King's legacy still cause of debate

King's legacy still cause of debate

There are 1090 comments on the USA Today story from Jan 19, 2014, titled King's legacy still cause of debate. In it, USA Today reports that:

It is a large legacy that looms over the past five decades, from the prophetic "I Have a Dream" speech delivered during the March on Washington to his last campaign taking a stand for underpaid black sanitation workers in Memphis, the city where he was slain.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at USA Today.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1059 Jun 24, 2014
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> Duh....the link is interesting, but irrelevant to the dispute currently on the table.
You said I need to study philosophy like Kwame Ture. Well, Kwame said Nkrumah was not a Marxist. Maybe you need to do the studying of hat Kwame said.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> At any rate, Nkrumahism is an a kind of Marxism in the African context
Funny how no knowledgeable person agrees with you on that one
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> As for the liberation of Africa from imperialism there could be no disagreement between King and Nkrumah. On that they agreed. But the philosophical idealism of King constitutes a different point of view vis-à-vis Nkrumahist materialism. And King's nearly unqualified commitment to nonviolence, both tactically and morally, clearly differed from Nkrumah, Fanon, Mandela, and others who were prepared at some point to take up arms against colonialism. And that's notwithstanding the fact that Nkrumah (and many others) at first resorted to nonviolent resistance.
Actually, Positive Action always prefer the non-violent path. But when the non-violent avenue is closed, there is no hesitation in pursuing the Armed Struggle. Nkrumahism is clear on this point. Malcolm said it best: by any means necessary.

But MLK was first and foremost a preacher and a minister. Like Gandhi, he avoided political activity. He was somewhat other-worldly, but I would not say absolutely other-worldly. Some of us are better at some things than others. We cannot all do the exact same thing. Somebody has to concentrate on religious affairs. Others on statecraft. King was not a statesman. Thus he had no need to deal with the political realities that Nkrumah had to deal with.
Nkrumah was also a minister. But politics called him into a more immediate reality here on earth.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> The same issue happened in South Africa when the fascistic repression convinced Nelson Mandela and others that the time of nonviolence had passed, while other members of ANC and some tried to hold onto nonviolence. There was NEVER a question about whether South Africa--indeed all of Africa--needed to be liberation. The question of HOW, by what methods was an issue.
Luthuli was a minister. I think h may have become weak minded or senile in his later years. He spent his life focused on non-violence. And when the war came, he did not seem to grasp or understand what it all meant.
American-Heretic

Huntington, WV

#1060 Jun 24, 2014
King had a great dream.. Obozo the Failed has a drone.......

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1061 Jun 24, 2014
Tell Conway to come join the Convention People's Party ( http://conventionpeoplesparty.org/ ), but leave all of his senseless violence and threatening and strong arm tactics baggage behind. We do not have any dictators in the CPP. We are all peaceful, democratic, and mutually respectful. We have some work for him to do, considering that he once had enough sense to work at a decent job. The CPP is 100% within the law. So he would have no problems there.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1062 Jun 24, 2014
American-Heretic wrote:
King had a great dream.. Obozo the Failed has a drone.......
I have a drone, this evening. I have a drone that one day, I might grow up and be a real man and not have to use drones as a phallus symbol. I have a drone this evening. I have a drone that I may impress my women by making them think I am worth a dam. I have a drone...

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1064 Jun 25, 2014
Howard teaches its student the skills of the bullshyter. But bullshyt skills will not win out in this brave new world of ideas. The world is a village. We as Africans cannot isolate ourselves and avoid interacting with the rest of the world and competing with the rest of world no matter how much we may desire to do so. So we had better star preparing ourselves to face the world, engage in it, compete with it, and defeat others and win the competition of ideas. One idea is that Africans are inferior. Howard certainly offers an inferior education. And when students come from Howard with such an education, everywhere they go, they will be inferior to others and will be perceived as such. Thus, what those idiots like Channcellor Williams afre doing to the minds of youth is extremely harmful. This is why they did not want me there. I would have NEVER accepted that crap.

One concrete example: the computer equipment in the main library is extremely outdated and inferior. Of course the human example of Chancellor Williams is far more harmful. I personally know some scholar so-called there who continue Williams' inferior behavior. But I will not name them in the hopes that they will still learn and correct themselves. But they have to first of all be honest men and women. Without honesty and a deep desire to spread truth, there is no hope for any of them.

In Brown vs Board of Education, it was found that segregation distorts the mind. That is why the Supreme Court decided that to impose segregated education, and Howard is a segregated school, was a crime that must be remedied. Stop distorting and destroying the minds of our youth.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#1065 Jun 25, 2014
Abdurratln wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah. Dr. King was middle class.
<quoted text>
Poor middle class...
<quoted text>
Now that he is dead, punk like you really have abandoned everything he ever stood for. Occupy will never make up for what you have already destroyed in this community. When you came out of college, the AAPRP consisted of nearly 1,000 members. Now, there is probably not 50 active members. What caused THAT? I was nowhere around. I was too busy fixing the personal problems you dogs created for me.
Dr. King was a middle class Black man, but with a much higher level of social consciousness than most middle class blacks of that time--or THIS time. If anyone is upholding the legacy of King it is I. Certainly not you. Indeed, I also hold suspect even your professed commitment to the ideals of Nkrumah.
And if you have personal problems they're most likely of your own making, especially if they are problems with women. I've never seen anyone arouse so much female hostility as you.

At any I was too young to take leadership when King died in order to perpetuate his legacy. But I am old enough now, and that's precisely what I'm doing.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#1066 Jun 25, 2014
Abdurratln wrote:
<quoted text>
You said I need to study philosophy like Kwame Ture. Well, Kwame said Nkrumah was not a Marxist. Maybe you need to do the studying of hat Kwame said.
<quoted text>
Funny how no knowledgeable person agrees with you on that one
<quoted text>
Actually, Positive Action always prefer the non-violent path. But when the non-violent avenue is closed, there is no hesitation in pursuing the Armed Struggle. Nkrumahism is clear on this point. Malcolm said it best: by any means necessary.
But MLK was first and foremost a preacher and a minister. Like Gandhi, he avoided political activity. He was somewhat other-worldly, but I would not say absolutely other-worldly. Some of us are better at some things than others. We cannot all do the exact same thing. Somebody has to concentrate on religious affairs. Others on statecraft. King was not a statesman. Thus he had no need to deal with the political realities that Nkrumah had to deal with.
Nkrumah was also a minister. But politics called him into a more immediate reality here on earth.
<quoted text>
Luthuli was a minister. I think h may have become weak minded or senile in his later years. He spent his life focused on non-violence. And when the war came, he did not seem to grasp or understand what it all meant.
Funny how many learned scholars (though probably no members of your cult) think it is OBVIOUS that Nkrumahism is a form of Marxism.

At any rate, I will not continue debating about Nkrumah in a thread on the legacy of Dr. King. For that only better enables you to deflect intelligent discussion from King legacy

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1067 Jun 25, 2014
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> Dr. King was a middle class Black man, but with a much higher level of social consciousness than most middle class blacks of that time--or THIS time.
Boy! That is an understatement. MLK was middle class by virtual of his position as a minister and advanced education. But he was never even close to being rich or anything like that. I saw the house he grew up in. It was rather small, wood frame house that would be less than $100,000 in today's market. What money there is the family has come since his death as a result of the Nobel Prize and the sell of some of his books, etc. So, his widow li=ved in half-million dollar house. I do not remember how she came to own that. But I do know that her children contributed to her ownership of it.

MLK's dad was a country preacher who worked more as a share dropper than as a preacher. I know the drill. A few extremely lucky ones made it as sharecroppers. But the whole sharecropper system was designed to keep the workers in near slavery.(Even the land owners often came close to starvation. a small garden or a couple of pigs is the only things they had to fall back on. Only the bankers and financiers made big money off that system.) My own parents were sharecroppers. And during hard-times, especially as mechanization took over farming, it was actually impossible to survive. Many people literally starved to death. American sharecropping 3-40 years ago was worse than anything to be seem in the world today in terms of extreme poverty in the Third World. In fact, in many of the countries we think of as poor, the people live better than Africans do in this country today.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> If anyone is upholding the legacy of King it is I. Certainly not you.
I do not claim to uphold MLK's ideals. I am on a different path altogether. But I love and respect him for the work he did. Gandhi freed India. And I certainly do not agree with some of what Gandhi stood for.

Savant wrote:
<quoted text>Indeed, I also hold suspect even your professed commitment to the ideals of Nkrumah.
Bytch, you do not know me and therefore have no right to say that. This is why you and I do not get along.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text>And if you have personal problems they're most likely of your own making, especially if they are problems with women.
No. The problems I referred to have long ago been solved. I was referring to how COINTELPRO disrupted my personal life.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> I've never seen anyone arouse so much female hostility as you.
I like having b-dagger hostility. I want it. What can a b-dagger do for me? NOTHING. So, I know they have hostility towards me. They are suppose to. I am against everything represent.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text>At any I was too young to take leadership when King died
You are still too young to lead me anywhere.

Savant wrote:
<quoted text>in order to perpetuate his legacy. But I am old enough now, and that's precisely what I'm doing.
No, my friend. You are not even a midget to MLK's giant. Humble yourself as a first and necessary step to wisdom. You are still too narrow minded, arrogant and ignorant. There is much for you to learn. But your egotism and arrogance has blinded you. Plus, your tunnel vision does not help. You know far too little about the great thinkers of history and their ideas. At a minimum, you need to know everything about Nkrumahism. Keep calling him a Marxist. I do not care. But he will never learn until you see how wrong you are on at least that point.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1068 Jun 25, 2014
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> Funny how many learned scholars (though probably no members of your cult)
No. I have no cults. I am a Muslim and do not agree with everything that many Muslim preachers preach. The thing about Islam is this: it is structured in such a way as to prevent cult formation for the most part. But NOI and the Moors certainly have cult qualities. You cannot help some fools no matter what. Their motivations are evil (we hate white people). As long as they are at that level, they will never rise above cult.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> think it is OBVIOUS that Nkrumahism is a form of Marxism.
I do not care what idiots like you "think". I know what Nkrumaah (and Kwame Ture) said. And that is what determines whether or not he was a Marxist. What other people said about him is secondary. He said she said. I also know what Brother Gamal Nkrumah said, what Sekou said, and what Samia said. None of them call him a Marxist. Plus, there is Francis. Those are his children. And they know him better than anyone else on earth. None his close friends, colleagues or comrades call him a Marxist. How could have been a Marxist when he was a Christian minister like MLK? Like Gandhi was a Hindu? Gandhi did not even accept socialism, much less Marxism. Nehru and India Gandhi accepted socialism but not Marxism.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text>At any rate, I will not continue debating about Nkrumah in a thread on the legacy of Dr. King.
Thank you.
Savant wrote:
<quoted text> For that only better enables you to deflect intelligent discussion from King legacy
I will not accept lies against Nkrumah or against MLK.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1069 Jun 25, 2014
People will notice that I can deal with that clown as long as he shows a minimum decency. I have not seem one post by attain to even the minimum level. Especially seems to be talking decent is when we must especially watch him closely because that when he is usually trying to slip in a few lies.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1070 Jun 25, 2014
I just hope debating that clown helps to lead to more ideological clarity in this community. And I know this is an uphill battle because they have been spreading ideological confusion and lies among us for decades, at least as far back as Chancellor Williams.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1071 Jun 25, 2014
As each one of us become clearer about what has been going on, please, take it upon yourself to enlighten at least one other person. Each one teach one. And before we know it, ideological clarity will take on a life of itself and spread throughout the African Nation. If they can balkanize Africa's largest country, Sudan, we can Unify the whole of Africa by each one of us teaching and clarifying the minds of just one other African at a time.

My biggest problem is I am extremely busy. I do not have the time that I would like to have to devote to this cause and this long hard struggle. Even now, I am stealing time that should be used on other work that is equally important if not more so.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1073 Jun 26, 2014
As the Civil Rights Movement enters a new stage, Pan-Africanism has become stronger than ever: http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/Print/6522.aspx

and http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/Print/6535.aspx

Insect Trust

Since: Aug 13

Location hidden

#1074 Jun 26, 2014
Abdul is boring us with his nonsense. Panafricanism, his cult, his idiotic and hysterical fear of gay people, of socialism, etc.

In fact the point here is that Dr. King's philosophy and praxis clearly show that he would be opposed to the way things are going in the U$A under the continuation of Reaganomics, the giving way of the country to corporate power, the reduction back to serfdom of the working population, etc.

Oh no, Abdul can't be bothered with all that, he's going to stay in the U$A babbling about Nkrumah. He doesn't follow allow with any of the people who won him the right to drink from the common water fountain... no, he's special, he's to esoteric for that, and besides, he's a Moslem, the ultimate in prissy elitism.

F U Abdul. Shut your filthy mouth and stop clogging this thread with your offal.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#1075 Jun 26, 2014
Insect Trust wrote:
Abdul is boring us with his nonsense. Panafricanism, his cult, his idiotic and hysterical fear of gay people, of socialism, etc.
In fact the point here is that Dr. King's philosophy and praxis clearly show that he would be opposed to the way things are going in the U$A under the continuation of Reaganomics, the giving way of the country to corporate power, the reduction back to serfdom of the working population, etc.
Oh no, Abdul can't be bothered with all that, he's going to stay in the U$A babbling about Nkrumah. He doesn't follow allow with any of the people who won him the right to drink from the common water fountain... no, he's special, he's to esoteric for that, and besides, he's a Moslem, the ultimate in prissy elitism.
F U Abdul. Shut your filthy mouth and stop clogging this thread with your offal.
I'm pretty much ignoring that pimp, that pseudo-Nkrumahist hustler. What interests me nowadays is something King and Nkrumah did share in common--the end of racism and class oppression, and liberation of Third World countries from poverty and imperialism. And his philosophy of COMMUNITY--the core of his ethical thought--which is markedly anti-capitalist and pro-socialist. Naturally, since capitalism is anti-community, antihuman, and a scourge upon the Earth.

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1076 Jun 26, 2014
Savant wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm pretty much ignoring that pimp, that pseudo-Nkrumahist hustler. What interests me nowadays is something King and Nkrumah did share in common--the end of racism and class oppression, and liberation of Third World countries from poverty and imperialism. And his philosophy of COMMUNITY--the core of his ethical thought--which is markedly anti-capitalist and pro-socialist. Naturally, since capitalism is anti-community, antihuman, and a scourge upon the Earth.
Ah! So Isee you have decided to attempt to divert attention away from one of our newest Pan-Africanist heroes. Huh? That does not surprise me at all, punk. You want to talk about anything and everything except Pan-Africanism because you know as well as I do that this will expose you as the shyster and charlatan and anti-Pan-Africanist, anti-Nkrumahist that you are. I know you are against both MLK and Nkrumah because you repeatedly and consistently lie on both of them. If you were in favor of what they stood for, you would tell the simple truth about them. If you ain't for me, you are against me. And your unprincipled smear campaigning and lying on me is further proof that you oppose not so much me as a personality but you oppose what I have consistentlt fought for all these decades. It is dogs like you who set me up for COINTELPRO. It would not surprise me if you are personally involved.

I a sand for Pan-Africanism. Even f you do not like me personally and I hope your perverted assss does not like me, you can still support or oppose Pan-Africanism which is an ideal and principle, not a personality. But your consistent attacks on me proves you oppose Pan-Africanism and you oppose MLK.

But for those who do not oppose Pan-Africanism, here are the links again: http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/Print/6522.aspx and http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/Print/6535.aspx

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1078 Jun 26, 2014

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1080 Jun 26, 2014

Since: Aug 09

Minneapolis, MN

#1082 Jun 26, 2014
It seems that POS has finally destroyed this thread with his stupid lies and deliberate confusion.

“Yes WE Can! Yes we Will!”

Since: Jul 07

Baltimore, Md.

#1084 Jul 13, 2014
Abdurratln wrote:
<quoted text>
MLK was leftist leaning. I do not question that. What I question is the theory that the left is worth a dang when it comes to helping Africans to solve our problems. Obama has been in there for 6 long miserable years. All he has done so far is "gay rights". He has done absolutely nothing for Africans, except lie out of both sides of his mouth. Meanwhile he murdered our leader Brother Qaddafi and lied on and disrespected Mandela at his funeral.
Is the left useful in helping African people solve their problems? We can debate that. But I suspect that a good number of African leftists think (or thought) so. Men like Nkrumah, Nyerere, Fanon, Cabral and others. And AA leftists like Dr. King, post-Mecca Malcolm X, Paul Robeson, Kwame Ture thought so.
And most of what Africans and African-Americans have achieved has been done under the leadership and in movements tat were at least moderately left-of-center.

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