Blaming Israel for carnage

Blaming Israel for carnage

There are 121922 comments on the Fort Worth Star-Telegram story from Jul 22, 2006, titled Blaming Israel for carnage. In it, Fort Worth Star-Telegram reports that:

Most media outlets aren't providing news of Israel's barbaric air raids on Lebanon with fairness and integrity.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Fort Worth Star-Telegram.

Since: Jun 12

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#114145 Jan 8, 2014
Further, it is contemplated that the status of all citizens of Palestine in the eyes of the law shall be Palestinian, and it has never been intended that they, or any section of them, should possess any other juridical status. So far as the Jewish population of Palestine are concerned it appears that some among them are apprehensive that His Majesty's Government may depart from the policy embodied in the Declaration of 1917. It is necessary, therefore, once more to affirm that these fears are unfounded, and that that Declaration, re affirmed by the Conference of the Principle Allied Powers at San Remo and again in the Treaty of Sevres, is not susceptible of change.

During the last two or three generations the Jews have recreated in Palestine a community, now numbering 80,000, of whom about one fourth are farmers or workers upon the land. This community has its own political organs; an elected assembly for the direction of its domestic concerns; elected councils in the towns; and an organization for the control of its schools. It has its elected Chief Rabbinate and Rabbinical Council for the direction of its religious affairs. Its business is conducted in Hebrew as a vernacular language, and a Hebrew Press serves its needs. It has its distinctive intellectual life and displays considerable economic activity. This community, then, with its town and country population, its political, religious, and social organizations, its own language, its own customs, its own life, has in fact "national" characteristics. When it is asked what is meant by the development of the Jewish National Home in Palestine, it may be answered that it is not the imposition of a Jewish nationality upon the inhabitants of Palestine as a whole, but the further development of the existing Jewish community, with the assistance of Jews in other parts of the world, in order that it may become a centre in which the Jewish people as a whole may take, on grounds of religion and race, an interest and a pride. But in order that this community should have the best prospect of free development and provide a full opportunity for the Jewish people to display its capacities, it is essential that it should know that it is in Palestine as of right and not on the sufferance. That is the reason why it is necessary that the existence of a Jewish National Home in Palestine should be internationally guaranteed, and that it should be formally recognized to rest upon ancient historic connection.

This, then, is the interpretation which His Majesty's Government place upon the Declaration of 1917, and, so understood, the Secretary of State is of opinion that it does not contain or imply anything which need cause either alarm to the Arab population of Palestine or disappointment to the Jews.

For the fulfilment of this policy it is necessary that the Jewish community in Palestine should be able to increase its numbers by immigration. This immigration cannot be so great in volume as to exceed whatever may be the economic capacity of the country at the time to absorb new arrivals. It is essential to ensure that the immigrants should not be a burden upon the people of Palestine as a whole, and that they should not deprive any section of the present population of their employment. Hitherto the immigration has fulfilled these conditions. The number of immigrants since the British occupation has been about 25,000.

It is necessary also to ensure that persons who are politically undesirable be excluded from Palestine, and every precaution has been and will be taken by the Administration to that end.
Mandate are not being fulfilled by the Government of Palestine.

To be continued

Since: Jun 12

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#114146 Jan 8, 2014
It is intended that a special committee should be established in Palestine, consisting entirely of members of the new Legislative Council elected by the people, to confer with the administration upon matters relating to the regulation of immigration. Should any difference of opinion arise between this committee and the Administration, the matter will be referred to His Majesty's Government, who will give it special consideration. In addition, under Article 81 of the draft Palestine Order in Council, any religious community or considerable section of the population of Palestine will have a general right to appeal, through the High Commissioner and the Secretary of State, to the League of Nations on any matter on which they may consider that the terms of the Mandate are not being fulfilled by the Government of Palestine.

With reference to the Constitution which it is now intended to establish in Palestine, the draft of which has already been published, it is desirable to make certain points clear. In the first place, it is not the case, as has been represented by the Arab Delegation, that during the war His Majesty's Government gave an undertaking that an independent national government should be at once established in Palestine. This representation mainly rests upon a letter dated the 24th October, 1915, from Sir Henry McMahon, then His Majesty's High Commissioner in Egypt, to the Sharif of Mecca, now King Hussein of the Kingdom of the Hejaz. That letter is quoted as conveying the promise to the Sherif of Mecca to recognise and support the independence of the Arabs within the territories proposed by him. But this promise was given subject to a reservation made in the same letter, which excluded from its scope, among other territories, the portions of Syria lying to the west of the District of Damascus. This reservation has always been regarded by His Majesty's Government as covering the vilayet of Beirut and the independent Sanjak of Jerusalem. The whole of Palestine west of the Jordan was thus excluded from Sir. Henry McMahon's pledge.

to be continued

Since: Jun 12

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#114147 Jan 8, 2014
Nevertheless, it is the intention of His Majesty's overnment to foster the establishment of a full measure of self government in Palestine. But they are of the opinion that, in the special circumstances of that country, this should be accomplished by gradual stages and not suddenly. The first step was taken when, on the institution of a Civil Administration, the nominated Advisory Council, which now exists, was established. It was stated at the time by the High Commissioner that this was the first step in the development of self governing institutions, and it is now proposed to take a second step by the establishment of a Legislative Council containing a large proportion of members elected on a wide franchise. It was proposed in the published draft that three of the members of this Council should be non official persons nominated by the High Commissioner, but representations having been made in opposition to this provision, based on cogent considerations, the Secretary of State is prepared to omit it. The legislative Council would then consist of the High Commissioner as President and twelve elected and ten official members. The Secretary of State is of the opinion that before a further measure of self government is extended to Palestine and the Assembly placed in control over the Executive, it would be wise to allow some time to elapse. During this period the institutions of the country will have become well established; its financial credit will be based on firm foundations, and the Palestinian officials will have been enabled to gain experience of sound methods of government. After a few years the situation will be again reviewed, and if the experience of the working of the constitution now to be established so warranted, a larger share of authority would then be extended to the elected representatives of the people.

The Secretary of State would point out that already the present administration has transferred to a Supreme Council elected by the Moslem community of Palestine the entire control of Moslem Religious endowments (Waqfs), and of the Moslem religious Courts. To this Council the Administration has also voluntarily restored considerable revenues derived from ancient endowments which have been sequestrated by the Turkish Government. The Education Department is also advised by a committee representative of all sections of the population, and the Department of Commerce and Industry has the benefit of the co operation of the Chambers of Commerce which have been established in the principal centres. It is the intention of the Administration to associate in an increased degree similar representative committees with the various Deparments of the Government.

The Secretary of State believes that a policy upon these lines, coupled with the maintenance of the fullest religious liberty in Palestine and with scrupulous regard for the rights of each community with reference to its Holy Places, cannot but commend itself to the various sections of the population, and that upon this basis may be built up that a spirit of cooperation upon which the future progress and prosperity of the Holy Land must largely depend.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/brwh1...

Since: Jun 12

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#114148 Jan 8, 2014
Zioni wrote:
<quoted text>
Without Balfour there may still have been Israel, you are making assumptions again.
A: Now who is making assumptions by stating may have been?

52 countries of the LoN agreed to the Mandate

A:Yes and of them six were coerced; into changing their vote and how many abstentions were there again? Why did they need to extend the time for the voting???

Again you seem ignore the 1920-30's. The immigration restrictions for Jews began in the early 1920's. So your claims are false.

A:Where have I ignored the 1920's I mentioned the restrictions documented in the white papers which were written and available in 1922

Its section 2 not 11.
A: Yes I know, you clearly don't recognize Roman numerals

The Mandate clearly states that there will be a Jewish homeland, and there is specifically no mention of political rights in the document unlike the other Mandate documents which speak of political rights for the locals.

A; It didn't need to mention them as they were already living there, the Jews weren't

I never said it was necessarily fair.
Not saying the Arabs had no reason to be upset. Basically the Arabs of W.Palestine got the short end of the stick while their brothers, uncles, nephews, cousins in the surrounding lands got everything while the other groups in the region got nothing

A; You're dam right it wasn't fair

The Brits didn't give away land and until the 1940 war Jews bought the land they used.
Britain actually according to the Mandate were required to encourage Jewish settlement on public lands. Most of this arable public land was given to Arabs often new immigrants themselves.

A: It doesn't matter they had no right to give it away at all

The Mandate allowed Britain to cut off 80% of Palestine (Trans-Jordan) from the land.
A; Which was also wrong

It was the Jews spoken about in the Mandate and the Mandate also speaks of helping the Jews set up the institutions necessary for self government.

A: So why does that mean that the mandate didn't apply to the indigenous Arabs who lived there
So why than did the Arab attacks on Jewish civilians start 2 decades before the time you
speak of
A I have already explained that and you continue to ignore it. The white paper which was written in 1922

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114149 Jan 8, 2014
Zioni wrote:
<quoted text>
You keep saying simple fact but Israel is still a democracy with equal rights. Whatever some Rabbi said doesn't change that. Palestine Arabs can sit in Parliament and call for the destruction of Israel, go on the Maamara which was illegal as they were trying to break a legal blockade, and nothing happens to them. Even according to the UN Palmer Report.
We don't have political correctness BS in this country and unless you are inciting violence its a free for all. If you are inciting violence you will get targeted more if you are right wing than left probably cos' the media is left.
More assumptions. Rabbi Ovadia Yosef was a great scholar of Judaism and was respected by many in the country. The large majority of people who didn't go to the funeral either don't agree or laugh at him. I know though that most of the people I know who were at the funeral would never agree with the extreme comments he made but respected him for his other side.
You will find that most religious leaders are bigoted or prejudice whether they say it to the world, community or family. That is religion as it automatically discriminates against others.
Where is your evidence and who is it that you are claiming states this??

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114150 Jan 8, 2014
Zioni wrote:
<quoted text>
We are talking about today and the current Palestinian leadership who call for the extermination of Israelis, end of Israel, supply arms funds and training for terrorism against Israeli civilians.
You refuse to condemn the current Palestinian leadership, and refuse to accept that these people are not interested in peace and admit to being terrorists.
The same British who labeled Begin a terrorist, supported numerous Arab massacres against Jews on the land during the Mandate.
The same British who labeled Begin a terrorist are paying the salaries of mass murderers being released by Israel on good will, they also pay for the hatred in Palestinian schools, and fund numerous organizations who advocate the destruction of Israel. So not the best example.
So don't be the one to throw the first stone or it will come right back at you.
I have never denied that Zionists carried out terrorist attacks, they even carried out attacks against their own. You are the one who denies it was the Arabs who began the attrocities on the land against the indigneous Jews.
Nope you are, not me, we are talking about terrorists full stop and how Israel let them back onto the streets and prior Israeli terrorists. You have yet to get back to me on the two examples that I gave you. They don't need to be bes,t just your common home grown terrorists Also you have yet to get back to me re the 1977 anti proselytizing law that was introduced into a democratic country in 1977. You continue to deflect just like you accuse me of doing so go figure. BTW try and use your own quotes instead of mine

Since: Jun 12

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#114151 Jan 8, 2014
What cowards some on here are, hiding behind anonymity. They don't have the balls to express their points of view for all to see but they judge me. They are craven cowards who are to be pitied
cartooni

Santa Monica, CA

#114153 Jan 8, 2014
PeterSmokepolesake wrote:
<quoted text>
'Isreal haters'? that's a new one .. what does this particular crock of shit mean then pastry-too??
get beat up by that marauding gang of london street jews, yet ?

will i wish them better luck, for 2014.
cartooni

Santa Monica, CA

#114154 Jan 8, 2014
Sheilaa wrote:
What cowards some on here are, hiding behind anonymity. They don't have the balls to express their points of view for all to see but they judge me. They are craven cowards who are to be pitied
hahahaha really... you give a sh!t ?

cant you get otto to console you during these tough times ?

Go IDF IAF Mossad and ... those Kooky Zionists

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114155 Jan 9, 2014
cartooni wrote:
<quoted text>hahahaha really... you give a sh!t ?
cant you get otto to console you during these tough times ?
Go IDF IAF Mossad and ... those Kooky Zionists
This is the extend of your "intelligence" on this and other threads
<quote "cartooni>

"no one is looking to bang tongans... except maybe in football... bash bash bang, then MAYBE, you'll get a woman if you sign the big contract... if you havent impregnated one befoe you sign on the line....
except for maybe Troy Polamalu and maybe that seahawk one....
I dont do savages.
but i'll gladly meet Faith on your sheithole threads.... and join the fun "

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114156 Jan 9, 2014
* extent
Kantara2009

Turkey

#114157 Jan 9, 2014
Uzi wrote:
<quoted text>
Hello nazi shitstain, how u doing with Gibraltar and the Falkland Island among other places that U so conveniently ha ha "obtained"????? hahahaha hahahahha nazi shit.
...doing fine with both places,and the nearest thing to a nazi is your boy who should have gone the same way as his brother in Entebe.
Zioni

Kfar Saba, Israel

#114159 Jan 9, 2014
Sheilaa wrote:
<quoted text>
Its section 2 not 11.
A: Yes I know, you clearly don't recognize Roman numerals
The Mandate clearly states that there will be a Jewish homeland, and there is specifically no mention of political rights in the document unlike the other Mandate documents which speak of political rights for the locals.
A; It didn't need to mention them as they were already living there, the Jews weren't
......
It was the Jews spoken about in the Mandate and the Mandate also speaks of helping the Jews set up the institutions necessary for self government.
A: So why does that mean that the mandate didn't apply to the indigenous Arabs who lived there
So why than did the Arab attacks on Jewish civilians start 2 decades before the time you
speak of
A I have already explained that and you continue to ignore it. The white paper which was written in 1922
You clearly don't recognize numbers as you posted it as 11 not II.

So than why do the Syria and Mesopotamia Mandate speak of political rights for the locals if it was, as you claim, obvious?

If the Mandate was Political for the local Arabs than why is their SPECIFICALLY not mention of their political rights? At the same time it speaks of their civil and religious rights and also Jewish political rights in other lands.

You have been claimed since the begining that it was the Jews who started the violence, are you now admitting you were wrong??

It was the INDIGENOUS Jewish population that were massacred in Jerusalem, Hebron and other places so to blame immigration is ridiculous.

The White paper clearly shows British intentions from the begining and they were not pro-Jewish state.
Zioni

Kfar Saba, Israel

#114160 Jan 9, 2014
Sheilaa wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope you are, not me, we are talking about terrorists full stop and how Israel let them back onto the streets and prior Israeli terrorists. You have yet to get back to me on the two examples that I gave you. They don't need to be bes,t just your common home grown terrorists Also you have yet to get back to me re the 1977 anti proselytizing law that was introduced into a democratic country in 1977. You continue to deflect just like you accuse me of doing so go figure. BTW try and use your own quotes instead of mine
As usual you try to change the subject.

Only those who intentionally targeted civilians were terrorists. You seem unable to differentiate.
You refuse to condemn the current Palestinian leadership, and refuse to accept that these people are not interested in peace and admit to being terrorists.

I have never denied that Zionists carried out terrorist attacks, they even carried out attacks against their own. You are the one who denies it was the Arabs who began the atrocities on the land against the indigenous Jews.

What examples you keep making general statements or implications of people.

I did reply to you
proselytizing is not illegal in Israel just certain ways of proselytizing.

II have no interest whether Jewish, Christian, Muslim etc to preach to me. So I would say harassment of passers by or turning up on my doorstop is not something I want, like or need.

Your quotes???

Will you Agree that Abbas is a terrorist and so are much of the Palestinian leadership???
Will you condemn them and many Western countries who pay for the antisemitism (can't ask you to condemn anti-Zionism) and calls to kill Jews coming from numerous parts of Palestinians society?
Do you agree with Europe paying the salaries of mass murderers, especially when they often don't even work?
cartooni

Santa Monica, CA

#114161 Jan 9, 2014
PeterSmokesPoleSake wrote:
<quoted text>
We know how you wish Jews exact violence on all innocents Ratty including the children of Gaza ... What's new Rat-arse? What's new is violent Jews and their mason devil worshippers here will have to kill me next time and that won't happen.... Now go Ratty .. go find some pleasant shit for lunch munch, Fanny.
fcuk Gaza.... all of it.... what they need is more civilized settlements, less fcuking islamic scum... Go bulldozers.

as for their stupid perverted kids, mostly the males.... they blow up so quick.... fortunately.
ocxz

Sainte-clotilde, Reunion

#114163 Jan 9, 2014
cartooni wrote:
<quoted text>fcuk Gaza.... all of it.... what they need is more civilized settlements, less fcuking islamic scum... Go bulldozers.
as for their stupid perverted kids, mostly the males.... they blow up so quick.... fortunately.
civilized settlements with palestinians, because the zionist savages that came in the 1940's are such a cancer spread.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114164 Jan 9, 2014
Zioni wrote:
<quoted text>
You clearly don't recognize numbers as you posted it as 11 not II.
So than why do the Syria and Mesopotamia Mandate speak of political rights for the locals if it was, as you claim, obvious?
If the Mandate was Political for the local Arabs than why is their SPECIFICALLY not mention of their political rights? At the same time it speaks of their civil and religious rights and also Jewish political rights in other lands.
You have been claimed since the begining that it was the Jews who started the violence, are you now admitting you were wrong??
It was the INDIGENOUS Jewish population that were massacred in Jerusalem, Hebron and other places so to blame immigration is ridiculous.
The White paper clearly shows British intentions from the begining and they were not pro-Jewish state

.
That is how the number one 1 shows up on my laptop. The only way I could have got around that would have been by using the letter l. I thought that you'd have been smart enough to recognize that that was what I meant

Under the league mandate system , the terms of the mandates did not involve any cession of territory or transfer of sovereignty to the mandatories. The formal objective of the League of Nations Mandate system was to administer parts of the defunct Ottoman Empire, which had been in control of the Middle East since the 16th century, "until such time as they are able to stand alone.

Article 22 (4) provided that certain communities formerly belonging to the Turkish empire "have reached a state of development where their existence as independent nations can be provisionally recognized. The majority of the indigenous people living in Palestine at that time were Arabs. These mandates became known as class A mandates of which Palestine was one that was awarded to Britain in 1922.

Mandatories were subject to the overall jurisdiction of the League of Nations council which in turn delegated supervision of the mandatory administration to a Permanent Mandatory Commission which consisted of 10 member of who the majority were nationals of non-mandatory states

The mandates included extensive protection to the indigenous peoples of the mandated territory. If any dispute arose concerning the interpretation of the mandate the dispute was to be submitted to the Permanent court of International Justice

The British government did not do this and instead handed the entire problem over to the UN General Assembly which agreed to the Partition Resolution in 1947. This was never implemented

In relation to the mandate concerning Palestine UN Charter article 80(1) made it clear that the term of the mandate remained in effect pending their placement under the UN trusteeship system

The League of Nations covenant had already provisionally recognized the Palestinian people as an independent nation, which recognition is still entitled to legal effect under the conservatory clause found in the UN Charter.

In relation to the violence by the Jews I was referring to the attacks and dispossession of the Arabs prior to 1947/48. The Arabs themselves did initiate violence against the Jews and where hostile over

T o be continued

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114165 Jan 9, 2014
The only way it is a democracy is in your dreams. The reality is far different. There is not only discrimination against Christians and Arabs but also Mizrahim Jews. There is discrimination in land ownership, education, unemployment and mean income. At the top of the ladder are the Ashkenazims, followed by the Mizrahim and then at the bottom of the rung the Arabs

Why does the state own 90% of all land in Israel. You still haven't explained why a democratic country would have anti proselytizing laws. I have already given you examples of how Christians have been harassed and intimidated because of it.

Read about land regime and social relations in Israel by:

Alexander (Sandy) Kedar

University of Haifa - Faculty of Law

Oren Yiftachel

Ben-Gurion University of the Negev - Department of Geography and Environmental Development

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm...

I fully expect to get back to me again stating these are also self hating Jews

Why is it so difficult for non-Jews to obtain citizenship and yet it is given freely to Jews?

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#114166 Jan 9, 2014
Zioni wrote:
As usual you try to change the subject.

A: Not at all I have been quite specific about Israel releasing the terrorists and mentioning just a few who were Israeli terrorists such as Begin, Shamir and Sharon

Only those who intentionally targeted civilians were terrorists. You seem unable to differentiate.

A So now you are saying the examples I gave did not target civilians? They later became leaders in Israel

You refuse to condemn the current Palestinian leadership, and refuse to accept that these people are not interested in peace and admit to being terrorists

A: I'll do that what you condemn what the Israeli terrorists did
.
I have never denied that Zionists carried out terrorist attacks, they even carried out attacks against their own. You are the one who denies it was the Arabs who began the atrocities on the land against the indigenous Jews.

A. I have stated above I'll do that when you also condemn what Israeli leaders did

What examples you keep making general statements or implications of people.
I did reply to you

proselytizing is not illegal in Israel just certain ways of proselytizing.

A: Why should there be any restrictions on how people proselytize?

II have no interest whether Jewish, Christian, Muslim etc to preach to me. So I would say harassment of passers by or turning up on my doorstop is not something I want, like or need.

A: Sorry but that is not a good enough excuse for a democratic country that allegedly believes in free speech. You keep deflecting from the fact that a so called "democratic country has an anti proselytizing law.brought in 1977. I have also provided examples of how it is being used against Christians to intimidate and harrass them
Your quotes???
A: Never mind

Will you Agree that Abbas is a terrorist and so are much of the Palestinian leadership???
Will you condemn them and many Western countries who pay for the antisemitism (can't ask you to condemn anti-Zionism) and calls to kill Jews coming from numerous parts of Palestinians society?

A; I'll do that when you admit that Israeli terrorists that dispossessed&#8206; people from their land and home's then went on to become leaders in the government of Israel. As far as condemning the western countries go they are no worse or better than the countries that provided funds to Israel from Jewish National Funds, America, Europe etc who provided them with money to able to carry out their dastardly deeds

Since: Jun 12

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#114167 Jan 9, 2014
Based on UN Charter article 80(1) and League Covenant article 22 (4), America, Israel and all state parties to the UN Charter have already provisionally recognized the Palestinian people as an independent nation whether they realize it or not.

Further to the above, article 103 of the UN Charter provides that in the event of a conflict between the terms of the Charter and the obligations under any other international agreement, the obligations under the Charter shall prevail

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