Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#436 Nov 20, 2013
Annoying Proxy wrote:
<quoted text>I suppose the Catholics claim they created the Old testament also but they cannot prove the scriptures were kept from the common people. The Jews were very familiar with the written scriptures, why should Mark, Mike, Catholic Dave, and Jesus Creed think it should be any different today? There were groups or sects like Nazarenes, Sadducees, Essenes, and Zealots and Pharisees which were similar to denominations. There is a right and a wrong in denomination teaching and since it is each individuals soul at stake should they not have a choice in the matter? It would be bad to only have one false choice.
This post says it all about Protestantism. First of all Jesus never mentioned a Bible but...

They say he left us a book. Think about it, a book although he never mentioned one. And it up to us individually whether we can afford this book or even read this book and only if you are lucky enough to pick out the right "secret code" of interpretation can you make it heaven. Of course every community thinks they know the secret code and the rest are going to hell.

Are Protestants really Christians? This belief might prove otherwise. Protestant are idol worshipers, a book. The bible is just words made with ink on a piece of paper without proper instruction.

Jesus left us a Church. He specifically told us that. The Church created the Bible to help her teach.

Which makes more sense? For 1500 years all Christians believed that.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#437 Nov 20, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
<quoted text>
How great is your darkness? We can see your nose is affected too.
Sproul manure + words of wisdom from the resident arrogant prick...in a word...noisome.

Since: Jan 10

Royse City

#438 Nov 20, 2013
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>Because they are in your Bible and you accept their decision.

You would be better off by just saying God Bless You. You can hide your ignorance on the subject of Bible history.
But the early popes could keep up with 27 books?

Sad.

Since: Jan 10

Royse City

#439 Nov 20, 2013
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>This post says it all about Protestantism. First of all Jesus never mentioned a Bible but...

They say he left us a book. Think about it, a book although he never mentioned one. And it up to us individually whether we can afford this book or even read this book and only if you are lucky enough to pick out the right "secret code" of interpretation can you make it heaven. Of course every community thinks they know the secret code and the rest are going to hell.

Are Protestants really Christians? This belief might prove otherwise. Protestant are idol worshipers, a book. The bible is just words made with ink on a piece of paper without proper instruction.

Jesus left us a Church. He specifically told us that. The Church created the Bible to help her teach.

Which makes more sense? For 1500 years all Christians believed that.
First of all, Jesus never mentioned a pope.

And the CC allegedly created a Bible that actually contradicts catholic theology.

wow

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#440 Nov 20, 2013
HEATH - 72 wrote:
<quoted text>
But the early popes could keep up with 27 books?
Sad.
Today is November 20, 2013. Why? Because the Catholic Church told you it is. So do you believe the KJV Bible just fell out of the sky one day?

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#441 Nov 20, 2013
HEATH - 72 wrote:
<quoted text>
First of all, Jesus never mentioned a pope.
And the CC allegedly created a Bible that actually contradicts catholic theology.
wow
First of all, Jesus never mentioned Welchs Pasteurized Grape Juice in little cups. Second of all, Jesus never said it was OK to sing Baptist, Lutheran, Methodist, Presbyterian and Anglican hymns.
Dave P

Morehead, KY

#442 Nov 20, 2013
Annoying Proxy wrote:
<quoted text>I suppose the Catholics claim they created the Old testament also but they cannot prove the scriptures were kept from the common people. The Jews were very familiar with the written scriptures, why should Mark, Mike, Catholic Dave, and Jesus Creed think it should be any different today? There were groups or sects like Nazarenes, Sadducees, Essenes, and Zealots and Pharisees which were similar to denominations. There is a right and a wrong in denomination teaching and since it is each individuals soul at stake should they not have a choice in the matter? It would be bad to only have one false choice.
Yes, but how many had access to those scriptures? Very few. Weren't copies of the OT kept in the synagogues? And why would it have been a big deal for Hilkiah to have found the book of the law in the temple if everyone had a copy?

Were the Jews as a whole truly familiar with the scriptures, or had access to them? No. Why do you think Jesus said "You have heard it said"? The average Jew didn't have a copy of the Torah in his house.

Perhaps, just perhaps, the means for religious teaching was always meant to be the church and the leaders of it, with them being equipped to rightly divide word to instruct the people.

I do think it is good for all to have access to the scriptures. But is it good for all to think that their interpretation is valid as anyone else's, that they don't need the church or leaders to help them understand?
Dave P

Dahlonega, GA

#443 Nov 20, 2013
JesusCreed wrote:
Also, in the infancy of the Church, how did it survive without a Bible for so long? Oral messages from the Apostles, passed down Church to Church? Letters here and there? How? It is much to consider here. I am not attempting to throw out the Bible, but maybe we have made the Bible an object of worship. More bluntly, maybe we have made OUR UNDERSTANDING of the Bible an object of worship. It seems to me, our misunderstandings of SS have resulted in the MANY denominations today. Every single denomination rest upon its own understanding of Scripture. Is this what God planned? Did God plan such confusion? Surely God would know we all would not agree on SS.
Randy, you and I have a lot of similar thoughts in these 2 posts you gave. I don't have time for detailed responses now, but I have been thinking much on this too. See, when people like you and I THINK, it threatens the plantation mentality many believers have. Don't rock the boat, don't think, don't look at hard truths. Just duck into the sand and be a good boy.

The Bible in everyone's hands is a good thing; many people deciding they know how to interpret it hasn't necessarily been. Lutheranism, Calvinism, Wesleyanism, Sola Scriptura, Pentecostalism, Dispensationalism, Restorationism, CENI. All in 500 years.
Dave P

Dahlonega, GA

#444 Nov 20, 2013
JesusCreed wrote:
<quoted text>
I have ask myself these questions. You arenít far from converting to the Catholic Church. One of my favorite debaters is James White, a Calvinist. In one debate, a Catholic Apologist ate him up on certain points. The whole Cannon/Bible debate raises many questions. I also have to confess Mike has a point when he has noted many times that Jesus never promised us a Bible to follow with PRIVATE interpretation. In fact, as bad as this may sound, the Bible, in the hands of everybody, has caused the countless sects/denominations we have today. Is this what God wanted? Us all to make up denomination after denomination based upon HOW WE UNDERSTAND the Bible?
Don't be in such a hurry to convert me. Lol. But notice not many actually address the issues?

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#445 Nov 20, 2013
HEATH - 72 wrote:
<quoted text>
First of all, Jesus never mentioned a pope.
And the CC allegedly created a Bible that actually contradicts catholic theology.
wow
Once again your response should be 'God bless you'.

Of course he created a Pope. Upon you I will build my Church. I will give you the keys to the Kingdom, you can bind and loose, forgive sins or not, and whoever hears you, hears me. If it sounds like a Pope, it is a Pope.

Do you have the keys, can forgive sins, bind and loose? When people hear you, do they hear Jesus?

Nothing in the Bible contradicts Catholicism, only your poor, private, personal and insignificant interpretation of a book created 1600 years ago in a different language and 300,000 translations later.
William

Birmingham, AL

#446 Nov 20, 2013
Dave P wrote:
I do think it is good for all to have access to the scriptures. But is it good for all to think that their interpretation is valid as anyone else's, that they don't need the church or leaders to help them understand?
That's putting an awful lot of trust in something, and someone, else. Which is why having the scriptures and studying them makes a great deal of good, common sense.

Ideally, we study the scriptures with the diving author of them acting as our teacher. I'll take the Holy Spirit over any man's teaching, any day.
William

Birmingham, AL

#447 Nov 20, 2013
Who can argue with this sound advice, given by the Holy Spirit through the pen of the apostle Paul to the Corinthians:

1 Corinthians 2:11-16

11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ.

Sort of cuts out the middle-man, doesn't it.

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#448 Nov 20, 2013
Dave P wrote:
<quoted text>
Randy, you and I have a lot of similar thoughts in these 2 posts you gave. I don't have time for detailed responses now, but I have been thinking much on this too. See, when people like you and I THINK, it threatens the plantation mentality many believers have. Don't rock the boat, don't think, don't look at hard truths. Just duck into the sand and be a good boy.
The Bible in everyone's hands is a good thing; many people deciding they know how to interpret it hasn't necessarily been. Lutheranism, Calvinism, Wesleyanism, Sola Scriptura, Pentecostalism, Dispensationalism, Restorationism, CENI. All in 500 years.
I agree; the Bible in everyone's hands is a good thing; however, as you said, our interpretation hasn't necessarily been a good thing.

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#449 Nov 20, 2013
Dave P wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't be in such a hurry to convert me. Lol. But notice not many actually address the issues?
Yeah, I was joking bout you converting to RCC. Yeah, not many takers on the points of SS.
William

Birmingham, AL

#450 Nov 20, 2013
JesusCreed wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, I was joking bout you converting to RCC. Yeah, not many takers on the points of SS.
I'll stick up for both SS and SF.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#451 Nov 20, 2013
William wrote:
<quoted text>
I'll stick up for both SS and SF.
Yes, that would be the one member Church of the Fried Muslims.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#452 Nov 20, 2013
HEATH - 72 wrote:
Thus it is entirely possible to possess scriptures without having a canon, and this was in fact the situation in the first few centuries of the Christian church.(Lee Martin McDonald, James A. Sanders, Editors: The Canon Debate; Geoffrey Mark Hahneman, The Muratorian Fragment and the Origins of the New Testament Canon, 2002, p 380)
The Aramaic text from 167 AD was a copy of the original documents. Their historical account is that each book was received by either the author themselves or a very close associate of the author - personally delivered to the Eastern Church. Their record prior to 167 has the same 27 books that the RCC didn't declare cannon until much later. But even with 27 book prior to 167, the Easter Church didn't consider each book equal in authority to the others... unlike the undiscerning, confused and faithless Roman Church by 350 AD had become callously Paganistic.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#453 Nov 20, 2013
William wrote:
<quoted text>
I'll stick up for both SS and SF.
Freedom baby. Believe what you want. No truth will get in your way. The Holy Spirit speaks to you.

Praise the Lord.

Pope William the 40,000th.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#454 Nov 20, 2013
MarkEden wrote:
<quoted text>
Sproul manure + words of wisdom from the resident arrogant prick...in a word...noisome.
You never have anything to say. In kind with your brilliant remark, I still recall:
"I'm rubber, you're glue, whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to you";-)
I hope to be there when you account for these statements that are far worse than those Jesus said could imperil one to the fire of hell....
But since you follow the Pope, what else should we expect?
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#455 Nov 20, 2013
Mike_Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
This post says it all about Protestantism. First of all Jesus never mentioned a Bible but...
They say he left us a book. Think about it, a book although he never mentioned one. And it up to us individually whether we can afford this book or even read this book and only if you are lucky enough to pick out the right "secret code" of interpretation can you make it heaven. Of course every community thinks they know the secret code and the rest are going to hell.
Are Protestants really Christians? This belief might prove otherwise. Protestant are idol worshipers, a book. The bible is just words made with ink on a piece of paper without proper instruction.
Jesus left us a Church. He specifically told us that. The Church created the Bible to help her teach.
Which makes more sense? For 1500 years all Christians believed that.
No, Jesus never mentioned the word 'Bible', but neither was His name 'Jesus'. Both are Catholic inventions.

What did Y'shua call the "Set-Apart Scriptures", the "Torah" and many other words that you have ignored to make such an ignorant statement? What is 'monia'? That's Greek for ?????

Do make some sense in your comments... it would be nice for a change.

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