Claims of brother's sexual abuse stun...

Claims of brother's sexual abuse stun Cretin-Derham Hall commun...

There are 263 comments on the TwinCities.com story from May 22, 2009, titled Claims of brother's sexual abuse stun Cretin-Derham Hall commun.... In it, TwinCities.com reports that:

The news this week that a former Catholic brother at Cretin High School was accused of sexually abusing a teenage student has sent aftershocks throughout the school community and prompted other men as far away as California to report that they, too, were victimized by the cleric.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at TwinCities.com.

Bob Schwiderski

Ridgecrest, CA

#213 May 31, 2009
COMMENT FROM GREG BULLOUGH, Doylestown, PA, POSTED IN COMPANION ARTICLE OF PIONEER PRESS:

Civil Action wrote:
<quoted text>
Right a civil action is money.The abuser is not punished in any way.
In this case not so. The abuser is alive and still a member of the Christian Brothers, who enabled his abuse by looking the other way, shuttling him from region to region, and never really dealing with the problem.

Following 7 figures in settlements, you can bet that Rai Rose's standing in the organization which is his "family" has come down a few notches. That is punishment.

And the payouts certainly do "punish" the organization such that they'll live on in the organizational memory and perhaps cause the organization to think twice and three times before mollycoddling individuals such as Rose (or Moriarty, or Gutierrez) in the future.

No, they're not in jail where they arguably belong; but it is better, much better, than nothing. AND civil action gets to those who are beyond reach of criminal action in any case, such as the Visitors (the Christian Brothers term for regional superiors), who failed to discipline their colleagues and who thus put children in danger.
crummy timing

Saint Paul, MN

#214 May 31, 2009
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
COMMENT FROM GREG BULLOUGH, Doylestown, PA, POSTED IN COMPANION ARTICLE OF PIONEER PRESS:
Probably not a good idea to duplicate same information in two different threads, Bob. Linking is better.
My response to what Bob referenced at:
http://www.topix.com/forum/source/twincities-...
Civil Action

Saint Paul, MN

#216 Jun 1, 2009
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
COMMENT FROM GREG BULLOUGH, Doylestown, PA, POSTED IN COMPANION ARTICLE OF PIONEER PRESS:
Civil Action wrote:
<quoted text>
Right a civil action is money.The abuser is not punished in any way.
In this case not so. The abuser is alive and still a member of the Christian Brothers, who enabled his abuse by looking the other way, shuttling him from region to region, and never really dealing with the problem.
Following 7 figures in settlements, you can bet that Rai Rose's standing in the organization which is his "family" has come down a few notches. That is punishment.
And the payouts certainly do "punish" the organization such that they'll live on in the organizational memory and perhaps cause the organization to think twice and three times before mollycoddling individuals such as Rose (or Moriarty, or Gutierrez) in the future.
No, they're not in jail where they arguably belong; but it is better, much better, than nothing. AND civil action gets to those who are beyond reach of criminal action in any case, such as the Visitors (the Christian Brothers term for regional superiors), who failed to discipline their colleagues and who thus put children in danger.
Ok, well I don't see that Brother Rai is being punished at all and he will probably be dead in the next five years anyway. So, that brings me back to why you, Bob, were at Cretin Derham Hall giving a press conference apparently at some point expecting the school (40 years later) to provide you answers as to why Brother Rai was moved around. For some reason, you think you should punish the school now. I am starting to think this is all about you. I don't think the victim in this case instructed you to do that. Anyway, long story, short - money. Like everything else in life.
Lawyers

Minneapolis, MN

#217 Jun 1, 2009
The largest national group,with 4,600 members, lists as its number one donor Laurence E. Drivon. The Stockton, Calif. lawyer, who represents 320 plaintiffs in clergy cases, donated $20,000 last year. Another big Snap donor: Jeffrey Anderson, a lawyer in St. Paul, Minn. who has 250 clergy cases pending; he donated $10,000, according to Snap's IRS filing. Anderson says he has since donated $20,000 more and pledged another $30,000 matching grant for 2003.

The 3,000-member Linkup lists as its largest donor an Oregon plaintiff lawyer who has 50 clergy cases pending and last year made a $100,000 joint donation with a client who received a settlement from a religious order. The lawyer, Michael S. Morey, says the client put up two-thirds of the $100,000. Another Linkup donor is Joseph Klest, a lawyer who has handled more than 50 Catholic clergy cases in Illinois and who gave $2,615 to Linkup last year, according to Linkup's IRS filing.

You would think with all of the money these layers are raking in, they could donate a little more.
Suburban Dad

Minneapolis, MN

#219 Jun 1, 2009
Lets get the gay priests out and problem solved.
Bob Schwiderski

Ridgecrest, CA

#220 Jun 1, 2009
cOUNT 1 - FRAUD
By assigning Brother Raimond Rose to De La Salle, Cretin, Brady,_____, and _____, as a teacher who would have unsupervised access to children attending the schools, the Christian Brothers and the schools affirmatively representated to the victims of clergy sexual abuse and their families that Brother Raimond was safe around children and that he did not have a history of molesting children.

The Christian Brothers and the schools knew these representations to the victims of clergy sexual and their families were false because the Christian Brothers and the schools knew that Brother Raimond Rose had a history of sexually molesting children and was a danger to children.

WHY did the Christian Brothers and the schools knowingly put their students in harms way, WHY ?
p t bull

Minneapolis, MN

#221 Jun 1, 2009
Lawyers wrote:
...You would think with all of the money these layers are raking in, they could donate a little more.

A paltry sum, indeed. They sure get their money's worth, though, in term of lawsuit advocacy. I wonder if snap does any healing, or just keeps the wounds fresh for the purpose of lawsuits and publicity.
Lawsuit

Minneapolis, MN

#223 Jun 1, 2009
p t bull wrote:
<quoted text>
A paltry sum, indeed. They sure get their money's worth, though, in term of lawsuit advocacy. I wonder if snap does any healing, or just keeps the wounds fresh for the purpose of lawsuits and publicity.
SNAP and others with an agenda are to keep us bound up in the cycle of blame and vilification and loathing, and of course, money. Money equals healing and justice.
Why

Minneapolis, MN

#224 Jun 1, 2009
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
cOUNT 1 - FRAUD
By assigning Brother Raimond Rose to De La Salle, Cretin, Brady,_____, and _____, as a teacher who would have unsupervised access to children attending the schools, the Christian Brothers and the schools affirmatively representated to the victims of clergy sexual abuse and their families that Brother Raimond was safe around children and that he did not have a history of molesting children.
The Christian Brothers and the schools knew these representations to the victims of clergy sexual and their families were false because the Christian Brothers and the schools knew that Brother Raimond Rose had a history of sexually molesting children and was a danger to children.
WHY did the Christian Brothers and the schools knowingly put their students in harms way, WHY ?
Quit asking the question that isn't going to be answered because nobody is around from 40 years ago to answer it.
Mating Toads

Minneapolis, MN

#225 Jun 1, 2009
finger lickin good
Bob Schwiderski

Ridgecrest, CA

#226 Jun 1, 2009
Why wrote:
<quoted text>
Quit asking the question that isn't going to be answered because nobody is around from 40 years ago to answer it.


"Why" -- there are many, many victims and their family members around with dated letters and other evidence which shows Rose was moved from school to school.

Hopefully, others with similiar evidence will step from the shadows of silence.
Sen Amy K

Minneapolis, MN

#227 Jun 1, 2009
Sister Willa wrote:
I heard the priests asked the kids to bend over and touch their ankles and spell
r-u-n.
I keep doing it....I don't get it what is the joke here????
Bob Schwiderski

Ridgecrest, CA

#228 Jun 2, 2009
A REMINDER: The press release from last week

Clergy sex abuse victims are "outraged"

They demand local archbishop punish principal

In a letter, Catholic school president ‘outed’ molestation victim

It’s a ‘mean-spirited’ move to ‘intimidate others who are in pain’ SNAP says

Group believes church officials want to “scare” witnesses & whistleblowers too

WHAT
At a news conference, clergy sex abuse victims will
-- provide copies of a controversial new letter sent out this week by a Catholic school principal in which he discloses the identity
-- harshly blast the principal and other staff at the prominent school, and
-- publicly insist that the Minneapolis-St. Paul archbishop punish the principal for his ‘intimidating’ and ‘insensitive’ move

WHEN
TODAY, Friday, May 22, 1:30 p.m.

WHERE
Outside the headquarters of the Archdiocese of St. Paul & Minneapolis, 226 Summit Avenue, in St. Paul

WHO
Two men who were abused as kids by priests and who belong to a support group called SNAP.(Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests)

WHY
On Monday, SNAP announced that a former student at Cretin-Derham Hall High School filed a civil lawsuit charging that a) he was sexually assaulted by Brother Charles Anthony "Raimond" Rose (who worked at the school, and b) that school officials knew or should have known that Rose was a pedophile.

The man filed the suit anonymously, as most victims of sex crimes almost always do.

That same day, Cretin-Derham Hall principal Richard R. Engler sent a letter to alums naming the victim.
SNAP believes this was a deliberate attempt to intimidate victims, witnesses and whistleblowers into staying silent. The group wants Archbishop John Nienstedt to publicly punish Engler and make a strong statement throughout the archdiocese that other church workers will be fired for such callousness and insensitivity.

Catholic officials can't have it both ways, SNAP says. They can't urge victims to come forward and promise them help, while letting church employees attack victims or violate their privacy.

In 1970, Rose molested the then-teenaged boy at the Dunrovin Christian Brothers Retreat Center in Marine on St. Croix, Minnesota.

In the 1960s, Rose repeatedly molested a different teenager at DeLaSalle High School in Minneapolis, MN. Church and school officials let Rose work there, despite earlier reports, that Rose sexually abused at least one other child at the school.

In 2003, Rose was named in a civil suit as having abused a third boy on ski trip in 1982. In 2004, that suit was settled for $1 million. In 1983, church officials moved Rose back to Minnesota when allegations publicly surfaced that he was an molester.

The lawsuit charges three Catholic institutions (the Christian Brothers of the Midwest, The Christian Brothers of Minnesota and Cretin-Derham) with fraud. It was filed in Ramsey County Circuit Court. The Christian Brothers’ regional headquarters is in Chicago and their local headquarters is at 1883 Laurel Avenue in St. Paul.
http://www.startribune.com/local/stpaul/45322... ?

elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW 3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUnciaec8O7EyU sl
http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_123992...

CONTACT: Bob Schwiderski of Wayzata, Minnesota SNAP Director
David Clohessy of St. Louis, SNAP National Director
crummy timing

Saint Paul, MN

#229 Jun 2, 2009
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
...That same day, Cretin-Derham Hall principal Richard R. Engler sent a letter to alums naming the victim.
Over a week later, and you still can't get basic facts straight? All news accounts have said the letter was sent to parents of current students, parents of incoming 9th grade students, and the school's advisory committee. While some of the above are almost certainly alums, the letter was sent as a disclosure to the school's current stakeholders of a pending lawsuit. The name of the plaintiff of the law suit had been disclosed to the school and was in the letter. To claim that was to intimidate other potential victims from coming forward is going way too far, not supported by any facts.
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
The group wants Archbishop John Nienstedt to publicly punish Engler and make a strong statement throughout the archdiocese that other church workers will be fired for such callousness and insensitivity.
Again, more than a week later, basic fact missed. The archdiocese responded the same day that they do not have that kind of control over the school, and Engler is not a church or archdiocese employee.
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
Catholic officials can't have it both ways, SNAP says. They can't urge victims to come forward and promise them help, while letting church employees attack victims or violate their privacy.
Oh, come on, now that's just posturing. If they wanted to have it 'one way' instead of both ways, just attack victims, for example, that would be OK?? In any case, as above, the principal is not a church employee.
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
In 1970, Rose molested the then-teenaged boy at the Dunrovin Christian Brothers Retreat Center in Marine on St. Croix, Minnesota.
What? This didn't happen at the school? Then why is the school a defendant in the suit but not the accused molester? Why, Bob, Why?
SNAP

Minneapolis, MN

#230 Jun 2, 2009
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
A REMINDER: The press release from last week
Clergy sex abuse victims are "outraged"
They demand local archbishop punish principal
In a letter, Catholic school president ‘outed’ molestation victim
It’s a ‘mean-spirited’ move to ‘intimidate others who are in pain’ SNAP says
Group believes church officials want to “scare” witnesses & whistleblowers too
WHAT
At a news conference, clergy sex abuse victims will
-- provide copies of a controversial new letter sent out this week by a Catholic school principal in which he discloses the identity
-- harshly blast the principal and other staff at the prominent school, and
-- publicly insist that the Minneapolis-St. Paul archbishop punish the principal for his ‘intimidating’ and ‘insensitive’ move
WHEN
TODAY, Friday, May 22, 1:30 p.m.
WHERE
Outside the headquarters of the Archdiocese of St. Paul & Minneapolis, 226 Summit Avenue, in St. Paul
WHO
Two men who were abused as kids by priests and who belong to a support group called SNAP.(Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests)
WHY
On Monday, SNAP announced that a former student at Cretin-Derham Hall High School filed a civil lawsuit charging that a) he was sexually assaulted by Brother Charles Anthony "Raimond" Rose (who worked at the school, and b) that school officials knew or should have known that Rose was a pedophile.
The man filed the suit anonymously, as most victims of sex crimes almost always do.
That same day, Cretin-Derham Hall principal Richard R. Engler sent a letter to alums naming the victim.
SNAP believes this was a deliberate attempt to intimidate victims, witnesses and whistleblowers into staying silent. The group wants Archbishop John Nienstedt to publicly punish Engler and make a strong statement throughout the archdiocese that other church workers will be fired for such callousness and insensitivity.
Catholic officials can't have it both ways, SNAP says. They can't urge victims to come forward and promise them help, while letting church employees attack victims or violate their privacy.
In 1970, Rose molested the then-teenaged boy at the Dunrovin Christian Brothers Retreat Center in Marine on St. Croix, Minnesota.
In the 1960s, Rose repeatedly molested a different teenager at DeLaSalle High School in Minneapolis, MN. Church and school officials let Rose work there, despite earlier reports, that Rose sexually abused at least one other child at the school.
In 2003, Rose was named in a civil suit as having abused a third boy on ski trip in 1982. In 2004, that suit was settled for $1 million. In 1983, church officials moved Rose back to Minnesota when allegations publicly surfaced that he was an molester.
The lawsuit charges three Catholic institutions (the Christian Brothers of the Midwest, The Christian Brothers of Minnesota and Cretin-Derham) with fraud. It was filed in Ramsey County Circuit Court. The Christian Brothers’ regional headquarters is in Chicago and their local headquarters is at 1883 Laurel Avenue in St. Paul.
http://www.startribune.com/local/stpaul/45322... ?
elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW 3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUnciaec8O7EyU sl
http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_123992...
CONTACT: Bob Schwiderski of Wayzata, Minnesota SNAP Director
David Clohessy of St. Louis, SNAP National Director
Has the victim asked you to take charge here?
SNAP Demands Punishment

Minneapolis, MN

#231 Jun 2, 2009
Wow, I can't believe the Archbishop didn't jump on punishing the principal immediately at your demand. After all you are the judge and jury of this whole situation.
p t bull

Minneapolis, MN

#232 Jun 2, 2009
SNAP wrote:
<quoted text>
Has the victim asked you to take charge here?

No, this is all about Bob. Bob is angry, Bob must have his vengeance--oops, I mean 'healing'... Abuse victims are tools for Bob's crusade against all things catholic.
Bob Schwiderski

Ridgecrest, CA

#234 Jun 2, 2009
Matthew 18 5-6
"And any of you who welcomes a little child like this because you are mine, is welcoming me and caring for me. But if any of you causes one of these little ones who trusts in me to lose his faith, it would be better for you to have a rock tied to your neck and be thrown into the sea."

PARALLEL MESSAGE: 18-6 "Children are trusting by nature. Parents and adults who influence young children are held accountable by God for how they affect these little ones' ability to trust. Jesus warned that anyone who turns little children away from faith will receive severe punishment."

QUESTIONS: Is cover-up, denial, and false witness when informed that children have been harmed when under your influence applicable here ?

Have the naysayers in this comment section and their refusal to act or respond positively to stop the cycle of childhood sexual meeting the mission statement of the school ?
p t bull

Minneapolis, MN

#235 Jun 2, 2009
Bob Schwiderski wrote:
...Have the naysayers in this comment section and their refusal to act or respond positively to stop the cycle of childhood sexual meeting the mission statement of the school ?

So your narcissism is such that not agreeing with Bob today is tantamount to enabling sexual abuse 40 years ago. That is the world according to Bob. Its all about Bob and what Bob feels. We must all do what Bob says because he was abused.

But, Bob, calling me a molester-enabler doesn't make it so, its just extremely rude and reveals how Bob thinks.
Minnesotan

Ridgecrest, CA

#236 Jun 2, 2009
p t bull wrote:
<quoted text>
So your narcissism is such that not agreeing with Bob today is tantamount to enabling sexual abuse 40 years ago. That is the world according to Bob. Its all about Bob and what Bob feels. We must all do what Bob says because he was abused.
But, Bob, calling me a molester-enabler doesn't make it so, its just extremely rude and reveals how Bob thinks.
Thou shall not bear false witness against thy neighbor.[ you have used 5 false witness statements as to what I have said and you have an obvious name calling problem ] Shame on you.

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