Ambulance, fire levy sparks debate in Ohio

Feb 1, 2013 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: EMS1

CLEARCREEK TWP., Ohio - Trustees in Clearcreek Twp. - third among 11 Warren County townships in net property taxes - disagree about asking voters for an additional 4.5-mill levy to fund fire protection and ambulance services.

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1,501 - 1,520 of 2,037 Comments Last updated Friday Aug 22
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Englewood, OH

#1510 May 5, 2013
voting no on 3 wrote:
The vote NO people are putting out a phony flyer with no name on it. They are sticking it to mailboxes all over. Thanks for helping us wake up the neighborhood.
Jack, are you looking in the mirror again?????
Wake Up Call

Springboro, OH

#1511 May 5, 2013
notgreedy wrote:
Vote Yes On 3 For Community
may 4, 2013 by davidebowman
What makes a great community? A community you are proud to call home. To me the answer to this question begins with fundamental public services like strong schools, clean and safe parks, and well trained, equipped, and staffed police, fire, and emergency services.....,
Communities are about choices....... I am choosing to vote yes on issue 3. I am choosing to invest in my community.
-Dave Bowman-
Dave, I appreciate your remarks. I had to cut out a lot of your comments. But that doesn't mean that I'm callous and don't care. I'm especially sensitive to your remarks about your child and emergency services. I too credit my son's life to first responders. When I was an Air Force nobody who brought my son to an AF clinic with breathing difficulty, a med tech accurately and swiftly diagnosed him with a dire emergency. Today, he is larger than me and larger than life and I thank God every day that my son is by my side. He is now a Life Scout and I am so proud of him.

One of the things that's most important in this debate, and has proven to be the most elusive, is to keep an objective, non-emotional view. Clearly impossible if you look through the posts.

My analysis as an expert in the field of logistics management is that we as taxpayers have been paying for bad decisions, mis-management of funds, over-spending, and lack of management discipline over our spending and prioritization of needs versus wants.

It's a common mistake made by managers who are well-meaning but do not realize that the 1 dollar they spend today on the new gizmo or new fire station with cost them 50 dollars over the life of the purchase they just made.

If we as taxpayers reward this kind of mismanagement, lack of discipline, and ignorance of life cycle cost, then we as Clearcreek Township residents will always be paying for the next cost increase.

These cost increases are totally predictable. In fact, the levy question that you are voting on this Tuesday is a FOREVER tax increase. It does NOT expire in 5 or 10 years. You will be signing a BLANK CHECK to the Fire Department if you vote yes.

Throwing more money at a problem does not work. Let the Fire Department solve their spending problem before we as taxpayers just give them more.

This advice is coming from a guy who has indeed "Been There and Done That." My beloved first responders saved my son, but they did not need advanced sensors, technology, and all of those other "jazzy" gizmos to save him. My son needed an EMS who could recognize a med emergency, not one with all the "stuff" bought for him.
GlockMedic

Dayton, OH

#1512 May 5, 2013
Out and out lie. Anything from the Pro Levy has proper BOE required information. The no people are getting desperate. I have pic, just don't know how to post it here.
voting no on 3 wrote:
The vote yes people are putting out a phony flyer with no name on it. They are sticking it to mailboxes all over. Thanks for helping us wake up the neighborhood. You have inflamed many of the township residents. Everytime we tell them about your " secret " levy next Tuesday they see red. The vote no people are waking up the masses. We all will see you Tuesday at the polls.
My fanily is voting NO on your pay increase.
Only Facts

Englewood, OH

#1513 May 5, 2013
Issue 3

The Clearcreek Fire District is seeking a 4.5 mill operating levy during the May 7, 2013 election. The levy appears as "Issue 3" on the ballot. This will only be the second levy in the past 26 years, and the current 10 year levy has lasted 12 years.

This levy will support the continued operation of your local fire department at current service levels. In order to keep the millage as low as possible, no additional or expanded services (such as new fire stations or positions) are proposed through this levy.

The Clearcreek Fire District is currently operating on funding from a 2001 tax levy. In 2001, the department served approximately 21,017 people and responded to 1,584 emergencies.

Today, the department serves approximately 30,265 people, which is an increase of 44% from 2001. Crews responded to 2,735 emergencies in 2012, up 73% from 2001 counts. The fact is simple - the fire department cannot provide adequate service to a steadily growing population experiencing an increasing number of emergencies with the same funding level used in 2001.

In 2001 the Clearcreek Fire District promised not to come back to voters for additional funds for at least ten years. That promise has been kept, and as we look forward we commit to the voters not to seek additional operating funds for a period of at least eight years if this levy is approved.
 
The Clearcreek Fire District provides fire response and emergency medical (ambulance) services to the citizens of Springboro and Clearcreek Township. Our coverage area is over 50 square miles and our firefighters have an average response time of 4.54 minutes.

The Clearcreek Fire District employs only dual-certified firefighters and emergency medical technicians, providing the community with the most capable emergency force possible.

The Clearcreek Fire District applied for and was awarded over $1.3 million in federal grants during 2012. These funds allowed for the purchase of necessary equipment without having to spend local tax dollars.

www.YesTo3.com
FD Man

Youngstown, OH

#1514 May 6, 2013
The need for the new fire levy stems from increasing operational costs. When the last fire levy was passed in 2001, the cost of a gallon of diesel fuel was $1.86. Today that cost has increased to $3.43.
FD Man

Youngstown, OH

#1515 May 6, 2013
The Clearcreek Fire District responds to an average of eight emergency calls every day.
FD Man

Youngstown, OH

#1516 May 6, 2013
On May 7, 2013 voters in Springboro and
Clearcreek Township will cast their ballots on Issue 3, an operating levy for the Clearcreek Fire District.
Below, you can see what is being proposed and the actual ballot language.

Issue 3
The Clearcreek Fire District is seeking a 4.5 mill operating levy during the May 7, 2013 election. The levy appears as "Issue 3" on the ballot. This will only be the second levy in the past 26 years, and the current 10 year levy has lasted 12 years.
This levy will support the continued operation of your local fire department at current service levels. In order to keep the millage as low as possible, no additional or expanded services (such as new fire stations or positions) are proposed through this levy.
The Clearcreek Fire District is currently operating on funding from a 2001 tax levy. In 2001, the department served approximately 21,017 people and responded to 1,584 emergencies.
Today, the department serves approximately 30,265 people, which is an increase of 44% from 2001. Crews responded to 2,735 emergencies in 2012, up 73% from 2001 counts. The fact is simple - the fire department cannot provide adequate service to a steadily growing population experiencing an increasing number of emergencies with the same funding level used in 2001.
In 2001 the Clearcreek Fire District promised not to come back to voters for additional funds for at least ten years. That promise has been kept, and as we look forward we commit to the voters not to seek additional operating funds for a period of at least eight years if this levy is approved.

Ballot Language
The language of the ballot measure is as follows:
Issue 3 - Proposed Tax Levy (Additional) Clearcreek Township and City of Springboro, Montgomery and Warren Counties
A majority affirmative vote is required for passage.
An additional tax for the benefit of Clearcreek Township and City of Springboro, Montgomery and Warren Counties, for the purpose of providing and maintaining fire apparatus, appliances, buildings, or sites therefore, or sources of water supply and materials therefore, or the establishment and maintenance of lines of fire alarm telegraph, or the payment of permanent, part time, or volunteer firefighters or firefighting companies to operate the same, including the payment of the firefighter employer's contribution required under section 742.34 of the revised code, or the purchase of ambulance equipment, or the provision of ambulance, paramedic, or other emergency medical services operated by a fire department or fire fighting company at a rate not to exceed four and five-tenths (4.5) mills for each one dollar of valuation which amounts to forty-five cents ($0.45) for each one hundred dollars of valuation, for a continuing period of time commencing in 2013, first due in calendar year 2014.
[] FOR THE TAX LEVY
[] AGAINST THE TAX LEVY
You can also click here to see a sample ballot image
from the Warren County Board of Elections
FD Man

Youngstown, OH

#1517 May 6, 2013
Funny how this keeps coming back to some mysterious pay raises, conspiracy theories and greed. Actually that is all made up. My paycheck is smaller this year than last for starters, and will be even smaller next year.

This levy is about gizmo's and gadgets this levy is plain and simply going to keep all three stations open and all of our trucks that we currently staff, staffed. We are not building any new stations, we are not creating any new positions. This levy is just to maintain the current level of service that we have.

We will use the levy to replace some equipment over time that is beyond its servicable life. This isn't about having something new and shiny, it is about being able to still get replacement parts and following the rules and standards of Emergency Medical Services and Fire Department National Guidelines.

We are actually understaffed accoring to national guidelines, and we have been for year, but we work our tails off to make it work because we care about the community. We sacrifice new equipment for the sake of having the people to respond to your emergency. We understand that all the equipment in the world doesn't mean a thing if there aren't people to drive the truck to your home.

The fact of the matter is this. I live in this community and I work in this community. I am invested in this community and volunteer often in the community. I care about the citizens I protect, even the people spreading hate and lies about me. I will provide them the same level of care as anyone else. But I can't do that if we don't pass this levy, because my job will be on the chopping block. I can't help you, if you don't help me. Its not scare tactics, its just facts...

Thats why our firefighters have been going door to door for weeks and hit over 8,000 homes in the community. Thats why we donated our money to the campaign to fund posters, flyers, etc. Thats why we came in off duty to man a booth at the spring fling to educate the public. Thats why off duty we made phone calls, sent emails, created facebook posts and talked to you guys on here daily for months to make sure we were able to get your help so we could help you.

Help Us Help You

Vote YES to 3 on Tuesday.

Vote YES to protect Springboro and Clearcreek Township.

www.YesTo3.com
Just Watching

Cleveland, OH

#1518 May 6, 2013
FD Man wrote:
The Clearcreek Fire District responds to an average of eight emergency calls every day.
Same as you did in 2010

Look at the annual report issued by the fire department to put it in perspective.

2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls

After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money

2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls

Vote NO on Issue 3
Learn the Facts

United States

#1519 May 6, 2013
Folks, the opposition has resorted to making up numbers. The truth is easily gleaned from the fire district annual reports posted for your convenience at the www.yesto3.com website. Take a look for yourself, and VOTE YES On 3!!
Just Watching

Cleveland, OH

#1520 May 6, 2013
The Truth is they already spent the money before asking the taxpayers. They hired 12 full time firefighters and 3 full time managers using temporary SAFER grants. Now that the money is running out they need us to cover their collective heinies.

http://www.clearcreektownship.com/FireEMS/Fir...

See the annual report put out by the fire department in 2011 and 2012 regarding calls, response times, simultaneous alarms and major actions for each year

Misleading statements in respect to the fact the levy was passed to deal with that growth in 2001, are stock and trade. Since we put in effect the proceeds of that levy into two new firehouses, new equipment, and needed staffing, the changes in need are today minimal.

http://www.clearcreektownship.com/FireEMS/Fir ...

Fire Department calls are up but 5.4% from 2005 ( the first year all of the improvements of the 2001 levy were first in place) to 2012.

Requests for Service

2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls

After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money

2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls

If they are as understaffed after the stealth increase in the department of 35% in 2011 and 2012, how many more men and women do they think it will take to handle the same load they have been effectively handling the past 8 years?

Half truths, distortion of the facts, emotional blackmail, bad management, bloat, and they still have $7,000,000 in surplus from the current levy.

Vote NO on Issue 3
FD Man wrote:
We are not building any new stations, we are NOT CREATING ANY NEW POSITIONS. This levy is just to maintain the current level of service that we have.

We will use the levy to replace some equipment over time that is beyond its servicable life. This isn't about having something new and shiny, it is about being able to still get replacement parts and following the rules and standards of Emergency Medical Services and Fire Department National Guidelines.

We are actually understaffed accoring to national guidelines, and we have been for year, but we work our tails off to make it work because we care about the community.
On the Front Line

Youngstown, OH

#1521 May 6, 2013
Just Watching wrote:
<quoted text>
Same as you did in 2010
Look at the annual report issued by the fire department to put it in perspective.
2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls
After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money
2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls
Vote NO on Issue 3
Your analysis concerning the SAFER Grant is not correct.

With the SAFER Grant the Fire District hired 12 operational level Firefighter / Paramedics and one (1) front line operational supervisor, a Lieutenant who replaced another Lieutenant that had been lost to attrition because of retirement during 2008. These 13 individuals were hired during late May / early June 2011.

The Fire District did not hire any new administrative managers with the SAFER Grant. Our administrative management staff is the same number now as it was during 2008.
Puppy love

United States

#1522 May 6, 2013
Www.yesto3.com

If you vote no to this levy you hate puppy and babies.
On the Front Line

Youngstown, OH

#1523 May 6, 2013
Just Watching wrote:
The Truth is they already spent the money before asking the taxpayers. They hired 12 full time firefighters and 3 full time managers using temporary SAFER grants. Now that the money is running out they need us to cover their collective heinies.
http://www.clearcreektownship.com/FireEMS/Fir...
See the annual report put out by the fire department in 2011 and 2012 regarding calls, response times, simultaneous alarms and major actions for each year
Misleading statements in respect to the fact the levy was passed to deal with that growth in 2001, are stock and trade. Since we put in effect the proceeds of that levy into two new firehouses, new equipment, and needed staffing, the changes in need are today minimal.
http://www.clearcreektownship.com/FireEMS/Fir ...
Fire Department calls are up but 5.4% from 2005 ( the first year all of the improvements of the 2001 levy were first in place) to 2012.
Requests for Service
2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls
After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money
2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls
If they are as understaffed after the stealth increase in the department of 35% in 2011 and 2012, how many more men and women do they think it will take to handle the same load they have been effectively handling the past 8 years?
Half truths, distortion of the facts, emotional blackmail, bad management, bloat, and they still have $7,000,000 in surplus from the current levy.
Vote NO on Issue 3
<quoted text>
We are in fact understaffed in the based upon the provisions specified by the National Fire Protection Association (NFPA) 1710 Standard for the Organization and Deployment of Fire Suppression Operations, Emergency Medical Operations, and Special Operations to the Public by Career Fire Departments. NFPA 1710 is considered to be the baseline industry standard for fire departments such as ours.

The question is really simple. What level of service do you want? If you want a well trained, properly equipped, and staffed fire department---- that costs money. Simplified this can be broken into three basic categories with three basic principles.

If you want Good and Fast it is not going to be very cheap

If you want Good and Cheap it is not going to be very fast

If you want Cheap and Fast it is not going to very good
Just Watching

Cleveland, OH

#1524 May 6, 2013
Truth is, none of this stuff justifies another additional new money levy.

Truth is the 2001 levy keeps chugging on, we have about the same number of calls as we did in 2005, until they decided to tap SAFER federal grants and add 12 new firefighters and 3 new managers we were always in the black.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B0_emPjNYG-pN...
Page 8 for criteria,(we had no lay offs, no one in imminent danger of layoff, that leaves new hires)

Mostly obvious truth, who doesn't support the fire department or emergency services?

Lots of half truths about the effects of the current levy, they like to give you the pre 2001 stats that got that levy passed as a baseline, not the ones that demonstrate what happened after all the improvements were made with that money by 2005.

Simultaneous alarms are up 15% since 2005, look it up in the fire department annual report.

http://www.clearcreektownship.com/FireEMS/Fir...

Requests for service can be found there as well.

This is a true statement, however it is misleading in respect to the fact the levy was passed to deal with that growth in 2001. Since we put in effect the proceeds of that levy into two new firehouses, new equipment, and needed staffing, the changes in need are today minimal.

http://www.clearcreektownship.com/FireEMS/Fir ...

Fire Department calls are up but 5.4% from 2005 ( the first year all of the improvements were first in place) to 2012.

Requests for Service

2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls

After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money

2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls

Truth is we don't need to spend more money on an additional levy, we just need to manage our budget within our means.

Truth is we have a $7,000,000 plus surplus in our fire fund, built up over the course of the current levy.

Truth is we have a $1,000,000 plus surplus in our ambulance fund.

Vote No on Issue 3
Fact not Fiction wrote:


The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH is that the fire department has an expense budget of $6.4 million per year, but only brings in $4.4 million. This leaves a deficit of almost $2 million per year, which is obviously not sustainable.
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
The TRUTH
Just Watching

Cleveland, OH

#1525 May 6, 2013
Guess where your deficit really came from?

New hires purchased with a FREE federal money grant from the Department of Homeland Security. Only trouble with FREE money is that it often disappears, just like now.

12 new firefighters with 3 new managers and now they want us to pick up the slack.

Fire Department calls are up but 5.4% from 2005 ( the first year all of the improvements were first in place) to 2012.

Requests for Service

2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls

After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money

2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls

Vote No on Issue 3 make them live with the same budget constraints everyone else has.

Vote No on Issue 3

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#1526 May 6, 2013
another wade scam wrote:
bewteen wade, agenbroad and that new township trustee jason...let them pick up the bill on a new fire station if they want it so bad. I am voting no.
Again miss information NO NEW STATION

www.YesTo3.com
On the Front Line

Youngstown, OH

#1527 May 6, 2013
Just Watching wrote:
Guess where your deficit really came from?
New hires purchased with a FREE federal money grant from the Department of Homeland Security. Only trouble with FREE money is that it often disappears, just like now.
12 new firefighters with 3 new managers and now they want us to pick up the slack.
Fire Department calls are up but 5.4% from 2005 ( the first year all of the improvements were first in place) to 2012.
Requests for Service
2005.....2589 calls
2006.....2629 calls
2007.....2792 calls
2008.....3035 calls
2009.....2731 calls
2010.....2795 calls
After they added 12 new full time firefighters and 3 new administrators with SAFER money
2011.....2897 calls
2012.....2735 calls
Vote No on Issue 3 make them live with the same budget constraints everyone else has.
Vote No on Issue 3
Hello and for the third time:

Your analysis concerning the SAFER Grant is not correct.

With the SAFER Grant the Fire District hired 12 operational level Firefighter / Paramedics and one (1) front line operational supervisor, a Lieutenant who replaced another Lieutenant that had been lost to attrition because of retirement during 2008. These 13 individuals were hired during late May / early June 2011.

The Fire District did not hire any new administrative managers with the SAFER Grant. Our administrative management staff is the same number now as it was during 2008.
Just Watching

Cleveland, OH

#1528 May 6, 2013
FD Man wrote:
The need for the new fire levy stems from increasing operational costs. When the last fire levy was passed in 2001, the cost of a gallon of diesel fuel was $1.86. Today that cost has increased to $3.43.
What percentage of your $5,000,000 budget does fuel consume?
Just Watching

Cleveland, OH

#1529 May 6, 2013
butch 129 wrote:
<quoted text>
Again miss information NO NEW STATION
www.YesTo3.com
That still does not justify a new money levy.

Vote No on Issue 3

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