open township supervisor seats, have unfairly politicized the issue.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Evening Sun.

First Prev
of 2
Next Last
Sleepless in Mt Joy

Carlisle, PA

#23 Nov 1, 2009
The letter in response to the petition signers is threatening. They cant even face concerns without pulling in the SS Nazi stormtroopers. This is socialism. Covert newletter announces meeting dates and voting AFTER they have happened, secret locked door meetings and private supervisor meetings after resident meetings.
Mark this down folks, something big is on the verge of discovery and will go down as Mt Joy Watergate. Have you ever seen so much fuss over a job that pays $1800? Stamping personal property as they please for other usage without a word. Wait and see. There has been blackmail,breakage of state law, destruction of personal property namely trees cut down on the scale of 33 trees many over 6'' which is against code and NEVER told the owner or left the wood.
Why have so many employees left? Hmm, and why after certain events? Folks are putting grandpa on the porch to guard the doors. Watch out folks, you may be next.
what in the world

Dallas, PA

#24 Nov 1, 2009
What in the world are you talking about? There have been no employees quit the township in almost 3 years. There are no locked door meetings, and if you are too stupid to pick up the news paper and read the leagal notices then maybe you shouldn't be at the meetings. I would venture to say that there is no intelligence behind the comments you made. Not one thing you state as a concern makes any sense. Although that is how the wonderful watchdog group and their "nazi" followers throw things. I hope for all of the residents of Mount Joy Township that Updyke and Gormont are not jointly elected. Otherwise the Township will have so many legal issue that a whole team of attorneys won't be able to fix their stupidity or ignorance for the laws. GOD HELP US ALL.
Sleepless in Mt Joy wrote:
The letter in response to the petition signers is threatening. They cant even face concerns without pulling in the SS Nazi stormtroopers. This is socialism. Covert newletter announces meeting dates and voting AFTER they have happened, secret locked door meetings and private supervisor meetings after resident meetings.
Mark this down folks, something big is on the verge of discovery and will go down as Mt Joy Watergate. Have you ever seen so much fuss over a job that pays $1800? Stamping personal property as they please for other usage without a word. Wait and see. There has been blackmail,breakage of state law, destruction of personal property namely trees cut down on the scale of 33 trees many over 6'' which is against code and NEVER told the owner or left the wood.
Why have so many employees left? Hmm, and why after certain events? Folks are putting grandpa on the porch to guard the doors. Watch out folks, you may be next.
what in the world

Dallas, PA

#25 Nov 1, 2009
You left out that Rhodes should resign. He did sign the letter also. Or do you need your watchdog buddy to stay in office so you can tell him what to do. I would think that after a petition was filed in the Township office that any or all of the supervisors with half a brain would have got a response together whil probably working with the study group and/or YSM. I think what bother all of you the most is that you don't understand what you are reading, and that a response that had fact in was able to get out to all of us so quickly. Maybe you should have given us signors the facts when asking us to sign your falsly stated petition.
petition signer wrote:
How can Dr. Dayholf say the board hasn't looked at the map since it was published in June 2009.and they responded to the partitioners on October 29, 2009 with a two page letter about they issues they they have never seen.You can not pull the wool over my eyes with such falsehoods.
Mr. Waybright,Mr. Chantelau and Mr. Dayhoff you are not to be trusted and you should RESIGN from office. Our township does not need two face, power hungry people like you who does not give damn about the residence in office
Sleepless in Mt Joy

Carlisle, PA

#26 Nov 1, 2009
what in the world wrote:
You left out that Rhodes should resign. He did sign the letter also. Or do you need your watchdog buddy to stay in office so you can tell him what to do. I would think that after a petition was filed in the Township office that any or all of the supervisors with half a brain would have got a response together whil probably working with the study group and/or YSM. I think what bother all of you the most is that you don't understand what you are reading, and that a response that had fact in was able to get out to all of us so quickly. Maybe you should have given us signors the facts when asking us to sign your falsly stated petition.
<quoted text>
Or maybe landowners should have been notified FIRST. We would not be having this discussion sir. How about this. Do this for the sake of the township. Research how long ago this may have happened; did the township accept funds to secure greenways or easements? Date it for the readers. POINT Did it occur to you that things mentioned did not happen yesterday? Some of these issues go back 5 years. Employees have certainly left. POINT watchdog? Where did that name come from anyway? Is that what they called those who signed the Declaration of Indepenance? POINT did not ask anyone to resign.
Sleepless in Mt Joy

Carlisle, PA

#27 Nov 1, 2009
what in the world wrote:
What in the world are you talking about? There have been no employees quit the township in almost 3 years. There are no locked door meetings, and if you are too stupid to pick up the news paper and read the leagal notices then maybe you shouldn't be at the meetings. I would venture to say that there is no intelligence behind the comments you made. Not one thing you state as a concern makes any sense. Although that is how the wonderful watchdog group and their "nazi" followers throw things. I hope for all of the residents of Mount Joy Township that Updyke and Gormont are not jointly elected. Otherwise the Township will have so many legal issue that a whole team of attorneys won't be able to fix their stupidity or ignorance for the laws. GOD HELP US ALL.
<quoted text>
POINT residents have tried to enter the office when a locked door meeting was taking place. They can attest to that. An unannounced meeting. POINT newsletter regulary announces meeting dates and resident input date after they have already taken place and even the website has had bad dates. Links residents, a few did not know there was a newsletter. Does that seem covert to you? POINT are meetings on rec, conservation, trans, budget, etc announced in legal adds? Your kidding right? That looks wrong also. What do you expect folks to think sir?
Sleepless in Mt Joy

Carlisle, PA

#28 Nov 1, 2009
what in the world wrote:
What in the world are you talking about? There have been no employees quit the township in almost 3 years. There are no locked door meetings, and if you are too stupid to pick up the news paper and read the leagal notices then maybe you shouldn't be at the meetings. I would venture to say that there is no intelligence behind the comments you made. Not one thing you state as a concern makes any sense. Although that is how the wonderful watchdog group and their "nazi" followers throw things. I hope for all of the residents of Mount Joy Township that Updyke and Gormont are not jointly elected. Otherwise the Township will have so many legal issue that a whole team of attorneys won't be able to fix their stupidity or ignorance for the laws. GOD HELP US ALL.
<quoted text>
POINT I agree folks do not have knowledge of law in all areas. Common sense. Why dont supers explain guidelines on each issue at the meetings? So easy. I can run rings around you on law in several areas. And you can probably do the same. Hey, I help manage a group of 3200 people within a group of 33000. How much nonsense could be avoided that way by communicating instead of the current technique? Looks bad. POINT Do not fear groups of citizens, even if they exist. If the truth is maintained its so easy. To hide guilt is nothing but trouble. There have been several legal issues raised by residents. Does that tell you something is wrong? It was not like that 12 years ago. Even the Amish have all moved out of the township. POINT I will not tell you who to vote for but invite you do do so. I have seen tied and votes won and lost by a single voter. I have not met you but have seen you several times. You speak well in public but are way out of character here. Hope to see you Tuesday.
what in the world

Gettysburg, PA

#29 Nov 2, 2009
You may try to make sense and throw all these points trying to make it seem as though your thoughts make sense, but I WAS ONE OF THE SIGNORS OF THE PETITION. Since then, after receiving the Townships letter, I read the plan on the website. IN FULL. And managing a group of 3200 people, is somewhat different than running a local government and following the laws. It would be idiotic to explain every detail in the supervisors meetings. Many of those meetings last too long now, to explain everything in laymans terms would double the meeting. If you don't understand why something was done, don't right away go against it, try to ask or look into why it happened. But you are too quick to jump to the conclusion that something is happening behind your back. Worry about what is happening in front of your face that you do not understand first.
Sleepless in Mt Joy wrote:
<quoted text>POINT I agree folks do not have knowledge of law in all areas. Common sense. Why dont supers explain guidelines on each issue at the meetings? So easy. I can run rings around you on law in several areas. And you can probably do the same. Hey, I help manage a group of 3200 people within a group of 33000. How much nonsense could be avoided that way by communicating instead of the current technique? Looks bad. POINT Do not fear groups of citizens, even if they exist. If the truth is maintained its so easy. To hide guilt is nothing but trouble. There have been several legal issues raised by residents. Does that tell you something is wrong? It was not like that 12 years ago. Even the Amish have all moved out of the township. POINT I will not tell you who to vote for but invite you do do so. I have seen tied and votes won and lost by a single voter. I have not met you but have seen you several times. You speak well in public but are way out of character here. Hope to see you Tuesday.
Sleepless in Mt Joy

Carlisle, PA

#30 Nov 2, 2009
what in the world wrote:
You may try to make sense and throw all these points trying to make it seem as though your thoughts make sense, but I WAS ONE OF THE SIGNORS OF THE PETITION. Since then, after receiving the Townships letter, I read the plan on the website. IN FULL. And managing a group of 3200 people, is somewhat different than running a local government and following the laws. It would be idiotic to explain every detail in the supervisors meetings. Many of those meetings last too long now, to explain everything in laymans terms would double the meeting. If you don't understand why something was done, don't right away go against it, try to ask or look into why it happened. But you are too quick to jump to the conclusion that something is happening behind your back. Worry about what is happening in front of your face that you do not understand first.
<quoted text>
WOW, I am impressed, honestly. Have enjoyed chatting with you. Great to hear your perspective. You are correct that differances exist managing large groups of people but they do have the same large quantities of rules verses laws. They still need interpritation, enforcement,and adustment with the kind of communication that lifts people and is very clear. I feel that exists here in very short supply so when questioned they turn like an angry crocidile and start snapping. The only way to be heard then is by petition. I still think its worthy to brief residents on guidelines about issues. We all comment about seeing more people involved and asking questions. When I heard about the new septic servicing issues I looked into it and found its an issue first with DEP and not the township so I gatherd info and passed it along to the township in our defense to prepare for our plan. I also approuched DEP about the flawed policy. Maybe they had bad info. I know better. I have done work for EPA with hazmat and ordinance disposal. Tough and hardheaded groups. I found meetings that I attended short but certainly there are exceptions. So a singuler meeting issue seperate from the regular one would be great. We can do this. Only a couple times a year and some years none at all. This is where Rhodes comes in well. A super and prominate citizens have told me they like his involvment. He askes questions, listens,has a genuine concern for his home and community.He will admit a mistake if he makes one I assure you. Nothing to hide. Thanks for your opinion. Think about running for super next year. Perhaps I'll join you. Good evening.
petition signer

Carlisle, PA

#31 Nov 2, 2009
what in the world wrote:
You left out that Rhodes should resign. He did sign the letter also. Or do you need your watchdog buddy to stay in office so you can tell him what to do. I would think that after a petition was filed in the Township office that any or all of the supervisors with half a brain would have got a response together whil probably working with the study group and/or YSM. I think what bother all of you the most is that you don't understand what you are reading, and that a response that had fact in was able to get out to all of us so quickly. Maybe you should have given us signors the facts when asking us to sign your falsly stated petition.
<quoted text>
I have lived in this township for forty years and and Scott,Chantelau, Waybright, and Dayhoff are the worst supervisors for pasing laws behind the taxpayers backs.I understand what is going on. I do not want to pay higher taxes because of this secret agenda.Rhodes has shown common scense that the other four have not.Lets vote a complete new board in the next two elections, we can not do worst than what is on the current board.
Sleepless in Mt Joy

Carlisle, PA

#32 Nov 3, 2009
tired of the stupidity wrote:
Reading many of these comments goes to prove just how clueless and ignorant the Updyke and Gormont supporters are. I have been at the meetings also. There has NEVER been an intent to buy 4 parcels of land, the Supervisors have a copy of the Rec Plan, but have not had an opportunity to take official action on it because it has not been presented to them in a public meeting, making a passive greenway does not restrict what the property owner can do on their property, and in fact helps to protect their property from walking trails. Everyone is so concerned over what "lies" the current supervisors are talking about that you Updyke supporters are accomplises to him running for an office in a township that he DOES NOT RESIDE in. Happily married for how long????his wife and children live in Germany township. Maybe that is why he can claim he is happily married, he supposedly resides with his mother which is another crock of s**t. And as far as Tim Stonesifers articles...Learn to report Tim, you have all of the facts in front of you but still want to be nice to Hottenstein and everyone else who are too stupid to see the truth. Yes lets vote for the candidate who opposes land preservation...even though he is on the board, lets vote for someone who does not live in the township they are running in, and lets vote for the candidates who are proposing things that are illegal because they clearly do not understand or know about the 2nd class code for townships. Lets see how much leagal fees go up in the township with people who do not follow the law...oh but wait maybe leagal fees will balance a little since I am assuming Updyke will have no more issues to falsly sue the township over if he is in office.
VOTE FOR JAMES WAYBRIGHT and nobody else...it really is the only thing that makes sense for the Township
Oh I was told greenways forbid you to allow your horses and cows to drink and you can't cut down dead trees and more. Sounds restrictive to me and a foot in the door type of thing. I have known Dave for several years. He never gets angry, very mellow, he NEVER sued the township it was an appeal so thats a lie, do your homework like you are harping about. I have had the same phone number for Dave and its always at the farm as when I saw or met him for agriculture business again at the farm. Listen up.Close your mouth about peoples personal lives and marriages. You went way over the line here and cost Jim votes. Jim had a learning curve as all new people. How about you? Just get out the books. Lots of people to help. You want change, you run for super next year. People defending their homes is a pure incentive to run. You want to talk personal? Then look into the rumor Jim sold water rights on his land to the Links. I find that difficult to believe. Expect to see your name on the next ballot for super. Maybe someone can talk about your spouse.
SOS

Newville, PA

#33 Nov 10, 2009
Quote Sleepless Does that tell you something is wrong? It was not like that 12 years ago. Even the Amish have all moved out of the township.

Nothing is "like what it was 12 years ago. And the Amish moved out because too many cars kept hitting their horse and buggies.
"Sleepless", please take a nap. The world is now safe and secure from the "Greenway Goblins" in Mt.Joy since you and yours are now in charge!
SOS

Newville, PA

#34 Nov 10, 2009
Oh I was told greenways forbid you to allow your horses and cows to drink and you can't cut down dead trees and more. Another "Sleepless" quote

Guess you have never heard about Conservation, run-off and the Chesapeake Bay, fish, crabs,etc. let alone the DEP and the EPA. Keep you ears open and you might learn something. Like to hear the owls at night, like to see interesting birds and wildlife in your woods. Then learn to like dead trees. This has nothing to do with greenways, which I personally do not want, but everything to do with the quality of life in our neighborhood. Please after you "rest up" and take a nap, check out a few bird and wildlife books from the library. Happy dreams--
More responsibility

Carlisle, PA

#35 Nov 15, 2009
Hello Mount Joy township. Please fellow citizens and residents get out to the Mt Joy meetings this week. Why is there a change to the Rec Board meeting in time and date from Dec.1st to this Tuesday, Nov. 17th at 6PM? What is the agenda? Letís rethink all these greenway plans and ideas which are not well thought out nor desired by many. What happened to the revisions promised and citizensí inputs asking for specific changes? Did you all see the Adams County plans for your \neighborhoods and streams? NOW is the TIME to be HEARD in PERSON. How much more for Mud College with borrowed money? Let's take care of it ourselves now that we bought it. No MORE DEBT. ALSO, we all need to get to the Supervisor meeting on Thursday Nov. 19th at 7:30pm. Why not slow down and seek fiscal responsibility and common sense with the budget for 2010? Why borrow $500K or $2M more for now or in this economy? This will put us in more debt and longer - raise taxes in the long run. At the last monthís meeting, one supervisor said we will always be in debt as a township. WHAT no one caught that? Well, the 2010 budget will ensure such nonsense. Stop this train wreck now! Attend the meetings this week and in December. Why donít WE pay off the principal of the debt loans - they have already? Why mortgage our neighborsí and childrenís futures, just because we can? What? With TWO land preservation programs in the Adams County area already, this THIRD program is unnecessary and seems unwise in the current economy. This ainít - 2005 nor 2008! Balance the budget now and spend only funds received and then with wise stewardship. Really, Enough already.
When Wool is pulled

Shippensburg, PA

#36 Nov 16, 2009
What citizens of Mount Joy township don't know? Please fellow citizens and residents get out to the Mt Joy meetings this week. Why is there a change to the Rec Board meeting in time and date from Dec.1st to this Tuesday, Nov. 17th at 6PM? What is the agenda? Letís rethink all these greenway plans and ideas which are not well thought out nor desired by many. What happened to the revisions promised and citizensí inputs asking for specific changes? Seems that the Township has already reviewed and sent the flawed plan to DCNR for blessing even prior to the public meeting in October! What deceits - now we are finding out about un-public deals and activities! CITIZENS and RESIDENTS: We need to get to the Supervisor meeting on Thursday Nov. 19th at 7:30pm. Why not slow down and seek fiscal responsibility and common sense with the budget for 2010? Why borrow $500K or $2M more for now or in this economy? This will put us in more debt and longer - raise taxes in the long run. At the last monthís meeting, one supervisors said we will always be in debt as a township. WHAT no one caught that? Well, the 2010 budget will ensure such nonsense. Stop this spin out now! Attend the meetings this week and in December. Why donít WE pay off the principal of the debt loans - they have already? Why mortgage our neighborsí and childrenís futures, just because we can? What with seniors and neighbors affected by the tax increases - it is unfair to continue this on them? With TWO land preservation programs in the Adams County area already, this THIRD program is unnecessary and seems unwise in the current economy. This ainít - 2005 nor 2008! Balance the budget now and spend only funds received and then with wise stewardship. Let's restart and be wiser.
democracy

Chambersburg, PA

#37 Jan 25, 2010
SOS wrote:
Quote Sleepless Does that tell you something is wrong? It was not like that 12 years ago. Even the Amish have all moved out of the township.
Nothing is "like what it was 12 years ago. And the Amish moved out because too many cars kept hitting their horse and buggies.
"Sleepless", please take a nap. The world is now safe and secure from the "Greenway Goblins" in Mt.Joy since you and yours are now in charge!
So how many buggies were hit in this area? Can't find it in the records.
democracy

Chambersburg, PA

#38 Jan 25, 2010
SOS wrote:
Oh I was told greenways forbid you to allow your horses and cows to drink and you can't cut down dead trees and more. Another "Sleepless" quote
Guess you have never heard about Conservation, run-off and the Chesapeake Bay, fish, crabs,etc. let alone the DEP and the EPA. Keep you ears open and you might learn something. Like to hear the owls at night, like to see interesting birds and wildlife in your woods. Then learn to like dead trees. This has nothing to do with greenways, which I personally do not want, but everything to do with the quality of life in our neighborhood. Please after you "rest up" and take a nap, check out a few bird and wildlife books from the library. Happy dreams--
Wow, your telling this person and others what you want to happen with THEIR property? Really? I suspect they care for it just fine. Maybe thats why they live there. To enjoy and care for it. I know you would do the same. You want someone to tell you what to do with your property? This is socialism. Easier to practice in China. Tickets are cheap these days.
Okay

Chambersburg, PA

#39 Jan 26, 2010
democracy wrote:
<quoted text>
Wow, your telling this person and others what you want to happen with THEIR property? Really? I suspect they care for it just fine. Maybe thats why they live there. To enjoy and care for it. I know you would do the same. You want someone to tell you what to do with your property? This is socialism. Easier to practice in China. Tickets are cheap these days.
Please go back and READ what I said. I said nothing about telling anybody what to do. Nobody is taking away any of your rights. Just making sure that you know that you can NOT affect the stream in a way that would affect somebody else's rights down stream. And that is NOT Socialism.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker
First Prev
of 2
Next Last

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Mount Joy Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
News Woman hit by train (Jun '08) May 18 Amused 52
News Comedian Michelle Wolf ran track in Hershey bef... Apr 30 GEORGE 1
A vistior at Hershey Park, Pa 11-28-09 (Jan '16) Apr '18 choco latte 2
News Couple Charged with Child Abuse (Jul '06) Apr '18 mexicanfannybandit 12
York peppermint pattie (Sep '16) Apr '18 yorkpattiesRyummy 3
Non Compliant Offender Lisa Anna Plusch Dec '17 Mimallah 1
News Man has been charged with environmental violati... (May '09) Sep '17 aol 174

Mount Joy Jobs

Personal Finance

Mount Joy Mortgages