Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

[HughBe]

I now see it again.

[Frijoles]

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
Frijoles---DNA tests for relatedness
Frijoles---relatedness, not race
HughBe-- surely DNA tests are done to determine RELIGIOUS relatedness. ONLY a FOOL think that it has anything to do with BIOLOGY/race relatedness.
Frijoles---Jewish race? Sounds Hitlerian to me
HughBe--- List the elements of ethnicity. Does it include RACE? Your comment sounds very rabbinic to me i.e. it is STIPID and FALSE.

I just posted a bunch of links that said that race was a sucky concept. What you are getting it is really a degree of ethnicity.

I have to admit rarely do I encounter someone so dense.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_group
An ethnic group is a group of people whose members are identified through a common trait. This can, but does not have to, include an idea of common heritage, a common culture, a shared language or dialect.[1] The group's ethos or ideology may also stress common ancestry and religion, as opposed to an ethnic minority group which refers to race.[2][3][4][5] The process that results in the emergence of an ethnicity is called ethnogenesis. Some ethnic groups are marked by little more than a common name.

Jews are am ETHNO-RELIGIOUS group - see above

[Frijoles]

An ethnoreligious group (or ethno-religious group) is an ethnic group of people whose members are also unified by a common religious background.

Ethnoreligious communities define their ethnic identity neither exclusively by ancestral heritage nor simply by religious affiliation, but often through a combination of both[citation needed](a long shared history; a cultural tradition of its own; either a common geographical origin, or descent from a small number of common ancestors; a common language, not necessarily peculiar to the group; a common literature peculiar to the group; a common religion different from that of neighbouring groups; being a minority or being an oppressed or a dominant group within a larger community).[citation needed]

Examples of ethnic groups defined by ancestral religions are the Jews, the Druze of the Levant, the Copts of Egypt, the Yazidi of northern Iraq, the Zoroastrians of Iran and India, and the Serer of Senegal, the Gambia and Mauritania.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnoreligious

[Frijoles]

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
Your comment sounds very rabbinic to me i.e. it is STIPID and FALSE.

STIPID?

Why do you always bring things back to a comment about rabbis? That is rather pathetic.

[MUQ]

Bill Cosbeotch wrote:

<quoted text>
No thanks i enjoying the open roads since holidays are here and everyone tied down for next two weeks. Hopefully give you time to rethink your obsession of running into parked cars on purpose.

Holidays mean people are outside and enjoying themselves with shopping, drinking, dancing and reveling.

I heard there are more accidents in holiday period than on other days (most of drivers being drunk is another reason).

The only people on holiday would be bus drivers and truck drivers and similar people, that is why I asked you the civil question.

As for hitting the parked cars, when you have less accidents, then call us and we would try to help the situation.

[MUQ]

Which “Sword” the Prophet Used against his enemies: Part-5

Enemies of Islam represent our prophet as a very cruel and blood thirsty man, who would kill his “opponents, enemies and any one who disagreed with him” at “the drop of hat” and all his adversaries would be “terrified” at the mere sight of him.

The picture is far from true, let us look at some incidents from the life of prophet, as what was “this sword which killed the enmity for ever”

The Case of : ABDULLAH BIN SALLAM, JEWISH SCHOLAR

A. His Position in Medina

Abdullah bin Sallam was a well known and well respected Jewish scholar of Medina. Jews and other residents of Medina respected him and came to him, when there was any need of getting religious clarifications on any issue.

Abdullah was Scholar of Jewish Scriptures and he spent his time in studies and pondering over religious issues.

When prophet migrated to Medina, Abdullah was caught in a Dilemma. His studies of Jewish scriptures had convinced him, that one last prophet had to come into the world. Who it would be, he was not sure, there were signs and some of the attributes of that prophet mentioned in his Scriptures, most of them fit the New Prophet.

B. Abdullah Tests the Prophet:

But he was not sure, he wanted to test the prophet as to source of his divine knowledge. One day he came to meet the prophet when he was alone and said to prophet, I want to ask you three questions, no one knows the answers to them except a true Messenger of God, so please answer them, the questions were:

1. What is the first sign of “start of Last day”?

2. What will be the first food of those who will enter Paradise.

3. And why the Child sometimes resembles Father and some times he resembles Mother?

Prophet answered all the three questions, and Abdullah was satisfied with the answer and he declared his faith. Prophet told, that I did not knew the answer of these questions, Gabriel came just know and gave me the answers.

C. Abdullah tests Jews:

Abdullah said to prophet, please do not tell others about my conversion now . Call Leaders of Jews and ask them about me, I will hide behind this curtain, so they will not be able to see me.

The Prophet called all Leaders of Jews of Medina and asked “What is position of Abdullah bin Sallam amongst you”?

“He is our Leader, one of our Best man and son of our Best man, we do not find any thing but good in him” They replied with one voice.

“What would you say, if he became Muslim” Asked the Prophet.

“God Forbid, that he leave the Path of Moses and choose this New Path” said the Jews.

On hearing this, Abdullah came out from the curtain and said “You All be witness that I have accepted Islam and become a Muslim”!!

Jews rushed out of the Prophet’s House saying “He is the Worst amongst us, son of the Worse man and his opinion counts for nothing with us”!!

Such was Abdullah bin Sallam, another Victim of Sword of Knowledge of our prophet!!

Source: Companions of Prophet: by Talib Hashmi

[TrumpetCallofGod Online]

(an EXCERPT)

Behold, even those who dwell among you, who are called Christian, do pollute My name and crucify Me again and again in their hearts, by all they say and do; a very perverse people, a corrupt religion which looks nothing like Me; churches of men who worship themselves and their own ideals, as they proclaim a christ, an idol, which they have formed in their own image, continually reshaping it to meet their own expectations, that they might uphold their own traditions, which I hate!... Jerusalem, O Jerusalem, why have you forsaken Me?!

http://trumpetcallofgodonline.com/index.php5...

HEAR THE WORD OF THE LORD at: http://TrumpetCallofGodOnline.com

[Frijoles]

MUQ wrote:

Which “Sword” the Prophet Used against his enemies: Part-5
Enemies of Islam represent our prophet as a very cruel and blood thirsty man, who would kill his “opponents, enemies and any one who disagreed with him” at “the drop of hat” and all his adversaries would be “terrified” at the mere sight of him.
The picture is far from true, let us look at some incidents from the life of prophet, as what was “this sword which killed the enmity for ever”
The Case of : ABDULLAH BIN SALLAM, JEWISH SCHOLAR

Muhammad, the founder of Islam, traveled to Medina in 622 A.D. to attract followers to his new faith. When the Jews of Medina refused to convert and rejected Muhammad, two of the major Jewish tribes were expelled; in 627, Muhammad's followers killed between 600 and 900 of the men, and divided the surviving Jewish women and children amongst themselves.(3)

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/a... (gen).html

[Ozada]

Why do the children of the god of Abraham want to kill one another so badly?

Judaism, Christianity and Islam, who I like to call the "Psychotic Three" just can't seem to get along. They all preach love etc., why don't they practice it?

Christopher Hitchens one wrote; "Religion poisons everything". He was so right!

[Frijoles]

MUQ wrote:

Has any one noticed, all of a sudden "every one from top to bottom in World Superpower nations" are worried about the poor condition of Syrian people and how much they are at risk from these "Chemical Weapons"?
Does it rings a bell?
They say, people are not stung from the same hole twice, but in Politics and International Terror of these Superpowers, people are stung again and again by the same hole. In fact it is the "Only hole" available from where they can be stung!!
It was in 2003, when a "Similar Hype" was raised by these World Superpowers about the danger to which Iraqi people and its neighbors are suffering due to "Huge amount" of Chemical, Biological and WMD s which Saddam Hussain has its disposal.
The threat was "so imminent and so serious and immediate" that UN sanction to launch an attack was not "considered necessary".
And the Superpowers attacked in pack and the dictator was overpowered and Superpowers took upon themselves to re-start building Iraq from Scratch and make it an "ideal" for all its neighbors.
And every one knows what happened next, after four years with more than 5000 of their own dead, and 50,000 or more getting injured and a Million of Iraqis getting killed, they "abandoned" their hope of "improving lots" of Iraqi people.
Now no one even considers how Iraqi people are enjoying their "hard earned Democracy"
And the same thing happened in Afghanistan, there is no development there despite Superpowers ruling it for past 11 years (and there is no "hope" of any development either).
One would have thought that these Superpowers would have learned their lesson and would not try to "improve the lot of common people" in any more Arab or Muslim country.
But the old habits die hard, we see the "War Monger Lobby and Lame Duck President" is flexing their muscles to have a "Go" at another Arab and Muslim country. And the "Excuse" this time is Chemical Weapons (they do not use the term WMD this time, because the name is "soiled" already).
One might ask, why they do not use the term WMD when Chemical Weapons come under WMD? Only these Superpowers know, one must not question their judgment and use of terminology.
So we should not be alarmed if we hear that "One Fine Morning, these Superpowers launched an all out attack on Syria to "save its population and the "neighboring countries" from the dangers of Syrian (no Assad's!!) Chemical Weapons.
These superpowers seem to have exact knowledge about WMD s of every nation in the world, except the nation of Isreal!!
They do not "know" how much Nuclear, Chemical and Biological and other types of WMD s are hidden in that country!!
Who could believe that such double standards would be seen in this Modern age,
Looks Strange, but it is True!!
It should be sent to the Ripley Guy!!

The chemical weapons worry was voiced since day 1.

Yes, the former Iraq situation doesnt help the discussion much

Yesterday I heard on the radio an interview with a Syrian official who was in charge of a portion of the stockpiling - He is now defected and living in Turkey.

In Iraq, they couldnt find a single Iraqi who could give this type of information, obviously because there was no info to give.

I have noticed you always seem to pick these causes that are easily debunked through normal googling and awareness.

Why? Do you not have access to the free media in your country?

[former res]

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
Tell me, the MANY Jews who have NO religion are they Jews? Reconcile your "ethnoreligious" with atheists Jews.

They would be Jews ethnically but not in the religious sense.

Ask a more difficult question next time.

I need to feel challenged.

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you a Religious atheist?

No. How could that be?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxymoron

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
What was the religion of the Norther tribes of Israel?
What was the religion of Israel before "Judaism"?

Frijoles would know more about this than I would.

I do know that Israel did not exist until 1948.

[Frijoles]

Judging Fan, are you on vacation?

[former res]

HughBe wrote:

<quoted text>
Former--Whatever happened to "turn the other cheek"?
HughBe--- As I have so many times, I am no Jesus and His words are TRUTH. I tend to live by combining the law and the words of Jesus. So I will "turn the other cheek" but I will also give someone the RIGHT HAND, of correction.
Former--And if Frijoes believes it, then is it really a lie?
HughBe--- In many instances. Open your eyes and see.

An eye for an eye must come from your Jewish side.

:)

Old Testament, correct?

[Frijoles]

MUQ wrote:

<quoted text>
Ans.
A. Jews Persecution in Muslim countries:
01. Only writing "One side" of the story, could lead you into forming any conclusion. I do not say that all Muslims were ideal and no Jews were persecuted anywhere in any Muslim country.
02. But what I know and what every one knows that Muslims did not persecute Jews the way they were persecuted by Christians of Europe.
03. In Islam granting some one as DIMMI, is not a de-meaning term. It makes them "protectors by the state". They get rights and they have to fulfill their obligations.
04 You have mentioned so many incidents from Wikipedia, I have no means to confirm or deny them. Even if they be true, how can you know that "Jews were never at fault"?
05. We see this before our eyes even today. Jews and Christian writers blame Arabs and Muslims for all violence and Jews acting in "self defense", while Arab and Muslims saying that it is Jews who are oppressors. So it depends who gets his side of story into Wikipedia first.

Blaming the victims for slaughter of civilians. Nice.

Wikipedia posts citations at the bottom. If you are interested - go forth research them

Dimmi is not the issue - the issue is the violence. I wanted to post the whole newscopy so that you could see it full context.

Isnt your argument partly, "Muslim violence was not nearly as violent as Christian violence, therefore it is ok?"

[Frijoles]

former res wrote:

<quoted text>
An eye for an eye must come from your Jewish side.
:)
Old Testament, correct?

I might add that is a fundie interpretation.

Jews usually interpret those passages as an admonishment to use proportional compensation - I.E. If someone looses an eye they should be duely (financially) compensated - no less, no more.

[Frijoles]

MUQ wrote:

<quoted text>
D. Me as Judge:
04. I do not know what you mean by me acting as your "Judge"?
I do not judge any one, I can give my opinion on any post that I might get.

Its obvious that the most likely candidates are you and Hughbe. From the online habits, you are the more likely candidate.

Its ok - I enjoy it. All advertising is GOOD advertising in my book.

[former res]

HughBe wrote:

HughBe--- I BORE only women.

So you admit that you are boring?

HughBe wrote:

Former--"Best thing since sliced bread"? Are you suggesting they are somehow promoting something is actually under no one's control, much like eye or skin color?
HughBe--- How long did it take your IDIOTIC psychiatrists to discover that people could not control this particular PERVERSION?
Is this the only perversion that people cannot control? If not, sanctify them also and champion their RIGHTS to indulge.

It is not perverson anymore than is your supposed attraction to women.

We do not control whom we are attracted to or whom we love.

You need to opne your eyes, your mind and your heart and understand this.

HughBe wrote:

Former---Regarding the change in status of homosexuality as a "diagnosis" - societys do evolve. Our society used to enslave people of your shiny skin color.
HughBe--- Based on my understanding, YOUR society use to enslave people of your pale skin colour or WHITES, in early America. Check the history.

There was and remains much injustice in the world.

There are people here who hunt down and kill gays.

Does this outrage you?

HughBe wrote:

Former--You "use" homosexuality.
HughBe--- Yes but not in the way that you do. I use the example you use the practice.

My wife would not agree with you.

HughBe wrote:

Former--Yes, I do tend to believe that which has been established by science.
HughBe--- Prove the belief that " our deepest thoughts, aspirations and emotions are merely electrically charged chemical reactions."

I am not a scientist but I know they have done tests, EEGs etc.

This is not a matter of faith as is your god up in the sky.

HughBe wrote:

Former--What kind of cookies would you make?
Is there such a thing as a Jamaican cookie?
HughBe--- I'm not into cookie making and the truth is I would have to google it to know if there is such a thing as a Jamaican cookie. I simply eat.

Do you help out around the house? Cleaning, laundry, marketing etc?

What is your contribution?

[Frijoles]

MUQ wrote:

<quoted text>
B. On 1948 Borders:
06. Whether Arabs recognize borders of 1948 or not, Isreal can show its "principled stand" that it is not in market to gain an "Inch of the land" which UNO did not allotted it.
That would show its sincerity to the peaceful and co-existence intention and gain it respect from anyone and every one.
07. But the mood in Isreal and Zionist lobby is to "grab" any amount of land and hold tight to it by hook or by crook, And we see that the way Isreal keeps on building new housing colonies and "disregarding" protests and appeals by UNO to stop it.
They know fully well that their "Grand Daddy" will veto any move in Security council to impose any sanctions on them.

08. Would the same "Grand daddy" act in a similar way if any Arab or Muslim country "disregarded" request from UNO? The hells foundation would have shaken at the "disrespect" shown to the World Body.

You need to read more international media, or even meet a real life Jew. You would be suprised at the breadth of diversity of opinions on the subject, as well as what the consensus is. Stop reading Arab media.

The UN resolutions were recommendations, not mandates. In 1948 as well as in 2012. The UN can not mandate a state.

You seem to continue to return to the theme of the US GrandDaddy. The US is a democracy. If there wasnt internal support for their policies they wouldnt be implemented. If you feel as an Arab or Mulsim that you are being slighted, then your recourse is to vote. Of course in your case you cant since you are not a citizen. And that is EXCACTLY the way the system is SUPPOSED to operate.

(Kind of like HUGHBE having no standing to tell Jews how to be Jewish - similar idea)

[Frijoles]

Thank you for the judging, MUQ, I was worried that you were getting soft today...

[Frijoles]

former res wrote:

<quoted text>
They would be Jews ethnically but not in the religious sense.
Ask a more difficult question next time.
I need to feel challenged.

Huggy is being STIPID again.