teen challenge

[tammy Grubb Sweigart]

paul wrote:

SEEKING PEOPLE FROM TEEN CHALLENGE INDIANAPOLIS 79 -82 I WAS THERE I WAS IN THE BOYS HOUSE WE WERE LOCKED IN THE BASEMENT STEVE DANIALS , WAS THERE , MY NICKNAME WAS CRICKET ... BILL BATES , CHUCH MORRIS , MIKE PRIMEUMOX , I REMEMBER THE GIRL WHO WAS 14 YEARS OLD ( IT'S 80 DEGREES IN MY HOUSE ) AND I'VE GOT CHILLS WHEN I JUST STARTED TO WRITING ABOUT THIS 14 YEAR OLD GIRL NAMED MINDY AND I KNOW WHY AND HOW SHE DIED SHE WAS 14 YEARS OLD I DID NOT KNOW HER REAL WELL SHE SAT NEXT to me in school we went to home school in the girls building .... i never forgot about mindy shame no one ever spoke for her ... most of the people there must remember her ....i heard betty violet and her lover ruth thalman have a another place ....i heard betty violette is an alcoholic and stays in her room please write back !!!

I remember u in a way I was there 1979 /1980 I wasthere when the girl comitted suicide , and the closet deal the scrubbing of the floor ,,, my name is tammy grubb at the time ....

[tammy Grubb Sweigart]

God loves you wrote:

<quoted text>
I actually lived with Neeley ( cornelious) Ruth ann St John for several years. I wondered if the stories she told me were true. I visited betty & ruthie @ 3rd phase many times. I was appalled @ the so called living conditions & the work they had to do. They aren't supposed to have kids living there but they do. There is nothing Christ like about them. I would love to shut them down or have someone that really does love God run the place. I can't believe they have that huge house & the girls sleep on bunk beds on the 3 rd floor at the back of the room behind a partition. The test of the floor is filled with folding chairs.

i was there also and when I try to share that with people they dont believe it ,,,,

[joyce]

tammy Grubb Sweigart wrote:

wat i dont understand is how did them to get to start anothr program and it did not seem like they were arrested long why .they hurt alot of kids ,

I don't know, but TC was still operated by her, we all suspected of the health code/fire code inspectors as being "paid off" to look the other way. We were typically herded down into the basement out of sight and warned to keep quiet "or else", and the ones not at risk "to escape" were shoved in a van "for an outing". Having been a heroin addict and prostitute/madam, I am sure she was "well-connected", and probably had some dirt--or knew those that did--on certain "officials"--who knows, but God..?? I am not sure if she "did any time" after her arrest. It is very possible that she was exonerated after posting bail...she DID have a lot of "street smarts", and could probably talk her way "out of Jonah's 'whale'!"

[tammy Grubb Sweigart]

Mom Violete was really good at preaching ...I do wish that I could get a hold of other people .that went through tc

[just me]

How do we know what Betty said about her past life was true, or Ruthie, an Neilly was the biggest liar that ever lived. That woman lied with ever breath she took. Her testimony, the age she said she was, all the things she said she did. It was ALL a lie. She lived an breathed this lie, that woman had to be helping them launder money, or something, An if she is still alive i would love to see her birth certificate, an ask about that drug addicted Mother who locked her in the closet in a filthy rooming house, neilly was raised in the most affluent neighborhood in these States with wealthy parent. What a nut she was.

[Nancy Bailey]

just me wrote:

How do we know what Betty said about her past life was true, or Ruthie, an Neilly was the biggest liar that ever lived. That woman lied with ever breath she took. Her testimony, the age she said she was, all the things she said she did. It was ALL a lie. She lived an breathed this lie, that woman had to be helping them launder money, or something, An if she is still alive i would love to see her birth certificate, an ask about that drug addicted Mother who locked her in the closet in a filthy rooming house, neilly was raised in the most affluent neighborhood in these States with wealthy parent. What a nut she was.

Why do you believe Neilly lied about her past? Sadly, it is not that unusual for an infant or child to be locked in a closet by a drug addicted parent. Accounts of abominable child abuse are well documented in the news media. Perhaps she was adopted or 'fostered' by an affluent family? Something obviously went terribly wrong in her life as she ended up at TC (she certainly seemed abondoned). I lived with Neilly for 2 1/2 years at TC and don't recall any mendaciousness on her part. On the contrary, she seemed much more articulate and compelling than most. She is one of the few people I remember well.

[El Rushbo]

Why the hell are you people yapping about a thread from 2006?

[tammy Grubb Sweigart]

I really did not talk alot when I was there ... it was a weird situation , I did not ever hear the word brain wash until I got there ...... thats amazing that Betty lived a lie ....why would u want to do that ur whole life live a lie . what made her and how did she ever start working with kids ,,,Some one told me that shewent in to a nervous breakdown ... I cannot believe that I was in the program there ,, at that time

[El Rushbo]

Why the hell are you people yapping about a thread from 2006?

[joyce]

To "El Rushbo"--you ask a good question, now let me ask you one: Why do war Veteran's become so close? Why do they seek out one another and esteem their time in the Armed Services, esp. during wars, as something only another Veteran can possibly understand? Because they lived and saw trauma together. Do you think YOU could forget being held against your will, brainwashed, treated like a slave, and let that go and NOT want to process or talk about it. Don't addicts in AA and NA have a saying, "you're as 'sick' as your secrets?" My friend, or foe, walk a mile in our shoes--if you don't like the script, switch to another book. "SURVIVORS" gain strength from validating each other, and THIS is a forum for that.

[El Rushbo]

What did you survive?

[tammy Grubb Sweigart]

joyce wrote:

To "El Rushbo"--you ask a good question, now let me ask you one: Why do war Veteran's become so close? Why do they seek out one another and esteem their time in the Armed Services, esp. during wars, as something only another Veteran can possibly understand? Because they lived and saw trauma together. Do you think YOU could forget being held against your will, brainwashed, treated like a slave, and let that go and NOT want to process or talk about it. Don't addicts in AA and NA have a saying, "you're as 'sick' as your secrets?" My friend, or foe, walk a mile in our shoes--if you don't like the script, switch to another book. "SURVIVORS" gain strength from validating each other, and THIS is a forum for that.

thank u Joyce ,,U said that well ,,, enkess u have been anothers shoes keep ur yap shut ,,,It has helped me knowing that there r others that r going through the same thing after all theese years Besides I did not find this site until just recently ,,and I am glad I did

[El Rushbo]

Are you sure you survived?

[just me]

Well lets see, Neilly was not adopted, She was engaged to Randy Thurman, she told everyone she was 29 in 1979, her gray hair was a result of the life she led. In 1979 Neilly finally confessed she was really 42, In 1974 she took a I.Q. test an scored really high, her teaches were amazed that this street urchin was so smart, an so proud when they helped her receive her High School Diploma thru Broad Ripple, The truth was she had graduated from college an had a Masters Degree. She had been married to a Proffesor. I lived with Neilly for 4 years an yes i was amazed myself when i learned the truth. She had a mental problem alright. If poor little Neilly is still alive i cannot imagine why she would not tell eveyone why she told all this stuff.Yes i believe she told lots of lies just like Betty an Ruth.I cannot be the only person that knows all this, Randy where are you , poor Randy was shocked, when he found out his Bride to be was so old. One lie led to another with her. Like anyone you know that tell so many lies, there is no end to them.Where is Neilly? time to fess up girl.

[joyce]

Regarding "Just Me's" comments 3 hrs. ago: I always wondered if "Neilly" was her real name. I think by 1976 when I met her and was put at INDY's TC, I had already seen the movie, "The Valley of The Dolls". It's about addiction, and one of the main characters in the movie was named "Neilly" (do not recall if it was spelled the same), and that character was played by Patty Duke. It was also Sharon Tate's last movie before the Charles Manson "grape Kool-Aid followers" murdered her and several others. It COULD have been spelled "NEELY" in the movie. Anyway, it was a soap operatic, overly dramatic piece of work, and if Neilly was enamored with making up a different life and persona than her reality, perhaps she saw herself as an actress or another character. I DO agree with the aforementioned statement, "She had a mental problem alright," esp. someone who had LIVED with her for 4 years. I found everything "just me" said above revealing the REAL Neilly very interesting!!

[Nancy Bailey]

If Neilly was 42 in 1979 that would make her 75 years old today. Neilly (Neely?) is a nickname for Cornelia (her given name). I remember Neilly as vulnerable and sensitive, perhaps even delicate. I see her as a victim of Teen Challenge...she certainly wasn't part of the machinery that made Teen Challenge so abominably awful. I can't lump her in with the militant TC commandants so hell bent on indoctrination so I will give her a pass.:-)

[just me]

Neilly's name was {Ruth}, not Neilly or Cornelia,or St.John. And Brother Hutto an his lovely wife who was Betty Violettes brother and sister-in-law said His and Bettys parents were wonderful people, they had a great child hood. Betty is so misunderstood, an poor Neilly,I never seen her holding a girl down so Betty could pray the devil out of the child. She was soooo vulnerable that Neilly.And Betty an Ruth were just scapegoats for all the people who blame there problems on them.Yes Neilly {Ruth} is probably 75 by now. In 79 I was 21, She 42 the math is correct.

[joyce]

Funny...my memory may be clouded, but I do not remember anything but smiles from Neilly & Ruth. However, I can still recall Betty preaching and the severe, torturous facial expressions she manifested during sermons and in day-to-day verbal interactions whether brief reprimands or lengthy "called-into-the-office-f or-shaming-sessions" like I had. Toward the end of my stay there, I became more outraged and less afraid to "do" something ABOUT it, and word had gotten back to Betty about me being an "instigator" for some type of uprising--at least, talking her down with my fellow "alumni". So, she was happy to "hand me back" to my family once I agreed to go to college. Like I said before, I had kept notes in my socks so they couldn't find them when I took a shower, but my folks did not believe me about Betty and what went on there, so nothing ever came of "my notes". Betty probably not only had/has addiction problems, but probably "self-medicated" like so many Dual Diagnosis patients do, to hide the underlying mental illness--in fact, she herself MAY have been the one demon-possessed, or at least, severely OPPRESSED, leading her to see that in everyone around her..."just sayin'!!"...

[say what]

Ruth was always nice to me, and so was Neilly (Ruth),I cannot even say Betty was mean to me.These people had Preachers, the Mayor of Indy, wealthy people, to name one (The Steinways)Welfare agency's an Judges, believeing they were all so great.They have the touch because they are still doing it with the Third Phase program they run in Noblesville In.

[joyce]

say what wrote:

Ruth was always nice to me, and so was Neilly (Ruth),I cannot even say Betty was mean to me.These people had Preachers, the Mayor of Indy, wealthy people, to name one (The Steinways)Welfare agency's an Judges, believeing they were all so great.They have the touch because they are still doing it with the
Third Phase program they run in Noblesville In.

Grifters ARE 'gifted'!!