The Man

Merchantville, NJ

#21 Jun 26, 2013
The problem in a nutshell is the country is broke! Yet many want to raise taxes and keep the entitlement crowd happy. We just don't have the money to give to people who decide to slide through life any more let alone pay our obligations to those who paid into the system and are expecting a decent retirement.
Mongoose

Riverside, NJ

#22 Jun 27, 2013
enemy combatant wrote:
<quoted text>
I was using 90% as an extreme example. I believe that's what bohner got in he first debt ceiling negotiations. He got 90% and his face looked like he ate something sour. He treats your opinion of basically centrist as extreme left. That's the new right, it's so far right the center looks communist. The arguement starts from such far places common ground is but a dream.
I'm inclined to agree with you. Middle ground is really hard to find. You can take one side and make some people happy, or take the other side and make others happy, or you can compromise so no one is happy.
Mongoose

Riverside, NJ

#23 Jun 27, 2013
Haruko57 wrote:
<quoted text>
Really.... that's all you get from what I said?...No acknowledgement of how I said, Martin's actions were wrong... all you care about is the fact that I believe Zimmerman was wrong too... they can't both be wrong? Looking at the context surrounding the incident... I believe they were both wrong... and that there are a few lessons to be drawn from this ordeal. Also... if what happened before the fight had nothing to do with the fight... then what reason was there for the fight? Why do you hate context so much? If you're trying to understand an event, doesn't it make sense to consider everything surrounding it? I really do find your logic to be quite disconnected... and strange... please explain.
Perhaps he's trying to say that what happened before the fight would have made no difference to certain aspects of it. No matter what the reason, those two were fighting, and during that fight Zimmerman felt the need to shoot. Although, at point blank range you'd think that he'd aim for a nonlethal area, like the leg, or shoulder. Don't they require at least minimal training for civilians to get firearms in Florida? He should know how to shoot without killing.

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#24 Jun 28, 2013
Mongoose wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps he's trying to say that what happened before the fight would have made no difference to certain aspects of it. No matter what the reason, those two were fighting, and during that fight Zimmerman felt the need to shoot. Although, at point blank range you'd think that he'd aim for a nonlethal area, like the leg, or shoulder. Don't they require at least minimal training for civilians to get firearms in Florida? He should know how to shoot without killing.
Makes sense... though I'd like to hear such a succinct explanation from Bill, for once.
Jerseyboy For Life

Elkhart, IN

#25 Jun 28, 2013
Get real,what on earth would that prove?,a voice expert!,so what!.In the heat of a life incountering struggle,I'm not surprised both men were not screaming for help at the sametime.Maybe its just the clash of two like minded "racist"clashing in a life struggle ,and Zimmerman "WON"....Thats how I see it.Good job Zimmerman,hopefully more will head to your example,and a stern warning to all thugs,you live by violence,you will most likely get hurt, or killed by it!....Enough is enough...I think, we have turned our cheeks too many times,our cities and towns are being terrorized by blacks,who have too much time on their hands,and like to cause fear in neighborhoods.And those neighborhoods need to be protected,with whatever means it takes!.I heard it said ,that the criminals were long gone in Zimmerman's neighborhood,after someone was a victim of a crime,and he was tired of it.In a neighborhood, I understand that was being targeted by thugs,everyone becomes a suspect.The Law of the jungle...
Jerseyboy For Life

Elkhart, IN

#26 Jun 28, 2013
opps heed!

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#27 Jun 28, 2013
Jerseyboy For Life wrote:
Get real,what on earth would that prove?,a voice expert!,so what!.In the heat of a life incountering struggle,I'm not surprised both men were not screaming for help at the sametime.Maybe its just the clash of two like minded "racist"clashing in a life struggle ,and Zimmerman "WON"....Thats how I see it.Good job Zimmerman,hopefully more will head to your example,and a stern warning to all thugs,you live by violence,you will most likely get hurt, or killed by it!....Enough is enough...I think, we have turned our cheeks too many times,our cities and towns are being terrorized by blacks,who have too much time on their hands,and like to cause fear in neighborhoods.And those neighborhoods need to be protected,with whatever means it takes!.I heard it said ,that the criminals were long gone in Zimmerman's neighborhood,after someone was a victim of a crime,and he was tired of it.In a neighborhood, I understand that was being targeted by thugs,everyone becomes a suspect.The Law of the jungle...
You're scenario is certainly possible... but I wouldn't go praising Zimmerman's behavior... Both Zimmerman and Martin should have handled themselves better in this incident... and Martin was hardly "terrorizing" anyone in that neighborhood... unless being out late eating candy is terrorizing. And the whole, "whatever means necessary" ideology is part of what's caused the problems you're complaining about in the first place. Have SOME standards of human decency, please.
Mongoose

Riverside, NJ

#28 Jun 29, 2013
Haruko57 wrote:
<quoted text>
Makes sense... though I'd like to hear such a succinct explanation from Bill, for once.
So he never explains himself if someone asks him to? Does he at least provide some manner of context or source material once in a while?

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#29 Jun 29, 2013
Mongoose wrote:
<quoted text>
So he never explains himself if someone asks him to? Does he at least provide some manner of context or source material once in a while?
Occasionally a poor, vague amount of context is included, as long as it can be framed to fit his view... but there'd still be context missing, which would undermine his view... so he excludes it. He focuses in on one portion of information and disregards the rest of it.

Since: Jan 08

Willingboro, NJ

#30 Jul 2, 2013
Medical examiner blows Zimmerman "beating" out of the water.

2 superficial cuts to the back of the head turns out not to be life threatening
The Man

Merchantville, NJ

#31 Jul 2, 2013
I guess Zimmerman should have let Trayvon split his head open.
What if someone is shooting at you and keeps missing? Using your logic you can't shoot back!
The Man

Merchantville, NJ

#32 Jul 2, 2013
If you have been following this trial at all, you know the defenses best case has been built from the prosecutions own witnesses! Weak case, never should have gone to trial. especially as 2nd degree murder.

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#33 Jul 3, 2013
The Man wrote:
I guess Zimmerman should have let Trayvon split his head open.
What if someone is shooting at you and keeps missing? Using your logic you can't shoot back!
Oversimplification...:) Different context calls for adjustments in rules. Struggling against a teen in hand-to-hand combat and a shoot out with said teen are very different situations... If the kid had pulled a gun... or even threatened to pull a gun, shooting would have been perfectly justified... Even in this situation, shooting would have been more justifiable if he had aimed for a nonlethal area. I believe that Zimmerman likely thought he was in more danger than he actually was... After all, slight concussions have occurred from far less than having your head hit concrete a couple of times. I feel he overreacted in fear... and I feel he was wrong in how he handled the situation in the first place. If he had followed directions he probably wouldn't have riled up the kid and gotten into that fight.

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#34 Jul 3, 2013
The Man wrote:
If you have been following this trial at all, you know the defenses best case has been built from the prosecutions own witnesses! Weak case, never should have gone to trial. especially as 2nd degree murder.
I agree that a 2nd degree charge is very unlikely to stick. However you already know how I feel about this situation, and what I was after... at least I hope you do... I've said it so many times. I just hope the dude goes to therapy after this trial is over.
bill

Riverton, NJ

#35 Jul 3, 2013
Haruko57 wrote:
<quoted text>
Oversimplification...:) Different context calls for adjustments in rules. Struggling against a teen in hand-to-hand combat and a shoot out with said teen are very different situations... If the kid had pulled a gun... or even threatened to pull a gun, shooting would have been perfectly justified... Even in this situation, shooting would have been more justifiable if he had aimed for a nonlethal area. I believe that Zimmerman likely thought he was in more danger than he actually was... After all, slight concussions have occurred from far less than having your head hit concrete a couple of times. I feel he overreacted in fear... and I feel he was wrong in how he handled the situation in the first place. If he had follo?wed directions he probably wouldn't have riled up the kid and gotten into that fight.

Zimmerman has already stated that Trayvon was going for Zimmerman's gun. And said,"you gonna die tonight." So using your point Zimmerman was legal shooting Trayvon.
bill

Riverton, NJ

#36 Jul 3, 2013
Haruko57 wrote:
<quoted text>
Occasionally a poor, vague amount of context is included, as long as it can be framed to fit his view... but there'd still be context missing, which would undermine his view... so he excludes it. He focuses in on one portion of information and disregards the rest of it.
Show me.
bill

Sewell, NJ

#37 Jul 3, 2013
Haruko57 wrote:
<quoted text>
Oversimplification...:) Different context calls for adjustments in rules. Struggling against a teen in hand-to-hand combat and a shoot out with said teen are very different situations... If the kid had pulled a gun... or even threatened to pull a gun, shooting would have been perfectly justified... Even in this situation, shooting would have been more justifiable if he had aimed for a nonlethal area. I believe that Zimmerman likely thought he was in more danger than he actually was... After all, slight concussions have occurred from far less than having your head hit concrete a couple of times. I feel he overreacted in fear... and I feel he was wrong in how he handled the situation in the first place. If he had followed directions he probably wouldn't have riled up the kid and gotten into that fight.
Trayvon was walking between houses looking in windows.He was casing places for future crimes. You forget he was caught with a large screwdriver "burglary tool" and woman's jewelry while in school.
Broken nose head smashed against concrete. Trayvon could have easily out run Zimmerman. Instead he ambushed him,busting his nose and straddling him on the ground.Reaching for Zimmerman's gun telling him he was going to die tonight. Zimmerman protected himself from this wild animal. He didn't have any choice but to shoot the gang banger wannabe.

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#38 Jul 3, 2013
bill wrote:
<quoted text>
Zimmerman has already stated that Trayvon was going for Zimmerman's gun. And said,"you gonna die tonight." So using your point Zimmerman was legal shooting Trayvon.
Once again... You ignore the part where I give slight justification of his actions because I still think he was wrong... I will say this as directly as possible... He was afraid, which makes his actions understandable, but that does not make him any less wrong, in my opinion, for not following directions, and for not having the self control to make a non lethal shot. And I feel that legal or not killing a person should have consequences... And required therapy or a psych evaluation.

Since: Apr 12

Riverside, NJ

#39 Jul 3, 2013
bill wrote:
<quoted text>
Show me.
For example this conversation... Around may 30.
http://m.topix.com/forum/city/willingboro-nj/...

Since: Jan 08

Oceanside, CA

#40 Jul 4, 2013
bill wrote:
<quoted text>
Trayvon was walking between houses looking in windows.He was casing places for future crimes. You forget he was caught with a large screwdriver "burglary tool" and woman's jewelry while in school.
Broken nose head smashed against concrete. Trayvon could have easily out run Zimmerman. Instead he ambushed him,busting his nose and straddling him on the ground.Reaching for Zimmerman's gun telling him he was going to die tonight. Zimmerman protected himself from this wild animal. He didn't have any choice but to shoot the gang banger wannabe.
Medical examiner totally refutes the beating which is his whole self defense case. It could have been only one punch that did all the damage. Anyone ever cut their head? A small cut bleeds a lot and that's all he had was 2 small cuts. His head wasn't being slammed to the ground. Martins DNA Isnt on the gun. Simple fact is zimm followed a kid started a fight with him because "these punks always get away with it" then since he was losing the fight decided to shoot.
He didnt double back on zimm "he thought he got away from him".
Wild animal with only skittles and a soda on him

Gang banger? Where's the proof of that or is that code for any young black person?

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