Haler Heights safety watch tonight
DO the math

Pittsburgh, PA

#41 Aug 13, 2013
Take A Look wrote:
Low wages???? Are you kidding me??? Please go and check and see how much those police officers and firefighters are making in this city that is going broke!
What is your life or the lives of your children or family worth?

Think of it as insurance.

Everyone bitches about insurance payments and how high it is...but when the shit hits the fan, those same people want to get the most they.

No one really wants to live in McKeesport to begin with....how easy would it be to get good trained men and women who will risk their lives at half the going rate?

Riddle me THAT Batman.
DO the math

Pittsburgh, PA

#42 Aug 13, 2013
Over Staffed Port wrote:
<quoted text>

But to cut the fireman and policeman means a significant lost of votes.
It also means a significant "loss" of safety.
DO the math

Pittsburgh, PA

#43 Aug 13, 2013
Take A Look wrote:
Do you really think there is no end to the money gravey for you idiots? Ask the private sector unions how well that dumb thinking went.
There is a HUGE difference between the public/commercial sector and the public service sector.

Steelworkers , autoworkers, etc etc all work for COMMERCIAL enterprises...and the wages for those jobs are dictaed by what a company decides to pay etc....in the sake of profit, companies do and have screwed employees. Unions failed in the commercial sector because of greed on BOTH sides -- workers and employers.

Teachers, cops, firemen, etc. are ultimately paid by the government, which is in turn funded by the tax payer. And tax payers can be even cheaper than commercial companies. At least commercial companies realize that they need a good workforce to make a profit. Taxpers see cops, teachers, firemen etc as "overpaid, overstaffed loafers" until they themselves need the services. Everyone wants lil Jonny to read, but they want to pay that teacher as little as possible. Everyone wants the bad guys behind bars so that lil' Jonny is safe but no one wants to pay the guy who is risking his safety and life to GET the bad guy. And everyone wants their loved ones saved when they are standing outside their burning house at 2am but the day before they wanted to cut the pay to the same men who will run into that burning house to save their dumb ass dog or lil Jonny.

And the government that is in charge of paying them will always kiss the asses of the public and go for lower and lower wages for public servants so that they themselves can stay in office and power.

THAT is why public servants still need unions. I am not syaing the unions are not greedy sometimes too. But they are still needed in the public service sector.

Cutting costs in a dying city or one on life support is necessary.

But to cut the wages of the folks protecting the safety iof the residents of that city? That's back asswards thinking.

You want to cut the budget of the cops and firemen and teachers?

GET RID OF THE SECTION 8 crack houses, and the welfare projects. That is who uses probably 80% of the services what with shootings, fires caused by crack pipes and extra classes needed to teach lil' Jonny to read because he has no support for learning at home at the projects.

Get rid of that mess, then you can reduce your budget for public safety.
JIMMY YOUNG

Elizabeth, PA

#44 Aug 13, 2013
Still laughing wrote:
And Mr. Young, stop answering these idiots! You don't owe nobody an explanation! I know it must be tempting to answer these assholes but it only fuels their jealousy! Thank you for letting me know that the Mayor is a fn coward, who couldn't even ask you directly for your side but most of all thank you for your service on 9/11 and everyday here in McKeesport! Now with that being said - may these petty cowards homes burn to the ground! Karma!
Thank you. I will stop answering this crap after I clear up the Mayor issue you mentioned. I understand the Mayor had met with the Fire Fighters Union President reguarding this Magistrate matter. I was informed after threir meeting that I would get a reprimand in my file. The Mayor was a Union School Teacher.He went thru the Union as he should have.I just wanted to explain my side, and I never got my chance. When I do see the letter, I will get to tell my side court. The Mayor is no coward. He made a tough decision and stuck to it. Thats all
Wake up People

Turtle Creek, PA

#45 Aug 13, 2013
Anybody that thinks a company, school district or municipality would pay you what you make without a union contract is nuts! Unions only help!!! A living wage, a days work for a days pay, healthcare, vacation pay, sick days... good lord people wake up!!!
Union Pigs

West Mifflin, PA

#46 Aug 13, 2013
I work an non union job and get those benefits PLUS . that you mentioned above, however where I work we get raises and bonuses for our work performance...with unions you get the loafers and dead beats the same as your work horses.......every union is like that...i dont perform my job or goof off i get fired,you whiney cry baby union pigs scream " File a Grievance"...LOL!
..........and dont tell me unions dont protect the A holes,,they do!
Wake up Peoplel

Turtle Creek, PA

#47 Aug 13, 2013
You moron!!!! You only get those benefits because of union shops! Talk about an Ahole!
Larry

West Mifflin, PA

#48 Aug 13, 2013
Wake up Peoplel wrote:
You moron!!!! You only get those benefits because of union shops! Talk about an Ahole!
WHAT??????? You're the Ahole......youre saying only unions get paid vacations, benefits and raises and pensions? where the fuk you been.....I get raises and bonuses and the rest cause i work my butt off.....No union ever helped me out....and by the way......if unions are so great why have they been going down in popularity since the 70's? union shops never did anything for me....
Larry

West Mifflin, PA

#49 Aug 13, 2013
Unions are no longer beneficial in our society because today we have so many laws protecting the rights of workers.In the 19th and early 20th century the workers of America had virtually no rights and were unable to improve their work conditions, salary, etc. With the arrival of unions, the state of the common laborer greatly improved. But today, with so many laws ensuring the rights of employees, unions are doing more harm than good. For example, many analysts believe that union's demand for so many raises and benefits for the auto industry workers has driven it into the ground, so they are no longer able to compete with other countries.
Take A Look

Elizabeth, PA

#50 Aug 13, 2013
Larry wrote:
Unions are no longer beneficial in our society because today we have so many laws protecting the rights of workers.In the 19th and early 20th century the workers of America had virtually no rights and were unable to improve their work conditions, salary, etc. With the arrival of unions, the state of the common laborer greatly improved. But today, with so many laws ensuring the rights of employees, unions are doing more harm than good. For example, many analysts believe that union's demand for so many raises and benefits for the auto industry workers has driven it into the ground, so they are no longer able to compete with other countries.
Clearly educated and well read
I disagree

Pittsburgh, PA

#51 Aug 14, 2013
JIMMY YOUNG wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you. I will stop answering this crap after I clear up the Mayor issue you mentioned. I understand the Mayor had met with the Fire Fighters Union President reguarding this Magistrate matter. I was informed after threir meeting that I would get a reprimand in my file. The Mayor was a Union School Teacher.He went thru the Union as he should have.I just wanted to explain my side, and I never got my chance. When I do see the letter, I will get to tell my side court. The Mayor is no coward. He made a tough decision and stuck to it. Thats all
Nice of you to stick up for the mayor, but honest;y, he SHOULD have heard your side - publicly- FIRST, before asking for a letter of reprimand. Unless you were clearly wrong, in which cae, yeah you deserve it. But, if there is any (honestly) grey area, you should not have to go to court AFTER the letter is in your file.

"Innocent til proven guilty" and all.

Sounds like the mayor took the back door route to sweep this whole thing under the rug rather than keep things in the light of day...no serious repurcussions for you, and the matter just goes away....."better for the city" is what I bet was said at the meeting.

Why do you have to live with that in your file, if you were not wrong, right?

Just sayin'.
Half right

Pittsburgh, PA

#52 Aug 14, 2013
Larry wrote:
Unions are no longer beneficial in our society because today we have so many laws protecting the rights of workers.In the 19th and early 20th century the workers of America had virtually no rights and were unable to improve their work conditions, salary, etc. With the arrival of unions, the state of the common laborer greatly improved. But today, with so many laws ensuring the rights of employees, unions are doing more harm than good. For example, many analysts believe that union's demand for so many raises and benefits for the auto industry workers has driven it into the ground, so they are no longer able to compete with other countries.
Though it is well written, it is not founded in real world fact.

"many analysts" also believe the opposite, so what does that prove?

The city/twon, paid-by-taxes worker is a different animal than the average worker for the reasons stated above. The TAXPAYER controls the wages by way of electing certain political figures in and out of office. EVERYONE complains about high taxes and people will vote out the people who control the high taxes. So in turn those people who control the taxes keep wages of the city workers low tto keep taxes low (easy pickings).

That is why there needs to be something overseeing the wages of city workers.

That can be a union or a separate committee or board or whatever.

Here, it happens to be the union.

As far as unions making any US industry unable to compete with other countries, you have it only half right.

The other half is the US CONSUMER. We DEMAND high quality and bare-bones cost, yet ALSO demand HIGH wages for LITTLE work as workers ourselves.

What comes around goes around.
Half right

Pittsburgh, PA

#53 Aug 14, 2013
Wake up People wrote:
A living wage, a days work for a days pay, healthcare, vacation pay, sick days... good lord people wake up!!!
The issue is that people disagree as to what a "living wage" is.

I know a USWA member who, 8 years ago, made $90,000 a year for being a "marker"....the guy who sits in an air conditioned office until a roll of steel came down the line....goes out, marks the batch numbers etc on the roll and then goes back to the office till the next one comes down the line.

How is that a "fair wage" when we have teachers, cops and firemen not making that?

Then you had the grocery baggers at Giant Eagle demanding a union, healthcare and high wages...for a job that is supposed to be for KIDS and a stepping stone into a real job.

Then you have cities and school districts rolling back wages on civil servants and teachers because the voters who pay the taxes want more for less.

Yes, there is greed in some unions, just as there is greed in some workers, just as there is greed in some employers (which includes tax payers and consumers).

None of the three are 100% trustworthy all the time.

So we need checks and balances in place.

Not saying that graft and greed doesnt happen.

But it would happen a lot more.

Read your history books and look up "Pinkerton".

People in our area should know better than to say all unions are bad.
Not so fast

Pittsburgh, PA

#54 Aug 14, 2013
Union Pigs wrote:
I work an non union job and get those benefits PLUS . that you mentioned above, however where I work we get raises and bonuses for our work performance...with unions you get the loafers and dead beats the same as your work horses.......every union is like that...i dont perform my job or goof off i get fired,you whiney cry baby union pigs scream " File a Grievance"...LOL!
..........and dont tell me unions dont protect the A holes,,they do!
I know people who work for fortune 500 companies that get NO RAISES or 1% raises (not even cost of living) and are told "its all we can afford right now" yet give their CEOs millions in bonuses.

That is , of course, their prerogative - but just because you happen to get raises and such at your employer, realize that for every one non-union employee who gets great raises, cheap benefits and such there are 1000 others out there who do not.

Yes, some of the unions DO protect a-holes. But they ALSO protect the average hard worker and have set the bar for the rest of the folks.

Just like the law protects criminals to some degree "innocent til proven guilty" etc as well as the innocent.

You think an 8 hour workday was the standard before unions?

LOL

Read your history.
Not so fast

Pittsburgh, PA

#55 Aug 14, 2013
Larry wrote:
<quoted text>
.if unions are so great why have they been going down in popularity since the 70's? union shops never did anything for me....
a) because employers have found ways of "encouraging" employees to NOT want unions

b) SOME unions have had some scandals and bad raps and some have cheated their members

c) unions were predominantly hard-labor/skilled labor oriented where nowadays the average american worker is a low-skilled service worker or office employee (see point a)

d) we have become a nation of sheep...being led down the road of "you can trust us" and "we will do our best for you...trust us!" If you need proof of that just look at the government we have in place and who is "leading" our country right now. The welfare addicts LOVE it and go along with the sheep mentality. "THey will protect us."

Yeah. right.
wait a second

Turtle Creek, PA

#56 Aug 14, 2013
Any group of workers that want to join a union should be able to join one. I don't know which Giant Eagle you go to but my Giant Eagle is full of women and men in their 40's, 50's & 60's. They support their families on their earnings!! Sign the cards and get your election! Vote union.
Strive to do better

Pittsburgh, PA

#57 Aug 15, 2013
wait a second wrote:
Any group of workers that want to join a union should be able to join one. I don't know which Giant Eagle you go to but my Giant Eagle is full of women and men in their 40's, 50's & 60's. They support their families on their earnings!! Sign the cards and get your election! Vote union.
You have to be realistic.

Grocery bagging was never meant to be a career choice, nor is paper delivery.

Those jobs in this country were considered menial tasks and the youth were encouraged to do them as first jobs. They would work cheap and that benefitted the store, the customer and the youth by providing them with job experience. It doesn't take much IQ or skill to bag groceries.

There used to be a time when in this country people aimed to do more than get by and they chased better jobs.

Nowadays, there are people who work a couple jobs to get by and usually they are unskilled labor jobs like grocery bagging.

If , as a 40-60 year old, you choose or (due to your own lack of skill or gumption to get a better job) need to bag groceries as your main employment, that is fine.....props to ya.

But don't expect more than minimum wage, full health benefits and vacation time. Those are things relegated to CAREERS and SKILLED jobs.

Expecting those things for menial,unskilled jobs is why so many jobs are going away.

Have you noticed that many grocery stores now have self-serve aisles where you check out AND bag your own stuff?

You think that is because it benefits the store? Or because they want to help customers learn new skills? Self-checking, especially in areas like ours, leads to increased theft and all sorts of other issues. Yet the stores do it because it is still cheaper than paying a 40 year old $10 an hour and benefits to bag groceries.
I see both sides

Turtle Creek, PA

#58 Aug 16, 2013
You know my oldest brother worked at a Foodland when he was 16 ( he's 64 now) and there were many grown men that worked there full time. Yes, he was a part-timer and made decent money. I understand what you're saying and he did go on to college. But there were also men that raised their families, owned homes, vehicles, took family vacations, were able to give their children a good life on the income from the Foodland.
To assume that every worker is college material or could even a trade school candidate in not realistic. Nor is it fair to not pay a living wage to these workers. Stand on your feet 8 hours a day packing bags. Not so easy.
self serving

West Mifflin, PA

#59 Aug 16, 2013
i Like the self serve check out counter at stores this way i can fit a few steaks and a package of porkchops down my pants and no one will notice...
i once stuck a box of lucky charms up my vagina and walked right out of The stOre.
packers and sackers

Monongahela, PA

#60 Aug 18, 2013
I see both sides wrote:
But there were also men that raised their families, owned homes, vehicles, took family vacations, were able to give their children a good life on the income from the Foodland."
.... Nor is it fair to not pay a living wage to these workers. Stand on your feet 8 hours a day packing bags. Not so easy.
That's fine if you want to make grocery bagging your "career". The person or people you use as an example should thank their lucky stars they could do that.

But just like any career, some careers come with better wages and such than others. Its really not rocket science.

If EVERYONE made $15 an hour whether they bagged groceries or did skilled work, why would anyone want to put the effort out to do skilled labor?

(Its like welfare in some ways - set the bar low enough with enough reward and you wont have people pushing to raise the bar)

To have a union force its way in to try and force a store owner to pay more to someone just because they want more money is not right.

If the baggers feel they should make the same money as a skilled tradesoman does then they are free to see if another store offerst hat wage and go there.

If no other stores offer the wages they are looking for to bag groceries, WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU!?!?!!? It SHOULD tell you that BAGGING GROCERIES IS NOT A GOOD PAYING JOB TO RAISE A FAMILY ON and find something better - better yourself - learn a skill or trade and get a better job.

Instead, these lazy folks figure they can get the union involved and force their way into skilled-labor wage territory yet have no skills.

Yeah, standing on your feet 8 hours packing groceries (usually in an air conditioned store) may be hard. But waht about the tradesman who has a skill and works outside for 8-10 hours year round? Or people who are unskilled labor but work in factories 8-10 hours pushing brooms, mucking glop off the ground, etc./ What about farm hands, who muck stalls for a liing? Do you think bagging groceries and those are the same thing?

"A living wage" is a very often used but very rarely used PROPERLY term.

Minimum wage has been the established minimum amount of money that someone may work for for menial jobs such as bagging , etc.....non skilled jobs that WERE NEVER MEANT TO SUPPORT A FAMILY ON.

People may do it. That doesn't make it a reason that someone should EXPECT a certain level of wages to do it.

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