Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

[01Justsayin]

MUQ wrote:

<quoted text>How come the God changed the whole process?

Before jesus the salvation was obtained by following the teachings of prophets.

How come the whole process changed when jesus appeared?

There is something "fishy" in this logic and that is the catch.

The 'Idea" that salvation comes thru the blood of Jesus in not what Jesus taught himself.

It was what St. Paul taught "claiming to be the Spokesperson for jesus"

And everyone knows that this St. Paul never met jesus and not learned anything from him.

So those who believe in the theory that "Salvation comes thru the blood of Jesus" are taking a great risk?

Suppose in the hereafter Jesus asks these fellows "Where Did I say that salvation comes thru my blood?" And you people say "Lord, Lord that what was St. Paul taught us"

And Jesus says "Who is this St. Paul? I never knew anyone by that name while I walked on this earth. Who is this person speaking in my name?

What would be you answer?

"Lord, Lord, forgive us, we were taken for a ride..."

Aren't you people, speaking so brazenly as if Jesus told you this personally!!

Lol I am the last person in the world to believe in paulianity. Or the Romanized version of the teachings of Jesus. I will read up and reexamine what the word says about Jesus's own thoughts on salvation. As far as Jesus telling me this personally, I would love to have been able to sit at his feet when he walked the earth. As he is the ultimate "prophet". With regards to the prophets, we still have their teachings written plain as day in the Old Covenant. And I still read them.

[01Justsayin]

Frijoles wrote:

<quoted text>In all honesty, I do like MUQ - despite his tin ear with regard to any critique of his postings. He has a sense of humor which comes out from time to time. And if you can get him off script he can be interesting.

I like interesting :)

[Bruser]

MUQ wrote:

<quoted text>
How come the God changed the whole process?
Before jesus the salvation was obtained by following the teachings of prophets.
How come the whole process changed when jesus appeared?
There is something "fishy" in this logic and that is the catch.
The 'Idea" that salvation comes thru the blood of Jesus in not what Jesus taught himself.
It was what St. Paul taught "claiming to be the Spokesperson for jesus"
And everyone knows that this St. Paul never met jesus and not learned anything from him.
So those who believe in the theory that "Salvation comes thru the blood of Jesus" are taking a great risk?
Suppose in the hereafter Jesus asks these fellows "Where Did I say that salvation comes thru my blood?" And you people say "Lord, Lord that what was St. Paul taught us"
And Jesus says "Who is this St. Paul? I never knew anyone by that name while I walked on this earth. Who is this person speaking in my name?
What would be you answer?
"Lord, Lord, forgive us, we were taken for a ride..."
Aren't you people, speaking so brazenly as if Jesus told you this personally!!

You are a fool, speaking as if you understand the Christian faith.
You have no idea that the prophecy of the old testament had shown that a NEW COVENANT would be made by the coming of the MESSIAH.
when you say that Paul wasn't alive during Jesus time, you do not know the full story about St Paul, and his interactions with with Apostles, particularly with St Peter.
What about the other Gospels? what about St Johns 6:53?
and Mathew 26:26, Mark 14:22, Luke 22:14. Finally St John (with whom Jesus mother Mary went to live with according to what Jesus had told her and St John to do) Gospel 53:54, "Whosoever eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life....etc"
I don't know what faith you profess to be, but you do not know what you are speaking about. I have read the Full Bible, not just the new testament. You conveniently extract that which you will choose to believe, you have NO FAITH. And through faith you will obtain understanding, and will act accordingly. Your kind of belief has another word, it is called Apostasy, which has wormed it way into the Christian church, and is destroying the church from within, just as a cancer does. You are a blindman trying to lead others into following you, while you yourself do not know the road to salvation. "Better to appear foolish, than to open you mouth and remove all doubt of your foolishness."
Dominus Vobiscum

[Voluntarist]

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[Bruser]

The Second Amendment
Posted on January 29, 2013 by Bulldog1

I received this letter from members of the SOF community on their concerns for America and the Second Amendment. This letter was signed by over 1100 members of the SOF community, of which the names will not be published as this is Active and Retired members.

Whether you agree with it or not, it is well worth the read.

29 Jan 2013

Protecting the Second Amendment – Why all Americans Should Be Concerned

We are current or former Army Reserve, National Guard, and active duty US Army Special Forces soldiers (Green Berets). We have all taken an oath to “…support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same.…” The Constitution of the United States is without a doubt the single greatest document in the history of mankind, codifying the fundamental principle of governmental power and authority being derived from and granted through the consent of the governed. Our Constitution established a system of governance that preserves, protects, and holds sacrosanct the individual rights and primacy of the governed as well as providing for the explicit protection of the governed from governmental tyranny and/or oppression. We have witnessed the insidious and iniquitous effects of tyranny and oppression on people all over the world. We and our forebears have embodied and personified our organizational motto, De Oppresso Liber [To Free the Oppressed], for more than a half century as we have fought, shed blood, and died in the pursuit of freedom for the oppressed

The second part of the current debate is over “high capacity magazines” capable of holding more than 10 rounds in the magazine. As experts in military weapons of all types, it is our considered opinion that reducing magazine capacity from 30 rounds to 10 rounds will only require an additional 6 -8 seconds to change two empty 10 round magazines with full magazines. Would an increase of 6 –8 seconds make any real difference to the outcome in a mass shooting incident? In our opinion it would not. Outlawing such “high capacity magazines” would, however, outlaw a class of firearms that are “in common use”. As such this would be in contravention to the opinion expressed by the U.S. Supreme Court recent decisions.

Moreover, when the Federal Assault Weapons Ban became law in 1994, manufacturers began retooling to produce firearms and magazines that were compliant. One of those ban-compliant firearms was the Hi-Point 995, which was sold with ten-round magazines. In 1999, five years into the Federal Assault Weapons Ban, the Columbine High School massacre occurred. One of the perpetrators, Eric Harris, was armed with a Hi-Point 995. Undeterred by the ten-round capacity of his magazines, Harris simply brought more of them: thirteen magazines would be found in the massacre’s aftermath. Harris fired 96 rounds before killing himself.

The undersigned Quiet Professionals hereby humbly stand ever present, ever ready, and ever vigilant.

1100 Green Berets Signed this Letter

[Voluntarist]

Bruser wrote:

The Second Amendment
Posted on January 29, 2013 by Bulldog1
I received this letter from members of the SOF community on their concerns for America and the Second Amendment. This letter was signed by over 1100 members of the SOF community, of which the names will not be published as this is Active and Retired members.
Whether you agree with it or not, it is well worth the read.
29 Jan 2013
Protecting the Second Amendment – Why all Americans Should Be Concerned
We are current or former Army Reserve, National Guard, and active duty US Army Special Forces soldiers (Green Berets). We have all taken an oath to “…support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same.…” The Constitution of the United States is without a doubt the single greatest document in the history of mankind, codifying the fundamental principle of governmental power and authority being derived from and granted through the consent of the governed. Our Constitution established a system of governance that preserves, protects, and holds sacrosanct the individual rights and primacy of the governed as well as providing for the explicit protection of the governed from governmental tyranny and/or oppression. We have witnessed the insidious and iniquitous effects of tyranny and oppression on people all over the world. We and our forebears have embodied and personified our organizational motto, De Oppresso Liber [To Free the Oppressed], for more than a half century as we have fought, shed blood, and died in the pursuit of freedom for the oppressed
The second part of the current debate is over “high capacity magazines” capable of holding more than 10 rounds in the magazine. As experts in military weapons of all types, it is our considered opinion that reducing magazine capacity from 30 rounds to 10 rounds will only require an additional 6 -8 seconds to change two empty 10 round magazines with full magazines. Would an increase of 6 –8 seconds make any real difference to the outcome in a mass shooting incident? In our opinion it would not. Outlawing such “high capacity magazines” would, however, outlaw a class of firearms that are “in common use”. As such this would be in contravention to the opinion expressed by the U.S. Supreme Court recent decisions.
Moreover, when the Federal Assault Weapons Ban became law in 1994, manufacturers began retooling to produce firearms and magazines that were compliant. One of those ban-compliant firearms was the Hi-Point 995, which was sold with ten-round magazines. In 1999, five years into the Federal Assault Weapons Ban, the Columbine High School massacre occurred. One of the perpetrators, Eric Harris, was armed with a Hi-Point 995. Undeterred by the ten-round capacity of his magazines, Harris simply brought more of them: thirteen magazines would be found in the massacre’s aftermath. Harris fired 96 rounds before killing himself.
The undersigned Quiet Professionals hereby humbly stand ever present, ever ready, and ever vigilant.
1100 Green Berets Signed this Letter

They dont matter to the globalist, kissenger calls them dumb stupid animals.

[Frijoles]

Bruser wrote:

1100 Green Berets Signed this Letter

When I think of a group of cool, collected, nonviolent professing individuals, for some inexplicable reason, Green Berets never come to mind.

[Voluntarist]

Frijoles wrote:

<quoted text>
When I think of a group of cool, collected, nonviolent professing individuals, for some inexplicable reason, Green Berets never come to mind.

Liberals that favor abortions are also violent.

[Voluntarist]

The agenda-driven cable media outlets
have stooped to a new low once again in
effort to (openly) support those pushing
a gun control agenda.
MSNBC’s Martin Bashir claimed that
supporters of gun rights attending a
public hearing on Monday interrupted
the testimony of Neil Heslin, the father
of Jesse Lewis, who was murdered at
Sandy Hook Elementary.
A selective edit of the 15 minute
testimony deliberately portrayed the gun
rights advocates as “hecklers,” by
showing some six seconds, including
statements regarding ‘the second
amendment shall not be infringed.’
What MSNBC chose NOT to show its
audience was the fact that Heslin, who
favors a ban on assault weapons and high-
capacity clips, asked the audience during
his testimony,“I ask if there’s anyone in
this room who can give me one reason, or
challenge this question: Why anybody in
this room needs to have an — one of
these assault-style weapons or military
weapons or high capacity clips?”
The response from so-called “hecklers”
came in an orderly fashion only AFTER
Heslin followed up on silence to his own
question, stating,“Not one person can
answer that question.”
The crowd was, in reality, only
responding to the claim that no one could
answer the question.
See the comparison of the actual
testimony with the MSNBC edit below:

http://www.infowars.com/msnbc-edit-portrays-g...

[HughBe]

Frijoles wrote:

<quoted text>
Have you ever actually watched the Simpsons?

Distraction and not relevant. YOU said Simpson was a SOURCE of WISDOM.

To answer the question, I would say that it would have been a long time ago and certainly it was not a staple. In addition I would have done so when I was at your current mental age. That would make it a lifetime ago.

[HughBe]

former res wrote:

<quoted text>
You are being dishonest. This is not at all what Frijoles said.
I know actual facts annoy you (and elude you), but this is what he wrote:
"just because someone says something wise doesnt mean that they were historically real. This is the reason why we have fiction. You have no more proof that Jesus was real than I have that Homer Simpson was real. And that doesnt demean their teaching in any way."
Are you suggesting that the character of Homer never uttered any wisdom?(obviulsy as written by his creators)
Did Jesus ever utter any wisdom?(as recorded by the creators of the bible)

Former--Is Huggy saying there is absolutely nothing to be learned from fiction?

HughBe--- Son son, your man is saying that Simpson is the SOURCE of wisdom. Sit in a corner and THINK, for a change.

Former--You are being dishonest. This is not at all what Frijoles said.

HughBe--- Listen well BOY, don't step beyond your bounds. YOU are LYING, as usual. His actual words follow, DUNCE/LIAR.

Frijoles--"Homer Simpson is also a SOURCE of wisdom"

[HughBe]

former res wrote:

<quoted text>
Do I need to believe in your god in order for you to follow his rules and wishes?
<quoted text>
Do you do not need to believe in my Santa Claus in order for me to believe in him?
You see where I'm going with this.
What do my beliefs in your god have to do with anything?
<quoted text>
JC's teaching are well known and you simply are not living up to them.
You are a failure as a Christian, Jew or whatever you call yourself.
Get a life!

Get a REAL woman i.e. one without that appendage.

[Frijoles]

Voluntarist wrote:

<quoted text>
Liberals that favor abortions are also violent.

Vegetarians are violent

People who mow lawns are violent

so what?

[Frijoles]

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
Former--Is Huggy saying there is absolutely nothing to be learned from fiction?
HughBe--- Son son, your man is saying that Simpson is the SOURCE of wisdom. Sit in a corner and THINK, for a change.
Former--You are being dishonest. This is not at all what Frijoles said.
HughBe--- Listen well BOY, don't step beyond your bounds. YOU are LYING, as usual. His actual words follow, DUNCE/LIAR.
Frijoles--"Homer Simpson is also a SOURCE of wisdom"

I never said that, ding dong

Why do you lie - my post is one page ago

[Frijoles]

Frijoles wrote:

<quoted text>
Homer Simpson is also a source of wisdom. Whats your point?

Ooops I did say that

But later you (mr Hughbe) mis-paraphased it by saying that it was THE source of wisdom

not that it matters - the point is that you dont have to go all ET to find characters that say smart things

[Frijoles]

"son, on your man is saying that Simpson is the SOURCE of wisdom. Sit in a corner and THINK, for a change."

thats not what I said

[HughBe]

01Justsayin wrote:

<quoted text>
Personally I'm a Christian. So I believe deeply that Jesus is the Messiah. Jews don't. Yet we worship the same God. From a Christian (non Romanized) standpoint, I understand it like this. Salvation is offered to us through REbirth (the blood sacrifice of Jesus) in the manner that the Jews have salvation through birth. It's their birthright. He acted as our "skapegoat" if you will. Remember that from the old covenant? Blood had to be shed for our sins so he offered his. Again, that is just my understanding of it. I can completely understand why Jews don't see Messianic Judaism as actual Judaism. Because they don't believe Jesus is the Messiah. They're still waiting on him to come back. And I can respect their decision because I love the same God they do.

Justsay--Because they don't believe Jesus is the Messiah.

HughBe--- Not ALL hold such a view.

Are you saying that BIOLOGICAL Jews who are a part of that movement are not Jews? I ask because they certainly don't share the views of members of Judaism.

Again HISTORICALLY Christianity was regarded as a BRANCH of Judaism and so when you say "I can completely understand why Jews don't see Messianic Judaism as actual Judaism." you need to keep the FACTS of history in mind. Put it this way, Jews regarded it as a part of Judaism. Why? JEWS started Christianity.

3. Again, the rabbis of Judaism have a habit of redefining concepts to fit their agenda.

[HughBe]

Frijoles wrote:

<quoted text>
I never said that, ding dong
Why do you lie - my post is one page ago

Former--Is Huggy saying there is absolutely nothing to be learned from fiction?

HughBe--- Son son, your man is saying that Simpson is the SOURCE of wisdom. Sit in a corner and THINK, for a change.

Former--You are being dishonest. This is not at all what Frijoles said.

HughBe--- Listen well BOY, don't step beyond your bounds. YOU are LYING, as usual. His actual words follow, DUNCE/LIAR.

Frijoles--"Homer Simpson is also a SOURCE of wisdom"

Frijoles---I never said that, ding dong

HughBe--- YOUR post 48110 Page 2160 and your words follow--

"Homer Simpson is also a source of wisdom. Whats your point?"

Frijoles--Why do you lie - my post is one page ago

HughBe--I am NOT your rabbis, BOY. Your religion does not VALUE truth. NOT one of you Judahites are honest. You are also very STUPID and lack basic decency.

[HughBe]

Frijoles wrote:

<quoted text>
because they are against me
yes
yes
though the more accurate term might be proselytizing Christians

HughBe---why are you so anti-Evangelical Christians?
Are they against Jews?
Are they against your religion Judaism?

Frijoles---because they are against me
yes
yes

HughBe--- I believe that your rabbis should publicly declare this view so that the evangelicals can know that they are against you and them.

Read the 3 quotes below they are taken from the Jerusalem Post. Read the entire thing, Judahite.

"Israel’s greatest asset and best friend By EARL COX07/12/2012"

" Evangelicals use their political, financial and spiritual leverage to help Israel withstand whatever attack might come next."

"In recent years, however, a groundswell of support for Israel has arisen, creating a new and powerful friend for Israel in the form of Evangelical Christians. From all over the world these Evangelical Christian believers, including many Americans, are proud to be labeled as “Christian Zionists.”"

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-EdContributor...

[Frijoles]

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
HughBe---why are you so anti-Evangelical Christians?
Are they against Jews?
Are they against your religion Judaism?
Frijoles---because they are against me
yes
yes
HughBe--- I believe that your rabbis should publicly declare this view so that the evangelicals can know that they are against you and them.
Read the 3 quotes below they are taken from the Jerusalem Post. Read the entire thing, Judahite.
"Israel’s greatest asset and best friend By EARL COX07/12/2012"
" Evangelicals use their political, financial and spiritual leverage to help Israel withstand whatever attack might come next."
"In recent years, however, a groundswell of support for Israel has arisen, creating a new and powerful friend for Israel in the form of Evangelical Christians. From all over the world these Evangelical Christian believers, including many Americans, are proud to be labeled as “Christian Zionists.”"
http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-EdContributor...

Yes, and there are many Jews, myself included who are uncomfortable with some of the more right wing elements of the Christian support. Its for the WRONG reasons. Those people are bad news- they are bad news for Israel, and more importantly, bad news for my country (USA).

Shocking isnt it?