Baptism for remission of sins

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Since: Feb 13

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#1
May 9, 2013
 
Acts 2:38 and "baptized for remission of sins" can be interpreted many number of ways.

Why should anybody trust the Church of Christ and especially Johnny, Mark, James etc when they say they have the only true way to interpret Acts 2:38?

They could be wrong too. They will never say that. But it is true. They could be wrong too.

“Janitor Custodian ”

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#2
May 9, 2013
 
how else can acts 2 38 mean?

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#3
May 9, 2013
 
Olethros wrote:
Acts 2:38 and "baptized for remission of sins" can be interpreted many number of ways.
Why should anybody trust the Church of Christ and especially Johnny, Mark, James etc when they say they have the only true way to interpret Acts 2:38?
They could be wrong too. They will never say that. But it is true. They could be wrong too.
That text combined with other text about baptism show that baptism is one of the conditions of the gift of Salvation.

“Janitor Custodian ”

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#4
May 9, 2013
 
Man you throwing darts in the wind. You never gonna hit the target till you cut that fan off. You alway have a fight to pick with people nobody on here knows or cares about because nobody ever says nothing bout them but you. The verse acts 2 38 though is what we should make a talk about. Who cares bout those men you infatuated with I sure dont. When I reads act 2 38 after peter tells them to repent and be baptised for some reason they done what he said. What reason do you think it was. The name of your headline on this post tells dont it. for remission of sins is why they repented and got baptised. Creed on here say God will look over people if they misunderstand baptism what it is for. im not sure bout that. If people get baptised then why do they get baptised. Peter says cause its for remission of sins and that means what it says and says what it means.
Dave P

Morehead, KY

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#5
May 9, 2013
 
Hey mop-man I just posted something on the home churches thread about all this.

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#6
May 9, 2013
 

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Olethros wrote:
Acts 2:38 and "baptized for remission of sins" can be interpreted many number of ways.
Why should anybody trust the Church of Christ and especially Johnny, Mark, James etc when they say they have the only true way to interpret Acts 2:38?
They could be wrong too. They will never say that. But it is true. They could be wrong too.
If you contend that forgiveness comes before baptism, your argument fails because the promise of the Holy Spirit is also a consequence of repentance, baptism, and forgiveness.

Notice, that receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit is in the future tense,‘following’ the previous verbs “repent” and “be baptized”. I’m trying to boil this down to simple terms as possible. Please do a study on aorist/imperative tenses; I think this may help you understand Acts 2:38 better.“Repent” and “be baptized” are acts prior to the gift of the Holy Spirit yet unto/for forgiveness of sins- in the imperative tense.

Therefore, it’s not possible to argue that forgiveness of sins and receiving of the Spirit all precede baptism in Acts 2:38, regardless of what you do with the Greek word EIS-“for”.

I spent YEARS trying to find a way around this verse. As mopman says,“it means what it says and says what it means”.

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#7
May 9, 2013
 
Yep. Sure thang on that.

“Janitor Custodian ”

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#8
May 9, 2013
 
Dave P wrote:
Hey mop-man I just posted something on the home churches thread about all this.
Say what

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#9
May 9, 2013
 

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JesusCreed wrote:
<quoted text>
If you contend that forgiveness comes before baptism, your argument fails because the promise of the Holy Spirit is also a consequence of repentance, baptism, and forgiveness.
Notice, that receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit is in the future tense,‘following’ the previous verbs “repent” and “be baptized”. I’m trying to boil this down to simple terms as possible. Please do a study on aorist/imperative tenses; I think this may help you understand Acts 2:38 better.“Repent” and “be baptized” are acts prior to the gift of the Holy Spirit yet unto/for forgiveness of sins- in the imperative tense.
Therefore, it’s not possible to argue that forgiveness of sins and receiving of the Spirit all precede baptism in Acts 2:38, regardless of what you do with the Greek word EIS-“for”.
I spent YEARS trying to find a way around this verse. As mopman says,“it means what it says and says what it means”.
:)
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

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#10
May 9, 2013
 
JesusCreed wrote:
<quoted text>
If you contend that forgiveness comes before baptism, your argument fails because the promise of the Holy Spirit is also a consequence of repentance, baptism, and forgiveness.
Notice, that receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit is in the future tense,‘following’ the previous verbs “repent” and “be baptized”. I’m trying to boil this down to simple terms as possible. Please do a study on aorist/imperative tenses; I think this may help you understand Acts 2:38 better.“Repent” and “be baptized” are acts prior to the gift of the Holy Spirit yet unto/for forgiveness of sins- in the imperative tense.
Therefore, it’s not possible to argue that forgiveness of sins and receiving of the Spirit all precede baptism in Acts 2:38,

regardless of what you do with the Greek word EIS-“for”.
I spent YEARS trying to find a way around this verse. As mopman says,“it means what it says and says what it means”.
This Catholic guy totally agrees with you on this one.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

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#11
May 9, 2013
 
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
This Catholic guy totally agrees with you on this one.
Funny-how can you agree with any protestant on anything without thinking it through first? The coc believes the only water baptism that will save is done by complete immersion and you do not. You guys are talking about two different baptisms. Where you both agree is that water baptism is efficacious. Can anyone in the cathoilc church do the baptizing or does some mere man with catholic authority have to do it? Yea, I thought so.

Mike I finally got your number. I think you do have one fan on here and I think I know who he is-he is a catholic...

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#12
May 10, 2013
 
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>

I think you do have one fan on here and I think I know who he is-he is a catholic...
The only Catholics I know on here are Mike and EdenMark.

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#13
May 10, 2013
 

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Acts 2:38 only says baptism for remission of sins "and you will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

It doesn't say baptism for salvation.

The Church of Christ on TV here doesn't believe in the Holy Ghost being with Christians. I don't know what they believe in its place or why they don't think the Holy Ghost is with us.

Why is baptism required then?

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#14
May 10, 2013
 

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Olethros wrote:
Acts 2:38 only says baptism for remission of sins "and you will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."
It doesn't say baptism for salvation.
The Church of Christ on TV here doesn't believe in the Holy Ghost being with Christians. I don't know what they believe in its place or why they don't think the Holy Ghost is with us.
Why is baptism required then?
Acts 2:39- The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call. Acts 2:40- With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them,“Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.” Acts 2:41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

After being baptized, having trusted in Jesus Christ, they were added to the Body of Christ- THE CHURCH. True or False?
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

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#15
May 10, 2013
 

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Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
Funny-how can you agree with any protestant on anything without thinking it through first? The coc believes the only water baptism that will save is done by complete immersion and you do not. You guys are talking about two different baptisms. Where you both agree is that water baptism is efficacious. Can anyone in the cathoilc church do the baptizing or does some mere man with catholic authority have to do it? Yea, I thought so.
Mike I finally got your number. I think you do have one fan on here and I think I know who he is-he is a catholic...
I agreed with his statement. He didn't say anything about immersion being necessary.

You have to be a successor to the Apostles to administer sacraments except at eminent death and there is no priest around. You can punish a believe for the lack of priest.

Your Pastor is the only one in your Church that can perform a marriage. You cant, but I see your Church believes somewhat in sacraments even though they are not valid in the CC.
Dave P

Morehead, KY

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#16
May 10, 2013
 
Olethros wrote:
Acts 2:38 only says baptism for remission of sins "and you will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."
It doesn't say baptism for salvation.
The Church of Christ on TV here doesn't believe in the Holy Ghost being with Christians. I don't know what they believe in its place or why they don't think the Holy Ghost is with us.
Why is baptism required then?
Just what would salvation be then? Think remission of sins and the Spirit are necessary to be saved? If so, then salvation is in play in baptism.
Dave P

Morehead, KY

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#17
May 10, 2013
 
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
I agreed with his statement. He didn't say anything about immersion being necessary.
You have to be a successor to the Apostles to administer sacraments except at eminent death and there is no priest around. You can punish a believe for the lack of priest.
Your Pastor is the only one in your Church that can perform a marriage. You cant, but I see your Church believes somewhat in sacraments even though they are not valid in the CC.
I judge this wrong, nuts, clueless, and spam. Successor, sacraments, no priest? Bah Ashdod.

Pastor only one who can perform a marriage? All it takes is $25-35 to the state and anyone can do a marriage.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

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#18
May 10, 2013
 
Dave P wrote:
<quoted text>
I judge this wrong, nuts, clueless, and spam. Successor, sacraments, no priest? Bah Ashdod.
Pastor only one who can perform a marriage? All it takes is $25-35 to the state and anyone can do a marriage.
That's kind of sad to talk about Holy Matrimony like that. It is a vow you make before God.

Do you think a civil marriage by the courthouse judge is a "Holy" Marriage.

Matthew 19:5 - This is why a man leaves his father and mother and becomes attached to his wife, and the two become one flesh? They are no longer two, therefore, but one flesh.
Ephesians 5:25 - "love your wives, even as Christ loved the Church"
1 Thessalonians 4:4 - "acquire a wife for himself in holiness and honor"
Dave P

Morehead, KY

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#19
May 10, 2013
 

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Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
That's kind of sad to talk about Holy Matrimony like that. It is a vow you make before God.
Do you think a civil marriage by the courthouse judge is a "Holy" Marriage.
Matthew 19:5 - This is why a man leaves his father and mother and becomes attached to his wife, and the two become one flesh? They are no longer two, therefore, but one flesh.
Ephesians 5:25 - "love your wives, even as Christ loved the Church"
1 Thessalonians 4:4 - "acquire a wife for himself in holiness and honor"
Everyone not married in a CC simply concubines Mike? Is marriage void if a priest isn't present? Where was the priest at the wedding Jesus was at in John 2? Marriage is neither an ordinance or a sacrament according to the Bible.

Bah Ashdod!

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#20
May 10, 2013
 

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Acts chapter 2 doesn't mention water.

It mentions baptism but it doesn't mention water.

The chapter indicates the baptism is the one of the Holy Spirit, and not a baptism of water.

Acts 2:4 "And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance."

Those were the disciples and other friends and followers of Jesus who were together on Pentecost. They weren't baptized with water but the Bible makes it plain and clear that they were filled with the Holy Spirit.

Pentecost was well after Christ's death and resurrection. The CoC claims the Old Testament law was done away with when Christ died. CoC people like Johnny, Mark and James say that their Chuch is the church Jesus established and that to enter into it requires baptism by water.

So why are the very first members of the church filled with the Holy Spirit but did not get water baptized first?

Peter has been baptized by the Holy Spirit and filled with it. He tells the crowd to repent of their sins, to accept the Holy Spirit and the comfort it brings with it to know that sins are forgiven, and they too will be filled with it and everything that it gives believers.

Peter says to be baptized by the Holy Spirit. Not baptized with water. That to repent is to invite the Holy Spirit and to let it indwell. Peter and the other followers of Jesus had just been baptized by the Holy Spirit and they are telling everyone else how to b baptized by it too.

About three thousand souls repented and entered the church by their turning to Christ. They entered the Chuch because the were baptized by the Holy Spirit just as Peter and the others had been. They entered the church because of their faith.

That is the only possible meaning of the verse that takes everything in the chapter into consideration, that I can find.

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