Now this is unbelievable. Sickening.

Now this is unbelievable. Sickening.

Posted in the Maple Heights Forum

mapleman

Brecksville, OH

#1 Sep 22, 2009
Cleveland man, 53, charged with aggravated murder in fatal shooting of man who invaded his home, assaulted woman tenant
By Donna J. Miller
September 22, 2009, 1:40PM

CLEVELAND, Ohio Carl Kozlosky, 53, of Cleveland, is charged with aggravated murder in the shooting death of a man who broke into his house. He will be arraigned Wednesday morning.

Andre Coleman, 37, of Milverton Road, was shot and killed Sunday morning at the house Kozlosky owns in the 19100 block of Cherokee Avenue.

Police said this is what happened: Coleman went to the house about 9:30 p.m. and kicked in the door because a 26-year-old woman he had dated lived there and owed him money or drugs. Coleman began assaulting the woman.

Kozlosky, who rents part of the house to the woman, heard the noise, saw the woman being assaulted and shot Coleman. Neighbors called police.

One of the woman's family members told The Plain Dealer that Kozlosky had previously threatened to kill Coleman if he ever came to the house.

Coleman was sentenced to five to 10 years in prison in 1997 for involuntary manslaughter. His most recent local conviction was in January, 2005, for drug trafficking, when he was sentenced to 18 months of probation. He violated the rules within two months and was sentenced to 11 months in prison.
mapleman

Brecksville, OH

#2 Sep 22, 2009
If anybody should be charged with a crime it should be the prosecutor. Are they trying to send us a message that we can't protect ourselves or property? Are they trying to tell us we should just stand by and let somebody be assaulted?

After what happened to the mailman you would think nobody would be prosecuted for standing up to these thugs. The prosecutor should be fired for this.
xxxrayted

Berea, OH

#3 Sep 22, 2009
The Castle Doctrine does not apply to occupants involved in illegal activities. It also does not apply to protecting others--only yourself and family in your residence.
mapleman

Brecksville, OH

#4 Sep 22, 2009
So if you see somebody getting beat to death you can't save them if they are getting beat for something illegal? You are supposed to call the police and wait 30 minutes until they show up and the person is dead?

I thought our justice system wasn't tier based? I thought if I kill a hooker, a drug dealer or a old lady it is all aggravated murder and I do the same time.

Why are drug dealers allowed to shoot and kill people attempting to rob or assault them? There has to be more to this story.
xxxrayted

Berea, OH

#5 Sep 22, 2009
Well that's my point: drug dealers in the commission of an illegal act are not allowed to use firearms to protect themselves. And I agree with you--we should be allowed to use weapons to defend innocent people. But that isn't the case as of now.

This is all new to us. Baby steps are what is needed to get to the ultimate goal. Eventually, after some unfortunate incidents, people will write to their legislatures and demand expansions of the laws we have today. But you can't shove everything down the throats of Ohioans in one setting.

Take notice of the recent CCW laws. There were those who protested the new legislation including the police unions. After that settled, we introduced the Castle Doctrine. But now that the shiners of the CCW law went home and made dinner, the legislatures snuck in a clause under the Castle Doctrine that allowed citizens to arm themselves in their automobile.

Now if the CCW laws came out with the rider that people in cars can carry a loaded gun, it would have been met with much more resistance and possibly could have failed getting it into law.

Be patient man. We are on the right path. Hopefully, several years down the road, the Castle Doctrine will extend to protecting your property as well as those being attacked. It all takes time.
mapleman

Brecksville, OH

#6 Sep 22, 2009
I understand. The biggest problem with the CCW law was the car issue. For some reason they want to con us that law abiding citizens are going to shoot cops at traffic stops. LOL

This case is just scary. This man can probably beat it, but it will cost 30k at least if he takes it to trial. These prosecutors know people don't have the money to fight for their rights. They will overcharge you and plead you out.This man will go in debt for years trying to fight for his freedom.

My lawyer would get this crap thrown out before the grand jury indicted. This is why I say people need to watch what they say to police. The police could make a legit self defense case a murder case for you unless you STFU.

You know I am always ranting and raving telling people police are not your friends. STFU and lawyer up.

If citizens are going to defend themselves and others we must also know how to defend ourselves against the law.

The problem is people think the law is about what is right and nothing could be further from the truth. Just as we arm ourselves against these thugs, we must legally arm ourselves from our very government.
Pepperspray

Berea, OH

#7 Sep 23, 2009
xxxrayted wrote:
The Castle Doctrine does not apply to occupants involved in illegal activities. It also does not apply to protecting others--only yourself and family in your residence.
So, in other words, if I see a person being beaten beyond recognition on my front sidewalk, and the assailant looks to be trying to kill the victim, I can't run out there and but the thug to sleep because the victim isn't related to me? So, I call 911 and by the time the cops get here, the victim's body has already went into rigamourtus and the thug's already stolen a car and is in Wisconsin.
xxxrayted

Berea, OH

#8 Sep 23, 2009
Unfortunately, yes Pepper. However, if you have a CCW, and you intervene not using a weapon, and he then gets off his victim and comes after you, then you have the right to defend yourself using a firearm. But if that is the case, simply pointing the gun at the asshole and telling him to stop will be enough to get him off of the victim.

It's even better if he pulls his gun on you or is crazy enough to come after you with a knife. But the thing is, you can't shoot somebody for beating up another person when your life is not in danger. Hell, the police can't even do that.
Pepperspray

Berea, OH

#9 Sep 23, 2009
These laws need to be changed to where anyone can intervene if a stranger is being attacked. I know a woman that was attacked a few years ago by a couple black guys who wanted her purse and she's still traumatized. Maybe if someone was there to help her, she'd have come out of it a little better. We need a vigilante force to roam around and take care of these pot-headed-dope-taking-3-ounce -brained-worthless-animals.
mapleman

Northfield, OH

#10 Sep 23, 2009
It is sickening. Somebody sees my mother getting attacked and they are supposed to just call 911. By the time the cops get their she could be permanently injured or dead.

I tell you something, if somebody saves me and uses deadly force I am telling the police I didn't see sh@t. I wont give a description or cooperate in anyway if they are out to charge good citizens.
James

Lorain, OH

#11 Nov 4, 2011
Did I understand this right? What Carl said to the police was also used to make a case against him?

And now the police want us to vote no on issue 2 so they can keep their benefits and job security?
I'm voting YES!
white

Nashville, TN

#12 Nov 14, 2011
mapleman wrote:
If anybody should be charged with a crime it should be the prosecutor. Are they trying to send us a message that we can't protect ourselves or property? Are they trying to tell us we should just stand by and let somebody be assaulted?
After what happened to the mailman you would think nobody would be prosecuted for standing up to these thugs. The prosecutor should be fired for this.
I second that...
YOU SAID WHAT

Cleveland, OH

#13 Nov 16, 2011
Pepperspray, there are some cases where a citizen can assist and there are lawyers that specialize in protecting citizens that get sued by criminals that sue citizens that assist. And there are some laws that if a citizen assists a police officer they are protected also. I'm not a lawyer so I don't know all the details, but there are some laws and laywers that fight for good citizens. But assisting does not necessarily mean shooting them.
Sounds like the details of this case in the house with drugs and an exgirlfriend is not exactly the same as stepping in and helping a person being attacked on the street or helping an officer??? We helped an officer a number of years ago and we would do it again in a heartbeat.
Fed Up

Berea, OH

#14 May 28, 2012
mapleman wrote:
Cleveland man, 53, charged with aggravated murder in fatal shooting of man who invaded his home, assaulted woman tenant
By Donna J. Miller
September 22, 2009, 1:40PM
CLEVELAND, Ohio Carl Kozlosky, 53, of Cleveland, is charged with aggravated murder in the shooting death of a man who broke into his house. He will be arraigned Wednesday morning.
Andre Coleman, 37, of Milverton Road, was shot and killed Sunday morning at the house Kozlosky owns in the 19100 block of Cherokee Avenue.
Police said this is what happened: Coleman went to the house about 9:30 p.m. and kicked in the door because a 26-year-old woman he had dated lived there and owed him money or drugs. Coleman began assaulting the woman.
Kozlosky, who rents part of the house to the woman, heard the noise, saw the woman being assaulted and shot Coleman. Neighbors called police.
One of the woman's family members told The Plain Dealer that Kozlosky had previously threatened to kill Coleman if he ever came to the house.
Coleman was sentenced to five to 10 years in prison in 1997 for involuntary manslaughter. His most recent local conviction was in January, 2005, for drug trafficking, when he was sentenced to 18 months of probation. He violated the rules within two months and was sentenced to 11 months in prison.
The news story, man! Where's the site for the video or the newspaper article? We need to see the video or read the article man!
Feldman

Berea, OH

#15 Jun 4, 2012
Fed Up wrote:
<quoted text>
The news story, man! Where's the site for the video or the newspaper article? We need to see the video or read the article man!
Only applies to everyone else, Fed Up. Doesn't apply to mapleman.

Feldman?
Apple Pie

Berea, OH

#16 Jun 7, 2012
apple pah! APPLE PAH!
Amin

Cleveland, OH

#17 May 17, 2013
xxxrayted wrote:
The Castle Doctrine does not apply to occupants involved in illegal activities. It also does not apply to protecting others--only yourself and family in your residence.
Neither of these statements is correct.

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